67 replies to this topic

[pacificquay]

Reigning constructors champions!

 

Hopefully a quicker start to the season this time will put McLaren in contention for the drivers’ title too.

 

Lando is ready for the fight, while hopefully Oscar can become a more regular race winner too.

 

Let’s go!

 

[CPR]

It'll take a lot of hard work and maybe a bit of luck but I think both WCC and WDC are realistic targets.

 

But first things first: a properly good winter's testing for the first time in years please.

[mclarensmps]

Happy New Year everyone!

[rodlamas]

Time for the 10th and the 13th. Let's do it.

[kumo7]

New thread for new year! let us not break the momentum and take the both titles!!!

Champions come in all shapes and sizes. Literally in Keke Rosberg's case.

i think Norris’ case is somewhat different, in a sense that it involves his online racing carrier. we know that being a online champion does not mean directly to be the real on track champion. it takes a lot more to be the real on track champion. Norris’ rate of development as a real on track racer has significance. Now, can McLaren provide real opportunity?

Edited by kumo7, 02 January 2025 - 08:14.

[KWSN - DSM]

McLaren must enter 2025 with sights set on both drivers and teams championship.

[BertoC]

Now that the hard part is done, we need to aim further. Double championship.

[BRG]

Day 1 of 2025 and the big McLaren sign outside the MTC is still lit up in orange.  They are really milking it!  Usually it was lit up after a win for a day or so, not for nearly a month.  Or maybe it will stay orange instead of the old piss-green?

Edited by BRG, 02 January 2025 - 09:45.

[rodlamas]

Piastri: I have all tools to challenge for F1 title, now I need to deploy them

https://www.autospor...-them/10685786/

[kumo7]

in the article, Oscar says ‘in a good day’ so a bit more modest than what the headline says.
Norris for WDC, Oscar to chase him, they both should work together to make WCC truth early!

[pup]

For this year, I'm not predicting McLaren dominance; but I am prepared to be unapologetic about it. 

[pacificquay]

https://www.autospor...0327.1698243713

 

Talk of taking some risks.

 

Perfectly doable now, given there’s a solid baseline to build from.

 

Already they had 100% reliability in races, so that’s amazing.

 

What do we need to see from the new car?

[kumo7]

https://www.autospor...0327.1698243713

Talk of taking some risks.

Perfectly doable now, given there’s a solid baseline to build from.

Already they had 100% reliability in races, so that’s amazing.

What do we need to see from the new car?

Zak said:

“I think we'll be much more prepared next year, because I think we came into this year thinking not in a million years are we going to be where we are,”

geeez RedBull wait while wash your neck!

[kumo7]

McLaren should be threatening the RedBull and Ferrari to say the least, I think. If not, then McLaren got something to rethink about how its winter program is targeted.
Quite honestly, the team as currently McLaren operates does have strength to get the shoulder next to the competitors: Ferrari, RedBull, Mercedes.
I think Mercedes will be a surprise package. We will see…

Edited by kumo7, 03 January 2025 - 07:50.

[1player]

Given that Ferrari are going for a completely new concept this year, it's not a bad idea to take some risks ourselves, rather than remaining conservative.

[1player]

Crazy prediction: we won't have to worry about Red Bull. They have their champion, sure, but everything else is in shambles over there and the curse of the second seat is still in full force.

 

 

Ferrari will be scary (though I'm not optimistic about Lewis doing better than Carlos). Mercedes could be scary (though it all depends whether the Antonelli hype is founded)

 

The positive thing is that we're the only one among these that didn't change their line up, and stability is GOOD. Lando will improve, as he's been doing since 2019, and I'm certain Oscar will find his footing and consistency.

[Oblivion]

I think we are back to good ol' days McLaren vs. Ferrari. Let's hope it will be the title battle

[kumo7]

Crazy prediction: we won't have to worry about Red Bull. They have their champion, sure, but everything else is in shambles over there and the curse of the second seat is still in full force.


Ferrari will be scary (though I'm not optimistic about Lewis doing better than Carlos). Mercedes could be scary (though it all depends whether the Antonelli hype is founded)

The positive thing is that we're the only one among these that didn't change their line up, and stability is GOOD. Lando will improve, as he's been doing since 2019, and I'm certain Oscar will find his footing and consistency.

i am hoping that this is the case. but like in Brazil 2024, Max will kill any pink dream…

[SparkPlug86]

I think, and correct me if I'm wrong... but this will likely be the first winter test in some years where we already have a competitive base line car to work with. So we can expect the usual "sand bag" and "looks fast" claims in testing on pure merit. 

[KWSN - DSM]

Crazy prediction: we won't have to worry about Red Bull. They have their champion, sure, but everything else is in shambles over there and the curse of the second seat is still in full force.

 

 

Ferrari will be scary (though I'm not optimistic about Lewis doing better than Carlos). Mercedes could be scary (though it all depends whether the Antonelli hype is founded)

 

The positive thing is that we're the only one among these that didn't change their line up, and stability is GOOD. Lando will improve, as he's been doing since 2019, and I'm certain Oscar will find his footing and consistency.

 

Under expect Red Bull at your peril, they do not go from WDC to also rans in a season.

[onewingedangel]

This will be the first car Rob Marshall will have had a hand in laying out rather than working within the confines of existing hard points, so I'd suspect some suspension and packaging optimisations, with aero evolved around that.

[jensfan09]

I think, and correct me if I'm wrong... but this will likely be the first winter test in some years where we already have a competitive base line car to work with. So we can expect the usual "sand bag" and "looks fast" claims in testing on pure merit.

Knowing McLaren and their testing methodologies, they probably won’t show their hand until the very end! Lol

[Mc_Silver]

This will be the first car Rob Marshall will have had a hand in laying out rather than working within the confines of existing hard points, so I'd suspect some suspension and packaging optimisations, with aero evolved around that.

Yep. Really excited for 2025. We have everything in place. Everybody in the team is super confident and more motivated than ever for more success.

[SparkPlug86]

Under expect Red Bull at your peril, they do not go from WDC to also rans in a season.

 

Maybe, we'll see... it's happened before, it can happen again.

[RPM40]

Ferrari and Mercedes will be the main challengers.

 

Ferrari have the strongest driver lineup and produced a car that has generally been very competitive.

 

Russell is also a very good driver (underrated in general imo) and writing Mercedes off would be stupid, they seem to be on the rise too.

 

Weirdly I don't expect Red Bull to feature, while they don't go from 'WDC to also rans' in a season, I would say they were largely not competitive by the middle of 2024. With Newey now completely out I don't see why their performance would improve.

[CPR]

I find it kinda weird how many commentators expect 2025 to be largely a repeat of 2024.

 

Sure, I don't expect the competitive order to change all that much by the first race, but that alone will produce a very different dynamic - Red Bull (and Max) are unlikely to take an early lead. If Max is fighting multiple potential WDC contenders then taking a high-risk approach in wheel-to-wheel racing would hurt him overall. In other words, without a lead, let alone a large one, he'd have to play it reasonably safe to have any chance of keeping the WDC. If it ends up being largely Lando vs Leclerc in 2025 I suspect the dynamics will be rather different.

 

This is all before factoring in that McLaren (team and drivers) will be much better prepared for fighting for victories compared to last year.

Edited by CPR, 03 January 2025 - 23:47.

[jensfan09]

I find it kinda weird how many commentators expect 2025 to be largely a repeat of 2024.

Sure, I don't expect the competitive order to change all that much by the first race, but that alone will produce a very different dynamic - Red Bull (and Max) are unlikely to take an early lead. If Max is fighting multiple potential WDC contenders then taking a high-risk approach in wheel-to-wheel racing would hurt him overall. In other words, without a lead, let alone a large one, he'd have to play it reasonably safe to have any chance of keeping the WDC. If it ends up being largely Lando vs Leclerc in 2025 I suspect the dynamics will be rather different.

This is all before factoring in that McLaren (team and drivers) will be much better prepared for fighting for victories compared to last year.

A lot of respect between Lando and Charles, I think it will be a very fair but tough battle! (Especially compared to Lando vs Max! Lol)

[rodlamas]

Ferrari and Mercedes will be the main challengers.

 

Ferrari have the strongest driver lineup and produced a car that has generally been very competitive.

 

Russell is also a very good driver (underrated in general imo) and writing Mercedes off would be stupid, they seem to be on the rise too.

 

Weirdly I don't expect Red Bull to feature, while they don't go from 'WDC to also rans' in a season, I would say they were largely not competitive by the middle of 2024. With Newey now completely out I don't see why their performance would improve.

The Mclaren line up is definitely better than Ferrari's but I won't lose my time discussing this.

[rodlamas]

I just find it very difficult from any other team producing a better car than the MCL39, but let's first see it on track.

[RPM40]

The Mclaren line up is definitely better than Ferrari's but I won't lose my time discussing this.

 

Assuming that Leclerc and Norris are similar (I personally would rate Leclerc higher but I'll leave that) that means you would consider Oscar Piastri superior to Lewis Hamilton? I don't see how that is defensible, even if Hamilton is past his prime. 

[baddog]

A lot of respect between Lando and Charles, I think it will be a very fair but tough battle! (Especially compared to Lando vs Max! Lol)

 

Will last right up till they are one on one for the big cup I expect..

[kumo7]

I just find it very difficult from any other team producing a better car than the MCL39, but let's first see it on track.

True. this will be an very exciting pre season testing. shame it got very short testing time available. Three days in Bahrain! Am I incorrect?!? Three days!

From here i can say that any team who opt to run 100% brand new chassis for 2025 stands on his back foot. I do think that RedBull will do exactly this, while Ferrari, McLaren will be there with known body parts. I think McLaren will plans to mitigate 100% new mechanical car with known aero, developing it to the new car race by race. what do you think?

This will be the first car Rob Marshall will have had a hand in laying out rather than working within the confines of existing hard points, so I'd suspect some suspension and packaging optimisations, with aero evolved around that.

I think the car is 100% new, but the look of it might be a bit 2024-esque.


having said all these, i might he 100% looking at the incorrect direction as Zak said this ‘risky’ approach… which could mean 100% brand new car from the tip to the toe…

Edited by kumo7, 04 January 2025 - 08:54.

[kumo7]

A lot of respect between Lando and Charles, I think it will be a very fair but tough battle! (Especially compared to Lando vs Max! Lol)

as the teams backing its drivers, McLaren will most likely found equal deals for the both drivers. Ferrari on the contrary has history of the first and the second. In 2024, Charles and Carlos had got nearly equal equipments i think, but, Carlos was the one to be booted with no nothing, making way for Lewus.
got to know what Ferrari is up to between Lewis and Charles.

As of Oscar, it seems he has taken a modest path. Sounded like not saying bold things to the press, …

[CPR]

I just find it very difficult from any other team producing a better car than the MCL39, but let's first see it on track.

 

Given where the MCL38 ended the season I think we have a better chance than any other team of starting fastest, but the margins are very tight.

 

If we say for the sake of example that on an average track that at the end of the 2024 season the MCL38 had a 0.1s advantage over Ferrari, a 0.2s advantage over Red Bull (with Max) and a 0.3s advantage over Mercedes then if the MCL39 is not faster at the start then it'd probably be behind those other cars. Or putting it another way, the MCL39 probably needs to gain about 0.3s by the first race, maybe more, just to stay even. That should be practical even with the current cars being highly optimised to the current regulations but if the team does a particularly poor job or another team does a particularly good job then things could change rather easily. I'd be quite surprised if there's no changes to the pecking order.

 

If the margins stay tight then track layout could change the competitive order quite a bit, like we saw in 2024. Melbourne should be particularly good for us going by the MCL38 so if we're only ahead by 0.1s there I'd actually be a bit worried for the season. Either way it will likely take several races to get a clear understanding of the pecking order.

 

Conversely, Bahrain has seemed like one of our worst circuits, so I won't be panicking if we seem slightly behind in winter testing (which is hard to read anyway).

Edited by CPR, 04 January 2025 - 12:02.

[kumo7]

Given where the MCL38 ended the season I think we have a better chance than any other team of starting fastest, but the margins are very tight.

If we say for the sake of example that on an average track that at the end of the 2024 season the MCL38 had a 0.1s advantage over Ferrari, a 0.2s advantage over Red Bull (with Max) and a 0.3s advantage over Mercedes then if the MCL39 is not faster at the start then it'd probably be behind those other cars. Or putting it another way, the MCL39 probably needs to gain about 0.3s by the first race, maybe more, just to stay even. That should be practical even with the current cars being highly optimised to the current regulations but if the team does a particularly poor job or another team does a particularly good job then things could change rather easily. I'd be quite surprised if there's no changes to the pecking order.

If the margins stay tight then track layout could change the competitive order quite a bit, like we saw in 2024. Melbourne should be particularly good for us going by the MCL38 so if we're only ahead by 0.1s there I'd actually be a bit worried for the season. Either way it will likely take several races to get a clear understanding of the pecking order.

Conversely, Bahrain has seemed like one of our worst circuits, so I won't be panicking if we seem slightly behind in winter testing (which is hard to read anyway).

i can agree that i hope so. but in reality especially at the start of new season, a lot can happen. hope nothing goes wrong.

[Red5ive]

Fingers crossed its a great car out of the box - unlike the last 2 seasons.

 

I am however worried that the loss of the mini-flexi-wing-thingy was a bigger hit than it first appeared.

[CPR]

Yeah, it's not essential to start with the fastest car but it sure helps a lot. In particular it helps the fans stay sane 

[Francesc]

https://www.autospor...0327.1698243713

Talk of taking some risks.

Perfectly doable now, given there’s a solid baseline to build from.

Already they had 100% reliability in races, so that’s amazing.

What do we need to see from the new car?

This reminds me of 2013.

[rodlamas]

This reminds me of 2013.

All the idiots from 2013 are now gone.

[Risil]

I've merged the McLaren team and technical threads -- see this announcement: https://forums.autos...hreads-in-2025/

 

(Apologies Pacificquay)

[Mc_Silver]

I've merged the McLaren team and technical threads -- see this announcement: https://forums.autos...hreads-in-2025/

(Apologies Pacificquay)

Good decision!

[SparkPlug86]

I've merged the McLaren team and technical threads -- see this announcement: https://forums.autos...hreads-in-2025/

 

(Apologies Pacificquay)

 

Ah that's a shame, I prefer two threads - but understand the decision.

 

Can we rename the thread to: 2025 McLaren F1 Thread? All the other ones could follow the same naming process to make it easy.

[Risil]

Can we rename the thread to: 2025 McLaren F1 Thread? All the other ones could follow the same naming process to make it easy.

 

Pacificquay's call really, it's his thread But I can certainly make the change.

[pup]

Thanks, Risil - I think this will be much better.

[GreenMachine]

Bummer.   

 

Can the combined thread be vaccinated against the dreaded fanboiits virus before testing starts ... please?!

[FirstnameLastname]

How long into the season before it gets extra spicy between Norris and Piastri?

[pup]

Bummer. 

 

Can the combined thread be vaccinated against the dreaded fanboiits virus before testing starts ... please?!

 

Seems to have been dealt with quietly towards the end of the season.  I thought both threads were relatively chill for the last handful of races.  So, good job, mods.

Edited by pup, 06 January 2025 - 20:35.

[mclarensmps]

How long into the season before it gets extra spicy between Norris and Piastri?

 

It'll start in this thread before testing begins, I can almost guarantee it!

[kumo7]

any news on 39 yet?

[djparky]

How long into the season before it gets extra spicy between Norris and Piastri?

it depends on whether they are fighting for wins and the title between the 2 of them or not.

if it's like this year they'll get on fine.

however look at Mercedes 2015- 2016 for what may happen