90 replies to this topic

[KWSN - DSM]

Just a mad thought, but could Binotto potentially lure vettel out of retirement? Seb has expressed Interest in the past, and having him in Audi would certainly help marketing. he is not too old yet, and might have refreshed motivation.

 

It would be more than mad luring a driver who lost loads of speed over last 3 years of his active career back.

[brucewayne]

Oh so Binotto is back, Audi really wants to have a disaster

[brucewayne]

It would be more than mad luring a driver who lost loads of speed over last 3 years of his active career back.

It would be more than mad to work for someone who made Ferrari a laughing stock in the past

[BoDarvelle]

Oh so Binotto is back, Audi really wants to have a disaster

 

Will he hire his buddy Steiner as TP?

 

[William Hunt]

They should have made Binotto only head of the engine department: that's where his strength lies. They should have kept Seidl.

[KWSN - DSM]

It would be more than mad to work for someone who made Ferrari a laughing stock in the past

 

Laughingstock?

[Mohican]

Very strange to make Binotto “only” COO and CTO, who is the CEO?

And no mention of the engine operation in Neuburg ?

[f1rules]

I think honestly audi felt it was going to slowly. But they didnt do Seidl any favours either, with their hesitation to confirm their full commitment, after rumors started to come, that they were maybe pulling the plug. Made Seidls job almost impossible, to recruit etc. Then the apparent power struggle with hoffman. And last. The slow recovery this year, the hiring of key. Seidl supplied the right pieces for the puzzle at mclaren, but only after he and especially Key left, did they really take off, with a hands on person like stella. And i think thats what audi want with Binotto. Someone closer to everything and that has been more hands on. Only pitty. They didnt have time to hire sanchez. That would have been a great move

Edited by f1rules, 23 July 2024 - 15:46.

[Mohican]

Seidl was head of both Hinwil and Neuburg.

[Mohican]

I think honestly audi felt it was going to slowly. But they didnt do Seidl any favours with their hesitation to confirm their full commitment after rumors staryed to come, that they were maybe pulling the plug. Made Seidls job almost impossible, to recruit. Then the apparent power struggle with hoffman. And last. The slow recovery this year, the hiring of key. Seidl put the supplied the right pieces for the puzzle but only did mclaren really take off after a more hands on person like stella took over. And i think thats what audi want with Binotto. Someone closer to everything and that has been more hands on. Only pitty. They didnt have time to hire sanchez. That would have been a great move

All the talk last year of Sudi possibly withdrawing was highly damaging. Whether it was even possible is something else; there was after all a contractual situation with the seller.

[AustinF1]

Szafnauer back to F1 with his old team AM then?  

[Alfisti]

Just a mad thought, but could Binotto potentially lure vettel out of retirement? Seb has expressed Interest in the past, and having him in Audi would certainly help marketing. he is not too old yet, and might have refreshed motivation.

 Why in god's name would you want Vettel driving your car? And what's he gonna do, walk to to the fly away races because #oilismurder 

[Red5ive]

Audi is working on an usual corporate operation where the bosses eliminate his mistakes by expelling his lieutenant? 

 

 

Sounds like Alpine #2

[cyclist]

 Why in god's name would you want Vettel driving your car? And what's he gonna do, walk to to the fly away races because #oilismurder 

As I said, just a mad thought!

[MikeTekRacing]

Oh so Binotto is back, Audi really wants to have a disaster

I am not seeing Ferrari much better now that Binotto is gone. 

They seem to have reverted back to bad performances.

[Radman]

I think Seidl has had a pretty raw deal here. I think he’s been naive by focusing exclusively on 2026 and not realising he needs to keep an eye on the day to day and keeping confidence with the board on progress. Hoffman should have been ejected and Seidl left to deliver. Hoffman felt like a political corporate agitator and has paid the price, but taken down Seidl with him. Binotto is a good appointment, as long as he isn’t promoted above his level of competency, which it feels he might be

[onewingedangel]

I could see Seidl back at McLaren if they go ahead with the WEC entry.

[EvilPhil II]

Its pretty straight forward. 

McLaren were last on the grid when Seidl left McLaren. Now they are 1-2 on the grid and 1-2 in the race. 

Sauber meanwhile are now last on the grid... 

 

That is a risk that they cant afford to take. 

[AlexPrime]

Strong move in my book.

[jonklug]

Lol Seidl

[Nathan]

 

McLaren were last on the grid when Seidl left McLaren. Now they are 1-2 on the grid and 1-2 in the race. 

 

 

2018 6th

2019 4th - Seidl starts in May

2020 3rd

2021 4th

2022 5th - Seidl leaves in December

2023 4th

 

*edited to be correct

Edited by Nathan, 24 July 2024 - 12:29.

[Mark A]

I’d suggest reading the recent interview with Zak that was posted here. The headlines were about the Max and Red Bull comments.

 

However I think the important bit was about the turnaround, he says the people then are mostly the people now but the biggest change in McLaren was culture, they went from a very negative atmosphere where people were judged as guilty until proven innocent to a more inclusive working environment. Who knows if the issue was Seidl or not, perhaps the environment has changed at Sauber??

Edited by Mark A, 23 July 2024 - 21:52.

[Mohican]

I read that too, and understood it as a reference to the Honda collaboration.

Seems to me that all posters here forget two big events at McLaren where Seidl must have been involved: the switch to Mercedes engines and recruiting Piastri to replace Ricciardo.

[ATM]

În retrospect, looks like Seidl's job at McLaren was somewhat similar în targets as Rossi's at Renault - limited time job, take a ruderless team and put în place the basics for growth. Granted, Seidl did a better job than Rossi în that aspect; the trouble is he did not replicate it at Sauber - who, I'm sorry to say, sank like a stone recently.

Binotto, for all his management faults, is a brilliant engineer, we usually forget that. Put him in the right position, give him a team principal to alleviate the non-productive burdens and handle the politics (Krack seems indeed more adapt to that) and he'll happily trundle around the factory-with good results too, I expect. Not to mention he seems bent on a hiring spree from Ferrari-which, again, does NOT have the worst engineers on Earth, despite all the perennial criticism.

[Mark A]

I read that too, and understood it as a reference to the Honda collaboration.

 

I don't think it was, I read it as an internal issue, nothing to do with Honda.

[loki]

Seidl is Audi there…

[1player]

2018 6th

2019 4th

2020 3rd - Seidl starts in May

2021 4th

2022 5th - Seidl leaves in December

2023 4th

Your dates are a bit off. Seidl started in May 2019, not 2020.

[flingsofdeon]

So, my theory on why a change happened. Pure speculation, but - Carlos Sainz Jnr made a comment recently (paraphrasing) - talking to multiple teams gave him a view on where each team was at with their project.

I could imagine a scenario someone senior in Audi reached out to someone in his camp to try and understand where their F1 project sits / compares to the others.

Fair to say the response wasn’t favourable, perhaps even with a nod to how Binottos skill set could help.

The team doesn’t feel like it’s going to be a works Audi entry imminently…

[baddog]

Got to wonder if they do in fact have Sainz coming. Him and Hulk is a damned good duo, and Binotto, for all his flaws, has run a top team and knows what winning is like.

 

FIA just need to keep an eye on the engine management department ;)

[Stoffel]

Maybe Seidl simply isn't that good at this Formula 1 thing?  DTM or LMP1 (even in it's heyday) are of a completely different magnitude.

[JL14]

Apparently there's a 'small' financial miscalculation in the Audi project, equating to $1 billion 

Ralf Schumacher spricht über Audi, Andreas Seidl, Mattia Binotto & Carlos Sainz | Formel 1 News | Sky Sport

"The project was actually on the brink at Audi because there seemed to have been a small calculation error, which amounts to 1 billion. At least that's what you hear. This called into question what was happening. The team had to be refinanced because no money flowed. That's why I decided to keep  Zhou Guanu as a driver and take the money. Accordingly, nothing could happen. You couldn't hire people and you couldn't offer any prospects. Then you just let the whole topic run its course as it was before. With all the sympathy I have for the team, but at Sauber a lot has to change in the paddock. But Andi Seidl was fighting with blunt weapons at that moment."

[RedRabbit]

Your dates are a bit off. Seidl started in May 2019, not 2020.

It doesn't change much though - consistently midfield results with occasional podiums.

The team has been transformed over the last 2 seasons and are now winning on merit.

Sauber meanwhile have fallen to absolutely stone last from a consistent point scorer.

[frosty125]

Apparently there's a 'small' financial miscalculation in the Audi project, equating to $1 billion
Ralf Schumacher spricht über Audi, Andreas Seidl, Mattia Binotto & Carlos Sainz | Formel 1 News | Sky Sport
"The project was actually on the brink at Audi because there seemed to have been a small calculation error, which amounts to 1 billion. At least that's what you hear. This called into question what was happening. The team had to be refinanced because no money flowed. That's why I decided to keep Zhou Guanu as a driver and take the money. Accordingly, nothing could happen. You couldn't hire people and you couldn't offer any prospects. Then you just let the whole topic run its course as it was before. With all the sympathy I have for the team, but at Sauber a lot has to change in the paddock. But Andi Seidl was fighting with blunt weapons at that moment."

‘Small’ German sarcasm?

[1player]

It doesn't change much though - consistently midfield results with occasional podiums.

The team has been transformed over the last 2 seasons and are now winning on merit.

Sauber meanwhile have fallen to absolutely stone last from a consistent point scorer.

Yes, but I wouldn't be so quick to blame it on Seidl only. The team was undergoing internal reorganisation, we have a new wind tunnel, we got new engineering leadership, we poached people from the big teams, etc.

[JL14]

I wonder if Hulkenberg might have clauses in his contract in case there are major changes at the team, such as the people that he trusted and convinced him not being there anymore.

Don't think it's too far fetched to have those when signing to a new project.

Edited by JL14, 25 July 2024 - 13:49.

[catent]

Its pretty straight forward.
McLaren were last on the grid when Seidl left McLaren. Now they are 1-2 on the grid and 1-2 in the race.
Sauber meanwhile are now last on the grid...

That is a risk that they cant afford to take.

Right, Seidl was singlehandedly responsible for all of McLaren’s failures, and also singlehandedly responsible for their successes (upon leaving)! The other mechanics, engineers, etc, are irrelevant. Clearly it isn’t that straightforward, but as you were …

[Secretariat]

 

I wonder if Hulkenberg might have clauses in his contract in case there are major changes at the team, such as the people that he trusted and convinced him not being there anymore.

Don't think it's too far fetched to have those when signing to a new project.

 

Yup. He worked a bit with Seidl at Porsche which ended up with a win, and judging by an article both Seidl and Hoffman were influential in his decision. Hulkenberg said all the right things related to the changes, but it is interesting to consider whether he has the ability to re-consider his decision. Given his current form that might still make other teams take notice.   

[F1 Mike]

Seidlined

This is marvelous

[FirstnameLastname]

I wonder if Hulkenberg might have clauses in his contract in case there are major changes at the team, such as the people that he trusted and convinced him not being there anymore.
Don't think it's too far fetched to have those when signing to a new project.

For what though? What were the other more attractive options? (For him)

[ATM]

Not many of them, unless Verstappen asks specifically for him at RBR to replace Perez come 2025 - but that's far-fetched though.

[speedx]

Not many of them, unless Verstappen asks specifically for him at RBR to replace Perez come 2025 - but that's far-fetched though.

He wanted Hulk already before they took Perez. But...