110 replies to this topic

[FirstnameLastname]

https://www.dailymai...ne-ferrari.html

Alternative link: https://www.bbc.com/...1lglrj4gqro.amp

Some nice motors in that collection!

Getting his affairs in order now he’s 94 - and he wants to know where the cars end up too

Edited by FirstnameLastname, 01 December 2024 - 19:06.

[DeKnyff]

Would you buy a used car from this man?

[FLB]

Would you buy a used car from this man?

Isn't that how he got started? 

[Risil]

Extraordinary set of cars, hope wherever they go us regular folk get to see them from time to time

[SophieB]

I remember Alonso driving that beautiful Ferrari 375 around Silverstone in 2011.
 

 
 
 
He stayed out an extra lap and really hustled that thing through the corners. Bernie didn't look altogether pleased!

[jonklug]

I'll check my other pants for some change

[NikL]

[kumo7]

It is like Monica Berucci saying she is fed up and go to look for a new boy friend…

wooops except that she is not afaik…

Edited by kumo7, 02 December 2024 - 01:32.

[George Costanza]

Would you buy a used car from this man?

That's how he started his career in 1951...

[loki]

Yep.  Started as a used car salesman.  Like Mike Brewer…

 

Lot of Ferraris in that collection.  I’m sure it’s only a coincidence.

[GregThomas]

One Connaught apparently. Wonder if he kept that as a reminder of an early failure.

 

When he brought the Connaughts out here to NZ it was well known everything was for sale.

 

Nothing sold and everything was shipped back to the UK.  Probably covered costs with the start money

but I'd doubt he saw any profit.

[B Squared]

Yep. Started as a used car salesman. Like Mike Brewer…

Lot of Ferraris in that collection. I’m sure it’s only a coincidence.

I don't think it's any surprise that Ferraris are a desirable machine for most collectors.

Edited by B Squared, 02 December 2024 - 10:07.

[FirstnameLastname]

Yep. Started as a used car salesman. Like Mike Brewer…

Lot of Ferraris in that collection. I’m sure it’s only a coincidence.

Payment for favourable deals…

[B Squared]

Payment for favourable deals…

I'd like to see you put up the receipts to prove that. My brother and I have been around the Ferraris for over 60 years, and I remember learning in the 1970s that if you had the money, you can get on a list to buy Ferrari racecars.

Edited by B Squared, 02 December 2024 - 10:29.

[FirstnameLastname]

I'd like to see you put up the receipts to prove that. My brother and I have been around the Ferraris for over 60 years, and I remember learning in the 1970s that if you had the money, you can get on a list to buy Ferrari racecars.

I’ll just head to my filing cabinet and dig them out

It was said in jest. The guy was incredibly wealthy and had all the right contacts. Good that he wants them to end up in the right hands (probably as long as they are sufficiently wealthy… that’ll be the biggest factor for him I’m sure )

[Ruusperi]

Holy crap that's a yummy collection.

 

[BerniesDad]

Somebody somewhere has the job of looking after this collection for Mr E.

Mostly dusting, i'm sure, but also keeping them in running condition & transporting them to shows & races (which means the odd lap, at least?)

[JHSingo]

An amazing collection - hopefully there's lots of high-quality photos and videos that come from this. The same firm - Tom Hartley Jnr - released a brilliant video earlier this year about a helmet collection they had recently purchased. It was posted by someone in the random YouTube finds thread, but it's well worth a watch if you haven't seen this.

 

 

Good on Bernie for getting this sorted before it's too late - fingers crossed some of them get purchased by enthusiasts who are happy to show the cars off in public rather than just being locked away. 

Edited by JHSingo, 02 December 2024 - 12:50.

[Sterzo]

Would you buy a used car from this man?

I once met a man whose father bought a used motorbike from Bernie. Forty years later, he was still foaming at the mouth about the cheating ******* who'd allegedly swindled his Dad.

[BerniesDad]

I heard a story that Bernie had arranged to meet someone at an airfield who was buying an aeroplane from him.

They met up at the allotted time, the aeroplane wasn't there, and the guy started asking questions.

Bernie assured him that the plane would be arriving soon. 

 

"Who's bringing the plane then?"

"The guy that I'm buying it from, before I sell it to you" 

  

[B Squared]

Nice story BD, I think that people that represent/sell aircraft, boats, and collector cars generally want to be short-term possessors and turn the machine over for a profit as quickly as possible. When a friend of mine worked for Midcon Corporation, he dealt with Bernie's people in the selling of an aircraft and it went off without a hitch

[juicy sushi]

I remember Alonso driving that beautiful Ferrari 375 around Silverstone in 2011.
 

 
 
 
He stayed out an extra lap and really hustled that thing through the corners. Bernie didn't look altogether pleased!

Didn't understand Fernando probably upped the resale value an extra half mil by doing that.

[Autodromo]

I've never understood the whole "collection" thing.  Hopefully they will get out more often.

[DJH63]

I've never understood the whole "collection" thing.  Hopefully they will get out more often.

Realistically they’ll move from one warehouse to another

[loki]

He’s got enough of his old Brabhams left to start a vintage racing series.

[DeKnyff]

I've never understood the whole "collection" thing. Hopefully they will get out more often.

At least, they are stored and preserved in good condition.

[Nathan]

Not a lot of ways you can use an old race car.  Can't blame too many for not wanting to vintage race machines from those days.

[PayasYouRace]

I've never understood the whole "collection" thing.  Hopefully they will get out more often.

They’ll either get stored in a collection or they’ll be scrapped. Most of these cars are short run prototypes build solely for their constructor to race, and not for commercial sale. There’ll never be enough wealthy enthusiasts to give them all a good home individually.

[JHSingo]

I've never understood the whole "collection" thing.  Hopefully they will get out more often.

 

If you have the money and it gives you some happiness, why not? I certainly would if I was in that position. Although I'd probably lose hours every day just going into where I kept them and ogling them. 

Certainly beats splurging on some poncy artwork, anyway. 

[Autodromo]

If you have the money and it gives you some happiness, why not? I certainly would if I was in that position. Although I'd probably lose hours every day just going into where I kept them and ogling them. 

Certainly beats splurging on some poncy artwork, anyway. 

I get what you are saying, but artwork is meant to be simply looked at.  It seems a crime to have a huge collection of cars and they just sit.  Of course I don't know; maybe the warehouse microphone is piped into his bedroom speaker and his alarm clock every morning is one of those engines firing up in real time :-) 

[Anuity]

Looks quite impressive. Nothing wrong with him having so many Ferraris cars. It only makes sense.

 

its a bit sad though that he is selling it all and not keeping at least a part of it for his family who apparently have no interest in it.

 

great investment nonetheless.

[teejay]

What an amazing collection of cars. 

 

Hope it goes to somewhere that will display them for the public, or even run them from time to time. 

[TennisUK]

I noticed that the 89 and 90 Brabhams are in that collection, neither very storied cars - and neither safe from his tenure at Brabham - they must hold some sort of value to him though.

[cbo]

If you have the money and it gives you some happiness, why not? I certainly would if I was in that position. Although I'd probably lose hours every day just going into where I kept them and ogling them.

Certainly beats splurging on some poncy artwork, anyway.

Just get an "artist" to ducttape a banana to the car and value doubles....

[djr900]

They’ll either get stored in a collection or they’ll be scrapped. Most of these cars are short run prototypes build solely for their constructor to race, and not for commercial sale. There’ll never be enough wealthy enthusiasts to give them all a good home individually.

What makes you think any of these cars will be "scrapped" , they all look to be in good condition and are all rare, interesting cars.

It's not like it's a barn full of rusty old road cars

[JHSingo]

What makes you think any of these cars will be "scrapped" , they all look to be in good condition and are all rare, interesting cars.

It's not like it's a barn full of rusty old road cars

 

Yeah, I can't imagine any will be scrapped, given their history and former owner. They'll either be held onto until such a time that they find a buyer, or, failing that, donated to a museum. 

[DeKnyff]

What makes you think any of these cars will be "scrapped" , they all look to be in good condition and are all rare, interesting cars.

It's not like it's a barn full of rusty old road cars

 

Well, I don't know if they will scrapped or not. The most iconic pieces certainly not, but not all F1 cars that ever existed are still conserved. Not even one of each type. So, at some moment, many of them are scrapped.

[PayasYouRace]

What makes you think any of these cars will be "scrapped" , they all look to be in good condition and are all rare, interesting cars.

It's not like it's a barn full of rusty old road cars

I don’t think any of them will get scrapped. But my point was that they would be if it weren’t for the collectors who look after them so lovingly. The collectors that Autodromo was disparaging.

[djr900]

I don’t think any of them will get scrapped. But my point was that they would be if it weren’t for the collectors who look after them so lovingly. The collectors that Autodromo was disparaging.

If you don't think any will be scrapped, then why say that ?

The best cars will be worth millions perhaps, the others will be worth thousands.

My local scrapyard are currently paying £140 per tonne for scrap cars, do you really think any of these will sell for £140 per tonne ?

I don't think Bernie will need to call WeBuyAnyCar to get rid of them

[PayasYouRace]

If you don't think any will be scrapped, then why say that ?

The best cars will be worth millions perhaps, the others will be worth thousands.

My local scrapyard are currently paying £140 per tonne for scrap cars, do you really think any of these will sell for £140 per tonne ?

I don't think Bernie will need to call WeBuyAnyCar to get rid of them

Autodromo says they don’t understand the point of these collections. I pointed out that without these collections, the cars would not find good homes. If they don’t find good homes, they are scrapped.

It’s precisely the collectors that Autodromo doesn’t understand that saves these cars from the crap heap.

Come on, it’s not hard.

[DeKnyff]

If you don't think any will be scrapped, then why say that ?

The best cars will be worth millions perhaps, the others will be worth thousands.

My local scrapyard are currently paying £140 per tonne for scrap cars, do you really think any of these will sell for £140 per tonne ?

I don't think Bernie will need to call WeBuyAnyCar to get rid of them

 

Problem is that an F1 car is certainly valuable (some more valuable than others, in any case), but also extraordinarily expensive to be kept in running order, let alone repaired if something is broken. So, there is a moment the costs outweigh the value and then comes neglect and sale of components as spare parts. Scrap is finally the only realistic destination.

[djr900]

Autodromo says they don’t understand the point of these collections. I pointed out that without these collections, the cars would not find good homes. If they don’t find good homes, they are scrapped.

It’s precisely the collectors that Autodromo doesn’t understand that saves these cars from the crap heap.

Come on, it’s not hard.

You made a silly comment, just admit it.
Come on, it's not hard

[BerniesDad]

The problem here is the sheer scale. The estimated value of the collection is $400m.

The number of people in the world motivated and capable to invest $400m in a bunch of old cars is in single digits. Quite possibly it's just Bernie.

(not saying that he bought most of them at auction price, many are leftovers from when he owned Brabham)

The number of collectors prepared to pay multiple millions for even-one-single-item-from-the-collection is so limited, that it's unlikely that all the cars will sell.

 

(Edit to say : I do like the idea of WeBuyAnyCar quoting £250 for a old Brabham F1 car - minus their £40 admin, naturally!)

Edited by BerniesDad, 03 December 2024 - 11:08.

[PayasYouRace]

You made a silly comment, just admit it.
Come on, it's not hard

So what do you think happens to old racing cars if there aren’t collectors to save them?

[B Squared]

Before old racecars became fashionable, numerous ones were scrapped or parted out. Noted author and expert Doug Nye, commented on the tnf side of this very subject that none of the 246 Ferraris from 1958 survived in that guise.

[B Squared]

The 156 Ferrari "sharknose" is another example of non-surviving examples, if I remember correctly.

[B Squared]

Some here are too young to remember these days when an old racecar was just an old racecar. Acquaintance, author and Ferrari Club of America co-founder Richard Merritt with his find that day, 1958 250TR chassis 0728TR, the 1958 LeMans winning machine. Thank goodness for the foresight of people like him and other, dare I say it, collectors.

[DeKnyff]

Before old racecars became fashionable, numerous ones were scrapped or parted out. Noted author and expert Doug Nye, commented on the tnf side of this very subject that none of the 246 Ferraris from 1958 survived in that guise.

And still, Ferraris are highly collectible. But all those post-Piquet era Brabhams…

[B Squared]

And still, Ferraris are highly collectible. But all those post-Piquet era Brabhams…

At the time of the photo above, old Ferraris were not worth crap. I'm guessing he probably paid three to $4,000 for that car and today it would be worth 30 to 40 million. No one could have predicted that type of inflation, some people just absolutely loved the cars, even when they weren't worth s***.

As far as the Brabhams, with the money and garage space, I sure wouldn't turn them down.

[FLB]

And still, Ferraris are highly collectible. But all those post-Piquet era Brabhams…

A lot of people like 'odd' cars. 

 

The BT55 certainly qualifies as such.