6 replies to this topic

[Chaparel]

Hi everyone,

I’m cataloguing my 1/43 collection of race cars, and when doing so, I try my best to as closely as possible identify each car, race, and driver. In later years, this is easy. But with the brass era cars, it’s a bit harder. My quest today is to identify Brumm model r17, listed as a 1908 Fiat S61, car #42.

Can anyone tell me if this is a representation of an actual race car? Thanks!

Adam

https://www.delcampe...220/165_001.jpg

Edited by Chaparel, 04 January 2023 - 02:58.

[Tim Murray]

It would appear that this model has been misidentified by Brumm, and it’s actually the Fiat S74 driven by Ralph de Palma in the 1912 French GP. Take a look at this site:

https://formula143.o...t-s74-de-palma/

which includes this sentence:

The Brumm model is described erroneously as 1908 FIAT S61.

Here are a couple of photos of the actual car, showing that, if this is the car the model is based on, Brumm didn’t get various details such as the wheel colour right:

[Sterzo]

Now you have a conundrum, Chaparel. A true collector would keep the model exacly as Brumm manaufactured, warts and all, but others (like me) would happily reduce its value by wielding a paint brush for the sake of accuracy. The big question is: what colour was it, and why? Is it in American colours of blue and white? If so why is the bonnet rather than everything but the chassis white? Why would de Palma's car be blue and white when Bruce Brown's was apparently red? And is that bonnet really white, or (wild speculation) a last minute replacement not yet painted - unlikely, I know.

[Roger Clark]

The small photo posted by Tim shows that the bonnet  wasn't white.  Gary Doyle's biography of Ralph de Palma has a reproduction of a painting of the car; it is red.  Not conclusive but it seems most likely.

Edited by Roger Clark, 05 January 2023 - 09:31.

[D-Type]

Yes, Brumm, particularly the earlier models, suffer from poor research. But they are affordable (ie cheap) and readily available at collectors' toyfayres.  And, more importantly, they have modelled a lot of early cars that nobody else has - at least ones I can find on the market.

[Chaparel]

Thank you everyone for the feedback! Finding that formula143 website has been extremely helpful, also for other cars that I'm trying to catalog. As for trying to make these crude Brumm cars more accurate, maybe one day but not anytime soon. I have about 160 1/43 race cars from 1902 to 2020 covering nearly every type of racing. Thanks again for the help and if somebody can tell me how to post pictures, I'll share some of my collection with you all.

[Rob G]

It should be noted that Italy's national racing color was originally black, but it had already switched to red by 1908.