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Niel Allen - RIP


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#51 Ian G

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 23:22

Were there club meetings at Catalina and Oran Park ?

 

 

 

Hazy memory these days but AFAIK the only club meetings were at WF. back then. There were Club Lap Dashes in the early 1960's at OP.



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#52 Ray Bell

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 03:13

It would be nice if Terry came back with some details about the earlier E-type...

 

And any other information he has on pre-Lotus 26R racing.



#53 Wirra

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 03:34



Hazy memory these days but AFAIK the only club meetings were at WF. back then. There were Club Lap Dashes in the early 1960's at OP.

 

There were sizeable club meetings at OP in the 60s. An RCN reported 5000 spectators at a WF meeting and I'd suggest at least similar, if not more, were at OP club meetings.

 

Here is a Lance Ruting photo giving some indication.

 

Phil-racing-2-s.jpg



#54 Ian G

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 07:17

There were sizeable club meetings at OP in the 60s. An RCN reported 5000 spectators at a WF meeting and I'd suggest at least similar, if not more, were at OP club meetings.

 

 

 

Ok,i don't remember them,i thought the Singer Car Club only did demonstration runs for its members.



#55 Ray Bell

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 07:25

The Warwick Farm Club Meetings had a huge injection of spectators from a promotion the AARC did with radio station 2GB...

 

The station were at that time running a 'club' called the '870 Club' with various prizes and so on. The AARC offered free admission and/or grandstands seats to either one or two of their Club Meetings to 870 Club members and they attracted the biggest crowds seen at such meetings. And don't forget that Warwick Farm was readily accessible by suburban rail, while a car was a necessity to get to Oran Park.

 

The Singer Car Club, which became the NSW Road Racing Club, promoted all the Oran Park meetings for years, but I don't recall any of them being Club Meetings as such, rather they were National Open Meetings. I can check the RCN calendars if you like. And that looks like Ray Scanlan letting the Holdens go by in his Simca, The Fiat in on the inside might be Grahame Ward.



#56 MarkBisset

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 08:20

042-AEF07-1-E6-B-43-F8-92-C5-B43-B1-B3-D

 

Niel Allen in his E-Type, WF on June 6, 1964 (Cummins Family Collection)

 

See this article for a snippet by Paul Cummins on Allen’s race use of this roadie :https://primotipo.co...acing-random-7/

 

The John Smailes piece I posted also has a mention of the TR3 and Jag


Edited by MarkBisset, 19 August 2022 - 08:24.


#57 Wirra

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 09:42

...The Singer Car Club, which became the NSW Road Racing Club, promoted all the Oran Park meetings for years, but I don't recall any of them being Club Meetings as such, rather they were National Open Meetings....

 

I have a vague recollection they may have been called 'Closed' meetings rather than 'Club'? It's my brother in the FIAT.



#58 Ray Bell

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 10:43

That's right...

 

Closed meetings vs National Open meetings.



#59 ReWind

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 14:05

We all know it was N. E. Allen, both in business and in racing.

Does anyone know what "E." stands for?

(I'm just curious.)



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#60 Ray Bell

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 14:24

I expressed that same curiosity early in the thread...

 

It wasn't there in the newspaper or funeral director notifications. I might give Warwick a call and see if it was on the Order of Service.

 

That pic Mark has posted does rather well illustrate what we saw when Niel was racing this Jag, but as in the Smailes story, the right-handers saw his head out the window. And there's a lot of right-handers at Warwick Farm.



#61 Tim Murray

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 16:00

Here’s an earlier thread on Niel:

Niel Allen

It includes this post from Terry McGrath with details of the Jaguar XK120 Niel owned in around 1960:

I was interested to see this thread as I wasn't on the forum 10 years but as a matter of reference Neil Allens's race career started a little earlier than the E type as in feb 1960 he brought an ex Stillwell XK120 (chassis no 660214) that was prepared for racing he was a member of the North Shore Sporting Car Club and I believe entered some events in the car selling it in 1961.His E type from memory a cream 3.8 litre coupe maybe a roadster, a car I don't believe he brought new I have not been able to identify it but if anyone can help with photos particularly one showing a rego number it would be of great help to tie this car down to a chassis number.The XK120 660214 was up for auction recently at Bonhams at the Pebble beach weekend.The full history of this car can be seen in our new book "The Jaguar XK120 in the Southern hemisphere" by john elmgreen and terry mcgrath.



#62 Bob Riebe

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 17:27

He was just a name and pictures I knew when I was in my glory years of teens and early twenties but with his passing, and the passing of his like, the wonder years of my youth is passing also. ):



#63 TerryS

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Posted 21 August 2022 - 01:46

It would be nice if Terry came back with some details about the earlier E-type...

 

And any other information he has on pre-Lotus 26R racing.

 

I recall hearing about the first E Type from mates in the seventies. They were talking about how wild he was, The car was a roadster and light cream or white.

Two posters in the Niel Allen thread have noted it.

 

As for his pre 26R racing this gets a bit confusing. Before the E types there are some contradictions. In the Speedcafe interview he says his first competition was in an Austin Healey Six.

In the John Smailes interview he says it was a triumph TR3A.

 

As for the Jaguar XK120 ex Stillwell, I had never heard of it before. Although "race prepared" I think he may have only used it as a road car. Also I think this may have been the car in the street at Cremorne.



#64 Ray Bell

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Posted 21 August 2022 - 08:54

Terry, going on Warwick Farm entries and races, I've uncovered what I posted previously:

 

He ran a TR3A at an open meeting in June, 1962. That was prior to the first meeting I ever attended, in October of that year.

 

I found the mention of the 100/6 in the report on the AARC Club meeting on November 3, 1963. By that time I was going to every race meeting in or around Sydney and I saw the grey E-type at both open and closed Warwick Farm meetings as well as at Catalina Park, I cannot recall ever seeing a cream open-top E-type on the circuits at all. There is no card for such a car in Allen's name at any time, so it would have to have been at another circuit, or possibly Towac.

 

To find this car on the circuit we would have to be looking between June, 1962 and June, 1964. I don't believe he would have raced it once he had the grey closed car. But the anomoly is the 100/6, which shows up just eight months before the grey E-type. Would he have gone backwards from the E-type to a Healey? Would he have had both cars at the same time, and if so, why race both?

 

Niel did gain a reputation of being 'spectacular' in the E-type. Big spins at the Warwick Farm Club meeting in August, 1964, would have contributed to that while damage to the Elan at its first outing, even though it wasn't his doing kept this going.



#65 Ray Bell

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Posted 28 August 2022 - 23:34

In the same issue of Racing Car News as the report on the Lakeside race meeting at which Niel crashed appeared, Dr Michael Henderson had this article about the results of it...
 
0822fr0968henderson1.jpg
 
0822fr0968henderson2.jpg

 

Of note in the pictures is, as I have described elsewhere, Niel in the remains of the tub lying on its side...

 

Also of note is the fact that the whole crew and a marshal have run to the scene. I described previously how the ambulance at the other end of the circuit was running around in circles looking for a way to get there while the one serving this section sat beside the control tower, its driver unconcerned, and when moved to action he drove quite slowly to the scene.

 

Wayne Eckersly, as I recall, was first to reach the scene. Peter Molloy is at the left in that pic, apparently supporting Niel's head.

 

Peter was to have nightmares for years that the crash was his fault, I have recently learned. He had lightened the steering arms on the front uprights and one of them was broken, though who's to say whether it broke and caused the crash or it was broken in the crash.

 

Niel later on consulted Jim Bertram, showing him an original steering arm and asking Jim if he thought it could be safely lightened... basically Jim said, "No, I don't think so."



#66 TerryS

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Posted 30 August 2022 - 01:28

Ray, in your post #11 on the Niel Allen thread you noted "the Mini he raced earlier"

 

Can you please tell us more about that?



#67 Ray Bell

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Posted 30 August 2022 - 12:46

Yeah, sure...

 

Niel acquired the Ron Clarke Mini, which was typically the second or third fastest of the 1310cc Minis racing. That was in late 1964 or early 1965, I'm not at home to check the magazines but I know he ran it at least once at Catalina (I reckon that would have been the January meeting of 1965) and I have the Warwick Farm record of him running at the International Meeting of 1965. There may also have been an AARC Club Meeting too, I don't recall him running it at Oran Park.

 

It was painted the same colour as the grey E-type and it might have been the car Phil Barnes raced later. At the Farm he was about three seconds slower than Brian Foley.



#68 pacificquay

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Posted 01 September 2022 - 15:52

What’s the origins I wonder of his name being spelled Niel rather than Neil as would be more usual.

 

In fact aside from him I’ve never seen it spelled that way - presumably pronounced the same?



#69 Ray Bell

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Posted 01 September 2022 - 22:34

Pronounced the same, yes...

 

Maybe his parents were sticklers for the "I before E except after C" rule?



#70 john medley

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Posted 01 September 2022 - 22:53

A relative-by-marriage of Niel told me (true or not) it was short for Daniel.



#71 Lee Nicolle

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Posted 02 September 2022 - 04:41

Pronounced the same, yes...

 

Maybe his parents were sticklers for the "I before E except after C" rule?

A kid at school was caned because he refused to spell his name the'accepted' way. His parents had put a Euro connotation on his name,, and yes it was what was on his birth certificate.

A couple of times I had issues as well with Lee. Then the American way. At that time the english Leigh was the 'accepted' way. This all before 1970. My grandparents on mums side were Scottish American. Common these days.

Even in fairly recent times an ex g/f  daughter was in trouble because her name was pronounced DEEanna instead of the 'accepted' Dianna. Her parents are Serb and that is the way it is pronounced there.

Even Kym and Kim has caused issues as well.

My brother also had problems with Cleve,, teacher insisted it was Clive!! Again common name now but not in the 60s. And again the American is coming through