72 replies to this topic

[Beri]

Waking up to the news that Zandvoort will not extend the contract and the Dutch Grand Prix will not be held anymore after 2026.

The organization do not want to rotate with other venues. And they want to quit at their peak.

News will likely be brought out this week officially. Perhaps even as soon as today.

Dutch news site;
https://www.ad.nl/fo...voort~aa0f721f/

Edited by Beri, 04 December 2024 - 06:35.

[JL14]

It's because ticket sales are going down and for next year's GP they are below expectations / what they need to be.

Also why they started advertising already, for example by sponsoring The Race's podcast to draw in more foreign visitors, as the hype among the Dutch fans seems to be going down year on year.

Edited by JL14, 04 December 2024 - 06:36.

[Beri]

This year's Grand Prix already was down on ticket sales. Major parts of the grand stands were empty. Even the hospitality ones.

That being said, they are indeed quitting at their peak. And it's better to quit now than to wait for numbers to go down so drastically, for example in the wake of Verstappen his retirement, and to find yourself in financial difficulties. For an organization with no government funding, this is a wise decision in my opinion.

[JimmyClark]

That's a shame - I really like the circuit and it's so refreshing to see a classic on the calendar among the new Tilkedromes and street circuits.

[Mark A]

This year's Grand Prix already was down on ticket sales. Major parts of the grand stands were empty. Even the hospitality ones.

That being said, they are indeed quitting at their peak. And it's better to quit now than to wait for numbers to go down so drastically, for example in the wake of Verstappen his retirement, and to find yourself in financial difficulties. For an organization with no government funding, this is a wise decision in my opinion.

 

Their own website says 2026 is the last one.

 

I thought about going and to be honest the cost put me off in the end.

The organisers seem to cater for local fans quite well from what I saw, I was in the Netherlands by chance that weekend and staying near Deventer and they had coaches running from there to and from the GP, I just wasn't sure I wanted to spend 2 hours in a coach each way with a bunch of fanatical Max fans .

I looked at it late and there were still a few options in grandstands, GA was all sold out, but it wasn't easy to get to the tickets for the GP as they were really trying to sell packages and the Friday tickets, neither of which were of interest. I've just gone to the site now and it isn't possible to buy Sunday only tickets.

It's a nice old school circuit, I've driven it a number of times on trackdays (before the banked corner updates), still not sure it is 100% suited to F1.

[Beri]

And Liberty has now acknowledged the news, Zandvoort to be gone after 2026:

https://www.telegraa...at-hoger-gelegd

[PrinceBira]

And Liberty has now acknowledged the news, Zandvoort to be gone after 2026:

https://www.telegraa...at-hoger-gelegd

 

Fantastisc news, more room for a Grand Prix in a country without any racing history nor many racing fans!

[Beri]

Their own website says 2026 is the last one.

 

I thought about going and to be honest the cost put me off in the end.

The organisers seem to cater for local fans quite well from what I saw, I was in the Netherlands by chance that weekend and staying near Deventer and they had coaches running from there to and from the GP, I just wasn't sure I wanted to spend 2 hours in a coach each way with a bunch of fanatical Max fans .

I looked at it late and there were still a few options in grandstands, GA was all sold out, but it wasn't easy to get to the tickets for the GP as they were really trying to sell packages and the Friday tickets, neither of which were of interest. I've just gone to the site now and it isn't possible to buy Sunday only tickets.

It's a nice old school circuit, I've driven it a number of times on trackdays (before the banked corner updates), still not sure it is 100% suited to F1.

 

The entire railway timetable for that weekend is altered to cater to the Grand Prix. Even time tables in Deventer have small alterations to serve this purpose. 2 platforms of Amsterdam Central Station are dedicated for trains going to or coming from Zandvoort. A train leaves every 10 minutes.

This mere fact alone is something that shows the way The Netherlands have really lifted this event to the next level. Yes ofcourse one could argue over the suitability of the track. And one could argue over safety. Or even the event being only on the calendar because of Verstappen. But fact the matter is that previously, Grands Prix were mere local events and regional events at best. Zandvoort has shown that it can be something that is country wide well recieved. That it is not only a matter of government funding to turn a profit. Silverstone is the other venue which doesnt have any government funding. But in contrast; Silverstone has a name and an event it already builds upon for 70+ years or so. Zandvoort had to get the event going in an age of hyper modern Tilkedromes, with oil money dripping out of every corner and state of the art hightech facilities that are still modern to other racing series in 20 years from now. Add in the sustainability, the whole festivities surrounding the event and the fact that 90% of the visitors dont travel by car, and one can see why Zandvoort is a blueprint example of how such an event should be the base standard to any Grand Prix in the future.

 

Personally I am a bit saddened by this news. I am no Verstappen fan and I loathe the Orange Army with its carnivalesque outings. But I thoroughly enjoyed the 3 events that I have visited.

[PayasYouRace]

Such a shame. One of the few recent additions to the calendar that I felt really belonged. The modifications to the circuit should also be a model for every other F1 circuit. They did a great job with the circuit, and incorporating the banking into the final corner was genius.

But hey, gotta make room for tracks in the desert that look like they’ve been designed by a hyperactive 8 year old. “…and this corner is in a tunnel, and this corner is in the sky! And …”

[SenorSjon]

Fantastisc news, more room for a Grand Prix in a country without any racing history nor many racing fans!

 

Preferably at night in a generic street track or desert.

 

The entire railway timetable for that weekend is altered to cater to the Grand Prix. Even time tables in Deventer have small alterations to serve this purpose. 2 platforms of Amsterdam Central Station are dedicated for trains going to or coming from Zandvoort. A train leaves every 10 minutes.

This mere fact alone is something that shows the way The Netherlands have really lifted this event to the next level. Yes ofcourse one could argue over the suitability of the track. And one could argue over safety. Or even the event being only on the calendar because of Verstappen. But fact the matter is that previously, Grands Prix were mere local events and regional events at best. Zandvoort has shown that it can be something that is country wide well recieved. That it is not only a matter of government funding to turn a profit. Silverstone is the other venue which doesnt have any government funding. But in contrast; Silverstone has a name and an event it already builds upon for 70+ years or so. Zandvoort had to get the event going in an age of hyper modern Tilkedromes, with oil money dripping out of every corner and state of the art hightech facilities that are still modern to other racing series in 20 years from now. Add in the sustainability, the whole festivities surrounding the event and the fact that 90% of the visitors dont travel by car, and one can see why Zandvoort is a blueprint example of how such an event should be the base standard to any Grand Prix in the future.

 

Personally I am a bit saddened by this news. I am no Verstappen fan and I loathe the Orange Army with its carnivalesque outings. But I thoroughly enjoyed the 3 events that I have visited.

 

I'm at peace with it. Viaplay really killed of any positive vibe for me by stealing F1 from Ziggo. And I refuse to use public transport or get extorted for sleeping in a tent. So it didn't even cross my mind to attend. Next to the price. It is cheaper to visit the Hungary or Austria tracks.

[Hellenic tifosi]

So excited to see Zandvoort go away and make room for yet another street or desert race

 

Who cares about history, actual racing fans and calendar variety?

Edited by Hellenic tifosi, 04 December 2024 - 09:05.

[absinthedude]

Zandvoort spent all that money for only a few races....what a shame. I am sure, however, that Liberty will make a lot of filthy lucre from whatever replaces it.

 

The "orange army" are an embarrassment but Zandvoort represented both an old school track and something different in today's environment. I made a point of at least watching highlights of last year's race there. 

 

It is only acceptable to see somewhere like Zandvoort go if it's replaced by a race in Germany, Portugal or some other country with real open wheel motorsport heritage. But I bet it's a night street race in the desert in a country with an extremely dodgy human rights record and a lot of money. 

[Heyli]

Wise choice. It simply wasnt a viable on the long term, definitely without Verstappen.

 

It's asahme, as ai like the circuit, but it is what it is. 

[PayasYouRace]

Wise choice. It simply wasnt a viable on the long term, definitely without Verstappen.

It's asahme, as ai like the circuit, but it is what it is.

Have I missed something? Verstappen isn’t going to be around for the long term?

[Viryfan]

Zandvoort departure is probably going to save Spa permanent place on the calendar.
Which should enable Spa 24 hours to get back to its original spot.

[Viryfan]

Have I missed something? Verstappen isn’t going to be around for the long term?

Having attended several races per season over the last few years, i can see that the Orange army dwindled this year.
There were probably more Perez's red bull cap and Mclaren papaya clothes than Verstappen merch at the track.


It might just be blip due to the olympics and Euro of football, maybe not but i guess Zandvoort promoter were not willing to take chances.

[Anja]

I won't say Zandvoort was a must-have on the calendar as the races were so-so but it's sad that we're losing one of the few tracks that still have some unique character left. That counts for a lot in my book in the cookie cutter circuit takeover of F1. 

[SenorSjon]

Having attended several races per season over the last few years, i can see that the Orange army dwindled this year.
There were probably more Perez's red bull cap and Mclaren papaya clothes than Verstappen merch at the track.


It might just be blip due to the olympics and Euro of football, maybe not but i guess Zandvoort promoter were not willing to take chances.

 

F1 moved the Viaplay which has less presence as a payTV channel instead of a hosting provider with way bigger reach.

[Calum]

I’ve preferred the return of Circuit Zandvoort, compared to the fairly recent short return of another legacy track, Paul Ricard.


Quite shocked it’s going so soon. I would have believed the Verstappen local interest hype could have kept it going for a new 5 year deal.


We’ll all just have to enjoy the Spanish industrial estate instead.

[B38]

Sorry to hear this. It is a stunning track. While I was very sceptical when Zandvoort was announced as F1 circuit, I have to admit I was wrong, it quickly became one of my favorite tracks. Sure, overtaking is difficult but it can be done, there are multiple racelines possible and unlike Monaco, this circuit is harsh on tyres so if Pirelli makes the right tyre selections, you can also enjoy the 1 stop vs 2 stop strategy battle.

 

BTW

Understood that one major reasons to quit was that the new elected Dutch goverment has increased the sales tax on (sport) events from 9% to 21%, so in order the keep the same amount of net revenue, the tickes prices had to be increased which might result in fewer ticket sales. As result, this goverment will after 2026 not receive a single penny cent from f1 ticket sales and also miss out on taxes on hotel stays, food, .. etc.

Edited by B38, 04 December 2024 - 18:51.

[LolaB0860]

Apparently there will be Sprint ™ at Zandvoort in it's final running in 2026. Maybe Liberty demanded it in order to get the final 1 year extension.

Anyway, it's a shame since we all know this won't free room more Euro events (or prevent the rotation of them), but gives excuse to have two races in Saudi Arabia. And along with Baku it's been one of the few good additions to the calendar in the last 15 years?

Edited by LolaB0860, 04 December 2024 - 11:25.

[Heyli]

Have I missed something? Verstappen isn’t going to be around for the long term?

At some point he wont be there anymore. I didnt mean to say that 2026 would be the final year, but Zandvoort direction made it clear that they do not want to wait for Verstappen to quit and stop on a high point.

[absinthedude]

I really admire the Hungarian Grand Prix organisers. They’ve had a race at a track that was almost universally loathed, though has become more popular of late, and their race never, ever seems to be in danger.

 

In the beginning it was the genuine novelty and sheer amazement of holding a race behind the Iron Curtain. The original track was considered fun to lap, but not at all good for racing. Yet look at some of the races there in the 80s, there were some iconic moments. 

 

What is amazing is how it hung on in the 90s until they lengthened the front straight in 2003...which always seemed the obvious thing to do but must have required considerable investment.

 

It's now decent enough. And we must remember that in 1986 it was replacing tracks like Zandvoort, Kyalami and Brands Hatch. Today it's in among tracks in which it does not look at all out of place. 

[Muppetmad]

It's a shame. Zandvoort should never have worked as an F1 venue in the 2020s, but it did. As others have said already, Zandvoort will no doubt be making space for a dull atrocity. A pity.

[JimmyClark]

In the beginning it was the genuine novelty and sheer amazement of holding a race behind the Iron Curtain. The original track was considered fun to lap, but not at all good for racing. Yet look at some of the races there in the 80s, there were some iconic moments. 

 

What is amazing is how it hung on in the 90s until they lengthened the front straight in 2003...which always seemed the obvious thing to do but must have required considerable investment.

 

It's now decent enough. And we must remember that in 1986 it was replacing tracks like Zandvoort, Kyalami and Brands Hatch. Today it's in among tracks in which it does not look at all out of place. 

 

The climate changing helps too; we went 20 years without a wet race there, but now given central European summers tend to be a lot stormier, it is now one of the most regular wet races, which always offers up fun.  

[midgrid]

Having attended several races per season over the last few years, i can see that the Orange army dwindled this year.
There were probably more Perez's red bull cap and Mclaren papaya clothes than Verstappen merch at the track.

 

How easy is it to distinguish between the Orange Army and the Papaya Patrol in person?

[Risil]

 

What's the future like for Zandvoort the circuit?

[babbel]

 
What's the future like for Zandvoort the circuit?

The circuit will be fine. It’s pretty much booked year round.

[Marklar]

Having attended several races per season over the last few years, i can see that the Orange army dwindled this year.
There were probably more Perez's red bull cap and Mclaren papaya clothes than Verstappen merch at the track.


It might just be blip due to the olympics and Euro of football, maybe not but i guess Zandvoort promoter were not willing to take chances.

When I was in Spielberg this year the track CEO (I think it was him) bragged on stage about how many Dutch fans prefer to go to Spielberg over Zandvoort because it's cheaper and because it is a nice option to combine a vacation with a race attendance. I have no idea how much truth there is to this, however. Because I too have noticed that there was more McLaren than Max clothing in Spielberg as well (while last year when I was in Spa this wasnt the case), regardless.

I also suspect that the first race in 2021 being this impossible to get ticket for (and then for the 2nd year those people that got tickets also got preference) made many people believe that it's impossible to get tickets and thus they didn't even try. I was under that impression for instance because I knew that ticket requests for 2025 were already open in 2023 (together with 2024) so I assumed it was sold out already and that all of the Netherlands still wants to attend this race, otherwise I would have likely picked this race for 2025 to attend.

[aportinga]

So excited to see Zandvoort go away and make room for yet another street or desert race

 

Who cares about history, actual racing fans and calendar variety?

 

Or... Maybe a 4th race in the States at Thermal?

[Sash1]

Prices for grandstand sat/sun worth a weekend at Assen TT + Spa Wec + food/drink combined. No thanks. It was nice for a lot of Dutchies to have seen Verstappen in Holland once in their life, but not worth a 2nd time. So good that they stop and prevent a disappoinment and financiel problems. Let Liberty go suck an organisation empty somewhere else.

[earthling45]

Understandable given the costs and certainly good if this means that Spa remains on the calendar every season.

But my feeling is that with the new regulations from 2026 onwards racing would be even better because cars have less downforce and are smaller/lighter compared to the current F1cars.

Luckely we get to see a race in 2026 in Zandvoort with the new cars and regulations.

[r4mses]

 

Understandable given the costs and certainly good if this means that Spa remains on the calendar every season.

But my feeling is that with the new regulations from 2026 onwards racing would be even better because cars have less downforce and are smaller/lighter compared to the current F1cars.

Luckely we get to see a race in 2026 in Zandvoort with the new cars and regulations.

 

 

Imho Spa and Silverstone are Liberty's fig leaves used to signal to older F1 fans (who actually care about racing history et al) it's still the F1 they fell in love with. The leaves which cover all the bs venues beneath.

 

See? We're racing at Spa and Silverstone! ...oh, and Bahrain, Saudi-Arabia, Qatar, Abu Dhabi and two US races none wants...BUT it's Spa, too!

[KWSN - DSM]

4th US GP coming up - Night race in downtown Houston.

 

/s

[Risil]

Imho Spa and Silverstone are Liberty's fig leaves used to signal to older F1 fans (who actually care about racing history et al) it's still the F1 they fell in love with. The leaves which cover all the bs venues beneath.

 

See? We're racing at Spa and Silverstone! ...oh, and Bahrain, Saudi-Arabia, Qatar, Abu Dhabi and two US races none wants...BUT it's Spa, too!

 

Perhaps, but how is that different from how things were in, say, 1996? I don't know if F1 has lost any additional truly historic venues since then.

[Beri]

Perhaps, but how is that different from how things were in, say, 1996? I don't know if F1 has lost any additional truly historic venues since then.

Hockenheim in it's old form to start with. Estoril is also a track I'd like to see return. But otherwise, only Buenos Aires, Nürburgring and Magny Cours have fallen away from us.

[balmybaldwin]

Massive shame, a completely different track, lots of elevation change and good racing.

 

Makes room for another billiard smooth night race in a dictatorship though

[PayasYouRace]

Perhaps, but how is that different from how things were in, say, 1996? I don't know if F1 has lost any additional truly historic venues since then.

There does seem to be a historic no man’s land where some of the very oldest circuits are still with us but then a period of circuits that have disappeared.

[LolaB0860]

I guess Barcelona still has small chance of staying in in 2027 with Zandvoort exit, but the problem is Qiddiya is also projected to be completed in 2027.

 

Oh and the South Korea, Rwanda whatever GPs.

 

For Zandvoort, and many of these other ex or soon-to-be-ex F1 tracks, I wish some of them were utilized by F2/F3. Not every event needs to be always tied up with the main series.

Edited by LolaB0860, 04 December 2024 - 18:08.

[FirstnameLastname]

Admirable that the circuit bosses would rather protect the circuit than keep chasing the F1 dream.

Shame though, Dutch fans are very passionate about the sport & the circuit always looked superb, banking was a near solution, and the weekend event looked like a great time. Would have been on my list to do in the future

[Risil]

For Zandvoort, and many of these other ex or soon-to-be-ex F1 tracks, I wish some of them were utilized by F2/F3. Not every event needs to be always tied up with the main series.

I would like to agree but would anyone turn up to watch an F2/F3 standalone?

Now BTCC Zandvoort round, I'd like to see that

[Yoshi]

Zandvoort departure is probably going to save Spa permanent place on the calendar.
Which should enable Spa 24 hours to get back to its original spot.

Lets hope

[P123]

Fun track, great atmosphere.  Of course it had to go.  Stick in another couple of 'could be anywhere' night races instead.  

[Nemo1965]

That's a shame - I really like the circuit and it's so refreshing to see a classic on the calendar among the new Tilkedromes and street circuits.

Perhaps it’s horrible as a Dutchman to say… But this Zandvoort- track has nothing to do with the old one, and therefore is not a classic in my eyes. The people that redesigned it, did a great job. I’m really impressed. But I just don’t like the track…

It’s narrow, when there’s camber there’s not a hint of danger. Not that it should be dangerous, but I’ve driven on the track, the old one, and I’ve been driven around by a very competitive driver. It was just a little bit scary even when I drove myself on modest speeds.

So I’m sad to say I’m not really that disappointed that the track will disappear from the calendar

[JimmyClark]

Perhaps it’s horrible as a Dutchman to say… But this Zandvoort- track has nothing to do with the old one, and therefore is not a classic in my eyes. The people that redesigned it, did a great job. I’m really impressed. But I just don’t like the track…

It’s narrow, when there’s camber there’s not a hint of danger. Not that it should be dangerous, but I’ve driven on the track, the old one, and I’ve been driven around by a very competitive driver. It was just a little bit scary even when I drove myself on modest speeds.

So I’m sad to say I’m not really that disappointed that the track will disappear from the calendar

 

Fair, but then one could say the same about Spa? 

 

Personally it still has a great old-school feel, a track that flows with the scenery and hasn't been designed with a completely soulless bit of software like the one this weekend. Its like a classic club circuit and adds real value to the calendar, in my humble opinion. 

[F1 Mike]

Does this mean there aren't as many fans of the sport as a whole in the Netherlands and they are truly only fans of their star driver? I could never imagine Australia numbers dwindling simply because they didn't have a competitive Aussie driver, or USA events becoming unviable due to lack of American driver success

[earthling45]

Does this mean there aren't as many fans of the sport as a whole in the Netherlands and they are truly only fans of their star driver? I could never imagine Australia numbers dwindling simply because they didn't have a competitive Aussie driver, or USA events becoming unviable due to lack of American driver success

 

Everyone in my family and friends colleagues watch and talk about F1 and yes also long before Max did become an F1 driver.

Having a race in the Netherlands again after such a long time is new and shiny at that moment, but after a few years it loses its shine.

[Ruusperi]

Big shame. The old-school feeling is so unique that only Suzuka and Zandvoort have that magic. It's a complete opposite of what Liberty wants, that is, TikTok/nightclub city street tracks or $$$ oil wealth autocracy sportswashing playgrounds. But that's why I love Zandvoort: pure motorsport circuit for us petrolheads, where racing is the main event and not after-GP parties.

 

But even though it's gone from 2027 onwards, I hope it will return someday. Maybe Verstappen will quit but then pulls a Schumi and there will be another hype in The Nerherlands. It's still s FIA Grade 1 track, and if there's another pandemia, there are not too many tracks to choose from. And if Imola made a comeback, so can Zandvoort.

Edited by Ruusperi, 04 December 2024 - 20:33.

[Deeq]

What Verstappen retiring 2026?😱😱

[Nemo1965]

Fair, but then one could say the same about Spa?

Personally it still has a great old-school feel, a track that flows with the scenery and hasn't been designed with a completely soulless bit of software like the one this weekend. Its like a classic club circuit and adds real value to the calendar, in my humble opinion.

I think Spa kept more of the old track, they had just more space to work it. You say it well: the current Zandvoort is now a club circuit, perfect for people to learn to drive fast or faster. I just can’t see it as a Grand Prix track. It kind of works, but the same as a padel or pickleball-court works juxtaposed to a tenniscourt.