1741 replies to this topic

[gillesfan76]

As a Hamilton fan, I’d just like to say just how thoroughly impressed by Sainz. Not just because of his win in Mexico but by his attitude in general. Even though Ferrari is replacing him with Hamilton, he is not negative or bitter at either Ferrari or Hamilton. In fact, he has said the opposite and that he can understand it! That alone speaks volumes of his character as a person. But even before that, I’ve said it before, that I think he was severely underestimated. Even on baseline, he’s a top notch driver but on top of that he’s calm, patient and open to learning. He may not quite have the natural speed of Leclerc, but he’s not far behind and he works hard.

 

I truly wish Sainz the very best, and while I hope Hamilton’s tenure at Ferrari is a success for both, it’s clear that it is finite. So I truly hope that after Hamilton hangs up his boots, that Ferrari is still competitive and Sainz comes back. He looks good in red.

[STRFerrari4Ever]

Yes. Ferrari have made a mistake. Leclerc is flaky, fell off the road as soon as Norris got near him. Sianz, who is not good enough to be a Ferrari driver, showed everyone, including Verstappen, the way home in Mexico.

Amazing trolling, keep it up.

Sainz is a very good driver, on his day like this past weekend, he has the speed to beat anyone but that day probably comes twice or four times a season. The rest of the time he is solidly there, usually duking it out in the top 6.

Leclerc didn’t have a stellar weekend, he lacked the speed of his teammate but he also didn’t have FP1 to work with because of the young driver outing and crash to his car. However, he has been ahead of Sainz for most of the season, hence why he’s in within an outside shot of the WDC if the front two come to blows.

I liked Sainz going back to his Toro Rosso days because of an interview he did with Ted on Ted’s Notebook in 2015 during winter testing, where he revealed he liked Notorious BIG!

But a few things that have revealed themselves over time are that he’s also quite a snake in the sense that when he’s behind Leclerc, he’ll ask to be let past(usually during the early phases of the race when Charles is saving tyres) or he’ll just attack him without a second thought. Then when the roles are reversed and he’s ahead, he immediately calls for the team to call Charles off like this past weekend, it’s shameless because keep the same energy you have when you are behind, if you wanna race and show you’re faster just do that and don’t use the team as a shield to protect you.

With all of that said we’ll see how the team dynamic is next season with Hamilton arriving because despite the toxicity that can arrive when discussing Leclerc and Sainz, the two themselves actually seem to get on very well from what they show us on their social media etc. I just hope the TeamLH crowd don’t infiltrate Ferrari and bring some of their conspiracies and gripes.

[ARTGP]

But a few things that have revealed themselves over time are that he’s also quite a snake in the sense that when he’s behind Leclerc, he’ll ask to be let past(usually during the early phases of the race when Charles is saving tyres) or he’ll just attack him without a second thought. Then when the roles are reversed and he’s ahead, he immediately calls for the team to call Charles off like this past weekend, it’s shameless because keep the same energy you have when you are behind, if you wanna race and show you’re faster just do that and don’t use the team as a shield to protect you.

 

A snake?

 

He's every other F1 driver out there. Charles also wanted them to call off the dogs in Austin. Ferrari's "problem" is a luxury. It's a great driver line up no matter if it's Sainz or Hamilton. 

Edited by ARTGP, 29 October 2024 - 17:32.

[SCUDmissile]

I had a quick look and Charles was, if I remember correctly, on a 12-2 run against Carlos in races before Mexico and on a 12-1 run in quali before Austin.

The moment he finishes behind once, people who thinks that he's average or that Ferrari kept the wrong driver emerge from their hiding places.

It's not only annoying but also unfair.

It's a pity because while Leclerc is my favourite, I actually like Carlos, good person and very very good driver, him and Charles are a great pairing and it's a pity to split them.

But it's really embarrassing to read certain things sometimes.

That's why you have to ignore it.

[STRFerrari4Ever]

A snake?

He's every other F1 driver out there. Charles also wanted them to call off the dogs in Austin. Ferrari has a luxury problem. It's a great driver line up no matter if it's Sainz or Hamilton.

Usually when Charles requests that it’s because he’s saving his tyres in the early stint of the race. In the Austin Sprint he was saving tyres and Sainz passed him which is fair enough but we saw on race day what the result was as he won comfortably.

Charles has been easing his tyres in during early stints of the races for years now, when Sainz is directly behind him during this time he either asks the team to usher Leclerc out of the way or he goes for a move. However, more often than not, Leclerc opens the gap and those requests end up looking silly. It’s just my observation during their 4 seasons together.

[SCUDmissile]

Usually when Charles requests that it’s because he’s saving his tyres in the early stint of the race. In the Austin Sprint he was saving tyres and Sainz passed him which is fair enough but we saw on race day what the result was as he won comfortably.

Charles has been easing his tyres in during early stints of the races for years now, when Sainz is directly behind him during this time he either asks the team to usher Leclerc out of the way or he goes for a move. However, more often than not, Leclerc opens the gap and those requests end up looking silly. It’s just my observation during their 4 seasons together.

It's just facts. Then people come and spout rubbish after the 1-2 times a year Sainz smashes it but don't pay attention at those points.

Edited by SCUDmissile, 04 November 2024 - 00:54.

[JL14]

Just learned that if Ferrari doesn't win the WCC this year and add a 16th winless season, they are setting a new record for their longest period without a title.

So quite a bit (pride) at stake.

[sterlingfan2000]

Long Run Pace looks insane but don't know fuel load.

One Lap is lacking

[AlexS]

Big mistake that Ferrari accepted the London show for F1 2025.

[JL14]

Big mistake that Ferrari accepted the London show for F1 2025.

 

They can still organise their own launch of the actual new car.

[Clatter]

Sainz has been unlucky with how this played out, certainly. Offering a proper evaluation of Ferrari's decision to sign Hamilton won't be possible until 2026, though. Hamilton has helped to bring a lot of new talent across to the team, so if Ferrari delivers a car capable of winning the title in 2026, I'd say he was likely worth signing even if he's not the one to take that car to the title.

Who has joined ferrari because of Hamilton?

[ferrarista]

https://x.com/Ferrar...377660789502182

Bring that F80 balance on the next F1 car please

Edited by ferrarista, 15 November 2024 - 12:10.

[vlado]

https://x.com/Ferrar...377660789502182

Bring that F80 balance on the next F1 car please

EU regs killed the V12 it seems … real shame because that thing doesn’t sound like a flagship Ferrari at all

[brucewayne]

EU regs killed the V12 it seems … real shame because that thing doesn’t sound like a flagship Ferrari at all

Na, move on. V12 is not needed.

[MRX94]

EU regs killed the V12 it seems … real shame because that thing doesn’t sound like a flagship Ferrari at all

Meanwhile they manage to sell the Purosangue with a V12, in terms of EU regulation a limited run halo car is a drop in Lake Como in comparison. No, the reason it's a V6 is performance and the 499P connection.

[vlado]

Na, move on. V12 is not needed.

 

These things are toys tho, non of them are "needed", but they are nice to have... just like a V12

[vlado]

Meanwhile they manage to sell the Purosangue with a V12, in terms of EU regulation a limited run halo car is a drop in Lake Como in comparison. No, the reason it's a V6 is performance and the 499P connection.

 

Was the SUV homologated before the latest regulations? Maybe.. it makes no sense you are right 

[sheSgoTthElooK]

Charles newest "Top Gun" vid is extraordinary. woooah

 

 I just learnt that we have a thing in common, I also like to say "crazy s.hit". My favorite frenchie driver 

Edited by sheSgoTthElooK, 19 November 2024 - 15:05.

[Boxerevo]

Cheering each day more and more for you guys. Bring it on. Forza.

Edited by Boxerevo, 19 November 2024 - 23:08.

[DeKnyff]

brucewayne, on 28 Nov 2024 - 18:06, said:

Some people live in the past. To compete in WCC, you can’t rely solely on one driver anymore. The playing field is getting more even, that’s what the budget cap is for. And for making profits obviously. RB won’t win a WCC anymore unless they upgrade their second driver.

For Ferrari, Leclerc extended his contract for 3 years, and an 7 time world champion will join for two year. They did their homework.

 

Who cares about the WCC?

 

Ferrari could still win it, do you see any excitement?

[DeKnyff]

Peeko, on 28 Nov 2024 - 18:15, said:

 

 

Show me where I have been pissing on Sainz? Go ahead. I'll wait. You Sainz apologists are in here tearing down Lerclerc because you don't like what's being said about Sainz. Its primary school recess stuff.

 

 

 

Oh, stop taking things personally.

 

If you start a post saying "Sainz can't be gone soon enough", which is pure flame bait, don't expect an exquisite response.

 

BTW, I'm not a "Sainz apologist", I don't have any problem in admitting Leclerc is the better driver. I rate Sainz as a reasonably good driver, but far from exceptional and having a boring personality (no different to Leclerc on that). In fact, I'm surprised of how well he has performed against Leclerc, I expected a much worse result. But frankly, I don't understand why you categorize me as "a Sainz apologist", which I am not.

 

What I do not accept is that idiotic notion which pretends that the Sainz camp, thanks to some mysterious magical wand, influenced Ferrari so that the willful lost the 2022 WDC, so that Carlos could save face versus Leclerc. This is an absurdity beyond belief and I'm completely against conspiranoic theory, but other than this I'm by no means a Sainz fan.

 

I was a great fan of his father when he was rallying, that yes.

Edited by DeKnyff, 28 November 2024 - 17:59.

[Enzoluis]

brucewayne, on 28 Nov 2024 - 18:06, said:

 

Who cares about the WCC?

 

Ferrari could still win it, do you see any excitement?

 

I do. No matter I risk another depression   I want to win WCC. Because the WCC usually is a prodrome for WDCs.

[DeKnyff]

I do. No matter I risk another depression   I want to win WCC. Because the WCC usually is a prodrome for WDCs.

 

Not in 2008. Not in 1982. Not in 1983.

[BertoC]

brucewayne, on 28 Nov 2024 - 18:06, said:


Who cares about the WCC?

Ferrari could still win it, do you see any excitement?

Every Mclaren and Ferrari fan wants it and are excited with the prospect of ending a decades long drought of not a single championship. There are young adults that never experienced their favourite team winning a championship. Lets not diminish the amazing acomplishment that is winning a WCC.

[DeKnyff]

To be excited is one thing (although I repeat I don’t see much excitement), choosing an ultra expensive driving lineup for WCC above WDC (which was the point I was addressing) is another one.

[Peeko]

Peeko, on 28 Nov 2024 - 18:15, said:

 

 

 

 

Oh, stop taking things personally.

 

If you start a post saying "Sainz can't be gone soon enough", which is pure flame bait, don't expect an exquisite response.

 

BTW, I'm not a "Sainz apologist", I don't have any problem in admitting Leclerc is the better driver. I rate Sainz as a reasonably good driver, but far from exceptional and having a boring personality (no different to Leclerc on that). In fact, I'm surprised of how well he has performed against Leclerc, I expected a much worse result. But frankly, I don't understand why you categorize me as "a Sainz apologist", which I am not.

 

What I do not accept is that idiotic notion which pretends that the Sainz camp, thanks to some mysterious magical wand, influenced Ferrari so that the willful lost the 2022 WDC, so that Carlos could save face versus Leclerc. This is an absurdity beyond belief and I'm completely against conspiranoic theory, but other than this I'm by no means a Sainz fan.

 

I was a great fan of his father when he was rallying, that yes.

Because 'bias' doesn't seem to be an issue for you when it it leans towards Sainz. You call out other posters for having a bias against him, but not a word when it goes the other way. Like I said, your horse has long legs.

Edited by Peeko, 28 November 2024 - 20:34.

[SCUDmissile]

I fear unless McLaren bottle it this weekend the WCC looks difficult

Edited by SCUDmissile, 28 November 2024 - 20:34.

[DeKnyff]

Because 'bias' doesn't seem to be an issue for you when it it leans towards Sainz. You call out other posters for having a bias against him, but not a word when it goes the other way. Like I said, your horse has long legs.

 

Could you post some specific examples, so that I can make any idea of what you're talking about?

 

What 'bias' have I ever shown towards Sainz, other than saying that this 2022 conspiracy theory is beyond absurd? Are you sure you are not taking me for someone else?

[Peeko]

Could you post some specific examples, so that I can make any idea of what you're talking about?

 

What 'bias' have I ever shown towards Sainz, other than saying that this 2022 conspiracy theory is beyond absurd? Are you sure you are not taking me for someone else?

Its your calling out posters for having a bias against him and that their argument holds little weight because of it, while ignoring those that are biased towards him and never questioning anything they have to say. They are no different, but you only have a problem with one angle.

[DeKnyff]

Its your calling out posters for having a bias against him and that their argument holds little weight because of it, while ignoring those that are biased towards him and never questioning anything they have to say. They are no different, but you only have a problem with one angle.

 

I have never criticized anyone for saying Sainz is not as good as Leclerc, because I think it's a reality.

 

I may have criticized some posts which said that Sainz was a subpar driver because, again, I think it's the reality. My point has always been that Ferrari has the better driver lineup in the sport, Leclerc been a top driver and Sainz a very reliable, solid and above average driver.

 

I also believe that two star drivers in a team (Leclerc and Hamilton) is a mistake, as History shows.

 

I have never criticized any one for saying Leclerc is not as good as Sainz... because I don't remember any one saying that. I'd criticize it if someone said that.

 

I have strongly criticized the ridiculous notion that the Sainz camp obliged Ferrari to self-sabotage and lose any chance to fight for the 2022 WDC, so that Sainz looked better than he really is.

 

How is that 'calling out' posters? As said before, I have the impression you are getting me mixed up with someone else.

[vlado]

[Okyo]

I have never criticized anyone for saying Sainz is not as good as Leclerc, because I think it's a reality.

 

I may have criticized some posts which said that Sainz was a subpar driver because, again, I think it's the reality. My point has always been that Ferrari has the better driver lineup in the sport, Leclerc been a top driver and Sainz a very reliable, solid and above average driver.

 

I also believe that two star drivers in a team (Leclerc and Hamilton) is a mistake, as History shows.

 

I have never criticized any one for saying Leclerc is not as good as Sainz... because I don't remember any one saying that. I'd criticize it if someone said that.

 

I have strongly criticized the ridiculous notion that the Sainz camp obliged Ferrari to self-sabotage and lose any chance to fight for the 2022 WDC, so that Sainz looked better than he really is.

 

How is that 'calling out' posters? As said before, I have the impression you are getting me mixed up with someone else.

I do support DeKnyff on this one, or should I say I get where he's coming from. There have been many, many kneejerk reactions to some Charles - Carlos situations. Whenever Carlos fought for himself as a driver, something he's absolutely entitled to do as it's not him, but the team that has to enforce team orders in a clear and logical way, it has always gone along the lines of "selfish", "wants to be something he's not", "sabotaging to the team", "we should get rid of him" and on, and on and on. Wont get in to the stuff we heard when Binotto was around as it did borderline absurd. Now it's only natural that this kneejerk reaction, will get a kneejerk reaction response. Given the fact that there are a lot more people here that support Charles it can get rather suffocating in this thread if you try to go and defend Carlos, which usually ends up making the response more on the offence and more harsh/stern as you try to counterbalance the majority stance. It has been like that for a long time here so i don't really find it surprising that some are just a bit more rough around the edges in the way they talk in support of Carlos occasionally sounding like they do it even at expense of Charles though they really are not.

EDIT: oh dear, didn't notice this was a week old post 

Edited by Okyo, 06 December 2024 - 07:24.

[Sash1]

But a few things that have revealed themselves over time are that he’s also quite a snake in the sense that when he’s behind Leclerc, he’ll ask to be let past(usually during the early phases of the race when Charles is saving tyres) or he’ll just attack him without a second thought. Then when the roles are reversed and he’s ahead, he immediately calls for the team to call Charles off like this past weekend, it’s shameless because keep the same energy you have when you are behind, if you wanna race and show you’re faster just do that and don’t use the team as a shield to protect you.

 

The problems that this situation shows is that Leclerc is not a natural team leader. A Schumacher, Hamilton, Verstappen, Senna, Manssel, Prost would not accept this in the race (instead of getting furious after the race like a little team bitch). Charles should be racing more instead of following the computer team strategy. It happens over and over again that he does not make the right calls and goes feet up when the team asks stuff. Now it is all explained, talked about and accepted again and again and again. F' off, put your team mate in the grass when he goes against team orders and show who's boss. Let Sainz talk to the press that 'we talked and it is all good'. This is his weakness and it is exploited by all around.

[ferrarista]

https://x.com/Scuder...856642765480102

[MinardiM02]

The problems that this situation shows is that Leclerc is not a natural team leader. A Schumacher, Hamilton, Verstappen, Senna, Manssel, Prost would not accept this in the race (instead of getting furious after the race like a little team bitch). Charles should be racing more instead of following the computer team strategy. It happens over and over again that he does not make the right calls and goes feet up when the team asks stuff. Now it is all explained, talked about and accepted again and again and again. F' off, put your team mate in the grass when he goes against team orders and show who's boss. Let Sainz talk to the press that 'we talked and it is all good'. This is his weakness and it is exploited by all around.

 

Much agreed. Charles, like Lando for example, lacks in the mental department. I don't think there's much that seperates him from the likes of Max and Lewis on pure pace but he just doesn't have the mentality or personality of a multiple wdc. He hardly makes desicive calls and faults himself mega hard when things go wrong. 

That's how the true greats like Max and Lewis - and Schumacher and Senna before them - made the differance. They were pitbulls and leaders on track. That's why Charles will always remain in that top tier with the likes of Lando and George. Possible wdc given the right circumstances, but never true greats of the sport. 

[vlado]

Much agreed. Charles, like Lando for example, lacks in the mental department. I don't think there's much that seperates him from the likes of Max and Lewis on pure pace but he just doesn't have the mentality or personality of a multiple wdc. He hardly makes desicive calls and faults himself mega hard when things go wrong.
That's how the true greats like Max and Lewis - and Schumacher and Senna before them - made the differance. They were pitbulls and leaders on track. That's why Charles will always remain in that top tier with the likes of Lando and George. Possible wdc given the right circumstances, but never true greats of the sport.

Wrong.

[baddog]

Wrong.

 

I agree, its nonsense.

 

The reality is you can only do what this person expects if your teammate is beaten decisively, and Sainz was too good. The total team dominance thing is a result of performance relative to your teammate not a cause of it. Max is undisputed No1 at RBR not because of his personality but because of his and his teammate's driving.

[Quickshifter]

Sainz will always be my most underrated driver on the grid. He is a near complete package, not best at anything but is good at almost everything.

[prty]

Max is undisputed No1 at RBR not because of his personality but because of his and his teammate's driving.

I disagree there. It's of course mostly his driving, but he and his entourage get vicious if there's even a hint that he's challenged.
See Jos or whoever leaking to the press that Pérez did whatever with other women in Monaco (of course that's not right, but that's an extremely low thing to fight with), or Max refusing team orders in Brazil.

[ferrarista]

https://x.com/AeroGi...799674088148995

The good old Fred couldn’t resist to reply to the new Sauber TP, the so called Pharaoh.

😎

[TheAviator]

https://x.com/AeroGi...799674088148995

The good old Fred couldn’t resist to reply to the new Sauber TP, the so called Pharaoh.

😎

Damn son

[baddog]

I disagree there. It's of course mostly his driving, but he and his entourage get vicious if there's even a hint that he's challenged.
See Jos or whoever leaking to the press that Pérez did whatever with other women in Monaco (of course that's not right, but that's an extremely low thing to fight with), or Max refusing team orders in Brazil.

 

All of that would just get him sacked if he wasnt as good as he is.