8 replies to this topic

[SennasCat]

I recall in a magazine article in the early 80s (maybe around 82 or 83) that there were some up and coming drivers (I think Bellof, Senna and maybe Brundle) who were called in for a test drive at McLaren F1 as part of a prize for their deeds in smaller formula cars.

As memory serves me, i recall that Senna and the other guy lapped in a time of around 1.14.1 (not sure what circuit). I think that Bellof was actually about 0.4 seconds quicker than the pair of them.

Does anyone know if this really happened, or was it just an urban myth???

PS I had widely heard that H-H Frentzen was quicker than Michael Schumacher in the early days - again is this really true??

Steve Williams
Sydney,
Australia:rolleyes:

[Mickey]

Hi Steve,

I have no idea about that McLaren test, but there is a good thread about the 1984 Monaco GP in the AtlasF1 Court, which obviously deals a lot with Senna and Bellof.

Check it out here: http://www.atlasf1.c...&threadid=14834

And welcome to the forums, btw

[LittleChris]

Steve,

The test happened at the end of 83, involving the 3 drivers you noted. I think that Senna was actually quickest, however he managed to get one more run than the others as he blew an engine on his potentially quickest lap. Ron Dennis was NOT impressed by the fact that Senna kept his foot down as the motor expired in a vast plume of smoke, however he allowed him another run at which point Senna put in the fastest lap of the day !!

Chris

[David M. Kane]

At the time much was made of the Brundle and Senna rivalry since
they apparently were very strong against each other in F3. Martin
was really seen at the time as the next great British driver. I think he was very good, but he also had a lot of bad luck along the way. Sometimes we make our luck, anyway it never seemed to come together for him.

This is strictly a gut feeling, but I thought Bellof was stunning
in sort of a Gilles Villeneuve sort of way. He was very brave, maybe even a little crazy. Like Gilles he had uncanny car feel
and blinding reflexes.

Michael Schumacher many times that he feared H-H. If I recall
Michael's wife had been H-H girlfriend before she started dating
Michael. They might have even competed against each other in karts.

[LittleChris]

I saw Senna vs Brundle in F3 several times during 1983 at Thruxton and the only real difference between them was that Senna was always blindingly fast on the opening lap of the races. After that Brundle was able to match him for pace. There were also rumours of dodgy engines being used by both teams ( Dick Bennetts West Surrey Racing for Senna and Eddie Jordan for Brundle ). The only other person that year in the same league was Davy Jones.

Chris

[Vitesse2]

Schumacher and Frentzen were both part of the Mercedes Junior Team (aka Sauber-Mercedes), together with Karl Wendlinger. All three had been in contention for the 1989 German F3 title, which was won by Wendlinger by just one point from Schumacher and Frentzen in joint second place.In sports cars, Frentzen was considered faster than Michael, but nevertheless Michael got the breaks, jumping straight from sports cars to F1 while H-H had a torrid year with Eddie Jordan in F3000 and ending up in Japanese F3000 where he rebuilt his career for the first time.

David Kane's post recalled a fairly tasteless joke that went the rounds a few years back:

Q: What's the difference between Michael Schumacher, Hein-Harald Frentzen and Ralf Schumacher?

A: Ralf hasn't slept with Corinna

[C F Eick]

IIRC, I once read an article where the journalist had dug up the lap times from Frentzen's and Schumacher's Sauber-Mercedes period. Apparently, Frentzen often managed to put in faster lap times than Schumacher, but Schumacher's times were almost always more consistent during a whole race.

[LittleChris]

Vitesse2, perhaps you should add the word ' Allegedly ' to the answer to the joke !!

[Timekeeper]

Christopher Hilton's biography of Senna includes an account of the Bellof, Brundle, Senna test. The test was at Silverstone and John Watson set a yardstick time which the 3 young drivers beat. As LittleChris said Senna's engine blew during the test. Herbie Blash from Brabham was also out at the back of the circuit that day and is quoted in the book.

'I went purely to watch Senna. We had Brabham and Senna in mind at that particular time. I was timing Senna, he did a lap - a 1 minute 11 - and then the engine blew up. It happened where I could see - and none of the McLaren people could - exactly how quick this lap would have been. When the engine blew he never made it past the point where they were timing the cars, so they never got the lap. Obviously I informed Senna. He said he knew it was quick but I was the only one who knew how quick it was. Obviously I didn't inform McLaren...'