They have given him 2 seasons with little progress on his part, they can't take the gamble that he will come good next year.Whats stupid in it all is that next year's car will also be different and there Definately should be a Big improvement or adaptability, and change in car handling (removing the issues where the car handles differently between every corner as the current 1 is doing).
I dont see a reason why Dan should be dropped since he is still going to continue this year anyways.....there's just no way to find out unless he drives/tests next year's car and is compared against Lando for a few races at least.
What is going on with Ricciardo?
#3351
Posted 26 August 2022 - 14:36
Advertisement
#3352
Posted 26 August 2022 - 15:45
We have no idea what kind of contract was signed. It's all pure supposition. The only thing that we know is that Dan clearly felt his contract entitled him to drive in 2023 and McLaren felt that the contract didn't. What clauses each might have seen in the contract to make them feel that way is totally unknown to us.
McLaren realized they had a contract with him for 2023. They no longer wanted him to drive for them in 2023. That’s why they negotiated an exit. It appears both parties realized it wasn’t going to work after all the effort.
#3353
Posted 26 August 2022 - 16:07
[Steiner]: "Everyone thinks now Danny [is available] we have to take Daniel - maybe we don't want Daniel?" "Why do you think he has left McLaren? We need to be careful here. It's not just about what we have done, it's what we can do."
https://www.motorspo...tions/10358048/
#3354
Posted 26 August 2022 - 16:16
[Steiner]: "Everyone thinks now Danny [is available] we have to take Daniel - maybe we don't want Daniel?" "Why do you think he has left McLaren? We need to be careful here. It's not just about what we have done, it's what we can do."
https://www.motorspo...tions/10358048/
Word salad.
#3355
Posted 26 August 2022 - 16:20
Whats stupid in it all is that next year's car will also be different and there Definately should be a Big improvement or adaptability, and change in car handling (removing the issues where the car handles differently between every corner as the current 1 is doing).
I dont see a reason why Dan should be dropped since he is still going to continue this year anyways.....there's just no way to find out unless he drives/tests next year's car and is compared against Lando for a few races at least.
He has had time to show something, and hasn't. He's just not good enough and now he's gone. End of story.
#3356
Posted 26 August 2022 - 17:08
Word salad.
I think Steiner is just saying what most team principals will be thinking - if he was poor at McLaren for 2 seasons - why would he be any good with us.
I think a lot will depend on to what extent Ric is prepared to swallow his prided and accept a lesser contract with a lot of strings attached - he is no longer dealing from a position of strength.
#3357
Posted 26 August 2022 - 19:49
I think Dan *was* a top driver. The Dan that McLaren hired should have either beaten or been damned close to Lando. It was seen as one of the strongest pairings in current F1. But it hasn't worked out and taking on Dan for 2023 will be a bit of a gamble for any team. He probably comes with a decent salary demand as he's a multiple grand prix winner. I bet several teams are mulling him over, but also have doubts. If he comes good again, he could help a team like Haas or Alpine take the next step. If he can't regain his form, it's an expensive mistake.
For Dan himself it's sad. Likely his career will always be "what if?".
#3358
Posted 26 August 2022 - 20:32
I think Dan *was* a top driver. The Dan that McLaren hired should have either beaten or been damned close to Lando. It was seen as one of the strongest pairings in current F1. But it hasn't worked out and taking on Dan for 2023 will be a bit of a gamble for any team. He probably comes with a decent salary demand as he's a multiple grand prix winner. I bet several teams are mulling him over, but also have doubts. If he comes good again, he could help a team like Haas or Alpine take the next step. If he can't regain his form, it's an expensive mistake.
For Dan himself it's sad. Likely his career will always be "what if?".
Well Verstappen was beating him in big margin in 2018 Red Bull, in risk of becoming number 2 driver Ricciardo decided to go Enstone team for 2019.
Had he stayed in Red Bull 2019 he would been clear number 2 driver in the team and would have been in a same situation than he is currently against Norris.
He is a nice bloke, but lacks the tougness to be a champion. The polite drivers dont win normally titles sadly. You have to be ruthless as Verstappen or Hamilton in order to seal the deal.
Alpine would be the best option for next year if he drives in the sport.
#3359
Posted 26 August 2022 - 20:51
Well Verstappen was beating him in big margin in 2018 Red Bull...
No he wasn't.
#3361
Posted 26 August 2022 - 21:27
Max never beat Ricciardo 'with a big margin', there were always quite close, so were Sainz & Max at Toro Rosso. Max started beating a driver with a big margin when he had Gasly as his team mate: that was a very big margin in fact.
#3362
Posted 26 August 2022 - 21:43
In 2018 Ricciardo had horrible reliability. But at the end of the day, Max beat him comfortably. After the mistakes in 2017 he was pretty much faultless. In races where Ric outqualified Max it often was Max who was ahead after lap 1. It was clear Max was only getting better and better despite people whining about him being RBR's golden boy. I didn't like Max's defending at Baku and I certainly didn't like Ric's shenanigans in Austria qualifying, but I guess Ric saw what was coming and didn't want to get beaten by a big margin in 2019. Unfortunatelu he chose Renault when he first really expected a call from Ferrari. He probably knew right there and then that his chance to ever win a WDC was gone.
Edited by A3, 26 August 2022 - 21:43.
#3363
Posted 26 August 2022 - 22:10
Until this last two years, offcourse.
I was so happy he was going to my favourite team.
I dont think explaining his lack of adaptability , should concern me . It is a wasted effort , and without being in the team, I and we all, lack proper info
Great ones adapt , great ones know what makes them fast, he did not . End of story .
I still think he is worth a risk. Going to a different team and trying to unlock his potenttial in a different car. I will be rooting for that scenario
Also, I think guys who are calling Norris second coming of Christ, will be in a few years getting a rude wake up call. Simple logic, this kind of difference in performance indicates more Ricciardo's failure than Norris' s success.
#3364
Posted 26 August 2022 - 22:13
No he wasn't.
That's right
#3365
Posted 26 August 2022 - 22:16
Max never beat Ricciardo 'with a big margin', there were always quite close, so were Sainz & Max at Toro Rosso. Max started beating a driver with a big margin when he had Gasly as his team mate: that was a very big margin in fact.
Ricciardo was still ahead of Max in the championship when he announced he had signed with Renault after the Hungarian GP, it was only after that his car started to have horrendous reliability and the roles reversed.
Edited by RPM40, 26 August 2022 - 22:20.
#3366
Posted 26 August 2022 - 22:24
Post like this makes me laugh. Do please share all your insight from the three F1 teams he has driven for - and won races with.
No matter how likeable a driver or person someone is to the majority some will take a dislike. Read the posts on this site and you can easily pick that small number out. I try and avoid people like that as they are usually not very likeable themselves.
#3367
Posted 26 August 2022 - 22:49
#3368
Posted 26 August 2022 - 23:16
Ricciardo was still ahead of Max in the championship when he announced he had signed with Renault after the Hungarian GP, it was only after that his car started to have horrendous reliability and the roles reversed.
Still as delusional and dishonest as always I see.
#3369
Posted 26 August 2022 - 23:36
In 2018 Ricciardo had horrible reliability. But at the end of the day, Max beat him comfortably. After the mistakes in 2017 he was pretty much faultless. In races where Ric outqualified Max it often was Max who was ahead after lap 1. It was clear Max was only getting better and better despite people whining about him being RBR's golden boy. I didn't like Max's defending at Baku and I certainly didn't like Ric's shenanigans in Austria qualifying, but I guess Ric saw what was coming and didn't want to get beaten by a big margin in 2019. Unfortunatelu he chose Renault when he first really expected a call from Ferrari. He probably knew right there and then that his chance to ever win a WDC was gone.
Max had a sloppy start to 2018 with a few big mistakes. The largely faultless part only came after the low point in Monaco. For the rest I think you assessment is accurate. As a Max fan I enjoyed the rivalry with Ricciardo and the banter with (almost all of) his fans. It is a shame Ricciardo didn't get a seat at Ferrari, would have been interesting to see what he could have done there. Certainly did not expect at the time (2018) that their career paths would diverge so greatly. Hopefully Ricciardo can still find a good seat in F1 and show us once again what he is capable of.
#3370
Posted 27 August 2022 - 00:42
Not this again....
#3371
Posted 27 August 2022 - 01:30
Dan held his own against Max. But he wasn't quite as good and knew it....hence the move to Renault and then McLaren. However, Dan was not soundly beaten.
I sometimes wonder if there's a totally different set of races broadcast to certain homes.....
#3372
Posted 27 August 2022 - 01:57
Yeah wasn't much in it but Max had an edge. Which is why i don't buy this is normal Dan and Norris is suddenly some freak of nature. Dan just cannot drive this car and it will be fascinating to find out why one day in the future.
#3373
Posted 27 August 2022 - 02:02
What is there to “figure out”? He didn’t adapt. They told him to drive like Norris. They coached him into the corners. Said do this and that. He couldn’t. It’s called a lack of skill in a particular task. There are many things Daniel can do. Driving the Mclaren the way it needed to isn’t one of them. That was his downfall.Yeah wasn't much in it but Max had an edge. Which is why i don't buy this is normal Dan and Norris is suddenly some freak of nature. Dan just cannot drive this car and it will be fascinating to find out why one day in the future.
And no one is calling Norris a freak of nature either. No one is saying he’s 7 tenths faster than Leclerc and Verstappen.
The fact that no one has struggled in a Mclaren like Dan has says it’s more of a Daniel problem anyway. People need to accept that and stop trying so hard to blame the car. Alonso had no issue with this car. Neither did Sainz or Norris who you clearly think are both quite average. If a bunch of average drivers could drive the Mclaren, why couldn’t Daniel?
Maybe he declined? It happens to drivers. Kimi fell off hard. So did Montoya.
Edited by ARTGP, 27 August 2022 - 03:00.
#3374
Posted 27 August 2022 - 06:52
It's clear that the main issue is Ricciardo can't adapt specifically to the McLaren, not that he can't adapt.
I think Alpine would be silly if they didn't consider rehiring him, as it's more likely that a more conventional car, Ricciardo would deliver the results the rest of his career has shown him capable of.
And McLaren need to stop pointing fingers elsewhere again (remember Honda?) and take a look at their design philosophy of their cars. Just because Norris has a style that luckily fits the characteristics, doesn't mean that he wouldn't be faster more consistently if the car behaviour was a bit more "normal".
Edited by RedRabbit, 27 August 2022 - 06:54.
#3375
Posted 27 August 2022 - 08:14
He had a race winning car in the Red Bull. A chance of wins and fight for the WDC, even though he would have been up against Max. Better than being down the grid.
#3376
Posted 27 August 2022 - 08:19
Seeing as we now know what’s going on with Ricciardo, and the thread is devolving into old tired arguments from the past, this thread will be closed.
Dan’s future can be discussed in the Silly Season thread, his current performance can be discussed in the McLaren team thread, and any big news such as a signing can warrant a new thread.