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Singapo(u)re GP 2022 - Night race in the rain?


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#1 Redaxo

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:17

It seems as if almost every weather forecast predicts some kind of rain for the weekend. A lot of thunderstorms are being predicted, so it may pour down a lot:

 

s.jpg

 

https://www.nea.gov.sg/weather

 

https://www.timeandd...e/singapore/ext

 

https://www.bbc.com/weather/1880252

 

So can we expect a wet weekend with some fun action? Or a race filled with SC laps and red flags?



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#2 Risil

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:27

Ooooh



#3 Risil

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:27

Kudos on the thread title btw



#4 ToniF1

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:30

So since this race is on the calendar we had 12 races, and all of them were won by world champions.

 

Vettel 5

Hamilton 4

Alonso 2

Rosberg 1 ( he become the champion in 2016 when he won it).

 

 



#5 smitten

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:32

Given that F1 seems increasingly allergic to running in the rain, I find it hard to imagine they'll allow it to run at night in a thunderstorm.  But I'm very prepared to be wrong in that assumption :wave:



#6 Mechanic44

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:40

Last time it rained we had some banger racing at the start

#7 Heyli

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:52

Last time it rained we had some banger racing at the start

literally!



#8 Risil

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:55

Fun: a mock-up of the 1960s Singapore Grand Prix circuit on Thomson Road via Assetto Corsa

 



#9 ToniF1

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:55

Yeah a podium Ham, Ric, Bot would be nice.

#10 MaxCrazyEddieCayer

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 19:56

I’d be down with some night/rain action, doubt it will happen as I’d like it, but we shall see. Race management has been full of surprises in the last 12 months.

#11 Anderis

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 20:10

Yeah a podium Ham, Ric, Bot would be nice.

You may be 4 years late for such a wish. :p



#12 WonderWoman61

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 21:23

Some added spice before the race weekend has even started!

#13 JimmyClark

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Posted 28 September 2022 - 22:16

I predict the race will be bone dry.

Tropical region forecasts tend to show a risk of storms all day, but realistically they are very localised and happen in a short period of time, usually late afternoon. This looks like the forecast for all other 12 Singapore races, but only one was wet.

Even if it does rain, I don't expect the current overly cautious regime to allow it a race to happen until it's mostly dry.

However, I am really excited about this weekend. The drivers haven't been here for 3 years and the cars will be a handful. I expect they will be earning their money.

#14 FortiFord

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 07:05

It seems as if almost every weather forecast predicts some kind of rain for the weekend. A lot of thunderstorms are being predicted, so it may pour down a lot:

s.jpg

https://www.nea.gov.sg/weather

https://www.timeandd...e/singapore/ext

https://www.bbc.com/weather/1880252

So can we expect a wet weekend with some fun action? Or a race filled with SC laps and red flags?


Normal for Singapore. Usually it rains in the morning or late afternoon, rarely in the evening. Rain dries up quickly due to the temperature.

#15 RedRabbit

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 07:10

A surprise win for Alonso after his teammate crashes hard enough to bring out a safety car that allows him to jump into the lead after Ferrari try double stacking and forget to fit all the wheels to Leclerc's car.

Sainz has a sensational drive to 4th from the back after being delayed behind Charles in the pit fiasco until he nudges the wall going for the podium.

Charles just trundles around at the back all race, questioning his life choices and wondering if he has Markos number anywhere, while Max finishes 2nd to wrap up the WDC early.

#16 TradeMark

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 07:39

A surprise win for Alonso after his teammate crashes hard enough to bring out a safety car that allows him to jump into the lead after Ferrari try double stacking and forget to fit all the wheels to Leclerc's car.

Sainz has a sensational drive to 4th from the back after being delayed behind Charles in the pit fiasco until he nudges the wall going for the podium.

Charles just trundles around at the back all race, questioning his life choices and wondering if he has Markos number anywhere, while Max finishes 2nd to wrap up the WDC early.

Max can't win the title by finishing 2nd ;)

#17 jjcale

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 07:56

Max can't win the title by finishing 2nd ;)

 

Sadly .... the sooner we are put out of our misery the better, by the title "fight" this year.



#18 sheSgoTthElooK

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 08:05

I have been to Singapore and if it's raining... hell, it's very intense... and nothing F1 can handle.... 

 

 



#19 Goron3

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 08:38

It rains every day in Singapore, but usually before it gets dark. Would love to see a damp session at one point though.

 

Great to see lots of upgrades from the teams. Alpine seem confident.



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#20 BRG

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 09:43

I have been to Singapore and if it's raining... hell, it's very intense... and nothing F1 can handle.... 

A light drizzle is too much for F1 to handle.... :rolleyes:



#21 STRFerrari4Ever

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 09:45

Let’s see how these 2022 boats handle the Marina Bay Circuit, they’ll probably look cumbersome but maybe following might be a tad easier and we might get a couple more overtakes than 2019 or previous years.

#22 Widefoot2

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 10:01

It rains every day in Singapore, but usually before it gets dark. Would love to see a damp session at one point though.

 

Great to see lots of upgrades from the teams. Alpine seem confident.

Alpine have seemed confident about a lot of things recently.  Let's just say I'm not holding my breath...



#23 Sebastien007

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 10:06

If it rains let's hope it will be Verstappen vs Hamilton



#24 Jon83

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 10:55

If they wouldn't be willing to let them race there in the rain at night then they shouldn't be racing there at all.


Edited by Jon83, 29 September 2022 - 10:56.


#25 Spillage

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 10:57

It all sounds quite exciting. I bet it ends up being thirty-odd laps behind the Safety Car and a two-hour red flag period.



#26 Risil

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 11:00

I wonder if because we haven't had one of these since 2019, we've just forgotten that the Singapore 7-day forecast always has rain in it.



#27 WouterF1

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 11:56

 

FIA eases F1 porpoising metric from Singapore GP Formula 1’s porpoising metric has been tweaked from this weekend’s Singapore Grand Prix to help remove potential problems caused by bumpy tracks, Motorsport.com has learned.

As the result of the extreme bouncing earlier in the season that left drivers complaining about safety implications, the FIA announced ahead of the Canadian Grand Prix that it was introducing an Aerodynamic Oscillation Metric that teams would not be allowed to exceed.

Teams had to ensure that their car was below the maximum bouncing limit over each lap, or there was a risk of them being sanctioned on safety grounds.

In a document sent to teams ahead of the Montreal race, they were warned that breaching the rules would carry the risk of cars being excluded from events.

F1’s head of single seater matters Nikolas Tombazis said in that note: “Any car whose AOM exceeds the stipulated AOM [limit] will be reported to the stewards with the recommendation that they be excluded from the results of the sprint or race."

Following some debate with teams about the implications of the metric, it finally came in to force from the Belgian Grand Prix.

----------------------------

The FIA has said from now on that there will be a top limit of 7G attributed to readings – meaning any track strike above that will not be taken into account for compliance with the metric.

This change in approach should help teams avoid any risk of them inadvertently breaching the AOM limit.  :confused:

 

 

 

:eek: :rolleyes: Safety doesn't matter anymore? What will Toto say about this? He asked the FIA over and over again for the rules against porpoising.

 

https://www.motorspo...re-gp/10375872/


Edited by WouterF1, 29 September 2022 - 11:58.


#28 Heyli

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:13

:eek: :rolleyes: Safety doesn't matter anymore? What will Toto say about this? He asked the FIA over and over again for the rules against porpoising.

 

https://www.motorspo...re-gp/10375872/

I am confused. Any strike higher than 7G is not considered for the Metric? So, it would pay off to make the cars bounce harder...? 



#29 STRFerrari4Ever

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:17

:eek: :rolleyes: Safety doesn't matter anymore? What will Toto say about this? He asked the FIA over and over again for the rules against porpoising.

https://www.motorspo...re-gp/10375872/


Making it up as they go along, an utter joke.

#30 SenorSjon

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:17

Anyone spotted the Ferrari rear wing? I would love it if they kept the yellow lettering.



#31 TomNokoe

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:23

Big visual upgrade for McLaren, Norris only. I expected McLaren to be strong anyway, so hopefully Norris can pull something out of the bag. Qualified 4th Australia, 5th Monaco, 4th Hungary.

#32 Beri

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:24

I am confused. Any strike higher than 7G is not considered for the Metric? So, it would pay off to make the cars bounce harder...?


That won't be any good for the drivers. So let's hope no car will ever get to 7g

#33 SparkPlug86

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:41

Big visual upgrade for McLaren, Norris only. I expected McLaren to be strong anyway, so hopefully Norris can pull something out of the bag. Qualified 4th Australia, 5th Monaco, 4th Hungary.


P1 for Norris then… 😉

#34 vlado

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:43

I am confused. Any strike higher than 7G is not considered for the Metric? So, it would pay off to make the cars bounce harder...?


But they took away the plank wear protection techniques, aka flexi floors, so they still can’t do what they were able to do for the first half of the season.

Edited by vlado, 29 September 2022 - 12:44.


#35 JimmyClark

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:44

It's about time we had a wildcard race this year (after being spoiled in the last couple of years); I'd happily see Lando take the win this weekend, a year on from his agony in Russia. 



#36 RedRabbit

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:44

I am confused. Any strike higher than 7G is not considered for the Metric? So, it would pay off to make the cars bounce harder...?


I think it's surely to discount hitting a curb, or a once off bounce off the track surface?

#37 vlado

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:47

Anyone spotted the Ferrari rear wing? I would love it if they kept the yellow lettering.


It’s not there unfortunately

https://twitter.com/...ystl75Fxpn8NbmQ

#38 Myrvold

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:51

The only F1 race I've watched was Singapore 2017. Which is the only Singapore GP that was wet (at the start). It was somewhat of the same forecast then, but according to the locals it wouldn't be much of an issue, it would rain "every afternoon" and then clear up. It just was that part of the year. I expect it to be somewhat the same again.



#39 SenorSjon

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:57

It’s not there unfortunately

https://twitter.com/...ystl75Fxpn8NbmQ

 

Darn it. Back to F2/F3 looks it is.



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#40 Ev0d3vil

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 12:59

I'm Singaporean, it doesn't really rain at night, only during the early mornings/afternoons. and if it rains at night, the F1 Gods only allow rain to pour after the race has ended..



#41 Risil

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 13:38

I think it's surely to discount hitting a curb, or a once off bounce off the track surface?


Jonathan Noble goes into more detail further down the article:

With the metric being taken as an average over a distance – initially 10 J/kg per 100km - running of the cars had shown that if cars hit bumps on the track then those impact spikes could serve to have a dramatic impact on lifting the overall average.

Running cars on especially bumpy tracks meant that teams could inadvertently exceed the AOM limit because of the surface of the circuit rather than anything to do with there being too much porpoising.


The goal is not to skew the average upwards by including the impacts of bumpy track surfaces which are expected at Singapore and Austin.

I guess not beyond criticism but the original goal was to protect drivers from porpoising, not bumps in the road.

#42 WouterF1

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 13:59

I'm Singaporean, it doesn't really rain at night, only during the early mornings/afternoons. and if it rains at night, the F1 Gods only allow rain to pour after the race has ended..

Thank you! And how about thunderstorms  after 6 pm / 18:00h ?



#43 Ev0d3vil

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 14:06

Thank you! And how about thunderstorms after 6 pm / 18:00h ?


Quite uncommon but it does happen from time to time. Even now it’s bone dry!

Edited by Ev0d3vil, 29 September 2022 - 14:06.


#44 AlbertPark

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 14:08

1662906561869688.gif

#45 STRFerrari4Ever

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 14:21

1662906561869688.gif


Merc’s lobbying didn’t yield any wins, I still remember that Baku race and it was a 5* performance from the whole team there and thereafter.

#46 Ev0d3vil

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 14:43

I have been to Singapore and if it's raining... hell, it's very intense... and nothing F1 can handle.... 

 

It did pour cats and dogs this morning at 6am, but absolutely bone dry now.



#47 RedRabbit

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 15:53

Jonathan Noble goes into more detail further down the article:


The goal is not to skew the average upwards by including the impacts of bumpy track surfaces which are expected at Singapore and Austin.

I guess not beyond criticism but the original goal was to protect drivers from porpoising, not bumps in the road.


The measurement per 100km is quite strange to me - a car gets 1/3rd into the race then before anything can be done?

#48 ARTGP

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 16:00


The goal is not to skew the average upwards by including the impacts of bumpy track surfaces which are expected at Singapore and Austin.

I guess not beyond criticism but the original goal was to protect drivers from porpoising, not bumps in the road.

Why distinguish between porpoising and bumps in the road? They both have the same effect which is a large vertical acceleration on the driver?

So 7g is ok every lap as long we call it “bumps”?

Edited by ARTGP, 29 September 2022 - 16:00.


#49 Risil

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 16:01

Why distinguish between porpoising and bumps in the road? They both have the same effect which is a large vertical acceleration on the driver?

 

Good question. I suppose the FIA doesn't want to get into quantifying whether or not a track is too bumpy for racing to safely take place?



#50 ARTGP

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Posted 29 September 2022 - 16:03

Good question. I suppose the FIA doesn't want to get into quantifying whether or not a track is too bumpy for racing to safely take place?

I think it should be on the team to soften up the suspension for the bumpier tracks.

If FIA is going to make changes in the name of driver safety, then physically speaking there is no difference between bumps and porpoising. A driver will knock his back out regardless. To now raise the metric because of bumps just makes a mockery of the TD039 and you question what the motivation was.

Imo FIA though TD039 would do the opposite of what it actually did, and now some back tracking is taking place…

Edited by ARTGP, 29 September 2022 - 16:08.