7942 replies to this topic

[KWSN - DSM]

Zhou is expected to sign with Ferrari as third and reserve driver according to Corriere della Sera

 

Things that surprises a lot (if it happens).

[Francesc]

He won't touch the car. It's only because of the Chinese market.

[JvsKVB77]

Things that surprises a lot (if it happens).

He was Ferrari junior driver in past, Mercedes had Gutierrez and Mick, as their reserve driver, Ferrari had Werhlein, why not Zhou then, if they lose Shwartzman and Bearman, and Giovinazzi has WEC dates conflicts.  

Edited by JvsKVB77, 16 November 2024 - 13:31.

[messy]

Test and reserve drivers these days aren't what they used to be. If Esteban Gutierrez can spend a few years occasionally getting picked up on camera staring into a monitor with his arms folded, so can Zhou.

Hopefully this opens a door to their WEC programme though, I could see him being genuinely good at that.

[Venom]

The Colapinto financials are absolutely the main bargaining chip here. The fact he’s, so far, proven to be a capable F1 driver is a bonus.

From Red Bull’s perspective it’s an opportunity to replace Perez while retaining all the good parts of having Perez - the Latin American backing.

In terms of competitiveness it’s a gamble, but they probably believe there’s not much to lose given Checo can barely score points any more.

[DJH63]

If they bought him out, he will end up at AT with Lawson dumped imo. 

[pacificquay]

If they bought him out, he will end up at AT with Lawson dumped imo. 

Pretty sure Lawson is safe within Red Bull next season, his drives this year have only enhanced his reputation

[Beri]

If they bought him out, he will end up at AT with Lawson dumped imo.

Why would Lawson be dumped? He is close to Yuki already, who has some 80 races more experience.
Yuki was clearly affiliated to Honda as well and Honda is out after 2025. If any driver would be ditched at Minardi in favor for anyone else, it is Yuki in my book.

[DJH63]

Why would Lawson be dumped? He is close to Yuki already, who has some 80 races more experience.
Yuki was clearly affiliated to Honda as well and Honda is out after 2025. If any driver would be ditched at Minardi in favor for anyone else, it is Yuki in my book.

Lawson doesn’t have a contract for 2025, unlike Perez, Tsunoda and Verstappen and RB have already decided he’s not good enough for the main team. Like Ricciardo he was a Hail Mary, not a long term play.

 

I dont really believe that RB will buy Colapinto out but if they do it’s pretty clear who would end up missing out.

[garoidb]

Lawson doesn’t have a contract for 2025, unlike Perez, Tsunoda and Verstappen and RB have already decided he’s not good enough for the main team. Like Ricciardo he was a Hail Mary, not a long term play.

 

I dont really believe that RB will buy Colapinto out but if they do it’s pretty clear who would end up missing out.

 

That's perfectly logical. One thing troubles me about it, though. Do you think they have started to think about who will drive for them in 2026 yet? How many of the current late 2024 roster will still be there? 

Edited by garoidb, 17 November 2024 - 14:02.

[DJH63]

That's perfectly logical. One thing troubles me about it, though. Do you think they have started to think about who will drive for them in 2026 yet? How many of the current late 2024 roster will still be there? 

Assuming they buy out Colapinto

 

Verstappen/Russell & Colapinto

Hadjar & Lindblad 

[garoidb]

Assuming they buy out Colapinto

 

Verstappen/Russell & Colapinto

Hadjar & Lindblad 

 

Yes. I don't know if those are going to be the names or not, but I do think they are potentially going to be replacing everyone. Even if Verstappen stays for 2026, he is likely to be a flight risk for 2027. They need new drivers and I am sure that is a big part of their thinking right now.

[jcbc3]

I thought the idea of Russell leaving Mercedes was based on Max going there?

 

So who do you guys envision beside Antonelli (providing he gets more than one season)?

[garoidb]

I thought the idea of Russell leaving Mercedes was based on Max going there?

 

So who do you guys envision beside Antonelli (providing he gets more than one season)?

 

I think that's what DJH63 means - it's either Max staying or George arriving in as his replacement, having been displaced at Mercedes. 

[jcbc3]

Ah, yes. Of course.

 

As you were then.

[messy]

Why would Lawson be dumped? He is close to Yuki already, who has some 80 races more experience.
Yuki was clearly affiliated to Honda as well and Honda is out after 2025. If any driver would be ditched at Minardi in favor for anyone else, it is Yuki in my book.

If they decide Lawson isn't the guy for them to replace Perez, it really wouldn't shock me if they just ditched him regardless of how accomplished he's been. They're Red Bull, they're that perfect mix of ruthless and clueless.

[southernstars]

Well, this seems to confirm that Alpine are not making any changes:

 

https://www.instagra...XU1eGFuMGc5M25z

 

Jack will be using the number 7 for next year. The caption, perhaps pointedly, says: "Drawing #7 for 2025. We're looking forward to seeing 7 on the A525"

 

But if that wasn't enough, the second top comment reads thus, translated from the Spanish: "Then come the furball fans of Colapinto saying that their driver is going to race in Alpine and the one who is confirmed is the guy in the video (Doohan). Let's see if they finally understand with this video."

 

Alpine have "liked' that comment...

[Alfisti]

Word is doohan has a 5 race contract.

[southernstars]

Word is doohan has a 5 race contract.

 

Same word that had Colapinto in that seat? 

[rodlamas]

Word is doohan has a 5 race contract.

Source: voices on my head

[DJH63]

Same word that had Colapinto in that seat? 

In fairness it’s not Alpine’s decision if RB are genuinely interested in Colapinto

[SenorSjon]

Word is doohan has a 5 race contract.

Colapinto is already well on his way to have wrecked 5 this year.

[Flyhigh]

Sainz not being signed with RB is pure madness, its insulting to logic and reason. The guy who is making a case for it now is Tsunoda on track and out of respect for all the years he has committed to the team then have Colapinto and Lawson duke it out at AT to see if there is a strong prospect on the long term.  

Perez and Stroll have no business on the grid is frustrating seeing 2 good seats wasted. 

[Clrnc]

Test and reserve drivers these days aren't what they used to be. If Esteban Gutierrez can spend a few years occasionally getting picked up on camera staring into a monitor with his arms folded, so can Zhou.

Hopefully this opens a door to their WEC programme though, I could see him being genuinely good at that.

Yup agree.

I mean he's been terrible this year but yet at the same time underrated here in comparison to Bottas who is still somehow hailed as one of the best out there despite being beaten by Zhou on pace half the time when Zhou has no mechanical issues

[PayasYouRace]

Word is doohan has a 5 race contract.

Do you have any source for that?

[jals99]

Do you have any source for that?

F1 insider 2 weeks ago said this
Hopefully it is rubbish

[Grippy]

Do you have any source for that?

https://www.foxsport...20cd2c504f4b9d9

 

The above article from Fox Sports Australia says it's a report from Auto Bild;

"...............With Auto Bild reporting that Doohan’s one-year deal is only guaranteed for the first five races of 2025, Ecclestone suggested it wouldn’t take much to break the deal..........."

[DJH63]

Viaplay claiming Mintzlaff was in Vegas to tie up a deal for Colapinto to join Alpha Tauri. 
 

Lawson would be out.

[balage06]

That would be hilarious.

[messy]

I don't think Lawson has been amazing- but that would be so harsh. About two weeks ago he thought he was replacing Perez! Colapinto hasn't quite lived up to that initial hype either. Red Bull clearly have no actual strategy to any of this.

[sterlingfan2000]

I think checo is staying , he might not lied.

Colapinto should seriously choose Alpine over Racing Bulls. Alpine would have Merc Engine in 2026

[andysaint]

RB need to look ahead to 2026.

I see next year being a struggle for them. McLaren are on the up, Mercedes are on the up, Ferrari are on the up. RB can barely keep pace. It’s only Max doing Max things which is keeping them where they are.

I see Max leaving for 2026 so they could well end up in a position with two seats at RB to fill for 2026 and 2 seats at the junior team to fill as matters currently stand today.

I don’t see Tsunoda staying in Red Bull full stop when Honda leaves.
Lawson I don’t believe has convinced anyone for the main drive. Do they want him in the junior team if there is no prospect of stepping up?
Perez is almost certainly finished beyond 2024
I think Red Bull are in a hole at the moment and they know they are in a hole. This is why the decision making process is so messed up, they cannot make one. I’ll even go as far as saying I think Horner may not be Team Principle come 2025 so they may not want him making decisions on drivers.

[garoidb]

RB need to look ahead to 2026.

I see next year being a struggle for them. McLaren are on the up, Mercedes are on the up, Ferrari are on the up. RB can barely keep pace. It’s only Max doing Max things which is keeping them where they are.

I see Max leaving for 2026 so they could well end up in a position with two seats at RB to fill for 2026 and 2 seats at the junior team to fill as matters currently stand today.

I don’t see Tsunoda staying in Red Bull full stop when Honda leaves.
Lawson I don’t believe has convinced anyone for the main drive. Do they want him in the junior team if there is no prospect of stepping up?
Perez is almost certainly finished beyond 2024
I think Red Bull are in a hole at the moment and they know they are in a hole. This is why the decision making process is so messed up, they cannot make one. I’ll even go as far as saying I think Horner may not be Team Principle come 2025 so they may not want him making decisions on drivers.

 

They could still contend for the 2025 WDC with Max and Honda. In a way, 2025 is not the problem. If Max does leave in 2026 or 2027, they probably won't have a team leader in the ranks waiting to take over. There isn't anyone as good as Max anywhere so the new one doesn't have to meet that criterion. I could see it being Sainz at some point, but not before Max leaves. Regarding Horner being potentially ousted, they should be careful to have a good replacement on hand if they do that. Everyone is expendable so it is not unthinkable but then it would be a complete rebuild job. Do they, the drinks company, even still want to be F1 owners?

Edited by garoidb, Yesterday, 20:28.

[noikeee]

RB need to look ahead to 2026.

I see next year being a struggle for them. McLaren are on the up, Mercedes are on the up, Ferrari are on the up. RB can barely keep pace. It’s only Max doing Max things which is keeping them where they are.

I see Max leaving for 2026 so they could well end up in a position with two seats at RB to fill for 2026 and 2 seats at the junior team to fill as matters currently stand today.

I don’t see Tsunoda staying in Red Bull full stop when Honda leaves.
Lawson I don’t believe has convinced anyone for the main drive. Do they want him in the junior team if there is no prospect of stepping up?
Perez is almost certainly finished beyond 2024
I think Red Bull are in a hole at the moment and they know they are in a hole. This is why the decision making process is so messed up, they cannot make one. I’ll even go as far as saying I think Horner may not be Team Principle come 2025 so they may not want him making decisions on drivers.

Sack all drivers and hire all new ones?

There's not even good drivers out there free of contract in the market. They're ****ed.

[andysaint]

They could still contend for the 2025 WDC with Max and Honda. In a way, 2025 is not the problem. If Max does leave in 2026 or 2027, they probably won't have a team leader in the ranks waiting to take over. There isn't anyone as good as Max anywhere so the new one doesn't have to meet that criterion. I could see it being Sainz at some point, but not before Max leaves. Regarding Horner being potentially ousted, they should be careful to have a good replacement on hand if they do that. Everyone is expendable so it is not unthinkable but then it would be a complete rebuild job. Do they, the drinks company, even still want to be F1 owners?

Yes they could still contend I agree especially if next season lives up to its billing as one of the most open. I think Max will need much more help next year more than he has needed before. The team mate will be hugely important.

If Horner is going to go, I think it needs to be next year and not at the start of a major change in regs. At least then for next year they will already be working on the car and have a good base to go off from.

Even if they wanted out, Red Bull is going to be worth a fortune. Who would have the funding to buy it? Forbes say $2.6 billion.

[KWSN - DSM]

Much as I was high on Colapinto when he was the new girl in class, shine have gone off, I do not think there is anything special, at least not special enough to make any impact full contributions to any of the Red Bull teams. 

[andysaint]

Sack all drivers and hire all new ones?

There's not even good drivers out there free of contract in the market. They're ****ed.

Yes they are.

I do think Max is gone and there is nothing Red Bull can do about it. If they want Tsunoda they need to take him away from Honda and put him in the main team next year under his own guise. I cannot see it happening.

Lawson I think can be replaced without too much drama.

Piastri Le Clerc Hamilton Norris are all signed up. Sainz is gettable. Russell is gettable. Alonso I don’t think would be considered. Save for Tsunoda I cannot see anyone else on the grid that would be considered a good step up for Red Bull in 2025/2026. Russell and Sainz would be a good team if they end up losing Max and probably the strongest combination they will be able to get for the foreseeable.

[expert]

I don't think Lawson has been amazing- but that would be so harsh. About two weeks ago he thought he was replacing Perez! Colapinto hasn't quite lived up to that initial hype either. Red Bull clearly have no actual strategy to any of this.

It was always a bit suss that they only gave him 6 races with no guarantee of next year.  He's definitely the "expendable" one here.

[ATM]

Russell and Sainz sounds quite a strong pairing actually; RBR could do a lot worse than that.

[Lennat]

Russel is about as good as anyone excluding Max AND put of contract for 2026. An obvious target IMO.

[DJH63]

It was always a bit suss that they only gave him 6 races with no guarantee of next year.  He's definitely the "expendable" one here.

Lawson was always a Hail Mary, same as Ricciardo. They already have a solid yardstick in Tsunoda, they’re looking for someone who can join the main team so Colapinto would be the next Hail Mary lined up.

[GhostR]

F1 insider 2 weeks ago said this
Hopefully it is rubbish

 

 

https://www.foxsport...20cd2c504f4b9d9

 

The above article from Fox Sports Australia says it's a report from Auto Bild;

"...............With Auto Bild reporting that Doohan’s one-year deal is only guaranteed for the first five races of 2025, Ecclestone suggested it wouldn’t take much to break the deal..........."

 

Neither source all that reliable IMO

[Beri]

Neither source all that reliable IMO

 

Auto Bild not that reliable? You're joking right? An independant magazine that is renowned for its objective journalism is the one source you doubt?