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Ferrari's strategic incompetence - can Binotto survive?


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Poll: Will Binotto survive? (204 member(s) have cast votes)

Will Binotto survive?

  1. Yes (94 votes [46.08%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 46.08%

  2. No (110 votes [53.92%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 53.92%

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#1 Disgrace

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:42

What is going on at Ferrari? Is there any historical precedent for this level of race operations incompetence from a title-fighting team?

 

Williams in 1995? Ferrari themselves at the finale in 2010? Something else?

 

Why does Binotto insist on denying that there's a problem? How can he possibly survive this? Will he?

 

Is Binotto even the problem? If not, who else on the pitwall is calling Ferrari's strategy so catastrophically wrong every race?



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#2 BoDarvelle

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:43

Who's his boss?



#3 Ev0d3vil

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:43

Did they make such bad calls pre 2022 ?



#4 TheAviator

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:44

Can he? Yes. Should he? No.

#5 George Costanza

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:44

It's different than 1995 Williams. Williams were defending champions since 1992 and then won it absolute dominant fashion in 1996.

But I think he unfortunately stays at Ferrari.

Edited by George Costanza, 31 July 2022 - 15:55.


#6 TheFish

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:46

Denying all the problems is odd. They’ve thrown away 3 wins for Leclerc that instantly come to mind (Silverstone, Monaco and today plus Leclerc messing up France). I can’t ever remember a team being this bad with such a good car.

Binotto is showing he isn’t a competent leader, but I have no clue who they could get in to replace him.

#7 Ev0d3vil

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:47

Denying all the problems is odd. They’ve thrown away 3 wins for Leclerc that instantly come to mind (Silverstone, Monaco and today plus Leclerc messing up France). I can’t ever remember a team being this bad with such a good car.

Binotto is showing he isn’t a competent leader, but I have no clue who they could get in to replace him.

Bring Arrivabene back!



#8 Ferrari2183

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:51

Bring Arrivabene back!


Hell no. Arrivabene is too busy f@cking Juventus up…

#9 MJB5990

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:52

Survive for how long?


I mean he might make the end of the season but I can't see a future after that.

#10 George Costanza

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:53

Bring Arrivabene back!


Ross Brawn is the guy but he won't do that.

#11 DeKnyff

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:54

TBH, I'm not sure Binotto should be made directly accountable for the strategical mistakes. Other than this, I modestly believe that he has made a decent job, bringing the team back to the top.

 

But it's clear that their strategists seem to enter into panic mode time after time. Maybe a new leadership is required in that area?



#12 krea

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:54

Vettel is free next season 



#13 Jones Foyer

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:54

The whole management structure seems comfortable with themselves. No one is taking responsibility, nothing will change. Despite it all, Binotto will likely be retaining his seat in 2023…that’s how poorly things are run. They don’t make the adjustments they need across the board at every level. It’s an organization with no ideas for solutions so they are paralyzed with indecision.

#14 ARTGP

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:56

Binotto is not the one who makes the strat calls, but his unwillingness to hire the right people to do that job will be a stain on his career if Ferrari don't bring home a title because of it. 



#15 HP

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:56

I don't know if he will be sacked from that position. IMO he should make way for someone else and focus on what he is best at, focussing on the technical side within the Ferrari team. That scenario probably would be best for Ferrari.



#16 SilverArrow31

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:59

Ross Brawn is the guy but he won't do that.


Oh Ross Brawn becoming the big boss at Ferrari... that's up there on the things I'd like to see that will never happen

#17 vlado

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:59

Its not him, but he should probably push for a change on the strategy crew, otherwise it will be tricky to win races.. 



#18 ARTGP

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 15:59

Unfortunately I strongly believe that employment at Ferrari is highly political in nature, so people remain because of social power and not necessarily performance. Maybe Binotto is unable to get rid of the people that need to go for that reason.

Edited by ARTGP, 31 July 2022 - 16:00.


#19 Garagista

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:02

It is not Binotto, it is the mentality. Ferrari can't continue to behave as they are great just because they are Ferrari.

It is time to look at Red Bull and Mercedes the last 12 years champions and learn with them. More agile teams and less proudness for the good sake of being proud.

I think people like Silvia are the clear example of what needs to change (based on the drive to survive)

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#20 Leibowitz

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:02

The strategy wasn't that much of a problem during the Domenicalli era. Yes, Abu Dhabi happened under his watch, but no one knew that tyres would last that long and it was perfectly reasonable to cover Webber.

As for today's Ferrari, it would be an understatement to call this amateurish mistake. And ultimately Binotto bears the blame, so he should be sacked (ASAP in my opinion).



#21 motorhead

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:02

Binotto is not the one who makes the strat calls, but his unwillingness to hire the right people to do that job will be a stain on his career if Ferrari don't bring home a title because of it. 

 

I believe the strategy above Binotto is still to hire best Italian guys to do the jobs. 



#22 STRFerrari4Ever

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:06

I don’t know if the big wigs(Elkan et al) are ruthless enough to take a stand and make quite clearly necessary changes to the situation. It could be hiring someone else as TP and Binotto goes back to focus on the car and it’s development because he is not a leader and he’s sounding more and more like a deluded politician clinging on.

I have yet to see a car of this speed and consistency get wasted by strategic incompetence that is self inflicted each and every time. How do you not win at Monaco and Hungaroring whilst leading and being the fastest car out on track? Unbelievable

#23 STRFerrari4Ever

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:10

Also, you can question Binotto’s merits as a leader because Rueda is still the Head of Strategy despite being terrible ever since he’s been in that position, I agree with a post above about certain positions and hiring potentially involving social clout or standing within the organisation/team. Any other competent business would eradicate a repeated weakness that stems from the individual(s) preparing race strategies and approaches to a race.

#24 FLB

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:11

I believe the strategy above Binotto is still to hire best Italian guys to do the jobs. 

Not this again...

 

 

(Two of the engineers getting the most blame, Inaki Rueda and Laurent Mékiès, are not Italian. Rueda is Spanish and Mékiès is French)



#25 jimjimjeroo

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:13

Whitmarsh

#26 Tenmantaylor

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:14

Needs to go ASAP. Ferrari are terminally operationally deficient under his 'leadership'.

They should be leading both championships comfortably and working together to beat Max. Instead, when they are fighting each for favorable strategy, they are fighting drivers they shouldn't be and making beyond poor strategy calls every week.

#27 Scaboo22

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:16

It’s quite astonishing, I don’t remember a team with such a strong car throw away so many wins on strategy alone.

Binotto should get credit though for the amazing car they’ve created. But there need to be changes in the race management(strategy) department.

If they don’t want to sack Binotto they should at least try and hire someone to help get this team in order. Maybe Jean Todt as a consultant/advisor to help reshape the strategy department would help a lot. Not sure if he’d be interested but they should at least try.

Inaki Rueda on the other hand should 100% lose his job, no question about that.

#28 JRodrigues

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:18

The strategy wasn't that much of a problem during the Domenicalli era. Yes, Abu Dhabi happened under his watch, but no one knew that tyres would last that long and it was perfectly reasonable to cover Webber.

As for today's Ferrari, it would be an understatement to call this amateurish mistake. And ultimately Binotto bears the blame, so he should be sacked (ASAP in my opinion).

 

Strategy was already a problem in 2008.

Silverstone 2008, the "great win" for Hamilton who was under threat from Kimi until the pitstops where they didn't change his tires, while Hamilton did. Everyone saw that, and he (Kimi) ended up pitting again.



#29 FullOppositeLock

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:18

Binotto is not the one who makes the strat calls, but his unwillingness to hire the right people to do that job will be a stain on his career if Ferrari don't bring home a title because of it.


An even bigger stain than being the man responsible for their power unit cheating in 2019? He managed to survive that disgrace, so this should be a walk in the park for him.

#30 Marklar

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:19

the team was already 2018 operationally very poor (they made Merc look like gods, like they do now), it was just easier to hide because Vettel was ****ing up himself a lot. But it's a similar case of a championship that is (probably) decided with a huge gap when it really should go down to the last race

Kinda puzzling that they cant seem to find a way out. They were until 2015-ish really not bad at this. What happened? Wasnt the current strategist hired around that time?


Edited by Marklar, 31 July 2022 - 16:20.


#31 OvDrone

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:19

Drive to Survive should have this season exclusively with Ferrari.

I'd watch that in a heartbeat. 

ecww70kxgaacmaf.jpg


Edited by OvDrone, 31 July 2022 - 16:24.


#32 Leibowitz

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:21

Strategy was already a problem in 2008.

Silverstone 2008, the "great win" for Hamilton who was under threat from Kimi until the pitstops where they didn't change his tires, while Hamilton did. Everyone saw that, and he (Kimi) ended up pitting again.

 

I agree that it was a problem, but not as acute as it is today. They'd make mistakes here and there, but overall it was relatively ok. 



#33 FLB

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:21

I know it's Lapo, but there's anger at the very top:

 

Lapo Elkann sur Twitter : "" / Twitter



#34 hayabusasc

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:22

Heads must roll for these repeated mistakes. Its almost like the strategists are not watching the race.

#35 Cyanide

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:23

The bigger question is - should Charles do something about this and if yes, what could he do?

 

Imo, he has to demand new strategists and an engineer - for the former, I'm sure Sainz would agree as well.



#36 jwill189

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:23

Drive to Survive should have this season exclusively with Ferrari.

I'd watch that in a heartbeat. 

 

The theme music should have something with calliopes. As horrific as Alpine's strategy was today (I thought they pulled a Ferrari), Ferrari outdid Ferrari.



#37 SophieB

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:24

I know it's Lapo, but there's anger at the very top:

 

Lapo Elkann sur Twitter : "" / Twitter

Who is Lapo? I’m not up on the latest Ferrari/Chrysler corporate movings and shakings.



#38 Casey

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:24

What is Jean Todt doing today ?



#39 RedRabbit

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:25

Well, he better not. Along with the entire pitwall and several others. I don't support the firing culture, but these idiots have had a few years now, and were also in charge during the "questionable" engine saga.

I genuinely hope that little trip to the motor home was to collect his P45 or the Italian equivalent.

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#40 GunnarN7

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:25

The strategy wasn't that much of a problem during the Domenicalli era. Yes, Abu Dhabi happened under his watch, but no one knew that tyres would last that long and it was perfectly reasonable to cover Webber.

As for today's Ferrari, it would be an understatement to call this amateurish mistake. And ultimately Binotto bears the blame, so he should be sacked (ASAP in my opinion).

 

 

And Chris Dyer was fired without hesitation right after Abu Dhabi despite that being the only major mistake in the entire season. Meanwhile this season they've had multiple embarrassing errors, they might not have been in the very last race but they have cost them the championship all the same.

 

I'm usually against pointing fingers but I in this case that strategy team is irredeemable. It just doesn't work. Binotto and the lot of them should take responsibility.



#41 Mercstar

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:25

This team is too arrogant and entitled to win. They need to get their heads out of their asses. Complete change in culture needed.

#42 motorhead

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:26

Not this again...

 

 

(Two of the engineers getting the most blame, Inaki Rueda and Laurent Mékiès, are not Italian. Rueda is Spanish and Mékiès is French)

 

Well, what do I know. Berger seems to think so too https://www.planetf1...alian-approach/


Edited by motorhead, 31 July 2022 - 16:26.


#43 w1Y

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:26

No wonder red bull like fighting ferrari.

After all the reasons everyone wanted rule changes we have ended up with even bigger dominance. But people won't moan

#44 Marklar

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:26

Strategy was already a problem in 2008.

Silverstone 2008, the "great win" for Hamilton who was under threat from Kimi until the pitstops where they didn't change his tires, while Hamilton did. Everyone saw that, and he (Kimi) ended up pitting again.

Isolated blunders are fine. RB does them too, Merc does them plenty. People say Abu Dhabi 2010, but overall Ferrari was run well operationally during Alonso's time. It's when the blunders are the rule rather than the exceptions when it gets critical

 

 

The bigger question is - should Charles do something about this and if yes, what could he do?

 

Imo, he has to demand new strategists and an engineer - for the former, I'm sure Sainz would agree as well.

not sure what blame the engineer has, the performance is fine (although strategy ties in with feedback). Communication is something you have to work on as a driver as well. But that hasnt stopped others before.


Edited by Marklar, 31 July 2022 - 16:29.


#45 P123

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:26

It will be more people than just Binotto.  Who runs strategy?  What input does Leclerc's engineer have?

 

Binotto interviews after any screw up tend to come across as disingenuous waffle that hold a lot of hope that people take what he says at face value...



#46 FLB

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:27

Who is Lapo? I’m not up on the latest Ferrari/Chrysler corporate movings and shakings.

Lapo Elkann, John Elkann's brother. Sit on the board Generally considered a bit... eccentric, but he's passionate about Ferrari. 



#47 Marklar

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:27

Who is Lapo? I’m not up on the latest Ferrari/Chrysler corporate movings and shakings.

John Elkann's brother

Edit: ninjaad dammit


Edited by Marklar, 31 July 2022 - 16:28.


#48 messy

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:28

At this rate they’ll not even finish second in the WCC. Which would be a complete joke.

#49 Cyanide

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:30

Isolated blunders are fine. RB does them too, Merc does them plenty. People say Abu Dhabi 2010, but overall Ferrari was run well operationally during Alonso's time. It's when the blunders are the rule rather than the exceptions when it gets critical

 

 

not sure what blame the engineer has, the performance is fine. Communication is something you have to work on as a driver as well. But that hasnt stopped others before.

Both engineers are mediocre in terms of communication. Last race, they told Sainz he had a 5s stop/go penalty, where it was just a 5s penalty.



#50 GuilhermeMach

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Posted 31 July 2022 - 16:31

At this rate they’ll not even finish second in the WCC. Which would be a complete joke.

The threat is real. To think that after Monaco people who were suggesting this were being ridiculed...