450 replies to this topic

[HeadFirst]

 I could not find 2022 team thread for AM any where, so I started one. Couldn't help myself, being Canadian eh. So pitter patter let's get at her. 

[BRG]

Oh well, to start things off, I will throw a firecracker on the flames.

 

I reckon Stroll was showing excellent spatial awareness and wheel-to-wheel racing skills in Imola, as well as his usual good wet weather driving.

[KWSN - DSM]

The magic behind the veil.

 

[HeadFirst]

Imola was encouraging, and I have to admit I was surprised. The car looked, but that's easy to say considering how bad it looked in the previous races. The drivers, on the other hand, drove well considered races, making the most of opportunities. Hopefully in Miami we will see continued improvement on the tech side and another strong effort from the drivers. Another double points day is not out of the question, with a little luck.

[Hellow]

No wonder they're moving forward as inspector Seb was doing his job!


But well yeah it is nice to see Aston Martin & Seb doing better - it is a bit tragic that so beatiful car is so slow.

[Mohican]

Stroll has fired AML’s CEO, Tobias Moers, today - and the Q1 results are very bad.

Stroll must be looking for the exit re AML (the public company), will be interesting to see where this leaves AMR F1.

But this development explains all the sudden talk of Aston Martin and Audi; all looks quite desperate.

[statman]

Stroll has fired AML’s CEO, Tobias Moers, today - and the Q1 results are very bad.

Stroll must be looking for the exit re AML (the public company), will be interesting to see where this leaves AMR F1.

But this development explains all the sudden talk of Aston Martin and Audi; all looks quite desperate.

 

Aston Martin Boss Tobias Moers Quits Over Disagreement With Lawrence Stroll

[ARTGP]

Last gen show car in the new colors looks great.

 

https://twitter.com/...5766016/photo/1

[Claymore25]

A shame that Vettel's race was ruined.

[Disgrace]

Nice to see that Vettel still has a champion's drive in him on occasion.

[baddog]

Yeah great drive from Vettel there.

[STRFerrari4Ever]

Vettel pulled off the moves of the day, you saw he had some fight in him despite being in that dog of a car. I hope there’s significant upgrades to at least get them closer to the top 10 because they’re in no mans land.

[Baddoer]

The car is around Alpina in terms of performance or whereabouts and can score points consitently. But mistakes like fuel temperatures are going to be costly.

[ARTGP]

FormulaRacers on Twitter: "Aston Martin's major upgrade package for Barcelona will reportedly only be available to Lance Stroll, whilst Sebastian Vettel will drive the old-spec car. [@GiulyDuchessa]" / Twitter

 

I wonder how they are justfiying this. Vettel is ahead in the points. Arguably considered the #1 driver as well. 

 

In 2020, they said that Stroll got the upgrade in Mugello instead of Perez because Stroll was ahead in the points (Perez missing races due to COVID).

In 2021, they gave Stroll the upgrade in Portugal after 3 races because Stroll was ahead of Vettel in the points.

 

So now why is Stroll getting the upgrade first when he is behind in the points?

Edited by ARTGP, 15 May 2022 - 14:40.

[Astandahl]

FormulaRacers on Twitter: "Aston Martin's major upgrade package for Barcelona will reportedly only be available to Lance Stroll, whilst Sebastian Vettel will drive the old-spec car. [@GiulyDuchessa]" / Twitter

 

I wonder how they are justfiying this. Vettel is ahead in the points. Arguably considered the #1 driver as well. 

 

In 2020, they said that Stroll got the upgrade in Mugello instead of Perez because Stroll was ahead in the points (Perez missing races due to COVID).

In 2021, they gave Stroll the upgrade in Portugal after 3 races because Stroll was ahead of Vettel in the points.

 

So now why is Stroll getting the upgrade first when he is behind in the points?

Because he is the son of the Team owner

[HeadFirst]

Because he is the son of the Team owner

 

Easy to say. Perhaps it is nothing more than a last gasp experiment, Stroll's the guinea pig. Have you considered that Vettel took a pass on the upgrades?

[JimmyClark]

Maybe they tossed a coin?

[Ali623]

Maybe they tossed a coin?

 

Heads, Stroll get's the upgrade. Tails, Vettel doesn't.

[HeadFirst]

Maybe they tossed a coin?

 

When the car is that bad, does it really matter who drives it? Neither driver makes difference. A thought ... has Seb already indicated his intentions for next year?

[ARTGP]

Easy to say. Perhaps it is nothing more than a last gasp experiment, Stroll's the guinea pig. Have you considered that Vettel took a pass on the upgrades?

 

 I would hope that Vettel conceded as it would be a bit unfair otherwise.

[ARTGP]

When the car is that bad, does it really matter who drives it? Neither driver makes difference. A thought ... has Seb already indicated his intentions for next year?

 

Well with the rumours of the B-spec being half a car, it could be night and day between the two cars (Aston will be hoping...).

 

If B-spec is somehow a step backwards, it would all be moot of course. 

Edited by ARTGP, 15 May 2022 - 15:01.

[HeadFirst]

Well with the rumours of the B-spec being half a car, it could be night and day between the two cars (Aston will be hoping...).

 

If B-spec is somehow a step backwards, it would all be moot of course. 

 

Fortunately this is not like the olden days, when the #2 was always the "test" driver on race weekend. Without modern simulations and CAD, running the new parts was often a bit dicey.

[Autodromo]

I don't know so I am asking; would a driver like Vettel (who prefers a well-nailed-down rear end) defer on an upgrade if it would potentially make the rear end looser?  That Stroll might be able to take better advantage?

[Astandahl]

I don't know so I am asking; would a driver like Vettel (who prefers a well-nailed-down rear end) defer on an upgrade if it would potentially make the rear end looser?  That Stroll might be able to take better advantage?

Highly unlikely considering the current situation (car not being very good).

 

Stroll always had a better treatment compared to his teammate after Stroll Sr. became the owner of the Team. There is nothing strange in this case.  They are probably struggling with production and gave Stroll priority.

Edited by Astandahl, 15 May 2022 - 17:12.

[charly0418]

I love how Seb fans are pissed at things that already happened in 2019. Lawrence being a douchebag, Lance getting upgrades first, the team having no ability no develop a concept on their own.

They ignored our warnings

[Claymore25]

Last year STroll got all the updates always first and Vettel still defeated him

[BRG]

Then there is no reason to worry about it, is there?

[ARTGP]

Then there is no reason to worry about it, is there?

 

Well it's not about Stroll vs Vettel. It's about who can maximize the package to score the most points for AMR.  If Vettel is finishing ahead, but being handicapped by an inferior package, then that makes no sense to give Stroll the upgrades first. 

Edited by ARTGP, 16 May 2022 - 13:32.

[New Britain]

I love how Seb fans are pissed at things that already happened in 2019. Lawrence being a douchebag, Lance getting upgrades first, the team having no ability no develop a concept on their own.

They ignored our warnings

Perhaps Vettel believed commitments he was given by Lawrence Stroll?

[BRG]

Well it's not about Stroll vs Vettel. 

People here certainly seem to see it that way, don't they?

Perhaps Vettel believed commitments he was given by Lawrence Stroll?

What commitments?  "Here, have this massive pay-cheque" was the main commitment. 

 

What about Vettel's commitment he gave to Lawrence Stroll "Sign me, I can win for you"

[New Britain]

People here certainly seem to see it that way, don't they?

What commitments?  "Here, have this massive pay-cheque" was the main commitment. 

 

What about Vettel's commitment he gave to Lawrence Stroll "Sign me, I can win for you"

It may have happened that way but we don't know, do we?

[Nathan]

the team having no ability (to?) develop a concept on their own.
 

What about the previous 30 years??

 

  

[charly0418]

What about the previous 30 years??

 

  

 

this isnt Force India or Jordan. Theres almost no one left from those days other than Andrew Green and Andy Stevenson

[Claymore25]

People here certainly seem to see it that way, don't they?

What commitments?  "Here, have this massive pay-cheque" was the main commitment. 

 

What about Vettel's commitment he gave to Lawrence Stroll "Sign me, I can win for you"

Could have been in Hungary last year if Aston Martin did not ****ed the pit stop and the fuel problem, so Vettel fullfilled his commitment.

[BRG]

Well, he didn't win though, but we can let that go.  So what commitments did Stroll make to Vettel that he has failed to deliver?  He has paid the obscenely large retainer (not as large as some others but still more than most of us would earn in a lifetime) but what else is he supposed to have promised?  

[Claymore25]

Well, he didn't win though, but we can let that go.  So what commitments did Stroll make to Vettel that he has failed to deliver?  He has paid the obscenely large retainer (not as large as some others but still more than most of us would earn in a lifetime) but what else is he supposed to have promised?  

A race winner car. That's what Stroll senior promised him.

[HeadFirst]

A race winner car. That's what Stroll senior promised him.

 

Did he really? Was there a time frame on that? If Seb believed that Stroll could take the team from scoring the odd podium and 1 lucky win to winning races on merit in 2 years against Mercedes, Ferrari and Red Bull, he is a fool. I don't think Seb is a fool.

[Shell]

Will Aston Martin surpass Alfa Romeo thanks to the new upgrades coming this weekend ?!

[BerniesDad]

Will Aston Martin surpass Alfa Romeo thanks to the new upgrades coming this weekend ?!

I'd love to see it happen, but shan't be holding my breath. And even if they reach the dizzying heights of being quicker than Alfa Romeo, it's hardly going to pop any corks. Don't think that what Stroll Sr. invested his money for.

[F1 Mike]

The way the team is clearly sided with Stroll Jnr is a clear indication to me that it will never be successful in its current configuration.
There is no clear evidence that Lance is consistently better than Vettel. It's not a Schumacher vs Barrichello type scenario.

I can't imagine it's a situation that would generate a lot of confidence across the factory either, especially after having your team leader walk out the door after some moderate success in his time at the helm.

Edited by F1 Mike, 17 May 2022 - 16:43.

[charly0418]

A race winner car. That's what Stroll senior promised him.

 

Um.... what?

[Claymore25]

Um.... what?

Vettel like Alonso signed with the promised of having a good car (means at least one or two race wins) if not they go home. Believe otherwise it's simple naive.

[ARTGP]

We were told that Aston Martin chose their 2019 W10 design because they wanted to full focus on the next set of regs. Surely Seb assumed they would be where Alfa Romeo are or better (winning). It's not been anything close unfortunately. 

 

I think regardless of whether you think Aston could win or not, Vettel certainly did not sign on to get knocked out in Q1/Q2 and it's doubtful this season so far, is what he was promised. 

Edited by ARTGP, 17 May 2022 - 20:09.

[MikeTekRacing]

A race winner car. That's what Stroll senior promised him.

and do you think Seb still believes in fairy tales? 

They all say they want to design winning cars. The year before Seb came the car actually won a race - so thinking they could carry on and build on that could have been a thing on Seb's mind.

Someone with more insight though would think that a "Mercedes B car" will be hard to improve and iterate on, and that 2020 would be a 1 off for Racing point. 

 

Stroll promising a race winner happened for sure. Seb believing it - I am not so sure

[Autodromo]

and do you think Seb still believes in fairy tales? 

They all say they want to design winning cars. The year before Seb came the car actually won a race - so thinking they could carry on and build on that could have been a thing on Seb's mind.

Someone with more insight though would think that a "Mercedes B car" will be hard to improve and iterate on, and that 2020 would be a 1 off for Racing point. 

 

Stroll promising a race winner happened for sure. Seb believing it - I am not so sure

I think at that point Seb was mostly trying to keep racing.  His stock had dropped dramatically and he is smart enough to know that having a teammate who is the son of the team's owner means you will never receive preferential treatment.  I am sure he would love to win and I think he has some more races in him, but I doubt he seriously believed that AM would be at the front.  He has been in top teams and while I do not know for sure, I doubt AM is run like one.

[HeadFirst]

And as it turns out, both SEB and Lance got the upgrades, and the car is declared legal after an investigation by the FIA. Much more fun to bad-mouth a team and it's owner though isn't it.

[Claymore25]

Vettel destroyed Stroll.

[ARTGP]

They were both in the points at one point. Was the pace any good?

[Disgrace]

Vettel destroyed Stroll.

 

Since the Australia disaster, he's quietly been one of the top drivers of the season so far. Miami, Imola and Barcelona have all been top performances.

[William Hunt]

Stroll seems to have tangled with someone (not the first time) but I had missed that incident, was just having a very short toilet break when that happened, who did he tangle with and who was at fault? Don't think he lost much time with it.