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1965 World Sportscar Championship Scoring


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#1 JonnyA

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Posted 13 January 2022 - 12:38

Hello everyone,

 

I am trying to find out what the scoring system was for prototypes in the World Sportscar Championship in 1965. Wikipedia gives the overall scores at the end of the season, but doesn't explain how they are calculated, and I cannot find this information anywhere else online. Wikipedia gives its reference for the scores as Time and Two Seats, P611, but sadly I don't have a copy. Can anyone help with what the scoring system was, please?

Thanks in advance.



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#2 68targa

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Posted 13 January 2022 - 13:48

This is what Wimpffen (Time and Two Seats) says regarding the 1965-67 Prototype Championship.

 

"Each marque had to have a Prototype category car start in four of the six qualifying rounds in order to be eligible for the Prototype Trophy. The best four scores counted."

 

He also confirms that the " points system followed the GT style (8-6-4-3-2-1) but  with 9 points now going to the winner." 

 

I will try and work this out later !



#3 D-Type

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Posted 13 January 2022 - 13:52

From Peter Higham's "International Motor Racing Guide," in 1965 it was 9, 6, 4, 3, 2, 1.  Best result for each marque only.  Best 6 results count

  
As the book dates to 2003, it is due an update.  Is there a market for it any more?


Edited by D-Type, 13 January 2022 - 14:29.


#4 Michael Ferner

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Posted 13 January 2022 - 14:05

No, it would only lead to people criticizing it, citing wikipedia articles (with info copied from the earlier version).



#5 JonnyA

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Posted 14 January 2022 - 11:32

Thank you very much for your answers, however the total scores given on Wikipedia are as follows:

Ferrari 58.5

Porsche 30.4

Ford 19.6

Iso 3.9

 

Which suggests there is some other element involved, maybe weighting for the score of individual races, e.g. Le Mans maybe being worth more than Daytona?

 

It's also interesting Wimpffen says there were six qualifying rounds, as there appear to have been 10 rounds where prototypes competed.



#6 rl1856

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Posted 14 January 2022 - 13:39

1965 results should include Chaparral with 18pts for having won the 12HR of Sebring and Bridgehampton.  However, they only contested 2 races.



#7 68targa

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Posted 14 January 2022 - 16:11

Looking at Wimpffen again his results for each race he indicates which Championship or Trophy apply and for the 1965 Prototype Trophy these are shown as, Sebring, Monza, Targa Florio, Nurburgring, Le Mans and Bridgehampton.  

 

he lists the end of year points thus:

1965 Prototypes Trophy

Ferrari    79.8  (58.5)  --  presumably  this reflects the best four scores

Porsche 30.4

Ford  19.6

Shelby  7.8   (Shelby Cobra)

Iso  3.9

Abarth  3.2

Austin Healey  1.6

Chevrolet  1.6

 

but have a look at  

http://www.wsrp.cz/t...akes.html#1965P

 

this shows six races out of 20 Sports/GT/Prototype events and I make it that  race  #2 Sebring - #5 Monza - #7 Targa - #9 Nurburgring - #12 Le Mans and # 20 Bridgehampton.

 

 this shows the points scored in each round and the breakdown although there is no explanation for the weird scoring system used.  It might be worth contacting Martin Krejci who also runs   https://www.racingsportscars.com/


Edited by 68targa, 14 January 2022 - 16:13.


#8 small block

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Posted 14 January 2022 - 16:44

According to the 1965 edition of The Motor Racing Register:

 

The GT Manufacturers' Championship

FIA series which replaced the former SportsCar World Championship.

Results decided on a points system as follows:

 

Le Mans 2 pts

Sebring, Targa Florio, Nurburgring 1000km, Mille Kilometres de Paris, Tour de France 1.6 pts each

Other circuit events 1.3 pts each

Hill climbs and other events included in the Championship for the first time 1 pt each

Classes are : up to 1300cc (GT 1)

Over 1300cc and up to 2000cc  (GT 2)

Over 2000cc (GT3)

Each class is sub-divided at 1000cc, 1600cc and 3000cc

 

1965 Prototype and GT Manufacturers Championship Calendar

 

Feb 28 Daytona Continental (GT2-3)

Mar 27 Sebring 12 Hours (P, GT 1-2-3)

Apri 11 Bologna Cups (GT 1)

Apr 25 Monza 1000 Kilometres (P, GT 1-2-3)

May 1 Tourist Trophy (GT 3)

May 9 Targa Florio (P, GT 1-2-3)

May 16 Spa Grand Prix (GT2-3)

May 23 Nurburgring 1000 Kilometres (P, GT 1-2-3)

June 6 Mugello (GT 2)

June 23 Rossfeld hill Climb (GT 3)

JUne 19-20 Le Mans 24 Hours (P, GT 1-2-3)

July 3-4 Reims 12 Hours (GT3)

July 4 Bolzano-Mendola hill climb (GT1)

Aug 8 Freiburg hill climb (GT 2)

Aug 15 Enna Cup (GT 3)

Aug 29 Ollon-Villars hill climb (GT 1-2-3)

Sep 5 Nurburgring 500 kilometres (GT 1)

Sep 14-24 Tour de France (GT 1-2-3)

Sep 18-19 Bridgehampton Double 500 (P, GT 1-2-3)

Oct 10 Paris 1000 Kilometres (P, GT 1-2-3)

 

__________________________________________________________

 

Perhaps the system shown above is for multiplication of points scored in races, e.g. a win at Le Mans is worth double points and so on.



#9 68targa

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Posted 14 January 2022 - 17:41

Taking Ferrari's score for the year then we have:

 

Sebring     -  2nd place = 6pts  x 1.6  = 9.6

Monza 1000kms - 1st place  = 9pts  x 1.3  = 11.7

Targa Florio      -   1st place =  9pts x 1.6  =  14.4

Nurburgring 1000kms 1st place = 9pts x 1.6  = 14.4

Le Mans    -      1st place = 9pts  x 2.00  = 18

Bridgehampton  - 1st place  = 9pts  x 1.3 = 11.7

 

Best four scores count so 18 + 14.4 + 14.4 + 11.7  = 58.5

 

 

The Paris 1000kms did not take place in 1965 so that would account for the six races.


Edited by 68targa, 14 January 2022 - 17:45.


#10 JonnyA

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Posted 14 January 2022 - 18:51

Thank you all so much, that finally makes sense now!



#11 D-Type

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Posted 14 January 2022 - 22:18

There were two championships: The GT Manufacturers' Championship and the International Championship for Makes.  Peter Higham's International Motor Racing Guide refers to the latter.

 

He lists the following qualifying races:

Daytona Continental

Sebring 12 Hours

Monza 1000km / Trofeo Filippo Carraciolo

Tourist Trophy

Targa Florio

Gp de Spa-Franconchamps

Nurburgring 1000km

Le Mans 24 Hours

Reims 12 Hours

 

Some cars competing in these races were sports-racing cars and ineligible for points, eg Chaparral and Brabham

 

Points for eligible cars were 9,6,4,3,2,1

 

The points totals given are

1  Ferrari - 54 (66)*

2=  AC Cobra -  23

     Porsche - 23 (26)*

4  Ford - 22

5  Iso-Grifo - 2 

6  Fiat-Abarth - 1

*  Best six results count 


Edited by D-Type, 14 January 2022 - 22:22.


#12 Doug Nye

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Posted 16 January 2022 - 12:36

If it's of any interest - since this does not relate to 1965 but to the 1964 FIA GT Championship - this is the original regulations release to the teams, circulated by the FIA early that year.  Curiously, the release is dated March 24, 1964 - three days after the Championship's second round (the Sebring 12-Hours) had been run.  The FIA has always moved in mysterious ways... 

 

(These documents are as reproduced in the recent 'GTO/64' book)

 

GPL-DSJ-1964-GT-CHAMPIONSHIP-REGS-1.jpg

 

GPL-1964-GT-CHAMPIONSHIP-REGS-2.jpg

 

GPL-1964-GT-CHAMPIONSHIP-REGS-3.jpg

 

GPL-1964-GT-CHAMPIONSHIP-REGS-4.jpg

 

GPL-1964-GT-CHAMPIONSHIP-REGS-5.jpg

 

GPL-1964-GT-CHAMPIONSHIP-REGS-6.jpg

 

DCN


Edited by Doug Nye, 16 January 2022 - 12:43.