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Kimi@Watkins Glen


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#1 Primo

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 20:17

I see no thread discussing Kimi getting behind the wheel in a NASCAR at Watkins Glen this weekend. I'm curious, I will definitely watch it, but... what are his chances?
Will the regulars let him race at least a few laps before they bump him off the road? I think he will still have the speed to do at least better than JJ in Indycar, but I doubt he is as fast as the top guys. Who is the fastest road course guy, by the way? 



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#2 Myrvold

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 20:21

I see no thread discussing Kimi getting behind the wheel in a NASCAR at Watkins Glen this weekend. I'm curious, I will definitely watch it, but... what are his chances?
Will the regulars let him race at least a few laps before they bump him off the road? I think he will still have the speed to do at least better than JJ in Indycar, but I doubt he is as fast as the top guys. Who is the fastest road course guy, by the way? 

 

NASCAR has fallen in Autosport-forum popularity. So even in a race with Daniil Kvyat, Kimi Räikkönen and Mike Rockenfeller, it's the NASCAR-season thread that's king.

He'll probably get the same experience as Joey Hand if he starts getting into the top 15 positions. As he isn't a full-time driver, it's a lot more bumping and banging to get him out of the way, no dangers in doing so. The exception might be that the full-time drivers have been "adviced" not to act like that towards Räikkönen, as that car is a car meant for "international stars" that will help NASCAR PR, and it looks bad to intentionally dump him.



#3 Mark521

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 20:41

Who is the fastest road course guy, by the way? 

 

Full time active drivers only would be Chase Elliott but AJ Almendinger is a typical "road course ringer".  I see Joey Hand is racing too, I met him back in 2001 in Houston when he was first in Atlantics, I probably still have his autograph somewhere  :rotfl: .

I don't typically watch Nascar anymore but I'll have to set a reminder for this to see where Kimi ends up.



#4 Primo

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 20:44

The exception might be that the full-time drivers have been "adviced" not to act like that towards Räikkönen, as that car is a car meant for "international stars" that will help NASCAR PR, and it looks bad to intentionally dump him.

Yes, I was thinking along those lines, that it'd be good for the "show", the sponsors etcetera, if Kimi stays in there for a while.



#5 GlenWatkins

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 20:59

I'll be setting my DVR, it will be fascinating to see how Kimi does.



#6 loki

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 21:21

Kimi won’t get any special treatment.  If he does something to deserve to be dumped or gets in the wrong guy’s way they’ll dump him.  He can give as good as he gets.   If he gets a top 10 he’ll be doing great.



#7 bargeboard

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 21:50

Who is the fastest road course guy, by the way?


Toss up between Tyler Reddick and Chase Elliott IMO. AJ Allmendinger, Ryan Blaney and Austin Cindric are right there as well.

#8 Primo

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 21:50

Kimi won’t get any special treatment.  If he does something to deserve to be dumped or gets in the wrong guy’s way they’ll dump him.  He can give as good as he gets.   If he gets a top 10 he’ll be doing great.

I have not watched a lot of NASCAR, but it seems to me that simply "being ahead" makes you "deserve" to be punted. The Demolition Derby aspect of NASCAR is why I rarely bother to watch a whole race.



#9 KWSN - DSM

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 22:00

Boris Said still being recruited for road courses?



#10 Tenmantaylor

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 22:14

I think he'll do better than most expect, Watkins will suit Kimi, high speed sweepers like Spa. Epic slinging a Nascar round there he will love it.

#11 danmills

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 22:35

Great track for Kimi to run at. He will be faster than we probably expect. Might raise some eyebrows, can see him getting some smart overtakes in.

#12 paulb

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 23:01

He is working hard in preparation for the race, https://racer.com/20...ckhouses-marks/ and https://racer.com/20...t-watkins-glen/



#13 KWSN - DSM

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 23:01

Montoya did nothing of importance for 10 years, I expect Kimi to do nothing this weekend.



#14 Primo

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 23:43

Montoya did nothing of importance for 10 years, I expect Kimi to do nothing this weekend.

He won in his first season. This is Kimi's first season ;)



#15 KWSN - DSM

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Posted 17 August 2022 - 23:51

He won in his first season. This is Kimi's first season ;)

 

I stand corrected.



#16 William Hunt

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 01:17

He won in his first season. This is Kimi's first season ;)

 

Well Kim tried the NASCAR trucks before (which is the 3rd level) and was pretty good at it.



#17 loki

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 01:20

An issue with Kimi last time around in trucks and Nationwide was that he didn’t want to listen to others with more experience.   Hopefully this time he’ll take those into account. 

 

Montoya also did an ARCA and a couple of Busch races with the finale Cup date in 2006 prior to his first full Cup season.  He was in a bit better position than Kimi is now.  He was a talent on road course but didn’t quite take to ovals the same way.  Both he and Kimi have the sort of attitude it takes to make it in Nascar.



#18 William Hunt

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 01:23

I remember Montoya doing pretty well in NASCAR, in particular for a driver who came from outside the stock car world.  Kimi was running as high as 4th even I think in his NASCAR truck debut, sure he did show he had the skill for it.
Magnussen also had a go at a NASCAR race once.


Edited by William Hunt, 18 August 2022 - 01:24.


#19 loki

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 01:28

Well Kim tried the NASCAR trucks before (which is the 3rd level) and was pretty good at it.

He finished 15th in his single truck race and 27th in Nationwide the next weekend.



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#20 loki

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 01:35

I remember Montoya doing pretty well in NASCAR, in particular for a driver who came from outside the stock car world.  Kimi was running as high as 4th even I think in his NASCAR truck debut, sure he did show he had the skill for it.
Magnussen also had a go at a NASCAR race once.

In 255 Cup starts 2 wins,  24 top 5, 59 top 10, 9 poles, avg finish 19.8.

 

https://www.racing-r..._Pablo_Montoya/



#21 jonpollak

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 01:45

Nice to see a thread for this even if only cuz Kimster.

I’m hoping for a top 15 finish and a qualy of anywhere from P10-P20.

Good thing is he is with a winning team.
Jp

#22 Primo

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 03:05

He finished 15th in his single truck race and 27th in Nationwide the next weekend.

Did you watch the races?



#23 krapmeister

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 03:30

In 255 Cup starts 2 wins, 24 top 5, 59 top 10, 9 poles, avg finish 19.8.

https://www.racing-r..._Pablo_Montoya/

And the only driver to take down a jet dryer on track during a race, let alone while under caution

Edited by krapmeister, 18 August 2022 - 03:30.


#24 BoDarvelle

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 04:43

In 255 Cup starts 2 wins,  24 top 5, 59 top 10, 9 poles, avg finish 19.8.

 

https://www.racing-r..._Pablo_Montoya/

 

Going entirely from memory here, but it seems JPM was pretty competitive on the roadies early in his time in Nascar.

 

I wouldn't be surprised to see Kimi in the top ten in this race.

 

Mag and Mick took a previous gen car for a spin on the Charlotte roval after Miami and the Stewart Haas guys were saying how impressed they were with their speed for just jumping in the car. I think it's a bit easier going from open wheel to stock car, on a road course, than it is the opposite.



#25 absinthedude

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 05:31

I think the time JPM started was the last time I had even a passing interest in NASCAR cup racing. It's probably morphed out of all recognition in the intervening years but Kimi generates interest.



#26 loki

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 06:16

Did you watch the races?

Yep.  And followed the ton of press before and after.  It was a big deal in the racing scene here and I was still racing at that point as well.  He burned some bridges at the time as he was supposed to do a 3 race deal in trucks with KBM but after the truck race switched to a Nationwide car that Shrub didn’t own.  I’d bet any acrimony has long since subsided.

 

He ran well in the truck race but was never a contender.  It was a great result.  He didn’t do so well in the Nationwide car.



#27 loki

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 06:22

Nice to see a thread for this even if only cuz Kimster.

I’m hoping for a top 15 finish and a qualy of anywhere from P10-P20.

Good thing is he is with a winning team.
Jp

 

Yeah those guys at GanassiCar Trackhouse do pretty well.  It should be as good a shot as he had at KBM in the truck.  I’d like to see him on some ovals again.



#28 SenorSjon

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 07:56

I have not watched a lot of NASCAR, but it seems to me that simply "being ahead" makes you "deserve" to be punted. The Demolition Derby aspect of NASCAR is why I rarely bother to watch a whole race.

 

I'm turned off by the stages and other crap making any strategy null and void.



#29 TennisUK

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 11:49

I have never watched a NASCAR race.

 

Is it even possible to do so in the UK? I presume there will be nigerian streams if you look hard enough on the internet, but is NASCAR actually on a TV service in the UK?



#30 Myrvold

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 13:52

Kimi won’t get any special treatment.  If he does something to deserve to be dumped or gets in the wrong guy’s way they’ll dump him.  He can give as good as he gets.   If he gets a top 10 he’ll be doing great.

 

I was referring to what Joey Hand talked about, how he noticed when he got higher up, it seemed like he was "in the way". He wasn't a regular, and would just be moved out of the way.



#31 markpenske

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 14:11

The NASCAR regulars have become pretty good road racers over the past few years. When these so called ringers like Kimi drop in for one race they never seem to do well. I hope he does well. I'm a short drive away and may head to the glen this Sunday. 


Edited by markpenske, 18 August 2022 - 14:12.


#32 eibyyz

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 14:47

And the only driver to take down a jet dryer on track during a race, let alone while under caution

 

I wish people would drop that.  It's not even a good meme.  JPM was a passenger.

 

If that crash had happened on the trioval, paying customers could have died.



#33 eibyyz

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 14:50

In 255 Cup starts 2 wins,  24 top 5, 59 top 10, 9 poles, avg finish 19.8.

 

https://www.racing-r..._Pablo_Montoya/

 

I still can't get over how he 'pooched the BY400.  The last time I could work up getting disappointed by a NA$CAR race.



#34 F1matt

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 14:59

I have never watched a NASCAR race.

 

Is it even possible to do so in the UK? I presume there will be nigerian streams if you look hard enough on the internet, but is NASCAR actually on a TV service in the UK?

 

 

I think it is on Premier Sports. 



#35 pacificquay

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 14:59

I have never watched a NASCAR race.

 

Is it even possible to do so in the UK? I presume there will be nigerian streams if you look hard enough on the internet, but is NASCAR actually on a TV service in the UK?

 

Premier Sports



#36 Myrvold

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 15:10

Did you watch the races?

 

I did. Can't remember much from the xFinity race, other than Räikkönen not really featuring. The Truck race is mostly remembered from the Autosport-thread with people complaining about all the cautions etc. It was easy to spot who had watched NASCAR, and especially Trucks before and who hadn't.

This was back when I had nothing much to do, so I watched every Cup, National, Truck and K&N East/West race. :drunk:



#37 John B

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 16:53

The NASCAR regulars have become pretty good road racers over the past few years. When these so called ringers like Kimi drop in for one race they never seem to do well. I hope he does well. I'm a short drive away and may head to the glen this Sunday.


Agreed, while certain drivers (Elliott, now Reddick) still have RC winning streaks the field is better on them than in the days when ringers could step in almost any car and compete for a win. I remember some teams didn't exactly prioritize road courses, using old chassis and the like.

#38 noriaki

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 22:54

I believe some people here are severely underestimating the challenge of Nascar. World champion or not, spending any time within the top-10 would be a stunning achievement for someone with so little preparation and basically zero previous closed-cockpit circuit racing experience.

Edited by noriaki, 18 August 2022 - 22:56.


#39 Nathan

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Posted 18 August 2022 - 23:03

I have not watched a lot of NASCAR, but it seems to me that simply "being ahead" makes you "deserve" to be punted. The Demolition Derby aspect of NASCAR is why I rarely bother to watch a whole race.

 

Well, if you rarely watch it then you probably don't understand why someone 'deserves' to get punted and end up thinking it's some sort of regular thing.

 

I'm turned off by the stages and other crap making any strategy null and void.

:up:



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#40 danmills

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 01:01

I find it amusing that there are almost snobbish parallels to following / not following US auto racing series as it is to liking or not even knowing obscure indie bands 😂

#41 ARTGP

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 01:08

I had a NASCAR phase. I believe it was 2008-2010 or something like that.

#42 SKL

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 02:45

Read on a Porsche forum (rennlist) he was at the Glen last weekend and during the lunch break of the Porsche club event, he did laps with some others in a Camaro, and even took his wife and kids for some laps.  I've actually gotten into the tintops since the nex gen car and the road courses are always fun to watch, even the Xfinity races.  And rubbin' is definitely racin'...   

 

Will definitely be worth watching IMHO.



#43 Myrvold

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 11:35

I find it amusing that there are almost snobbish parallels to following / not following US auto racing series as it is to liking or not even knowing obscure indie bands

 

Reminds me of "true F1 fans" when they talk about "DTS F1 fans". In the sense that it is amusing I mean.



#44 Jovanotti

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 15:23

Looks like it's even on free TV in German speaking countries. Sport1, 9 p.m. on Sunday for the race. Will definitely watch a bit :up: (until the first 15 minute ad break...)

#45 Squeed

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Posted 19 August 2022 - 15:39

I see no thread discussing Kimi getting behind the wheel in a NASCAR at Watkins Glen this weekend. I'm curious, I will definitely watch it, but... what are his chances?
Will the regulars let him race at least a few laps before they bump him off the road? I think he will still have the speed to do at least better than JJ in Indycar, but I doubt he is as fast as the top guys. Who is the fastest road course guy, by the way? 

 

Too many of these Cup drivers are a wreck waiting to happen on road courses.  If Kimi qualifies in the top 10, he has a good chance at getting a great result.  However, if he qualifies back in the pack and has to make his way forward, I don’t think he’ll finish the race.  I think he’ll expect other professional drivers to show a level of race craft and race IQ that will be severely lacking among his competition, and he will trust them too much when defending and/or overtaking and get wrecked out.  There is a small handful of Cup drivers who are really skilled on road courses, but most of them are absolutely clueless. 

 

I say all of this as an American who has followed NASCAR for over 30 years. 


Edited by Squeed, 19 August 2022 - 15:41.


#46 kumo7

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Posted 20 August 2022 - 01:04

Too many of these Cup drivers are a wreck waiting to happen on road courses. If Kimi qualifies in the top 10, he has a good chance at getting a great result. However, if he qualifies back in the pack and has to make his way forward, I don’t think he’ll finish the race. I think he’ll expect other professional drivers to show a level of race craft and race IQ that will be severely lacking among his competition, and he will trust them too much when defending and/or overtaking and get wrecked out. There is a small handful of Cup drivers who are really skilled on road courses, but most of them are absolutely clueless.

I say all of this as an American who has followed NASCAR for over 30 years.


F1 indeed is severely dependent on car performances and the strategy that AI produces. Kimi has less of AI navigations than the current drivers, yet the races are more procession and demands less of driver’s instinctive manoeuvre. If Kimi were to seek on track race that asks drivers skill above technology, then I hope he is right. If NASCAR drivers bumps his competitors off the track as his accepted manoeuvre, then Kimi has roads to climb up.

#47 OvDrone

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Posted 20 August 2022 - 02:18

OMG   :cool:   Another NASCAR thread  :clap:  Thank you Primo !

Let's get that visibility up. Kimi + Cup + Watkins Glen... I still can't hardly believe how great this is!



#48 Dmitriy_Guller

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Posted 20 August 2022 - 03:59

My impression is that NASCAR drivers have a code of conduct that is not conducive to good road racing, and they apply it to each other almost as much as to outsiders.  Rear-ending someone under braking should be a no-no at road courses, because it's a cheap shot that anyone can do, and racing would be pretty tedious to watch if it consisted of drivers rear-ending each other all the time.  In NASCAR that's considered okay, and almost mandatory on the last lap, unless both drivers are on good terms with each other and want to keep it that way.



#49 Dolph

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Posted 20 August 2022 - 08:07

Theoretical question. If Kimi wins (he wont), will he be in the chase?

#50 Myrvold

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Posted 20 August 2022 - 13:43

Theoretical question. If Kimi wins (he wont), will he be in the chase?

 

Nope. Unless you get a waiver (injury, covid and similar things) you must participate in all races to get into the playoffs. And you would still need to get inside top 30 in points IIRC.