161 replies to this topic

[SophieB]

@autosport

​Alpine is considering abandoning its works Renault engine in #F1 from 2026. 

 

Full story

https://x.com/autosp...6949515560?s=61

[LolaB0860]

How embarrassing, to even consider it in public

It's like saying our product is so garbage even our factory team doesn't want it

It's weird anyway as this isn't Lotus Indycar esque engine saga either

Edited by LolaB0860, 17 June 2024 - 15:00.

[nissan_gtp]

Cadillac LOL

[midgrid]

Collaboration with Andretti incoming?

[Risil]

How embarrassing, to even consider it in public

It's like saying our product is so garbage even our factory team doesn't want it

 

It's a little bit that but it's also that we're getting to the end of this engine rules cycle and Renault evidently doesn't want to make the investment to compete with Mercedes, Ferrari, Honda, Audi in the next one. Can't blame them really. 

 

I feel if it wasn't for the budget cap and de facto franchise system meaning their team is actually worth something on the market, Alpine would be gone by now. It's surely only a matter of time now.

[RainyAfterlifeDaylight]

I think Flavio Briatore rumors are true indeed.

[OvDrone]

They saw what happened at Le Mans.

Felt the horror, when they remembered that those are the same engines they have.

Forgot they were the same team all along as the one from Le Mans.

[Secretariat]

In my opinion only way this news come out the way it has is if they are considering purchase offers/selling. To me de Meo's forceful stance smells of "doth protest too much". In any event, its quite embarrassing for the brand. 

[flingsofdeon]

So, Yuki to Alpine and Honda partnership following the exploration of Honda and Nissans partnership etc?

[InSearchOfThe]

Maybe RBPT could help a friend in need...😉

[P123]

The first step in offloading the team to Andretti or another party?  Perhaps securing a customer deal purely as a placeholder makes them more attractive to a buyer, whilst saving Renault the expense of PU development if they don't plan on staying around.

[RainyAfterlifeDaylight]

Then they block Andretti and Cadillac to enter F1 ...

Edited by RainyAfterlifeDaylight, 17 June 2024 - 15:34.

[FirstnameLastname]

Renault powered by Redbull

[FullThrottleF1]

Collaboration with Andretti incoming?

Andretti is dead since MBS turned his back on them

[LolaB0860]

It's a little bit that but it's also that we're getting to the end of this engine rules cycle and Renault evidently doesn't want to make the investment to compete with Mercedes, Ferrari, Honda, Audi in the next one. Can't blame them really.

I feel if it wasn't for the budget cap and de facto franchise system meaning their team is actually worth something on the market, Alpine would be gone by now. It's surely only a matter of time now.

Yes, in that sense there is logic. But regardless it's horrible PR for their own product with the phrasing they've used

[Tiakumosan]

Bring back Cyril so he can complain about Red Bull engines.

[kumo7]

So, Yuki to Alpine and Honda partnership following the exploration of Honda and Nissans partnership etc?

Whatever you're smoking you smoking something advanced.

[MissingApex]

But hey! Some are still blaming Red Bull for calling them out, now even the factory team dumps them.

Anyhow, I think it’s a good decision, Renault has proven they can’t or don’t want to compete with the other manufacturers.

Just buy a Honda and rebrand it too Renault or Alpine, it will save them a load of money and they finally can be competitive.

[Disgrace]

Bad news for F1.

[Taxi]

They have been garbage since 2014. Since 2022 even worse. Alpine-Honda doesn't sound so bad. 

[JvsKVB77]

Maybe RBPT could help a friend in need...

RBPT said they would not have any other client apart RB F1 Team at least for some years after 26. Audi too was not very interested in other teams. Mercedes said 3 client teams was to much. Alpine need to sell their team with engine department to Andretti/Cadillac and buy RB F1, to get RBPT engines  

Edited by JvsKVB77, 17 June 2024 - 17:32.

[Anja]

As sad it would be and a bit embarrassing for the company, I can understand it. Spending all this money to develop a new engine for one underperforming team really doesn't seem like a good deal. Losing all their engine customers may have been a point of no return on the downward spiral.

Edited by Anja, 17 June 2024 - 17:42.

[pup]

I had to re-read that article to try to understand why anyone at Renault would think that making this public would be of any benefit to anyone, only to realize that they didn't.

 

In fact, the article is very, very low on substance.  Not that it would surprise me if it were true.  But the humor of including Luca de Meo's comments about rumor mongering in their entirely rumor-based article isn't lost on me.  

 

Also, it's one thing to hook your car up to the rumor train; quite another to have to hook it up behind Joe Saward, lol.  Two extra weeks of journalizing and the best they can do is a "we understand..." 

Edited by pup, 17 June 2024 - 18:17.

[KWSN - DSM]

Not that F1 would care, but F1 would have a LOT of egg on it;s metaphorical face if this comes to pass.

[IrvTheSwerve]

They saw what happened at Le Mans.

Felt the horror, when they remembered that those are the same engines they have.

Forgot they were the same team all along as the one from Le Mans.

It’s not the same engine apart from the configuration though is it? (V6T)

[Joseki]

I bet there is some genius at Alpine that is right now asking "how about we outsource the entire engine development at Mecachrome?".

[Sterzo]

If true, this story is unsurprising. They've sacked nearly everybody else; why not the engine supplier?

[FNG]

Embarrassing. I have a hard time believing this. If that is truly the case then just sell the team. That would look silly outsourcing an engine cause yours is so crap

[Clatter]

It's a little bit that but it's also that we're getting to the end of this engine rules cycle and Renault evidently doesn't want to make the investment to compete with Mercedes, Ferrari, Honda, Audi in the next one. Can't blame them really.

I feel if it wasn't for the budget cap and de facto franchise system meaning their team is actually worth something on the market, Alpine would be gone by now. It's surely only a matter of time now.

Renault have already signed up to 2026,so presumably their only way out is for alpine to dump them.

[speedx]

If you invest much less than your opponents in your engine development, what else can you expect?

They don't know how to run F1.

[InSearchOfThe]

RBPT said they would not have any other client apart RB F1 Team at least for some years after 26. Audi too was not very interested in other teams. Mercedes said 3 client teams was to much. Alpine need to sell their team with engine department to Andretti/Cadillac and buy RB F1, to get RBPT engines

I was being facetious based on the love lost between those teams.

Where's Viryfan? His imput is insightful concerning Renault. Probably drowning his sorrows...

[BertoC]

Amazing how mismanaged this team has been for so many years. So much potential wasted. Kinda sad really.

[Myrvold]

It’s not the same engine apart from the configuration though is it? (V6T)

Correct. The 3.4l WEC Engine is the same as the F3 & F2 Engine.

Edited by Myrvold, 17 June 2024 - 20:03.

[New Britain]

Collaboration with Andretti incoming?

This potentially could resolve the previous supposed roadblock that Renault (the parent) would sell the Alpine entry only to a party that committed to continuing to use Renault PUs.

[Clatter]

This potentially could resolve the previous supposed roadblock that Renault (the parent) would sell the Alpine entry only to a party that committed to continuing to use Renault PUs.

Andretti were originally going to use the Renault PU, GM only got involved when Andretti was told he had to bring a manufacturer. He did so, and they had to think up some new road blocks.

[azza200]

Not that F1 would care, but F1 would have a LOT of egg on it;s metaphorical face if this comes to pass.

 

My reaction if it does happen been saying it for a long time. F1 is ****ed if any engine manufactures pull the plug on their F1 program. F1 has lost other engine suppliers who did supply the lower end teams. Yamaha,Hart, Mugen Honda, Cosworth 

 

[EvilPhil II]

Sack all those engine employees for performance related rationales. Save yourself a fortune.

[F1 Mike]

As sad it would be and a bit embarrassing for the company, I can understand it. Spending all this money to develop a new engine for one underperforming team really doesn't seem like a good deal. Losing all their engine customers may have been a point of no return on the downward spiral.

Surely it's the other way around?

The reason they've been underperforming is because they've been underfunded and not had the full support of the manufacturer

[F1 Mike]

Perhaps the perfect time to repost this article which was supposed to be tongue in cheek just change the year to make it a prophecy...

https://www.topgear....end-2024-season

[Junky]

I have to be honest: I am tired of Renault/Alpine. They are, easily, the only team that I dislike, right now, in F1. From their operation in the sport up to the global strategy, there is not a single thing that makes sense. It is ridiculous. And this is another example. Just sell the f****** business to Andretti or any other brand and goodbye.

[GreenMachine]

I know I have said it elsewhere but WTH ... 

 

When Dan bailed halfway through a lucrative contract, I read into that he had lost all faith in the Renault F1 'project'.  While the on-track performance was fair-to-middling, and in fact that second year produced some decent performances, it was the behind the scenes management that caused him to pull the trigger.  Cyril's mantra of 'tomorrow we will be great, so don't worry about today' always rang my alarm bells, and now it looking like tomorrow, well it is looking like being cancelled.

 

I haven't seen a better case for non-elective euthanasia.   

[teejay]

Shameful that a business of that size and that history in motorsport can't work it out. 

 

Andretti-Alpine Cadi-Honda might be fun!

[kumo7]

I agree, to have Renault PU history, pedigree, heritage and legend through away like this is something that is not go about without surprise.

What if Famin doing "shaking" the entire company up? Can he see the end to it?

 

Certainly to have own PU department is nothing other than advantage,... It could still demand twice as much money in comparison from the race team as the 'works fee'. If you know what I mean.

 

Yes, if in case if I may render a picture of Renault, how about this?  The book keeper dumps all Renault-F1 budget to Alpine F1 team, and Viry take 85% out of it, so the race team is "historically" forced to go racing with the rest...

If this were true, Famin is fighting against this corporate structure by threatning that Viry's performance is way too low. If it were true, I kinda like Famin... 

Edited by kumo7, 18 June 2024 - 06:44.

[loki]

Sounds like a job for René Artois…

[jonklug]

It might be embarrassing and an admission that they just can't create a good engine in these regulations, but at the same time, I think it takes courage to finally admit the obvious and look for a solution to fix the issue, even if that solution is becoming a customer team. If this gets them back toward the front of the grid then why not do it? It will be much more embarrassing to be the slowest car in 2026 than have a Mercedes PU in your Alpine. 

[Beri]

Maybe RBPT could help a friend in need...

 

This would be downright slapstick comedy like material, should this happen.

[TennisUK]

This would be an humiliation.

And very dumb. It’s not like they are even that far off. Without the engine freeze they would surely be fine.

They are scared of 2026 and being locked in with another flawed powertrain.

It does show how stupid it was to proceed with zero other teams running the engine, though, much less data to play with.

[pUs]

A bit sad for F1 in general, we need healthy engine manufacturers. In hindsight, I guess RB were right - Renault never got totally on top of the 2014-onwards engine rules.

[Beri]

This would be an humiliation.

And very dumb. It’s not like they are even that far off. Without the engine freeze they would surely be fine.

They are scared of 2026 and being locked in with another flawed powertrain.

It does show how stupid it was to proceed with zero other teams running the engine, though, much less data to play with.

 

Well, no. Because why would Renault always need a lift on the freeze to better themselves? Whilst there are 3 other manufacturers who do not need it? No, they are not fine. And also will not be fine without the freeze, because they are seemingly always running behind the hurd.

[Clatter]

It might be embarrassing and an admission that they just can't create a good engine in these regulations, but at the same time, I think it takes courage to finally admit the obvious and look for a solution to fix the issue, even if that solution is becoming a customer team. If this gets them back toward the front of the grid then why not do it? It will be much more embarrassing to be the slowest car in 2026 than have a Mercedes PU in your Alpine.

It's especially embarrassing considering they were one of the big pushers for these PUs in the first place.