438 replies to this topic

[Cadence]

$100 on Danny Ric losing his seat after Singapore.

Not how an icon of sport should be treated IMHO. VCARB should have let him finish the season with some dignity.

What do they really expect to gain from Lawson driving for the last six races?

[krapmeister]

While it doesn't look good for Dan, this is a bit premature no?

 

Everyone was expecting Sergio to be replaced after the summer break and he got the reprieve. Not impossible that it happens for Ricciardo as well.

 

But I certainly don't expect to see him driving in F1 in 2025. I do expect him to stay within the F1 paddock in some form but I think his driving days will be over - apart from maybe a guest drive outside of F1 in NASCAR with Trackhouse and/or a wildcard in a Supercars race (as a fan of both series since childhood).

 

Mind you... marrying Heide, having what will undoubtedly be good looking kids and enjoying his monies sounds like a pretty decent retirement to me 

 

( once it is official I will definitely need to change my avatar and sig - which tbf is a bit out of date anyway)

Edited by krapmeister, 22 September 2024 - 00:42.

[mclarensmps]

I was surprised when I read the thread title, because I didn't read any confirmation about this anywhere. 

It's a real shame to see that he is unable to show his old speed and ability anymore. I hope he gets to finish the season, but it just hasn't been looking good, so I understand if VCARB decide to make a change. 

[FLB]

Maybe. But I think it's already done. After listening to Daniel today, I think he knows what's coming.

So do I. And I agree with your second sentence. 

 

He knows.

[Cadence]

While it doesn't look good for Dan, this is a bit premature no?

Everyone was expecting Sergio to be replaced after the summer break and he got the reprieve. Not impossible that it happens for Ricciardo as well.

But I certainly don't expect to see him driving in F1 in 2025.

Maybe. But I think it's already done. After listening to Daniel today, I think he knows what's coming.

[nissan_gtp]

He had a good run, and had more than enough chance to continue.  Time to bow out. 

[Cadence]

If only we could get him to take Stroll with him!

[thermonuclear]

I also think it's a bit premature to be wielding the executioner's axe for Ricciardo, Horner likes Ricciardo and doesn't rate Lawson in almost equal measure.

 

As for what there is to gain by putting Lawson in the car for six races, it can only be seen as a 2025 job interview. Lawson performs against Tsunoda like Colapinto is doing versus Albon, and he gets a 2025 race seat. He fails to impress much and Hadjar gets the job.

[krapmeister]

Maybe. But I think it's already done. After listening to Daniel today, I think he knows what's coming.

 

As I said it doesn't look good, he does have the air of resignation about him. But RBR have apparently changed their minds at the last minute before, so hope springs eternal lol... 

[Cadence]

...and Magnussen, Bottas, and Zhou.

[FLB]

As I said it doesn't look good, he does have the air of resignation about him. But RBR have apparently changed their minds at the last minute before, so hope springs eternal lol... 

Horner was his greatest defender. This afternoon... he wasn't 

[Cadence]

Horner was his greatest defender. This afternoon... he wasn't

This afternoon Horner wasn't talking about DR, he was talking about Russell.

[krapmeister]

I also think it's a bit premature to be wielding the executioner's axe for Ricciardo, Horner likes Ricciardo and doesn't rate Lawson in almost equal measure.

 

As for what there is to gain by putting Lawson in the car for six races, it can only be seen as a 2025 job interview. Lawson performs against Tsunoda like Colapinto is doing versus Albon, and he gets a 2025 race seat. He fails to impress much and Hadjar gets the job.

 

Yes agree that RBR still seems unconvinced about Lawson for some reason - you could be right that Lawson has the rest of the season to put those doubts to rest.

[FLB]

This afternoon Horner wasn't talking about DR, he was talking about Russell.

I beg to differ. Look beyond the title (my bolding) : Christian Horner cites Mercedes’ George Russell as potential Red Bull target as he says team not afraid to ‘go out of the pool’ in future | Formula 1®

 

 

 

Plainly asked if Singapore will mark Ricciardo’s last race for RB in 2024, Horner began: “Well, look, these things are under constant review. There is obviously a much bigger picture other than just Daniel as we continue to look at all of our options as we move forward. 

Edited by FLB, 22 September 2024 - 00:53.

[krapmeister]

Horner was his greatest defender. This afternoon... he wasn't 

 

TBF to Horner he did give RIC the chance to stake his claim to replacing Perez, unfortunately he hasn't done enough to make the case for that unarguable. 

[Cadence]

I beg to differ. Look beyond the title (my bolding) : Christian Horner cites Mercedes’ George Russell as potential Red Bull target as he says team not afraid to ‘go out of the pool’ in future | Formula 1®

The axe falleth!

Edited by Cadence, 22 September 2024 - 00:57.

[Nathan]

I don't think Red Bull or VCARB owe Danny anything anymore. They should be thinking about keeping Haas behind and getting their next hot shoe ready to go. Frankly, I'm surprised he has gone this far.

[Outsider]

perhaps VCARB started to get nervous how much community service Ricciardo potentially has to serve and frees him up for that. this guy cannot handle a sentence without throwing f-bombs in and look out for the hand-written messages on the helmet today

[miso]

Not how an icon of sport should be treated IMHO. VCARB should have let him finish the season with some dignity.

 

Even if they don't want him to finish the season, they should have let him have a celebratory last race (assuming that is what it is) rather than all of the mess they've let go on.

[Muzzyf1]

I believe this is true if you listened to horner's interview he basically let it slip

[JL14]

Horner was his greatest defender. This afternoon... he wasn't 

 

But in the same interview, Horner questioned Lawson, so while Lawson probably (by contract) gets the nod for the final races of the season, it sounds like that in now way means anything yet for 2025.

Even after the races Liam did last year, they are not sure whether he's a driver at the level of the rookies that have only shown what they can do in 2 F1 races or 2 FP1 laps.

 

Horner:

Liam, the job he did for us last year in the VCARB car was very impressive.

Now, we took experience over that because Daniel was our banker if Sergio [Perez] was to drop the ball. 

Daniel has had a reasonable season but it hasn't been a stellar year.
The question is how good is Liam and sometimes difficult decisions have to be made in order to get those answers.
We'll sit down with all of those options available to us during this next three-week gap.
It's not to the detriment of Daniel that he's in this position, we've got a lot of data and knowledge of where Daniel is. It's a much bigger picture within the whole driver merry-go-round of what does the future look like?
Max is delivering, Checo has been underdelivering this year, last year he did a good job or a good enough to finish second in the championship and be constructors' champion.
We're having to look further down the road. We've got Liam Lawson on the bench. We're not quite sure...looking at the likes of [Franco] Colapinto, [Ollie] Bearman and [Kimi] Antonelli. Is he at that level? Only time will tell. 

Edited by JL14, 22 September 2024 - 04:49.

[frosty125]

Early days but surely they need to get Lawson in and see what he can do over the last few races. Colapinto can’t be ignored either.

[RPM40]

I certainly get the feeling his time is coming to an end. But the thing is his results of late have actually been quite good. He nearly consistently has the better of Tsunoda in race pace.

I don’t think he’s done enough for promotion, but I still persist he’d be performing better than Perez in that Red Bull seat.

[Stoffel]

Still don't really understand what happened to him though.

Was it the cars moving away from suiting his driving style, was it him tailing off really early (Although he's now 35, his downturn began quite a few years ago already) or was it something else entirely?

[frosty125]

Still don't really understand what happened to him though.
Was it the cars moving away from suiting his driving style, was it him tailing off really early (Although he's now 35, his downturn began quite a few years ago already) or was it something else entirely?

It was not being able to adapt to the McLaren and Lando absolutely destroying him.

[TheFish]

I don't think I'll ever understand what happened to Ricciardo. He smashed Vettel, he beat Verstappen in 2016 and 2017 (sure Max was still very young and not the complete driver that he is now, and there were DNFs etc, but you don't beat a guy like Max without being very good). He was also brilliant for Renault, comfortably outclassing Hulkenberg and Ocon. That McLaren stint was disastrous and he couldn't recover.

 

It really felt to me like given the right circumstances he would become a WDC, in the mould of JB. Never the outright best but you don't need to be to win a WDC. His wins were almost always dramatic and entertaining.

 

I suspect he'll look back on his career with some disappointment that he didn't achieve more, but he'll retire a very wealthy man.

[southernstars]

Still don't really understand what happened to him though.

Was it the cars moving away from suiting his driving style, was it him tailing off really early (Although he's now 35, his downturn began quite a few years ago already) or was it something else entirely?

 

He got mentally beaten up quite badly at McLaren - not just the on-track stuff, but also COVID was a problem (he didn't get to go home for two years) and he ended up having a huge falling-out with his best friend at the time too, all the while Zak Brown was trying to paint everything at McLaren as Daniel's fault. It was so bad that he couldn't keep weight on from the anxiety.

[SophieB]

I’ve edited the thread title which announced Ricciardo was going to avoid misleading people but tbh, I’ve rarely seen a driver talking so much as knowing they are gone.

[Disgrace]

Didn't they consider replacing Perez with Ricciardo not that long ago? Everything seems a bit End of Empire, from the way Perez manages to survive to the loss of technical/management personnel following Horner's behaviour.

[Muppetmad]

Didn't they consider replacing Perez with Ricciardo not that long ago? Everything seems a bit End of Empire, from the way Perez manages to survive to the loss of technical/management personnel following Horner's behaviour.

Agreed. This isn't really about Ricciardo (although he's not driving as well as he needs to be), but about the broader dysfunction of Red Bull.

[ensign14]

Everyone was expecting Sergio to be replaced after the summer break and he got the reprieve. Not impossible that it happens for Ricciardo as well.

 

Given that not replacing Perez might end up costing Red Bull the constructors' title, Red Calf might take a different view on sticking now...

[GiorgioF1]

The sooner the better. Being dropped by two teams in a row for underperforming means he shouldn't be in F1 anymore. Bring on some new young guns. Watching Bearman and Colapinto is a freaking joy.

[kumo7]

I’ve edited the thread title which announced Ricciardo was going to avoid misleading people but tbh, I’ve rarely seen a driver talking so much as knowing they are gone.

Daniel had a bad qualify, that is there is to say IMPV. but here things are known faster.

I think Daniel could not bridge his Renault period to McLaren well enough. Then he went through moving three teams from one to the other in a very short period of time, and there was one too many I think. Hoping two in such a short period of time and keeping his performance high was already something.

Also, Renault F1 team might have had different future if it were to keep hold on him.

[jonklug]

It's overdue. As much as he is a likable guy off track, on track he's lost something for a few years now, and he's not getting it back. I agree it's a bit harsh to do it with just a few races to go, but as I understand it, they don't want to lose Lawson and he has a clause that he needs to race 5 races this year or he is a free agent. 

 

So Lawson in, Danny out makes sense. 

[kumo7]

It's overdue. As much as he is a likable guy off track, on track he's lost something for a few years now, and he's not getting it back. I agree it's a bit harsh to do it with just a few races to go, but as I understand it, they don't want to lose Lawson and he has a clause that he needs to race 5 races this year or he is a free agent.

So Lawson in, Danny out makes sense.

Daniel had a long carrier with his issue for the last years indeed. i mean this is exceptionally long for formula one.

[PayasYouRace]

I’m definitely getting Alboreto at Minardi vibes now.

[Amin]

Dan can still do a decent job in the midfield but it's clear he's not going to be a candidate for Red Bull going forward. Toro Rosso should go back to their roots, give young talented Red Bull juniors a chance. Lawson and Hadjar should be in F1 next season imo, with Lindblad following a year or two later. Promote Tsunoda to Red Bull or move him on.

[messy]

Personally I don't have a great problem with this. Ricciardo hasn't been performing well for such a long time now and the 'evaluate him for the RB seat' experiment is long dead now. Ricciardo seems fairly resigned to it himself too.

It's not the greatest end to his career, but since 2021 he's had many chances to rescue things and never really has. Personally I think its time for everyone to move on and I'm more interested to see Lawson again than I am in Dan's endless goodbye.

Edited by messy, 22 September 2024 - 08:05.

[jonklug]

Daniel had a long carrier with his issue for the last years indeed. i mean this is exceptionally long for formula one.

 

And it was generally quite a nice career that he can be proud of. People will mostly remember him for his highs rather than his lows, beating Vettel in his first year at RedBull, those nice wins for years in a RedBull car that was mostly 3rd fastest for years. Getting Renault back on the podium and winning the first race for McLaren in 10 years. It's been a good career for sure - in his prime he was definitely champion material, RedBull just weren't competitive enough at that time.

 

So while I'm sure he won't like this, he should look at the positives and understand it's the right time. 

[kumo7]

And it was generally quite a nice career that he can be proud of. People will mostly remember him for his highs rather than his lows, beating Vettel in his first year at RedBull, those nice wins for years in a RedBull car that was mostly 3rd fastest for years. Getting Renault back on the podium and winning the first race for McLaren in 10 years. It's been a good career for sure - in his prime he was definitely champion material, RedBull just weren't competitive enough at that time.

 

So while I'm sure he won't like this, he should look at the positives and understand it's the right time. 

Not sure about this.

[FirstnameLastname]

All considered it’s a bit of a shitty way to retire him. I mean look at Haas, they brought Bearman in to sub for K-Mag and he scored points… he’s their driver for next year…. They’d be forgiven for just telling K-Mag he’s done. But they apparently appreciate his efforts over the years and feel they owe him a proper goodbye

Ricciardo has been a big personality - and I know F1 is about the racing, but it’s a shame he’s obviously contractually obliged to not talk about it this weekend, so he’s not getting the grand goodbye that would normally happen at the final race of someone’s career

Whoever’s on the podium should do a shooey as a tribute!

[kumo7]

All considered it’s a bit of a shitty way to retire him. I mean look at Haas, they brought Bearman in to sub for K-Mag and he scored points… he’s their driver for next year…. They’d be forgiven for just telling K-Mag he’s done. But they apparently appreciate his efforts over the years and feel they owe him a proper goodbye

Ricciardo has been a big personality - and I know F1 is about the racing, but it’s a shame he’s obviously contractually obliged to not talk about it this weekend, so he’s not getting the grand goodbye that would normally happen at the final race of someone’s career

Whoever’s on the podium should do a shooey as a tribute!

i still think that he will be with us on tv.

[KavB]

It is strange as it was only a couple races ago that he looked like he might be replacing Perez at Red Bull. I would get it if they do replace him, but it really raises even more question marks as to why they kept Perez at the title winning team. I don't think Lawson is anything special that they are scared of losing him, so it is probably correct that they're giving him a final test to see whether he deserves the seat next year. At the end of the day, Ricciardo was given the opportunity on a silver platter to come back to RBR and didn't show enough so it is what it is.

 

It is a shame how Ricciardo's career has panned out. It is unfortunate because after this season you could actually say that the McLaren move was the correct decision on paper. He was never going to beat Max at Red Bull and would have needed a faster car to beat him to a title and he would have finally had that car this year if he didn't experience that huge loss in form. 

 

I know ifs and buts do not win you anything, however a prime 2014-2020 spec Ricciardo would have been a contender so it is unfortunate his decline arrived too early, just like his peak coincided with a not-so-great Red Bull. 

[Clrnc]

Didn't they consider replacing Perez with Ricciardo not that long ago? Everything seems a bit End of Empire, from the way Perez manages to survive to the loss of technical/management personnel following Horner's behaviour.

That was never concrete. It was just very optimistic fans here trying to piece 1+1 together. 

[SophieB]

It is strange as it was only a couple races ago that he looked like he might be replacing Perez at Red Bull. I would get it if they do replace him, but it really raises even more question marks as to why they kept Perez at the title winning team. I don't think Lawson is anything special that they are scared of losing him, so it is probably correct that they're giving him a final test to see whether he deserves the seat next year. At the end of the day, Ricciardo was given the opportunity on a silver platter to come back to RBR and didn't show enough so it is what it is.

 

It is a shame how Ricciardo's career has panned out. It is unfortunate because after this season you could actually say that the McLaren move was the correct decision on paper. He was never going to beat Max at Red Bull and would have needed a faster car to beat him to a title and he would have finally had that car this year if he didn't experience that huge loss in form. 

 

I know ifs and buts do not win you anything, however a prime 2014-2020 spec Ricciardo would have been a contender so it is unfortunate his decline arrived too early, just like his peak coincided with a not-so-great Red Bull. 

 

Yes, but even when he was being talked of as a possible at Red Bull, the same articles did say that he was also at risk of losing a drive if things didn't work out, so it seems to have been all or nothing for some time.

[krapmeister]

That was never concrete. It was just very optimistic fans here trying to piece 1+1 together.

It wasn't just 'optimistic' fans here - it was being speculated quite widely in the media at the time as well.

[Red5ive]

Hopefully this is true - he has been a waste of a seat for a number of seasons now - a ridiculous man-child and I certainly wont miss his stupid grin or his annual "Ricky Bobby" appearance in Austin.

 

Him being great at "PR" for Red Bull should not be a reason to keep him around the grid- send him off to a shopping mall to flog cans of RedBull if thats his strength.

 

Past time to see the Red Bull juniors get their chance - the terminally average Tsunoda should be binned also.

Edited by Red5ive, 22 September 2024 - 09:52.

[kumo7]

there are some people who with an interesting insights.

[Sterzo]

All considered it’s a bit of a shitty way to retire him. I mean look at Haas, they brought Bearman in to sub for K-Mag and he scored points… he’s their driver for next year…. They’d be forgiven for just telling K-Mag he’s done. But they apparently appreciate his efforts over the years and feel they owe him a proper goodbye

Ricciardo has been a big personality - and I know F1 is about the racing, but it’s a shame he’s obviously contractually obliged to not talk about it this weekend, so he’s not getting the grand goodbye that would normally happen at the final race of someone’s career

Whoever’s on the podium should do a shooey as a tribute!

It depends on what's been discussed and agreed over the last year. If targets have been set which he hasn't met, or if it was made clear they'd review him race by race, that would be different from a bolt from the blue when the contract is for the full year.

[se7en_24]

I think it's a shame he's not going to be able to say a proper goodbye to f1 and his fans, he deserves at least that rather than being unceremoniously dumped during a break. But this Red Bull I guess, and we all know they don't really have any kind of standards as human beings.

Edited by se7en_24, 22 September 2024 - 10:33.