12 replies to this topic

[highdownforce]

850cc engines agreed

https://motorcyclesp...google_vignette

Edited by highdownforce, 04 November 2023 - 12:33.

[flatlandsman]

Weil the last time this happened things did not go well, the 800 class became utterly dull, corner speed only and edge grip became king, we are still in the death throes of that era.

 

I guess by then the current grid will be long gone, Martin et al will be dominant, I do hope it attracts some new manufacturers, but the sports bike market i not where the money is in modern motorcycles, it used to be, but not anymore

[Risil]

Big news!

With the 800cc change long ago, it was never that clear to me whether it was the capacity change or the strict fuel limits that caused problems for the racing. Or even whether it was a new set of riders who wanted to control races from the front, ideally 20 seconds up the road.

[Skelly1927]

Big news!

With the 800cc change long ago, it was never that clear to me whether it was the capacity change or the strict fuel limits that caused problems for the racing. Or even whether it was a new set of riders who wanted to control races from the front, ideally 20 seconds up the road.

with smaller capacity engines you are forced into maintain revs through corners. Corner speed then becomes the primary factor in generating lap time which was bad for racing. It doesn't affect smaller bikes which this style is off-set by slipstream effect. Something along those lines iirc

[Jarninho]

I enjoyed the 800 era. Some classic races in it. I do remember most moaning was actually about the top speed advantage the Duc seemed to have and people using that as an argument to slam Stoner and praise Rossi as a superior rider, conveniently ignoring the fact that no one else could win on the red bike. A lot of moaning was also directed towards the electronics, which were very advanced, but I think that was an inevitable development anyway. The liter bikes would have seen the same advance or more because they had more torque.

For the perceived lack of overtaking, I am not sure that holds water. Rossi was so dominant in the previous era that he could and would just create a lot of artificial drama until the end of the race before winning with ease. It’s easy to overtake when you have superior straight line speed as well as corner speed (due to the bike as well as talent). With Stoner, Pedrosa and Lorenzo he was suddenly up against a new generation that was very professional and able to go wheel to wheel for the entire race. Obviously it's much harder to pass a fellow alien than it is to pass a pretty good one.

[AlexS]

So this means the bike weight will increase even more?

[Risil]

So this means the bike weight will increase even more?

By reducing the capacity by 150cc? I wouldn't have thought necessarily so.

[Dutchrudder]

What is the reasoning behind this? Are the Japanese manufacturers wanting this as a hard reset after falling into an insurmountable deficit vs Ducati?

[dissident]

Doesn't sound like a good idea.

[AlexS]

By reducing the capacity by 150cc? I wouldn't have thought necessarily so.

Sorry seems i am in another century when MotoGP was around 500cc

[Sash1]

850cc twostroke?
 

Or have some fun and go back to 6 cylinder 500cc fourstrokes. That would be fun.

And why 850? Why not back to 800? Why not 750? Why not 1000. Who cares. 

[Brian60]

850cc twostroke?
 

Or have some fun and go back to 6 cylinder 500cc fourstrokes. That would be fun.

And why 850? Why not back to 800? Why not 750? Why not 1000. Who cares. 

500cc two stroke triples - lets see how todays genration copes with do or die bikes.

[Risil]

What is the reasoning behind this? Are the Japanese manufacturers wanting this as a hard reset after falling into an insurmountable deficit vs Ducati?

It says there is a "settled majority" among manufacturers: the Europeans actually outnumber the Japanese on the grid these days (don't know if Suzuki have retained voting rights within the MSMA). So I assume at least one Euro manufacturer (presumably Aprilia, as they are quoted) is onboard.

As for why: most obvious explanation is that the bikes have too much torque and are too fast in a straight line, which makes certain circuits unsafe and also requires exotic and unloved tech like aero and mechanical anti-wheelie devices to get all the power down safely.