94 replies to this topic

[AustinF1]

So ... it looks like Max only needs to finish P6 or better in the Qatar Sprint to clinch the WDC. Hey, they can't say nobody told them this would happen. I remember some of you mentioning this scenario immediately when the idea of Sprints paying WDC points was first floated. 

 

Your thoughts?

 

 

Photo source unknown, other than this reddit thread: https://www.reddit.c...t_f1_driver_in/

Apologies if there is an existing thread similar to this one. I looked, but did not see one.

[DW46]

It’s like they are actually trolling the bloke. This is for me why we shouldn’t award points on a Saturday.

Dudes gonna be crowned champ with no one watching. Seems harsh given the quality of the season he’s just produced.

[midgrid]

Piquet effectively won the 1987 title when Mansell injured himself in qualifying for the Japanese GP.

[FNG]

LOL, if it were not for the sprint race we would have had a gripping finish to the title in the GP!

 

Don't think anyone really cares this season

[Collombin]

Dudes gonna be crowned champ with no one watching. Seems harsh

Especially after 2021 being spoiled by all the controversy and finding out about 2022 from Johnny Herbert. Poor guy just can't catch a break.

[PayasYouRace]

Piquet effectively won the 1987 title when Mansell injured himself in qualifying for the Japanese GP.

And that was on Friday.

[Collombin]

And that was on Friday.

Saturday was clinch day though, as there were weird rumours floating around about Nige maybe still being able to race. Only once he was safely on the plane home did we know for sure.

[Zippel]

Mika almost clinched the 1999 WDC when both Ferraris were initially disqualified from Malaysia.

[AustinF1]

It’s like they are actually trolling the bloke. This is for me why we shouldn’t award points on a Saturday.

Dudes gonna be crowned champ with no one watching. Seems harsh given the quality of the season he’s just produced.

Yeah this is something I was thinking about too. If Max wraps up the title on Saturday it sucks for the fans because it makes the GP a bit meaningless. It sucks for Red Bull and Max because they'll be celebrating the title on a Saturday with not many people in attendance or watching, while still preparing for the GP on Sunday, etc. And no podium celebration, right?). Basically, it just sucks all around. But ... F1 gonna F1.

Edited by AustinF1, 25 September 2023 - 23:05.

[jonklug]

If Max and RB are truly bothered by this they can always retire the car in the sprint. But they're not so I don't really see the issue. He's been the champion for some time now, it's not really new. And the real celebration will of course be on Sunday still. 

[PlatenGlass]

Don't see why it matters. He's going to win. The exact moment when it's clinched is of little importance.

[LolaB0860]

Well at least for the imaginary fans there's something to see that day. Because there is nothing else on Saturday program except for maximum of 45 minute qualifying session (sorry F1 SPRINT SHOOTOUT ™) and maximum of 30 minute race (sorry F1 SPRINT ™) with no support races and no demonstration runs

[ConsiderAndGo]

He’s going to win it, so I don’t really care whether it’s in a sprint or GP. Liberty will be salivating though as it just gives more credence to add more sprint races next year.

Edited by ConsiderAndGo, 26 September 2023 - 06:11.

[IrvTheSwerve]

Hope it happens. I hate the sprints taking away from the Grands Prix and this would literally take an important moment away from Sunday. It’s inevitable, yes, but I don’t think that matters.

 

I’d be a bit miffed if I’d paid for a Sunday ticket and not been able to see the crowning of the WDC.

[SophieB]

I hope it happens just to mildly embarrass the sport who said Sprint races won’t ever take anything away from the Grands Prix. However it happens it won’t take away from Verstappen’s achievement, though.

[sportyskells]

Last time this happened was in a piquet

[Heyli]

I dont really see how it matters this season? The titles were practically wrapped up for ages already. I didnt really get excited about Red Bull factually clinching it last sunday and I wont get really excited about Verstappen factually clinching it either.. Doesnt matter much if it's a saturday or a sunday really. 

[Roadhouse]

Last time this happened was in a piquet

What? Max getting his achievement too early?

[Gareth]

As long as we get this on Saturday, it'll be cool.

 

[SenorSjon]

Last year it was Herbert

This year it will be some desert location in the dark where no one wants to be. 

 

If only Perez got a proper penalty in Singapore. The 4 points he earned there dragged the WDC to Qatar.

[Ruusperi]

Well at least for the imaginary fans there's something to see that day. Because there is nothing else on Saturday program except for maximum of 45 minute qualifying session (sorry F1 SPRINT SHOOTOUT ™) and maximum of 30 minute race (sorry F1 SPRINT ™) with no support races and no demonstration runs

I wonder how much Saturday-ticket costs, if you're only going to see max 75 minutes of racing. Anyway, the crowd probably consists of CGI figures or employees of the organizer who are forced to sit there.

[Nemo1965]

The comedy club montage missed a nice bit. After the race at Suzuka, when Max was hugging the Red Bull mechanics, one of them said something like: don’t get the championship in the Sprintrace, we have to work on Sunday and can’t celebrate properly then!

[LolaB0860]

Liberty will be salivating though as it just gives more credence to add more sprint races next year.

"As you can see, it was the F1 SPRINT ™ that really decided the championship, which really shows the progress Liberty made in constructing the best possible entertainment model for our fans as well as economically working concept for our trusted partners. This year, 16 F1 Sprints ™ are on the cards in addition to 24 Grand Prix, making it even number of 40 races that is easy to remember for fans, stakeholders and partners. Finally, we are pleased to announce the introduction of awarding championship point for the fastest sprint car in the F1 SPRINT SHOOTOUT ™, truly emphasizing the importance of being as fast in 100 meter run as when running a marathon."

[pdac]

I've always disliked points being awarded for anything other than the race finish positions. But, really, I didn't want it, it was implemented anyway, so why should I worry anymore. If it proves to affect the long-term interests of F1, then I will feel smug and think "I told you so", but I doubt it will (and if it does, then I'me sure they will change things again) so I'm just going to move on.

Edited by pdac, 26 September 2023 - 09:56.

[PayasYouRace]

Why should anyone care about this anyway? If the championship isn’t decided during the last race of the season, there’s a fundamentally bigger problem than the point system distribution and awarding of bonus points.

[Clatter]

Hope it happens. I hate the sprints taking away from the Grands Prix and this would literally take an important moment away from Sunday. It’s inevitable, yes, but I don’t think that matters.

 

I’d be a bit miffed if I’d paid for a Sunday ticket and not been able to see the crowning of the WDC.

 

You pay to watch a race. Even without the sprint, there is still the possibility he wouldn't score the points come race day, and the championship decider moves on.

[Beri]

Piquet effectively won the 1987 title when Mansell injured himself in qualifying for the Japanese GP.

 

Rindt won it in 1970 under the sad circumstances that he didnt even got to compete in the final 4 Grands Prix.

[Jackmancer]

1989 title was decided after the race at Suzuka

[PayasYouRace]

Rindt won it in 1970 under the sad circumstances that he didnt even got to compete in the final 4 Grands Prix.

I was thinking about Rindt, but presumably the point where Ickx could no longer outscore him came on a Sunday.

[Collombin]

I was thinking about Rindt, but presumably the point where Ickx could no longer outscore him came on a Sunday.

Better to say "race day" rather than Sunday, as that's surely the intent of the discussion, otherwise all 3 of Piquet's titles could be mentioned.

[PayasYouRace]

Better to say "race day" rather than Sunday, as that's surely the intent of the discussion, otherwise all 3 of Piquet's titles could be mentioned.

Yes quite right.

[katmen]

sprint is also racing and more racing more fun, for logistic wiev it is better that this miniraces are held in the same places and same weekends as GPs,definitely I watched all sprint races , F1 is first racing other aspects.......

 

F1 is evolving, move on....

[Beri]

Well, arguably Verstappen his title is likely to be also clinched on a race day. The Sprint Race that is. But a race day none the less. It just isn't the race day of a Grand Prix.

[Collombin]

Well, arguably Verstappen his title is likely to be also clinched on a race day. The Sprint Race that is. But a race day none the less. It just isn't the race day of a Grand Prix.

When this plan was first under serious discussion in 1986, istr the FIA were very keen to insist that the sprint race was a qualifying session, not a race! Of course it wasn't intended as a standalone event back then.

Edited by Collombin, 26 September 2023 - 11:39.

[F1Frog]

Arguably it is good for F1 as the sprint will get more views than usual.

[Risil]

I was surprised to learn that Perez is Max's championship rival. I don't think I'd have been able to name who it is we're supposed to think has a chance of taking the title off Verstappen, if you'd given me a pop quiz.

[DaddyCool]

"As you can see, it was the F1 SPRINT ™ that really decided the championship, which really shows the progress Liberty made in constructing the best possible entertainment model for our fans as well as economically working concept for our trusted partners. This year, 16 F1 Sprints ™ are on the cards in addition to 24 Grand Prix, making it even number of 40 races that is easy to remember for fans, stakeholders and partners. Finally, we are pleased to announce the introduction of awarding championship point for the fastest sprint car in the F1 SPRINT SHOOTOUT ™, truly emphasizing the importance of being as fast in 100 meter run as when running a marathon."

^this is what I'm expecting as well - I have no doubt that they will spin it to propagate how awesome the sprints are

[PlatenGlass]

It's this obsession with exactly when a basically-already-won championship is clinched that led to Sebastien Loeb deliberately taking a penalty at the GB rally in 2005 after Michael Park's death so that he wouldn't clinch the title that round. This handed the rally win to Petter Solberg. This was a ridiculous thing to do, and I doubt he consulted Solberg on whether he wanted that particular rally win.

[IrvTheSwerve]

You pay to watch a race. Even without the sprint, there is still the possibility he wouldn't score the points come race day, and the championship decider moves on.

 

Well yeah, it's luck whether it's decided on the race you're attending or not, but what an anti-climax to show up at the circuit on the Sunday when it's all been celebrated the day before.

[Beri]

Arguably it is good for F1 as the sprint will get more views than usual.

 

Instead of two dogs and a cat, now it attracts to dogs, a cat and a chicken? I cant really be bothered to tune in for Sprint Races. Nor will I if there is a title on the line.

[lustigson]

Mika almost clinched the 1999 WDC when both Ferraris were initially disqualified from Malaysia.

 

I remember that... but wasn't that after the race instead of on the qualifying sprint day?

[PlatenGlass]

It took Massa until about 2025 to clinch the 2008 title.

[SenorSjon]

It took Massa until about 2025 to clinch the 2008 title.

 

Only to lose it again in 2029 after appeals.

[BerniesDad]

Phil Hill won his only WDC by finishing the race while his team-mate and fourteen spectators were dead at the circuit.

If it were me, I think I'd rather clinch the championship in a p**s-pot dumb sprint race. 

 

But I won't be watching.

[Collombin]

Similar to the other US champ, Mario - also clinched it at Monza with his teammate and rival's fatal crash.

[genius83]

Well at least for the imaginary fans there's something to see that day. Because there is nothing else on Saturday program except for maximum of 45 minute qualifying session (sorry F1 SPRINT SHOOTOUT ™) and maximum of 30 minute race (sorry F1 SPRINT ™) with no support races and no demonstration runs

 

With the bolded parts its ridiculous to think FIA and FOM/Liberty consider Sprint's idea to be logical from the start. Now the championship could be awarded in those 30 min session is as stupid as it could ever get. Basically they are just doing what late Paul Walker said in first Fast and Furious movie to Vin Diesel after the first drag race that you almost lost it, even though Paul did not finish the race after an engine issue.
 

Edited by genius83, 26 September 2023 - 16:13.

[renzmann]

I like the sprint races, but this is kind of messy. They should not do any sprint races this late in the season next time.

[LolaB0860]

I like the sprint races, but this is kind of messy. They should not do any sprint races this late in the season next time.

But that'll keep the championship artificially more open if the majority are at the end of the calendar. Such joy

[Burtros]

Who cares what day he wins it??

Saturday or a Sunday. Sprint or GP. It makes no difference to me at all.

This is complaining about sprints for the sake of complaining about sprints.

[Risil]

If you don't like sprints and don't have the time to watch them then it obviously is going to be annoying for the decisive moment of the championship to happen during one of them.

 

But it can't be a surprise -- the only way to avoid this would be to isolate the sprints from the championship by making them totally standalone events.

 

Surely an unintended consequence though. Wouldn't Liberty want maximum eyes on F1 at the time when a driver clinches the world championship?