32 replies to this topic

[john aston]

....according to John Swinney Scotland's First Minister, is Andy Murray. He won 3 Grand Slams. 

 

Last time I checked , both Milton, Dunbartonshire and Kilmany Fife  were in Scotland ,and their respective sons won 5 world championships between them. 

 

Just saying...   

[Charlieman]

Andy Murray has some Olympic Gold Medals too, but not as many as Chris Hoy, for example...

[jcbc3]

I Googled: list of greatest scottish sportsmen and the first hit was from The Scotsman January 2024: https://www.scotsman...ll-time-4472410

 

Voted on by their readers, so probably predominantly Scots

 

The list goes:

Andy Murray

Chris Hoy

Kenny Dalglish

Allan Wells

Alex Ferguson (yeah, even as a Manchester United fan, that seems a werid one since Fergie's sportsman career wasn't that great)

Jackie Stewart

Jocky Wilson (the first one, I'd never heard of)

Eric Liddell

Ken Buchanan

Doddie Weir

 

For fun and giggles, I also tried for Sports women. Here I found a 2020 list from BBC: https://www.bbc.com/...otland/53456260

 

Rose Reilly

Liz McColgan

Katherine Graninger

Catriona Matthew

Katie Archibald

Shirley Robertson

[Collombin]

I would consider Denis Law greater than Dalglish despite having a preference for the clubs that Kenny played for.

[lyntonh]

....according to John Swinney Scotland's First Minister, is Andy Murray. He won 3 Grand Slams. 

 

Last time I checked , both Milton, Dunbartonshire and Kilmany Fife  were in Scotland ,and their respective sons won 5 world championships between them. 

 

Just saying...   

 

Do what I do......

 

I ask myself...'is it just another version of a pointless list ?'

 

Yes....

 

Gnashing of teeth stops instantly....smile returns.....

Edited by lyntonh, 24 July 2024 - 12:00.

[BRG]

....according to John Swinney 

 

Possibly not the most respected authority on any matter at the moment?

 

I suppose we have to allow some leeway given Andy Murray's (massively overdue) retirement.  But the greatest?  No way 

 

Chris Hoy, yes, Sir JYS, Jim Clark (forgotten by Scotsman readers apparently!  ), Colin McRae, numerous bat, ball and running shoe exponents and even darts players might be ranked ahead of the grunting Murray.

[Tim Murray]

No mention yet of Scotland’s other World Rally Champion, Louise Aitken-Walker.

[Glengavel]

I would consider Denis Law greater than Dalglish despite having a preference for the clubs that Kenny played for.

 

Denis Law himself would put Jim Baxter on top.

[realracer200]

In my opinion the greatest Scottish sportsman is Stephen Hendry.

[opplock]

Possibly not the most respected authority on any matter at the moment?

 

 

 

It took me a minute to recognise the name. Deposed as SNP leader 20 years ago for being useless. Reinstated as SNP leader earlier this year after removal/resignation of the two most recent leaders. Lost most of their seats in UK General Election. 

 

 

I predict that the next Conservative leader will be Ian Duncan Smith.......

[pacificquay]

Andy Murray has achieved a lot in an era of tennis when he’s been up against Federer, Nadal and Djokovic, three of the greatest ever.

 

Good company to be in, but he was never the benchmark.

 

Sir Chris Hoy and Jim Clark are our top sportsmen ever.

[AJCee]

In no way endorsing listmania and recognising that Andy Murray has had a very successful and highly respectable career that ranks amongst the very best of any British player: but, to throw a few more names Mr Swinney’s way:

Willie Carson
Ian Stark
Old and young Tom Morrises and James Braid…

[marksixman]

Simply cannot believe that Jim Clark and Colin McRae were not even on that list from The Scotsman.

 

I wonder what the age demographic of the responders was.

[Risil]

Would it be churlish to wonder who Andy Murray thinks is Scotland's greatest politician

[Vitesse2]

Simply cannot believe that Jim Clark and Colin McRae were not even on that list from The Scotsman.

 

I wonder what the age demographic of the responders was.

Age distribution of visitors to their website indicates that approximately 50% are under 45. Clark died in 1968, McRae in 2007, so only the oldest members of that cohort would really remember McRae. Only 12.5% of website visitors are over 65, which is the age you'd need to be to remember Clark. Sport doesn't seem to be a particularly heavily visited section - and that mainly for football. 14% of hits on the site are actually from the United States. I can't find social class figures, but I would guess their readership is heavily weighted towards ABC1. Self-selecting polls of this sort tend to favour more recent events and/or people who are stiill high profile like Wee Jackie. Jocky Wilson is a bit of an outlier and I suspect there may have been a campaign by Scots darts fans to get him included, as he's definitely more Daily Record than Scotsman. Liddell's inclusion is also unusual, but then none of the others have been subjects of a feature film which is regularly repeated on TV  ...

[garoidb]

Apart from Sir Jackie, no luck for motorsport then. I am surprised by the omission of Jim Clark, who Jackie himself has often paid tribute to. JYS's presence in that list is well deserved and may also be related to his long years of post-racing ubiquity in the media even up until recently, an opportunity denied to Clark. 

 

Colin McRae had a video game under his name that was possibly more famous even than the man himself. Also, sadly not with us now to reminisce on his glory days.

 

Since we are mentioning Scottish racing drivers, I would hope Dario Franchitti's achievements also do not fade in the memory. I realise Indycar racing did not have the same profile as F1 in Scotland during his career. 

Edited by garoidb, 24 July 2024 - 21:28.

[ensign14]

Jocky Wilson (the first one, I'd never heard of)

[opplock]

Many will be unfamiliar with that early effort from the fake news pioneering BBC. Young innocents watching Top of the Pops would have been horrified to learn that the R&B and Soul legend Jackie Wilson was in fact a white Scots darts player.  

Edited by opplock, 24 July 2024 - 21:56.

[BRG]

Would it be churlish to wonder who Andy Murray thinks is Scotland's greatest politician

Murray made no secret of his pro-SNP and pro-independence views.  

 

"Anyone but England"

[ensign14]

Murray made no secret of his pro-SNP and pro-independence views.  

 

"Anyone but England"

That was actually a joke in an interview with Henman, who kept taking the piss that Scotland kept failing to qualify.  Naturally the Hate Mail (see sig) took it out of context. 

[Glengavel]

Apart from Sir Jackie, no luck for motorsport then. I am surprised by the omission of Jim Clark, who Jackie himself has often paid tribute to. JYS's presence in that list is well deserved and may also be related to his long years of post-racing ubiquity in the media even up until recently, an opportunity denied to Clark. 

 

Colin McRae had a video game under his name that was possibly more famous even than the man himself. Also, sadly not with us now to reminisce on his glory days.

 

Since we are mentioning Scottish racing drivers, I would hope Dario Franchitti's achievements also do not fade in the memory. I realise Indycar racing did not have the same profile as F1 in Scotland during his career. 

 

Unfortunately, Colin McRae's name is probably known more for the circumstances behind his death than for his sporting achievements.

[Alan Lewis]

As a Salopian married to a Scot, I feel duty bound to mention Sandy Lyle, a Scot born in Shropshire.

[john aston]

Unfortunately, Colin McRae's name is probably known more for the circumstances behind his death than for his sporting achievements.

I completely agree . I struggle to understand his post mortem beatification by some . 

[sabrejet]

Andy Murray has achieved a lot in an era of tennis when he’s been up against Federer, Nadal and Djokovic, three of the greatest ever.

 

Good company to be in, but he was never the benchmark.

 

Sir Chris Hoy and Jim Clark are our top sportsmen ever.

 

Not in the same league as Mark Cavendish. What Hoy and Clark did was done by others; what Cav has done is unique, and may well be for all time.

 

"Our" in this case being British, as in yours?

Edited by sabrejet, 25 July 2024 - 06:41.

[pacificquay]

Not in the same league as Mark Cavendish. What Hoy and Clark did was done by others; what Cav has done is unique, and may well be for all time.

 

"Our" in this case being British, as in yours?

Sir Chris was the benchmark in track cycling for a long time.

 

Cav, while he did some track, is known mostly as a road cyclist.

 

Different discipline.

[jcbc3]

Why are you talking about Cavendish?

 

He's Manx man. Even if a Scottish athlete is 'not as good as some other country's top athlete' he/she can still be the Scottish top athlete.

 

I have the greatest admiration for both the cyclists mentioned but they are as, pq says, incomparable.

[BRG]

Unfortunately, Colin McRae's name is probably known more for the circumstances behind his death than for his sporting achievements.

 

I completely agree . I struggle to understand his post mortem beatification by some . 

Whilst the circumstances of his demise were tragic, the shock of that news in Scotland was palpable.  I was visiting our office in East Kilbride when it happened and was surprised that so many of the Scottish staff were upset by it.  I had never realised that nearly all my colleagues there were closet rally fans.  It was evident that his fame had gone way beyond the usual crowd of rally jacket clad anoraks and that he had become a national figure.  So his omission from the listing is surprising.

[sabrejet]

Sir Chris was the benchmark in track cycling for a long time.

 

Cav, while he did some track, is known mostly as a road cyclist.

 

Different discipline.

 

Different discipline; one the world's greatest, the other great. That's the comparison. 

[RobertE]

Let us not forget Stirling Craufurd Moss! He should certainly qualify...

[arttidesco]

Being a former resident of Nottingham around the time he played for Forrest I might find space for Archie Gemmill, and being more interested in sportscars I think I mght find a spot of Alan McNish, on my list which would be headed by Jim Clark.

[BRG]

McNish   is a good addition and I would throw in one of the most successful and least celebrated of Scottish rally drivers, Andrew Cowan.  Twice winner of the London-Sydney Marathon, winner of the Bandama Ivory Coast Rally (WRC), six time winner on the trot of Australia's then premier really, the Southern Cross & winner of the Vuelta a la América del Sud in the fearsome works Mercedes 450SLC..  But he wasn't just a long distance specialist, he won rallies at home in Scotland and competed as far afield as New Zealand and South Africa.  A quiet unassuming man, he was never accorded the acclaim that he deserved.

[Glengavel]

McNish is a good addition and I would throw in one of the most successful and least celebrated of Scottish rally drivers, Andrew Cowan. Twice winner of the London-Sydney Marathon, winner of the Bandama Ivory Coast Rally (WRC), six time winner on the trot of Australia's then premier really, the Southern Cross & winner of the Vuelta a la América del Sud in the fearsome works Mercedes 450SLC.. But he wasn't just a long distance specialist, he won rallies at home in Scotland and competed as far afield as New Zealand and South Africa. A quiet unassuming man, he was never accorded the acclaim that he deserved.

Cowan also set up Mitsubishi Ralliart with no small measure of success.

[Glengavel]

Anent Andy Murray, still got an iron in the fire:

https://www.bbc.co.u...es/cy9454lj8kvo