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BTCC 2023


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#1001 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 17:34

No independent wins this year is surely a first for a very very long time. That’s quite a stat.


No independent wins? Good grief!

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#1002 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 17:38

No independent wins this year is surely a first for a very very long time. That’s quite a stat.


2003 I think was the last season where none of the Independents won a race.

#1003 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 17:44

Also BMW's first defeat in the Manufacturer's Championship since 2015 and first time since 2014 that the Manufacturer's Championship hasn't been won by BMW or Honda.

#1004 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 18:43

Been a long time coming for Motorbase/Alliance, started in 2006, started running Focuses in 2011 and also for Ford since it was still the Super Touring era (admittedly the end of it) when they last produced the Driver's Champion.

#1005 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 18:44

Also the first time since 2002 that the manufacturer that produced the Independent Driver's Champion didn't win a race outright (Dan Eaves in a Peugeot).

My 1500th Post!

#1006 PayasYouRace

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 18:49

No independent wins this year is surely a first for a very very long time. That’s quite a stat.

 

Like peak Super Touring then.



#1007 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 19:21

Like peak Super Touring then.


In a way, yes.

#1008 andysaint

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 19:21

Like peak Super Touring then.


Yep my favourite era. I think there should be a gap between the manufacturers and the independents. I don't think it's been a classic season but I am truly delighted for Sutton. The clear standard driver and domination with so many race wins. He deserves it despite the series' attempts to artificially mix up grids.

#1009 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 19:25

Yep my favourite era. I think there should be a gap between the manufacturers and the independents. I don't think it's been a classic season but I am truly delighted for Sutton. The clear standard driver and domination with so many race wins. He deserves it despite the series' attempts to artificially mix up grids.


ROLL ON 2024!

Edited by WonderWoman61, 08 October 2023 - 19:28.


#1010 PayasYouRace

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 19:27

I'd rather Sutton win title No.5 in 2027 or so. Let's have a bit more competition.

 

There's a reason Scott Dixon is my favourite multiple champion. 6 titles but never defended one.



#1011 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 19:29

I'd rather Sutton win title No.5 in 2027 or so. Let's have a bit more competition.
 
There's a reason Scott Dixon is my favourite multiple champion. 6 titles but never defended one.

Admittedly, it would be nice to see someone other than Sutton, Ingram or Turks to win the title for once.

#1012 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 20:09

Oh and Daryl DeLeon is the first driver from outside the British Isles to score points in the BTCC since Robb Holland and Alain Menu in 2015.

Edited by WonderWoman61, 08 October 2023 - 20:10.


#1013 andysaint

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 20:40

Admittedly, it would be nice to see someone other than Sutton, Ingram or Turks to win the title for once.


If Jake Hill can calm down a bit he's got to have a good shot next year. Aside Sutton, Ingram, Turkington and Hill it's difficult to see where the next champion comes from. Cammish should have had a better season. Cook would do well in a manufacturer team. They are the top drivers in the series.

#1014 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 20:49

If Jake Hill can calm down a bit he's got to have a good shot next year. Aside Sutton, Ingram, Turkington and Hill it's difficult to see where the next champion comes from. Cammish should have had a better season. Cook would do well in a manufacturer team. They are the top drivers in the series.


Yes, exactly! Jake Hill is overdue a title, if he could just string a season together like Sutton and Tingram.

Maybe '24 will be the year #24 becomes #1?

#1015 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 20:49

Oh and Daryl DeLeon is the first driver from outside the British Isles to score points in the BTCC since Robb Holland and Alain Menu in 2015.


Also, if Turkey is considered an Asian country, DeLeon is the BTCC's first Asian point-scorer since Erkut Kizilirmak in 2008.

#1016 PayasYouRace

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 21:16

Oh and Daryl DeLeon is the first driver from outside the British Isles to score points in the BTCC since Robb Holland and Alain Menu in 2015.


His bio says he was born in Ireland.

#1017 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 21:22

His bio says he was born in Ireland.


Well he's half-British, half-Filipino.

Edited by WonderWoman61, 08 October 2023 - 21:24.


#1018 PayasYouRace

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 21:45

Well he's half-British, half-Filipino.

But he’s definitely not from outside the British Isles, heritage not withstanding. A bit like Alex Albon.



#1019 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 21:53

But he’s definitely not from outside the British Isles, heritage not withstanding. A bit like Alex Albon.

I'll rephrase my previous comment then:

Daryl DeLeon is the first driver to race under the licence of a country outside of the British Isles to score points in the BTCC since Robb Holland and Alain Menu in 2015 and the first to race under the licence of an Asian country to do so since Erkut Kizilirmak in 2008, or failing that, Japan's Moto Kitano in 1973.

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#1020 Silverstone96

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 22:39

Despite challenges it’s still been a very good season and I’m sad to see it end.

Would have felt wrong had Ash not won it such has been his superiority, I said on here last winter what a shed the focus was so hats off to the Napa team for the job they have done re-engineering it into the unstoppable force it’s been.

Will be a very interesting winter I suspect with possibly some new cars to come.

Edited by Silverstone96, 09 October 2023 - 08:10.


#1021 WonderWoman61

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Posted 08 October 2023 - 22:51

Despite challenges it’s still been a very good season and I’m sad to see it end.
Would have felt wrong had Ash not won it such has been his superiority, I said on here last winter what a shed the focus was so hats off to the Napa team for the job they have done re-engineering it into the unstoppable force it’s been.
Will be a very interesting I suspect with possibly some new cars to come.


Yes, the series could do with some newer machinery, there's a new FL5 Civic just begging for an NGTC build for a start.

#1022 Kev00

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Posted 09 October 2023 - 07:57

Hill and Cook would be right up with Sutton and Ingram with the right equipment. Here's hoping.


Since when has Hill not got the right equipment? Sutton and Ingram are the difference makers here. Put them in any car on the grid (yes any) and they’d be fighting for the title, if not first year then their second year.

#1023 Burtros

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Posted 09 October 2023 - 08:46

I rate Hill. He’s got the car to do it, needs a bit more luck and a little more consistency. Without the Silverstone mech issue he’d have been in the mix at Brands.

I’ve just seen footage of his pass on Cook yesterday. Off the track much? Jeez! Shouldn’t have been allowed to keep that.

#1024 Disgrace

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Posted 09 October 2023 - 08:53

Since when has Hill not got the right equipment? Sutton and Ingram are the difference makers here. Put them in any car on the grid (yes any) and they’d be fighting for the title, if not first year then their second year.

 

He did last year, and could/should have won the title with fewer mistakes. But he was up there. I find it difficult to believe that BMW didn't go backwards this year, relative to the competition.



#1025 WonderWoman61

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Posted 09 October 2023 - 09:40

He did last year, and could/should have won the title with fewer mistakes. But he was up there. I find it difficult to believe that BMW didn't go backwards this year, relative to the competition.


He's getting there

#1026 Pete_f1

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Posted 09 October 2023 - 12:13

Just caught up with the last race.

Fantastic! BTCC at its best!

#1027 WonderWoman61

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Posted 09 October 2023 - 13:26

Just caught up with the last race.
Fantastic! BTCC at its best!

I agree

#1028 midgrid

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Posted 09 October 2023 - 21:42

Why? They wouldn’t meet the original accident until the next lap when they would be behind the safety car.


"Race back to the line" was done away with after an incident at Snetterton in 2007: there was a startline accident, the safety car was called, but there was another accident at the end of the first lap as the still-racing drivers came across the previous crash site at full speed.

#1029 F1Frog

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Posted 09 October 2023 - 22:26

Here are the qualifying 'supertimes' for the 2023 BTCC season. This takes the fastest qualifying lap for every driver and car, and ranks them against the fastest overall for the weekend as a percentage to estimate the order of the drivers and cars for overall speed.

For the cars, the results are:
1 Ford 100.011
2 BMW 100.289
3 Hyundai 100.410
4 Toyota 100.623
5 Honda 100.631
6 Vauxhall 100.865
7 Cupra 100.953

This supports the general idea that the Ford was the fastest car this season. They did take nine poles out of ten, after all! The BMW was faster than the Hyundai, which is probably what you would expect despite Ingram's brilliant second in the championship, and this difference in pace shows just how well Ingram did this year. Of course, this doesn't take into account the difference in driver ability, so it could just be Sutton making the difference. This is the result for the drivers, with anomalous results highlighted:

1 Ash Sutton 100.074
2 Jake Hill 100.337
3 Tom Ingram 100.410
4 Colin Turkington 100.457
5 Josh Cook 100.631
6 Dan Cammish 100.688 (drops to 100.371 - 3rd - without Knockhill)
7 Rory Butcher 100.770
8 Dan Rowbottom 100.833
9 Ricky Collard 100.911
10 Aron Taylor-Smith 100.977
11 Bobby Thompson 101.109
12 Dan Lloyd 101.111
13 Tom Chilton 101.133
14 Ronan Pearson 101.171
15 Andrew Watson 101.210
16 Adam Morgan 101.213 (drops to 100.832 - 8th - without Brands Hatch)
17 Stephen Jelley 101.262
18 Aiden Moffat 101.275
19 Mikey Doble 101.362
20 Sam Osborne 101.527
21 George Gamble 101.539
22 Dexter Patterson 101.640
23 Michael Crees 101.777
24 James Gornall 101.807
25 Jack Butel 102.085
26 Jade Edwards (Honda) 102.130
27 Rob Huff 102.503
28 Jade Edwards (Cupra) 102.862
29 Nic Hamilton 103.569
30 Daryl DeLeon 103.724 (drops to 101.989 - 25th - without Knockhill)
31 Nick Halstead 103.775
32 Will Powell 104.960

The big gap between Sutton and the rest demonstrates how good he is, although I think the results overall still suggest that the Ford is the best car.


Edited by F1Frog, 09 October 2023 - 22:27.


#1030 Disgrace

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 11:44

Steve Rider has been diagnosed with prostate cancer. It sounds like they've caught it early enough for surgery to be effective. Godspeed to him!



#1031 Pete_f1

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 13:54

Yes all the best.

Get checked guys.

#1032 PayasYouRace

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 13:55

Best of luck to him. Hope he pulls through.

#1033 Alan Lewis

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 14:50


Bit more detail on the story:

https://www.bbc.co.u...t-arts-67076336

Sounds quite hopeful, fortunately.

#1034 Pete_f1

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Posted 11 October 2023 - 19:16

He was unsure about doing this season, maybe this will make him retire and enjoy life (which I'm sure he does anyway!)