21 replies to this topic

[balmybaldwin]

Couldn't see a topic for this, but mods please merge if I've missed an older thread

 

New F1 Rules of Engagement have been leaked to the race aparently:

 

https://youtu.be/6gb...qkUdgW-YO4p0H8S

 

Some minor tweaks that explain some of the decisions this year.

 

Overall I think changes for the good, but I don't understand why they are kept behind closed doors

[SophieB]

It is very weird. Why would they not just let the fans know? 

[KWSN - DSM]

SophieB, on 01 May 2025 - 08:43, said:

It is very weird. Why would they not just let the fans know? 

 

Because the fans would then expect them always to be followed, adhered to and penalized in a consistent manner when/if not followed.

[jonklug]

I agree with the changes, and they make sense. It was silly for the driver on the inside to have to leave room on the outside for the guy he is overtaking. Just hope this is consistently enforced now and it should be nice and tidy.

[PayasYouRace]

Could someone sum up the tweaks please? Can’t YouTube right now.

[JeePee]

jonklug, on 01 May 2025 - 09:03, said:

I agree with the changes, and they make sense. It was silly for the driver on the inside to have to leave room on the outside for the guy he is overtaking. Just hope this is consistently enforced now and it should be nice and tidy.

F1 overtaking rules makes absolutely zero sense, and ruin side by side racing.

[PayasYouRace]

jonklug, on 01 May 2025 - 09:03, said:

I agree with the changes, and they make sense. It was silly for the driver on the inside to have to leave room on the outside for the guy he is overtaking. Just hope this is consistently enforced now and it should be nice and tidy.

What? No!

You’re telling me they’re making it acceptable to run your opponent out of road? That’s terrible. You should always have to leave space for a car beside you.

[IrvTheSwerve]

Kind of overregulation IMO. The issue is that the circuits are designed in such a way that it makes a driver have zero issue in running another driver off the track. If there was gravel (or even grass) - we aren't going back to walls of course - then this would happen far less. There are no consequences to running a driver off.

 

If a driver put another into a wall or a gravel trap, they'd be in line for a penalty - this would dissuade them from this kind of driving. The way it is now, it's simply two cars on a patch of tarmac, one is pushed out of the white lines, Croft goes bonkers as usual and we have endless discussion on what should happen next.

[jonklug]

PayasYouRace, on 01 May 2025 - 09:18, said:

Could someone sum up the tweaks please? Can’t YouTube right now.

 

Here you go:

 

 

[jonklug]

PayasYouRace, on 01 May 2025 - 09:24, said:

What? No!

You’re telling me they’re making it acceptable to run your opponent out of road? That’s terrible. You should always have to leave space for a car beside you.

 

It's how it always was in karting and such. If you can make the corner and are ahead, then you are entitled to give no room. It is essentially why Piastri wasn't penalized for the incident with Max in Saudi just now and why it didn't matter that Verstappen (the defending car) was slightly ahead at the apex. He was still the defending car, and not the attacking one, and Piastri was entitled to give him no space. Thus cutting the corner and gaining an advantage was a clear cut penalty. If they simply enforce this equally, then it's fair for all.

It would have also prevented Russell's penalty on Bottas in Austin last year. 

[Risil]

Cheers Jon

[PayasYouRace]

jonklug, on 01 May 2025 - 09:32, said:

It's how it always was in karting and such. If you can make the corner and are ahead, then you are entitled to give no room. It is essentially why Piastri wasn't penalized for the incident with Max in Saudi just now and why it didn't matter that Verstappen (the defending car) was slightly ahead at the apex. He was still the defending car, and not the attacking one, and Piastri was entitled to give him no space. Thus cutting the corner and gaining an advantage was a clear cut penalty. If they simply enforce this equally, then it's fair for all.

It would have also prevented Russell's penalty on Bottas in Austin last year.

I still think it’s a terrible way to do it in terms of giving space.

But I can see that the changes at least clarify things they way they want to run it.

[jonklug]

PayasYouRace, on 01 May 2025 - 09:36, said:

I still think it’s a terrible way to do it in terms of giving space.

But I can see that the changes at least clarify things they way they want to run it.

 

I think it's at least a step in the right direction of having clearer guidelines that are easier for the stewards to apply in the context of a penalty and for drivers to follow and understand. Will there still be controversies? I am sure, but still feel it's a step in the right direction of making things clearer to judge. 

[Ivanhoe]

IrvTheSwerve, on 01 May 2025 - 09:26, said:

Kind of overregulation IMO. The issue is that the circuits are designed in such a way that it makes a driver have zero issue in running another driver off the track. If there was gravel (or even grass) - we aren't going back to walls of course - then this would happen far less. There are no consequences to running a driver off.

 

If a driver put another into a wall or a gravel trap, they'd be in line for a penalty - this would dissuade them from this kind of driving. The way it is now, it's simply two cars on a patch of tarmac, one is pushed out of the white lines, Croft goes bonkers as usual and we have endless discussion on what should happen next.

The other side of that medal is that we would see fewer drivers hanging on the outside if there were gravel or a wall; for the same reason, there are no consequences running off.

[Ali_G]

Shocking if the overtaking driver can just drive the other off the circuit. It was not always this way and certainly not always this way in karting.

This weird form of racing really is only prevalent in the last 20 years.

[jonklug]

Ali_G, on 01 May 2025 - 09:45, said:

Shocking if the overtaking driver can just drive the other off the circuit. It was not always this way and certainly not always this way in karting.

This weird form of racing really is only prevalent in the last 20 years.

 

It's apparently what the drivers themselves asked for

[LiJu914]

What i don´t like about guideline A is its consequence in case of a collision.

 

Let´s assume Driver A is overtaking on the inside and is alongside the mirror of Driver B before and at the apex.

Now Driver A is entitled to leave no space for the rest of the corner, BUT he also is not ahead of driver B at that moment and hasn´t completed the move.

If Driver A now runs into Driver B, it will be regarded as the fault of Driver B even if it´s not a case of him "turning in" on Driver A.

Driver B is basically obliged to run off the track or yield his position beforehand in order to avoid a collision.

Edited by LiJu914, Today, 10:22.

[Stephane]

jonklug, on 01 May 2025 - 09:47, said:

It's apparently what the drivers themselves asked for

We'll see next time one of them says 'he pushed me off' 😅

[GlenWatkins]

Can't post a link, but Racer has a good write up about the new rules and Max's penalty last week.

In essence, if you are on the inside and your wheel is in front of the mirror of the other car at the apex, the corner is yours and only then can you run the outside car wide.

Edited by GlenWatkins, Today, 10:34.

[Analog]

Well, then the penalty for Max makes perfect sense. It did not (make perfect sense) according to last years guidelines.

Edited by Analog, Today, 11:17.

[RedRabbit]

Ivanhoe, on 01 May 2025 - 09:45, said:

The other side of that medal is that we would see fewer drivers hanging on the outside if there were gravel or a wall; for the same reason, there are no consequences running off.

This

[pdac]

I've never understood why they don't just paint a line a car-width in from the outside of each corner and say that, when overtaking on the inside, the car must not cross this line.