35 replies to this topic

[TerryS]

For interest something different:
 
How to build the UK's unlikeliest race car (msn.com)

[Doug Nye]

On an international level this entry took us by surprise yesterday when I turned up this photo:

 

 

Guy Chasseuil/Francois Migault,, Citroen SM, contesting the 1974 Spa 24-Hour race.

 

Photo Copyright: The GP Library

 

DCN

[Odseybod]

Pulling some Gs, in a nicely undramatic way, which I think is something of a big Citroen speciality.  I had my second CX around the time the A14 opened - returning from the Midlands at night, with hardly any traffic about, its gently seeping bends would stealthily turn into corners - while of course carefully observing Her Majesty's speed limits, officer ...

[john aston]

The only car which was  almost as much fun to drive as my Caterhams was the orange Citroen 2CV 6 I owned in 1979/80  . Unstickable grip , mighty roll, amazing ride , weirdly logical gearchange . invincible in snow  and a perfect way to learn the importance of timing and slipstreaming (or 'drafting ' , si vous voulez ) in overtaking   .  

[Zoe]

On an international level this entry took us by surprise yesterday when I turned up this photo:

 

 

Well, its half a Maserati anyway

[pete53]

Seeing Doug's photo of the lurching Citroen SM reminded me of seeing Mike Beckwith racing such a car in a Production Saloon Car race at Brands in around 1972.

 

I am aware of the 2CV series, but has anyone raced a 2CV outside of a one-make series?

[BRG]

A few years back, we dove a 2CV on an organised run (by 2CV Adventures) from Hampshire to Beaulieu-sur-Mer, just along from Monaco, taking a route through the Alps.  I had some knowledge of the cars as my brother had an Ami 6 and an Ami 8 - basically, 2CVs in party clothes - back in period.  Astonishingly, the weirdly logical gearchange came as second nature to me, even after more than 40 years.  We had a ball.  The cars are just a hoot to drive, and the French absolutely love them - we were cheered photographed and waved at all through France.  There were 14 2CVs on the run and ours seemed to be the fastest as we hit over 70 mph (probably, the speedo was a little vague) on the A27 at Brighton, passing most of the others.   Even in the Alps, the redoubtable little car marched up some of the higher Alpine passes without hesitation and we could even overtake the cyclists!  At one point on the route (defined in proper rally fashion by a tulip roadbook) we were directed along the edge of a field.  The 2CV's suspension soaked it up - if we had had the legendary bowl of eggs, they would have survived unscathed.  And we could just ignore speed bumps! 

 

If you have never sampled 2CV driving, it should be a bucket list entry.  As for racing them, well, maybe a step too far for me!

[timf5000]

Peter Thurston is currently building a V8 2CV!!!

[Zoe]

There's even a song by Lloyd Cole, called "2CV"!  

 

It must have been nearly 40 years ago when a friend of mine was driving a 2CV; I helped her to put a stereo radio in and was not excactly impressed by the floppyness of its steel (was it steel?) sidewalls.

 

For some reason, they were called "Ente" (duck) in Germany. The priest in the village where I lived in the seventies drove a Dyane, which was a kind of upscale 2CV. And of course the 2CVs were the car to drive for our hippie eco friends in the Seventies and Eighties!

[arttidesco]

On an international level this entry took us by surprise yesterday when I turned up this photo:



Guy Chasseuil/Francois Migault,, Citroen SM, contesting the 1974 Spa 24-Hour race.

Photo Copyright: The GP Library

DCN

This Automobiles Ligier Maserati entry marked the third appearance of an SM in the Spa 24 Hours, 1974 was the high point qualifying 10th but it was followed by the third consecutive DNF. Guy Verrier and Gerard Foucault tried unsucessfully to qualify an SM at Le Mans in 1972 while a chap called Lablanche is recorded as the winner of a 6 hour race in Dakar in 1973 on the racingsportscars.com website

The only car which was almost as much fun to drive as my Caterhams was the orange Citroen 2CV 6 I owned in 1979/80 . Unstickable grip , mighty roll, amazing ride , weirdly logical gearchange . invincible in snow and a perfect way to learn the importance of timing and slipstreaming (or 'drafting ' , si vous voulez ) in overtaking .

I had a couple of dozen 2CV's, sold them in the evenings after coming home from selling Volvo's in the day. I turned my orange one into a racer, below at Brands, with a cage similar to the one in the top photo of the linked article in the OP.



Taking part in the inaugural Mondello Park 24 Hour race, won by Pete Sparrow in the ECAS car seen in the article photo, with some mates was probably the most fun I had with my clothes on until I got Madge a couple of years ago.

I think we finished in the top 20 having covered around 900 miles, 100 more than I anticipated and about a 100 miles less than the winners.

We got through 6 brand new tyres, all swapped sides to even out the wear, a set of front pads, a fan after a collision with the Autosport entry and a rear light lens. Borrowed a set of tyres and a light lens from some one so that I could drive the car back to London the same night we finished. The 2CV's are a good deal more sophisticated now but I would be surprised if they are not just as much fun.

[Henri Greuter]

In the very very early days of Rallycross in the Netherlands, we had TV coverage of the onece a month in the season.

In one ov those years, I think it was in 1970 or 1971, there was one competitor who used a 2CV chassis. I doubt if he used an original 2CV engine.

 

There has also been a cross series for 2CV's, at least in the past. 

[Red Socks]

Years ago Steve Lydon arranged an HSCC race meeting at Crois -en -Ternois and as part of the package sold the 2CV racers a two  hour long race , something was needed to fill the time.

I was asked to do the commentary for the event.

During the day Steve asked me if I could do some of the commentary in French as some locals had turned up and were interested particularly in the concept of 2CV racing.

With my A level and restaurant French to hand I agreed to do what I could.

It was plainly pretty mediocre to begin with but after about half an hour the timekeepers dropped it. The next hour or so whilst they tried to sort out a stack of cars ,all the same colour,performance etc were perhaps the longest of my life.

I suspect there is to this day a tiny group in Northern France who wonder what the English are all about.

Steve did pay me !

[Steve99]

I was treated to the spectacle of a field of 2CV's racing at Cadwell a couple of years back. Very entertaining, and surprisingly fast. 

[john aston]

And they sound like  a low approach from the Battle of Britain Flight at nearby RAF Coningsby ..

[Derwent Motorsport]

I am fairly sure there is one fitted with a 1000cc bike engine.

[Michael Ferner]

For some reason, they were called "Ente" (duck) in Germany. 

 

Even more charmingly, many many years ago, a girl friend of one of my brothers used to call her's an "Int" in her local dialect - that stuck! 

[Sterzo]

And of course the 2CVs were the car to drive for our hippie eco friends in the Seventies and Eighties!

I met an "absolutely soooper" PR consultant from Hampstead who told a friend and I that she owned one. We asked if she had stick-on flowers on the doors, and of course she did.
 

[kevins]

I've seen them testing for the 24hrs at Mondello a few times, very entertaining to watch. I knew some guys that did it, said it was great fun as  arttidesco said. I understand complete engines were changed under the cover of darkness!

 

While the SM is being covered here too this is well worth a view (as are ALL of Iain's videos)

 

[Henri Greuter]

 

For some reason, they were called "Ente" (duck) in Germany. The priest in the village where I lived in the seventies drove a Dyane, which was a kind of upscale 2CV. And of course the 2CVs were the car to drive for our hippie eco friends in the Seventies and Eighties!

 

In the Netherlands 2CV's are also referred to as the Dutch name for Duck but even a but more offending:  "ugly duck"

[BRG]

I am fairly sure there is one fitted with a 1000cc bike engine.

More than one, I reckon.  Apparently inserting the flat twin BMW bike engine is quite easy. 

 

Someone has built a 2EV by putting the electric motor straight onto the existing transmission and changing the fuel gauge into a charge meter, otherwise largely as Andre Citroen .  Except a LOT faster!

[Steve99]

John Aston I live a mile from Coningsby, no better sound than a bunch of Merlins over the garden!

[Henk Vasmel]

In the Netherlands 2CV's are also referred to as the Dutch name for Duck but even a bit more offending:  "ugly duck"

 

The origin of this comes from a Dutch journalist. In the thirties Citroën used to publicize the "moteur flottant", an engine suspended by rubber as a swan floating on the "waves" of the double chevron.

When the 2CV appeared, he commented that the swan had given birth to an ugly duckling, after the Hans Christian Andersen fairytale.

The name stuck and the 2CV was commonly known in the Netherlands as the "Lelijke Eend", later usually abbreviated into "Eend" (Duck).

The Germans took it over and used the name "Ente", though I cannot remember "Hässliche Ente"

Try to describe this car to a Frenchman as "Canard" and you get blank faces.

 

Are there any other languages/countries that picked this up too?

 

Here I found a nice picture of the Citroën Swan. google for Moteur Flottant and you'll get more.

https://www.google.c...QAAAAAdAAAAABBo

[wheadon1985]

I’m Co-Ordinator of the U.K. Championship.

One of the best series to organise, great camaraderie and drivers who are very sympathetic to each other on track. The 24h at Snetterton is very much a family affair with mums, dads and kids all driving together, one of the best club races on the British calendar every year.

[Doug Nye]

In the early '60s I remember there was a widespread belief amongst Brits making their first foray 'abroad' through France that those all-pervasive Citroen 2CVs had been made out of re-beaten ex-Wehrmacht dustbins.  How else could they look so bad - and even moreso when they displayed such rubbish cornering characteristics...  

 

I do remember when I first drove one, however, being favourably surprised by just how well its Michelins actually seemed to hang on, despite the 60-degree (well that's what it felt like) angle of list threatening at any moment to deposit all occupants on the road alongside.  One's grip on the steering wheel, amongst other things, certainly tightened.  

 

The door window opening also intrigued.

 

DCN

[Stephen W]

We had three circuit racing 2CVs pitch up at Harewood hillclimb last year. They were put into the Up to 1400 Mod Prod Class and were at the back of the pack however, between the three the competition was intense and they were very entertaining for the spectators. One of the cars even had an engine change between runs!

[arttidesco]

I am fairly sure there is one fitted with a 1000cc bike engine.

 

There are a numerous 2CV's without original engines, IIRC 2CV's powered by any non standard engine are known as Sidewinders. Popular Sidewinder conversions in the 1970's used Citroen GS engines which unmodified produced circa 55hp to 65hp dependent on engine size twixt 1 ans 1.3 litres. 

[D-Type]

 ~

The door window opening also intrigued.

 

DCN

I once had a test drive in a 2CV.  The salesman demonstrated how you could pull the rear view mirror back to prop the window open and still see the bicycles coming up to overtake. 

To my eternal regret I didn't buy a 2CV but stuck with my rust-ridden Herald.

[Odseybod]

I think that lower door window section was specially designed for m'sieur to drape his elbow out of, while the hinged panel flapped up and down on top of it in the mighty slipstream, with much the same ventilation effect in the cabin that a tired punkah wallah might achieve (whether it was enough to disperse the Gauloise smoke is debatable, while the technique for transferring the butt from the lower lip to the outside hand for flicking at the looming bicyclettiste is also a bit of a mystery).

[sstiel]

In our Auto Tradition Yearbook, we have a feature by John Waghorn about 2CV racing.

[john aston]

I think that lower door window section was specially designed for m'sieur to drape his elbow out of, while the hinged panel flapped up and down on top of it in the mighty slipstream, with much the same ventilation effect in the cabin that a tired punkah wallah might achieve (whether it was enough to disperse the Gauloise smoke is debatable, while the technique for transferring the butt from the lower lip to the outside hand for flicking at the looming bicyclettiste is also a bit of a mystery).

One could also  operate the 2CV's answer to DRS by turning the knurled wheel under the dash to obtain  a gale of fresh air from an opened vent under the screen . The ensuing gale ensured my Marlboro smoke was blown into the faces of any rear seat passengers. The side windows are things of wonder - one can clip them in the up position or, far more entertainingly , let them hover half open in the breeze. At least until a lorry slipstream pulls them into place with a most satisfying bang .  One minor issue with the under screen flap was that it was open to the elements, so small insects, hail and rain could smack the front seat passengers in the teeth. My, what larks I had in that car - and girls seemed to love it far more than the Clan Crusader it replaced . Very adaptable car , the 2 CV .. 

[Michael Ferner]

One could also  operate the 2CV's answer to DRS...

I think the F1 copy of that concept was named something like "F-duct", wasn't it?

[Zoe]

The ensuing gale ensured my Marlboro smoke 

 

Désolée, but you are supposed to smoke Gauloises sans filtre in that car!

[TerryS]

It is very interesting that the thread I started on the esoteric topic of Citroen 2CV in Racing has drawn such interest.

 

It shows the the knowledge and enthusiasm of participants on this forum.

[D-Type]

I know 2CVs ran in the Monte but never won, notwithstanding the favourable handicap.  Does anyone know how well they got on?

[arttidesco]

I know 2CVs ran in the Monte but never won, notwithstanding the favourable handicap.  Does anyone know how well they got on?

 

Afraid not, but several 2CV's took part in the 1955 Mille Miglia best being G Seibert who came home 248th ! 

[D-Type]

Afraid not, but several 2CV's took part in the 1955 Mille Miglia best being G Seibert who came home 248th ! 

Well, that means 31 cars finished behind him!