92 replies to this topic

[MarkBisset]

Has anybody done an article on all of the 'Series' and Group C 105s? If so'I'd love to read it. A lot of cars mind you...

Was Jeff Harrison's car ex-Alfa Oz too?

At my one-and-only - wonderful - visit to Surfers ('73 Gold Star round) I'm sure I recall Christine Cole, as she then was I think, drove a 2-litre 105 in the taxi-races. I wonder if that car - which I don't recall being painted in other than an ex-factory road colour - became part of the Freddy G Team a couple of years later?

Am intrigued by your Ritter-LHD car Rob, when was that??

m

ps; The 105 Schenken rolled @ Bathurst after a tyre blowout/wheel failure was an Autodelta built LHD??

[Ray Bell]

Ritter merely did the engines, Mark...

 

Yes, at the time of the '73 Surfers Gold Star round CC was still CC, sometimes connected with PB, but she didn't run an Alfa at that meeting. Sue Ransom did, which must have been a one-off event.

[Lola5000]

Thanks Paul,

That answers it, when I looked again at the photo Lynton posted and 'my yellow one' and noticed the car was left-hooker I thought maybe it was factory built. So in reality it was, as you say, a 'quickie' given all the constraints.

Rob, Paul

Has anybody done an article on all of the 'Series' and Group C 105s? If so'I'd love to read it. A lot of cars mind you...

Was Jeff Harrison's car ex-Alfa Oz too?

At my one-and-only - wonderful - visit to Surfers ('73 Gold Star round) I'm sure I recall Christine Cole, as she then was I think, drove a 2-litre 105 in the taxi-races. I wonder if that car - which I don't recall being painted in other than an ex-factory road colour - became part of the Freddy G Team a couple of years later?

Am intrigued by your Ritter-LHD car Rob, when was that??

m

ps; The 105 Schenken rolled @ Bathurst after a tyre blowout/wheel failure was an Autodelta built LHD??

Paul did a very good listing a few years ago ,the Harrison car from memory was the Mal Robertson car?

1974 Bathurst 1,000 there is one there I don't know about Warren Thomson car? And not sure what happened to the Ritter LHD car .Also Bathurst 1974
Yes the Schenken car was the Autodelta car .
The 1973 Cole Surfers car became the team car that also Bell raced in 77 JH 1000.

[Paul Newby]

Here is a very abridged version.

 

The Alfa Dealer team had three 2000 GTVs at Bathurst n1975. There was the John French car with the light coloured upholstery that French/Johnson raced at Bathurst 74 in its original Le Mans Blue colour. That is the car that Schenken destroyed at McPhillamy.. The original Foley Chesterfield car from 73 for Cole/Ransom was the car that Bell/Leggatt won its class in 77. This car is currently being restored to its 77 colours in Melbourne. The LHD Autodelta car won its class in 75 with Beaumont/Leffler, was raced by Wherrett in 76 and written off by Gordon Rich in practice for 77.

 

The only other Group C 2000 GTVs known to survive is the Gil Gordon sponsored GTV driven by Gillard/Harrison in 76. Restored by Bill Magoffin, it is now back with the Gordon family in Geelong. I believe that Ray Gulson still has his dark blue 2000 GTV, but I've never been able to verify this. No other 1600, 1750 or 2000 GTVs or 1300 GT Juniors that raced in Australia, apart from those three, are known to have survived.

[TerryS]

Here are details of all the Alfa 105 GTV's 2000 that raced in the Bathurst 1000 in the Australian Group C era.

Jim Mckeown is not included in this listing.

Year Car # Drivers Position Laps
completed
1973 39 Ray Gulson and Peter Brown 19^th 51
40 Christine Gibson and Sue Ransom DNF 4
49 Ray Harrison and Mal Robertson 8^th 149

1974 39 Ray Gulson and David Crowther 9^th 151
41 Peter Brown and Graham Ritter DNF 54
43 John French and Dick Johnson DNF 71
49 Jim Murcott and Mal Robertson DSQ 153

1975 8 John Fitzpatrick and Fred Gibson DNF 121
26 Tim Schenken and Paul Bernasconi DNF 140
27 Marie Claude Beaumont and
John Leffler 7^th 149
40 Warren Thompson and Rod Morris 31^st 119
42 Ray and Paul Gulson 19^th 135

1976 39 Phil McDonnell and Jim Hunter 14th 151
40 Peter Wherrett and David Jones 18^th 148
41 Ron Gillard and Graham Harrison DNF 120

1977 58 Derek Bell and Garry Leggatt 8^th 150
61 Ray Gulson and David Crowther 12^th 145
63 Robin Dudfield and Tony Niovanni 21^st 131

1978 60 Peter Brown and Graham Ritter 26^th 133
62 Ray and Paul Gulson 16^th 143

1979 64 Ray and Paul Gulson 12^th 140

After 1979 there were no Alfa 105 GTV’s at Bathurst. The Alfetta had taken over.

[Porsche718]

I'm not sure I get the connection you are making with McKeown not being included in the Group C Bathurst races? Perhaps you could elaborate the response you were hoping for?

Jim only raced his Shell Alfa in five ATCC races in 1972 only finishing once (7th at Bathurst). All the Alfa runners in 1972 were disappointed that the level of assistance promised by Alfa Romeo Australia ended up being very little.

Perhaps the "support" deal was formulated before everyone understood that 1972 would be the last year of Improved Production, and a new set of rules were about to be introduced for the following year.

Perhaps Ray could elaborate on the introduction of Group C?

The "Great Race" at Bathurst was a different story. The GTV 2000 was a stalwart throughout the Hardie-Ferodo era against the power of the Ford GT's, Toranas, Chargers and Camaro's with six top 12 finishers during that period.

Toward the end the Alfetta was a tad quicker but none could catch the screaming Williamson Celicas.

But getting back to Jim McKeown, Terry, fantastic driver and one of my favourites.

From humpy Holdens, to Holden specials, to the first in the world to really master the rear "A" frame suspension in the Mk 1 Lotus Cortina. Not to mention extracting very good bhp numbers from the Twin Cam without any trick overseas parts. All locally developed.

Then ending his career with a wickedly fast Porsche RS "Special" mid-engined beast.

Wonderful time for Aussie touring fans.

Cheers Steve W

[TerryS]

I'm not sure I get the connection you are making with McKeown not being included in the Group C Bathurst races? Perhaps you could elaborate the response you were hoping for?

Just trying to show he was not at Bathurst in Group C era.

[Lola5000]

I agree with you Terry. It is disappointing that the McKeown thread got lost in the kerfuffle of another issue.

 

I'm not sure I get the connection you are making with McKeown not being included in the Group C Bathurst races? Perhaps you could elaborate the response you were hoping for?

 

Jim only raced his Shell Alfa in five ATCC races in 1972 only finishing once (7th at Bathurst). All the Alfa runners in 1972 were disappointed that the level of assistance promised by Alfa Romeo Australia ended up being very little.

 

Perhaps the "support" deal was formulated before everyone understood that 1972 would be the last year of Improved Production, and a new set of rules were about to be introduced for the following year.

 

Perhaps Ray could elaborate on the introduction of Group C?

 

The "Great Race" at Bathurst was a different story. The GTV 2000 was a stalwart throughout the Hardie-Ferodo era against the power of the Ford GT's, Toranas, Chargers and Camaro's with six top 12 finishers during that period.

 

Toward the end the Alfetta was a tad quicker but none could catch the screaming Williamson Celicas.

 

But getting back to Jim McKeown, Terry, fantastic driver and one of my favourites.

 

From humpy Holdens, to Holden specials, to the first in the world to really master the rear "A" frame suspension in the Mk 1 Lotus Cortina. Not to mention extracting very good bhp numbers from the Twin Cam without any trick overseas parts. All locally developed.

 

Then ending his career with a wickedly fast Porsche RS "Special" mid-engined beast.

 

Wonderful time for Aussie touring fans.

 

Cheers Steve W

Jim's career did continue years latter with a Elfin Streamliner and the Lotus Cortina in historics and I think he might have done the odd race in the 1st generation 996 GT3's?

Edited by Lola5000, 15 June 2023 - 08:32.

[Tim Murray]

Following the transfer here of Alfa-related posts from the Jim McKeown thread, some posts have been edited as the removed material is no longer relevant.

[Paul Newby]

Let's get the naming of these Alfa Romeo models correct!

 

These Alfas were never known as 105 Series GTV 2000's when they raced in the 1970s.

 

The correct name is actually 2000 GT Veloce often shortened to 2000 GTV. It is the same with the 1750 GTV. There was never a 1600 GTV (as raced at Bathurst 1967.) It was call the Giulia Sprint GT Veloce. '1600' sometimes appeared between the Giulia and the Sprint. The 1600 GT Junior was actually known as the GT 1.6 in Australia with its own unique badging. The term 'Junior' wasn't considered a great selling point here. Most of these models that survive have the 1600 GT Junior badge, which is still available to purchase as a spare part.

 

None of these Alfas were know as 105 Series in period. This seems to have been a recent naming protocol to distinguish it from that other GTV, the 116 Series Alfetta. The original Alfetta coupe was known as the Alfetta GT. When the smaller 1.6 model came along (not in Australia) the coupe was known outside Australia as the Alfetta GT 1.8. When the 2.0 Litre engine became available it was known as the Alfetta GTV 2000. The 'Nuovo' series from 1981 meant a new name - Alfetta GTV 2.0 and eventually the Alfetta name was dropped I think from 1984 onwards - it was just the GTV 2.0 (or GTV6 2.5 for the V6 engine coupe.)

 

In England or Europe you could substitute the name '105 Series' for 'Bertone.' The Alfisti will always know that it is a 105 Series, but general enthusiasts would distinguish it as the Bertone GTV.

Edited by Paul Newby, 15 June 2023 - 10:28.

[TerryS]

Images for Alfa 105 GTV 2000:

 

alfa 105 gtv 2000 - Google Search

[Porsche718]

In Europe during this time, ETCC and BTCC were a mixture of Group 1 and Group 2 saloons.

 

All Group 1 cars seemed to be producing about on average about 80 bhp per litre of capacity. Group 2 were much wilder producing 110 to 120 bhp per litre or more.

 

My question is, which group was nearer in spec to our Group C?

 

The European Group 1 Alfa GTV 2000's were making about 135 bhp in 1974 and about 155 bhp in 1975. I would have thought our Group C Alfas would have been a bit higher?

 

Thoughts?

[Lola5000]

In Europe during this time, ETCC and BTCC were a mixture of Group 1 and Group 2 saloons.

 

All Group 1 cars seemed to be producing about on average about 80 bhp per litre of capacity. Group 2 were much wilder producing 110 to 120 bhp per litre or more.

 

My question is, which group was nearer in spec to our Group C?

 

The European Group 1 Alfa GTV 2000's were making about 135 bhp in 1974 and about 155 bhp in 1975. I would have thought our Group C Alfas would have been a bit higher?

 

Thoughts?

I owned in 1982/3 the ex factory GTV2000 team car ,that had always been a racecar , the 1977 HF1000 Bell car , we did the motor up ,ported the heads some (Dyno Dave -HeadMod) new Borgo 10.5 to one pistons , the car ran 48 Webers and had a trick exhaust manifold , at best it was around 140 bhp.

[Ray Bell]

Okay, I'll have a go at this...

 

Group C was introduced in 1973 after the 'Supercar Scare' of mid-1972. For cars such as the Alfas, that is imported cars, Group 1 was the starting point.

 

Engine modifications were permitted in the valve train. Camshaft profiles, camshaft materials, valves, valve springs, pushrods, rockers, all free except that valve dimensions and valve spring types could not be changed.

 

Other than that, internal components were essentially just to be blueprinted and balanced (removal of metal only and only from areas as were used for balancing by the manufacturer). Fettling of ports was only permitted if it had been carried out by the manufacturer.

 

Carburettors exhaust systems were free, but only outside the manifold supplied by the manufacturer. Adaptors and modifications were allowed for the purpose of changing carburettors, so both inlet and exhaust manifolds had to remain essentially as they came from the manufacturer.

 

In the suspension, spring rates could be changed, anti-roll bars could be altered, added or deleted at will, dampers were free provided they replaced a similar type of damper. It was necessary for a car, with its driver, to be able to drive over an 80cm square block 10cm high.

 

Brakes were an area where modifications could be made. Discs had to be the same diameter and had the same friction area, backing plates could be removed, alterations could be made to caliper mounts to facilitate the use of different calipers.

 

Wheels had to provide no variation in track dimensions and tyres remained essentially within the original bodywork. To that end, it was permitted to re-form body protrusions (as in jointing of panels etc) inside the wheel wells to prevent damage to tyres, but the external shape of the car was not to be altered or to increase clearances within the wheel wells.

 

The interior of the car had to remain as built by the manufacturer except that a pair of new front seats could be fitted. These had to weigh at least as much as the original front seats.

[Lee Nicolle]

Maybe the wheels were supposed to be in standard track and under the guards. But none of them ever were,, made worse by the tyres not being suitable for the rims.

Alfas I do not know but XU1s were at least 3" over legal track and the tyres were mostly outside the guards. They only got a 9" wide rim under the rear by using very low profile tyres. Ditto on the front with 8" wide rims. L34 and later A9X were even worse and those huge tyres they all used were supposed to be on a 12" wide rim,, never a 10" I have raced on those tyres and the rear of the car was not really attached to the front.Why??  Because the same as most they had so much power they needed the wider tyres,,,,NOT.

Nearly every race contested over several years  all the big cars were illegal with the over wide tyres. And track rules. Same happened with Sports Sedans as well, in general the same tyres. First bigger Dunops I used were an inch narrower [300 700 16] than more common use ones.[325 70 16] Russel Stuckey stopped bring them in because they had to have 13"=wide tyres,, on a 10" rim. Drrrrr!! When we went to a bag width the bigger tyres were only just ok. And still moved too much on the rims. And those GpC crossplies were over the bag width. That is what my wets were

The Falcons were even more over track and had to 'tub' the guards to get those huge tyres under the rear guards. The fronts?? A smaller tyre [ as most of the A9Xs used] but a 10" rim does not fit those cars. The Camaros ditto.

Commodores were supposed to be 35P yet most used the same wheels on their VB VC VH VK that were about 10N. So about 5" over track. 

When being hassled at Sandown once about bullshit things I told the scrutes this. But it was all too hard for them. They did not like the font my name was in on the side windows. And that was a very common used font for signs. I just gave the measurements to the sign shop and that is what I got.

I have the wannabes wanting 10" rims for their Toranas and Falcons. Time after time I tell them they really do not fit,, but they have to have them anyway. Some have came back whining they will not fit. Which I had told them. And the 295 50 15 tyres are about 1.5" narrower than the Baddays they raced those Fords on. On a 4 door LH LX they nearly have to cut the corners out of the doors!

[Porsche718]

I owned in 1982/3 the ex factory GTV2000 team car ,that had always been a racecar , the 1977 HF1000 Bell car , we did the motor up ,ported the heads some (Dyno Dave -HeadMod) new Borgo 10.5 to one pistons , the car ran 48 Webers and had a trick exhaust manifold , at best it was around 140 bhp.

 

Lola,

 

I guess my surprise at the numbers of your ex-works Alfa is because the Group C Celica was making outrageous bhp for engine size. I knew the chap who bought the last Williamson car and it had BMW fuel injection grafted onto the "standard" manifold, the camshafts were Cosworth DFV profile and the thing was well over 200 bhp at some ballistic maximum revs.

 

I would have thought Autodelta in Italy would have been able to supply some very exotic bits and info for the Australian Alfas.

Edited by Porsche718, 16 June 2023 - 22:27.

[Lola5000]

Lola,

 

I guess my surprise at the numbers of your ex-works Alfa is because the Group C Celica was making outrageous bhp for engine size. I knew the chap who bought the last Williamson car and it had BMW fuel injection grafted onto the "standard" manifold, the camshafts were Cosworth DFV profile and the thing was well over 200 bhp at some ballistic maximum revs.

 

I would have thought Autodelta in Italy would have been able to supply some very exotic bits and info for the Australian Alfas.

Remember the Alfa twin cam is a long stroke engine  from the early 1960s,and Autodelta were more in those years into the Sportscar racing and in previous years the 4 valve and 8 spark heads (GTA/GTAM cars)

I don't imagine the Foley team had a huge budget for a than 4 year old car in 1977,perhaps the strength of the GTV2000 was it endurance ,braking and handling ?

 

So i bought that car in the time i mentioned  the previous owner had sprinted it in lap dash stuff as I did  he had bought it of Peter Brown who had raced it after Foley team ,I often drove the car on street in fact one year took it to Adelaide ,came over via the coast and at one stage on miles of flat road ,drove it to its max ...around 125 mph . .

 

They weren't highly modified cars.

Edited by Lola5000, 17 June 2023 - 01:12.

[TerryS]

Let's get the naming of these Alfa Romeo models correct!

 

These Alfas were never known as 105 Series GTV 2000's when they raced in the 1970s.

 

The correct name is actually 2000 GT Veloce often shortened to 2000 GTV.

None of these Alfas were know as 105 Series in period. This seems to have been a recent naming protocol to distinguish it from that other GTV, the 116 Series Alfetta. 

 

I

IMHO it is conceivable there may be errors in what you have alluded to.

 

The "105" is the series number used by Alfa factory. It applies to the 2000 GTV as well as many other models.

 

Refer to the attached. Click on 105 box.

 

Scroll down in first column and you will come to "105.21".

 

 

https://alfa105.org/Serie105/Lista105

 

Hopefully this resolves the matter.

Edited by TerryS, 19 June 2023 - 05:33.

[Paul Newby]

IMHO it is conceivable there may be errors in what you have alluded to.

 

The "105" is the series number used by Alfa factory. It applies to the 2000 GTV as well as many other models.

 

Refer to the attached. Click on 105 box.

 

Scroll down in first column and you will come to "105.21".

 

 

https://alfa105.org/Serie105/Lista105

 

Hopefully this resolves the matter.

 

Terry,

 

I know what I am talking about here. I have owned one of these cars for over 30 years and have kept tabs on a lot of cars via being an AROCA committee member and Concours judge. I know these cars very well.

 

Yes, they have always been categorised as the 105 Series, but were never referred to as 105 Series when they raced in period, most probably because the confusion with the 116 Series Alfetta GTV only came years later in retrospect.

 

 Also the reference that you quoted is incorrect. Tipo 105.21 refers to left hand drive cars. Right hand drive cars are 105.22 - Australian cars have a green sticker in the engine bay denoting '105.22.' In 1975 Australia did receive CKD South African 2000 GTV Autos and they had '105.22A' stickers in the engine bay. American 2000 GTVs with their Spica fuel injection were 115.01. The only 115 Series cars Australia received new were the  1972-74 1600 GT Junior - 115.05.

 

Hopefully this resolves the matter...

Edited by Paul Newby, 19 June 2023 - 12:39.

[TerryS]

For interest who assembled the Alfa CKD packs in Australia?

 

I had a feeling it might have been Lightburn.

Edited by TerryS, 20 June 2023 - 00:23.

[Paul Newby]

For interest who assembled the Alfa CKD packs in Australia?

 

I had a feeling it might have been Lightburn.

 

Lightburn Industries stated that they were planning on assembling Alfa Romeos from CKD kits but it never happened. I'm not sure how many cars it imported in 1964 - there was the road test Giulia Sprint GT (as seen in Wheels/Sports Car World) and a 2600 Sprint. I doubt that there would have been more than a dozen cars imported by Lightburn. At the same time Alec Mildren in Sydney was bringing them in and Murray Wright from MW Motors in Melbourne would soon follow. All of these cars were fully imported.

 

I believe that most South African Giulia models were assembled from CKD kits in their factory in Pretoria State. Other Alfa Romeo models were assembled right up to around 1985. As previously mentioned the only South African built model we officially received was the 2000 GTV Auto in 1975. I think a few others have come in since - I know of a late 1600 GT Junior that had the the grille and twin headlights seen on the 2000.

 

Of course, the holy grail of South African built Alfa Romeos is the unique Alfetta GTV6 3.0 from 1983-85, which was a homologation special and used a unique Autodelta developed engine block (that was different to later factory 3.0 engines.) Sources vary, but around 200 were built and quite a number have come to Australia in recent years.

[Lola5000]

I owned various GTV 2000's in the early 80s onwards after making the mistake of buying a nearly new Alfetta GTV 2l in 1980,in those days I was very active in AROCA VIC,committee and sprint/hillclimb days, we never revered to the GTV 2000s as 105s ,that came about few years latter to save confusion with the Alfetta GTV model.

 

I even have a letter from Alfaromeo.com, where I have made an enquiry about a GTV 2000 I owned and would like to know if its still around the letter refers to the model as "Alfa Romeo 2000 GT Veloce..

 

Paul are you able if I give you via a PM the chassis # to see if my old GTV 2000 is still around?

 

Rob Bailey.

Edited by Lola5000, 20 June 2023 - 05:51.

[MarkBisset]

Different strokes for different folks in all of this. My 105 1750 was 'my 1750' whereas my 2000 was  'my 2-litre', my GTV6 was 'GTV6' though I too dunno too if it was still officially an Alfetta by then. I wonder what the manual with the car said? Not that I give a toss.

 

Once I'd read Fusi I dropped '105' into the conversation all the time to keep up with the other Alfa-tossers...one make clubs not necessarily a good thing. An absolute pisser was being at an AROCA Vic meeting at Princes Park and watching two half-pissed well-nourished lawyers arguing the toss, almost to the point of blows, about the kosher front 'Alfa Romeo'badge on a 1750.

 

The Lightburn gig came to an end when the Zeta tanked and Lightburn pulled the pin on the auto side of their business inclusive of Alfa, Joe Kenwright cites 65 cars imported by them.

 

  

Edited by MarkBisset, 20 June 2023 - 06:36.

[Lola5000]

Different strokes for different folks in all of this. My 105 1750 was 'my 1750' whereas my 2000 was  'my 2-litre', my GTV6 was 'GTV6' though I too dunno too if it was still officially an Alfetta by then. I wonder what the manual with the car said? Not that I give a toss.

 

Once I'd read Fusi I dropped '105' into the conversation all the time to keep up with the other Alfa-tossers...one make clubs not necessarily a good thing. An absolute pisser was being at an AROCA Vic meeting at Princes Park and watching two half-pissed well-nourished lawyers arguing the toss, almost to the point of blows, about the kosher front 'Alfa Romeo'badge on a 1750.

 

The Lightburn gig came to an end when the Zeta tanked and Lightburn pulled the pin on the auto side of their business inclusive of Alfa, Joe Kenwright cites 65 cars imported by them.

 

  

Mark who were the 2 x lawyers ?  Do you remember the guy "Terry" who would get smashed at the bar and fall over ,think his wives name was Wonda?

[Lee Nicolle]

Lightburn Industries stated that they were planning on assembling Alfa Romeos from CKD kits but it never happened. I'm not sure how many cars it imported in 1964 - there was the road test Giulia Sprint GT (as seen in Wheels/Sports Car World) and a 2600 Sprint. I doubt that there would have been more than a dozen cars imported by Lightburn. At the same time Alec Mildren in Sydney was bringing them in and Murray Wright from MW Motors in Melbourne would soon follow. All of these cars were fully imported.

 

I believe that most South African Giulia models were assembled from CKD kits in their factory in Pretoria State. Other Alfa Romeo models were assembled right up to around 1985. As previously mentioned the only South African built model we officially received was the 2000 GTV Auto in 1975. I think a few others have come in since - I know of a late 1600 GT Junior that had the the grille and twin headlights seen on the 2000.

 

Of course, the holy grail of South African built Alfa Romeos is the unique Alfetta GTV6 3.0 from 1983-85, which was a homologation special and used a unique Autodelta developed engine block (that was different to later factory 3.0 engines.) Sources vary, but around 200 were built and quite a number have come to Australia in recent years.

Having seen the mess outside Lightburn in the 70s and later it is probably good they did not assemble them. And the paint on a Zeta looked like it was sprayed with a straw broom. So their paint line would have been,,,, well inadequate.

The washing machines were in finished gel coat so were not too bad.

Edited by Lee Nicolle, 20 June 2023 - 08:25.

[Lola5000]

Having seen the mess outside Lightburn in the 70s and later it is probably good they did not assemble them. And the paint on a Zeta looked like it was sprayed with a straw broom. So their paint line would have been,,,, well inadequate.

The washing machines were in finished gel coat so were not too bad.

There washing machines were rubbish too.

[Ray Bell]

They had a good reputation back in the day of the twin-tub...

 

Everyone recognised that their spin dryer was bigger than all the others and was good for double bedspreads.

 

The wash action, too, with the paddle moving back and forth, was very direct and got the clothes really clean. Their shortfall was in the earlier twin-tubs with just one motor in them, the spin dryer worked off a carbon cone drive and was not quite as durable as you might like. Kind of like a carbon clutch thrust on some cars.

[TerryS]

Ah, the mighty ZETA.

 

As I recall it, to go backwards you switched off the engine then started it in reverse. Then you had 4 reverse gears.
I think it would have been simpler just to lift it for reverse parking.......

Another unique feature was the petrol gauge. This was a tube that ran vertically up the dashboard.
Not completely accurate depending on the terrain.

Due to popular demand i understand only 10 of the utilities were produced

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[TerryS]

...

 

 

But is it a 2000 GTV or a 105?

Edited by TerryS, 21 June 2023 - 00:26.

[Paul Newby]

...

 

 

But is it a 2000 GTV or a 105?

 

Mmm... Terry, this is not a 105. Let me tell you why.

 

This is clearly an American market 2000 GTV with the Spica fuel injection. You can tell by the indicators being under the front bumper and the rectangular side indicators on the front guards (and the American number plate of course.) As such it is correctly designated as a 115 series car, or specifically 115.01 as you would have seen from one of my previous emails....

[ellrosso]

Just a bit of Alfa trivia, AV Jennings were probably the biggest home builder in Tassy during the 1960's and his daughter Lindy was a top golfer. Purity Supermarket was just near Lindisfarne Primary where i went to school

and I remember seeing Lindy pull up there in a very new looking dark blue Alfa 2600 coupe - maybe 1966 or 67. I was a big fan of 105 Alfas so very impressed at the time. She ended up marrying Billy Goggin - top Geelong football player

from memory - she continued her golf career as Lindy Goggin.

[Lola5000]

Just a bit of Alfa trivia, AV Jennings were probably the biggest home builder in Tassy during the 1960's and his daughter Lindy was a top golfer. Purity Supermarket was just near Lindisfarne Primary where i went to school

and I remember seeing Lindy pull up there in a very new looking dark blue Alfa 2600 coupe - maybe 1966 or 67. I was a big fan of 105 Alfas so very impressed at the time. She ended up marrying Billy Goggin - top Geelong football player

from memory - she continued her golf career as Lindy Goggin.

A.V Jenning were also strong supporters of Rolls-Royce in the period ,purchasing various new ones .

[TerryS]

For interest two ex Autodelta Alfas are currently for sale. Both rust free.

 

In both cases the ads give great detail about how model came into being and there histories.

 

The first is an Alfa 2000 GTAM. I believe this may be similar to the model that Brian Foley brought to OZ.

 

Racecarsdirect.com - ex-Autodelta Alfa Romeo 2000 GTAm

 

The second is an Alfa Guila Sprint 1600 GTA

 

Racecarsdirect.com - ex-Autodelta Alfa Romeo Guila Sprint 1600 GTA

 

Happy reading

[Lola5000]

Also for sale is the restored 2nd GTA Alec Mildren bought to Australia (RHD) the car in period raced by Frank G and KB and then John French before ending up in W.Aust .

[Ray Bell]

Gordon Stephenson, Frank Cecchele?

 

I think the one Gordon Mitchell drove was an everyday Alfa converted to Sports Sedan, wasn't it?

[Lola5000]

Gordon Stephenson, Frank Cecchele?

 

I think the one Gordon Mitchell drove was an everyday Alfa converted to Sports Sedan, wasn't it?

Yep thats the one .

[MarkBisset]

Two Mildren GTA minutae here; https://primotipo.co...alfa-romeo-gta/

[MarkBisset]

 

The AV Jennings chatter takes me back. 

 

The number of times Pete and Joan bundled us kids into the back of the haitch-R, HK and HG for trips from North Balwyn (aka North Boring aka The Punjab) to even-more-outer urban paradise in Doncaster, Donvale and Templestowe to look at endless AV Jennings display homes is forever etched on my child-mind! I was leader of the push to move closer to Melbourne, not further out! They did stay put, mumbo's place in Balwyn North - as it's called these days - is still in family hands albeit the star of the local mid-week-ladies tennis comp has been in a penitentiary (nursing home) since late last September, it's always the falls that gets us!?

 

 

This 2-litre gets a loving pat on the rump from me most mornings. It lives on the street in Windsor 600 metres away on my bee-line from Albert Park Lake to Mimolette, the little French joint where I get my first caffeine hit of the day, it's open from 6, very handy. There I mentally pat Stephanie on the rump each day too...

 

When I bought my first place in Windsor in 1985 I had my 1750 105, on-street parking in the inner suburbs made me weep. The number of occasions KRE592 copped a tap up the arse - it was never the nose fortunately - resulted in it's sale within 12 months. I bought a Sud Ti twin-carb which I wasn't so fussy about. Rust and Suds, far-canal etc.

 

photo url

 

Finally, this GTA was at Benzina magazine's concours at Daylesford in February. Nice guy, forgotten the story, I'd had a few Moets by the time I got to him. Too many to drive home I suspect, quick trip all the same 

Edited by MarkBisset, 24 June 2023 - 04:33.

[TerryS]

Mmm... Terry, this is not a 105. Let me tell you why.

 

This is clearly an American market 2000 GTV with the Spica fuel injection. You can tell by the indicators being under the front bumper and the rectangular side indicators on the front guards (and the American number plate of course.) As such it is correctly designated as a 115 series car, or specifically 115.01 as you would have seen from one of my previous emails....

 

Re 115.01, I note from the table i posted in #18 that the description of the model is:

 

"2000 GTV Veloce Gs USA)

 

Do you know what the Gs stands for?

[TerryS]

Also for sale is the restored 2nd GTA Alec Mildren bought to Australia (RHD) the car in period raced by Frank G and KB and then John French before ending up in W.Aust .

 

FOR SALE ALFA GTA

 

Fantastic detail and history in the ad. And only $699,900, a "bargain"

 

1965 Alfa Romeo Giulia Sprint GTA 1600 - Australia's Number 1 Motorsport Marketplace - my105.com

[Ray Bell]

Interesting that Foley is said to have fitted 13" wide rims when the class limit was 10"...

 

And that Warwick Farm is listed as one of the 'shorter tracks' when only two Australian circuits were longer during that period.

[ellrosso]

Wow, the $699,900 is quite the "red light" special......

[Lee Nicolle]

Interesting that Foley is said to have fitted 13" wide rims when the class limit was 10"...

 

And that Warwick Farm is listed as one of the 'shorter tracks' when only two Australian circuits were longer during that period.

I suspect they meant 13" tyres. 

As for the price?? tell him he is dreaming!!

However well it has been restored it is still an old Sports Sedan and I suspect is more spare parts than original. Even an unmolested car would very much struggle at that price.

If restored to the Brian Foley specs it would have more appeal,, though again a long way off of 700k

[MarkBisset]

Superb shots Lindsay! 

 

What is Mr King's first name?, and Dick's stuff always hits the spot! Gotta be a pretty-picture-taxi book in the best of Dick?

 

Is 'Hammo' on the rise out of Newry?? He came up in conversations at an Old Fossils lunch yesterday in a Carrera 356 context as being Porsche Oz best man with knowledge/service capability on these complex engines. Surprised me, I figured him as always 'a suit'.

 

I can never decide between Moffat's Mustang and Foley's GTAm as my favourite oz-tourer, such a handsome thing...

[Paul Newby]

Re 115.01, I note from the table i posted in #18 that the description of the model is:

 

"2000 GTV Veloce Gs USA)

 

Do you know what the Gs stands for?

 

Gs - guida a sinistra - translated as left-hand drive

 

Gd - guida a destra - translated as right-hand drive

[ellrosso]

Hi Mark, its Graeme King and I got onto him thru Bob Wright of Tassie "Tasma" sports car fame. He was a mate of Bobs and an enthusiast who liked to take pictures. Only a 50% strike rate re focus but some gems in his collection. Definitely a books worth of material in Dick's collection, especially

from 1967 - 73? maybe, certainly 1972. Good mix of sporties and open wheels in there too. A lot from Oran Park and W Farm as you would expect, but some great stuff from Calder, Sandown, Malalla, Hume Weir and Bathurst (and even Surfers and Lakeside come to think of it).

And all from the spectator areas - pretty amazing really. He had good gear and film but most importantly a great eye and the photographic skills to use it. I really take my hat off to him - he's got a great collection.

 

Hamilton is on the rise out of Newry - he did very well in that Alfa at Longford in 1968. He had raced at Longford before of course (in '66 - 904, '67 - 906) but I don't think he had raced the GTA before that meeting - others may know. I didn't know he was good "on the tools" either.

I saw Moff's Mustang several times live and its right up there for me, also saw Foles at Syms in '72 in the GTAm V8 too - very schmick car. The Geoghegan Mustang is my all timer though, with the Thommo VW Chev close behind - such an outrageous, quick car back in the day. Thommo seemed like a good guy too,

very popular in Tassy as he was quite a frequent visitor to Bask especially.

[Ray Bell]

I'd reckon his ability to work on the machines would have been at his father's 'request'...

 

A part of schooling the lad to take over from him one day, he'd need to know the ins and outs of things.

[ellrosso]

Mildren Team RHD GTA Surfers 12 hr.

[Ray Bell]

Judging by the angle of head leaning, that's KB at the wheel there...

 

And I'd reckon it's Roxburgh behind him in the Datsun he shared with Doug Whiteford. They completed 447 laps to the winners' 490, but the Alfa got nowhere, retiring at the first pit stop (about 90 minutes into the race) when it refused to start, being said to be 'too tight'. Yes, KB took the start and Doug Chivas never got to drive it.

[Lee Nicolle]

Superb shots Lindsay! 

 

What is Mr King's first name?, and Dick's stuff always hits the spot! Gotta be a pretty-picture-taxi book in the best of Dick?

 

Is 'Hammo' on the rise out of Newry?? He came up in conversations at an Old Fossils lunch yesterday in a Carrera 356 context as being Porsche Oz best man with knowledge/service capability on these complex engines. Surprised me, I figured him as always 'a suit'.

 

I can never decide between Moffat's Mustang and Foley's GTAm as my favourite oz-tourer, such a handsome thing...

Period Tourers?  Moffs Mustang and the Jane ZL1.

Sports Sedans, the Edmondsen Alfas and the Ricciardello Alfa and that is still racing after 30 odd years. I saw both cars being built,, or Tonys second Alfa at Elfin and the Ricciardello car at K&A. And yes there was similarities. Tonys first Alfa was K&A built.

AFAIK Chris Clearihan has the Edmonsen Alfa