25 replies to this topic

[Henri Greuter]

Got the latest Autocourse  the 2024/25 edition.  (Topic title has a typo)

 

I've read the editors top 10

 

At least one of the names within the top 8 of the top 10 is there because of him having that name and reputation at the expense of a driver who should have made that top 8 with ease.

 

(headshaking)

Edited by Henri Greuter, 29 January 2025 - 20:47.

[DW46]

Whose the top 10??

[Henri Greuter]

Verstappen, Leclerc, Norris, Russell, Sainz, Piastri, Hamilton, Alonso, Hulkenberg, Gasly.

[F1Frog]

The order is debatable but those seem like the obvious top ten to include. Anything else would have been strange.

[Beri]

Gasly is low down..

[Henri Greuter]

Gasly is low down..

 

Take away Brazil and see where Gasly would be then.
As for beig low down, So is Nico. He should have been in the top 8 easily for what he achieved the past season

[Stephane]

Oh no, a top 10 is not agreed on by someone...


Anyway

[Sterzo]

I'd put Verstappen higher than first. In fact my list would be: Verstappen.... oh, some others.

[Anderis]

I still can't figure out which drivers the OP was about. The order is pretty similar to how everybody else rated them.

[PayasYouRace]

OP, I’ve corrected your thread title.

[Henri Greuter]

I still can't figure out which drivers the OP was about. The order is pretty similar to how everybody else rated them.

 

All things combined I think Hulkenberg deserves to be rated above Alonso.

 

The automatic overrating of Alonso at work another time.

[messy]

I was half expecting to see they’d ranked Logan Sargeant seventh or something and left Leclerc off. But it looks pretty reasonable to me.

I agree people have overrated Alonso last season for being Alonso though, generally. He must always appear in every top ten ever because of obviously.

Edited by messy, 30 January 2025 - 08:46.

[kosmos]

This thread says more about the OP dislike for Alonso than the list itself. Funny that he didn't name him in his first post, like Alonso was the boogeyman or something.

[Henri Greuter]

This thread says more about the OP dislike for Alonso than the list itself. Funny that he didn't name him in his first post, like Alonso was the boogeyman or something.

 

 

 

Dislike or not, if he deserves the credit, he gets them from me.

 

But last year compared with Nico and the teams they both drove, I firmly believe that Nico did the better job than Alonso. 

But in the top 10 he was rated 2nd (!) in the year that was supposedly his first goodbye, based on whatever performances that warranted a second place?

So the "being Alonso"  bonus isn't something I made up but has been effective already and as far as I'm concerned, based on the perfomances of last year compared with other drivers was effective another time.

 

BTW: You are of course not biased and your avatar being purely coincidence?

Edited by Henri Greuter, 30 January 2025 - 10:01.

[Anderis]

Hulkenberg is one of my favourite drivers and Alonso is not, so I don't think I'm biased the "wrong" way here but I don't see anything outrageous in rating Alonso over Hulkenberg. Alonso scored 3x the points of his team mate (none of Stroll's previous team mates has ever done that) while Hulkenberg was far from flawless, struggling to beat  Bearman whenever he was the stand in driver, had his share of mistakes and bad weekends (Monza, Brazil, Qatar) etc.

Edited by Anderis, 30 January 2025 - 10:26.

[Henri Greuter]

Hulkenberg is one of my favourite drivers and Alonso is not, so I don't think I'm biased the "wrong" way here but I don't see anything outrageous in rating Alonso over Hulkenberg. Alonso scored 3x the points of his team mate (none of Stroll's previous team mates has ever done that) while Hulkenberg was far from flawless, struggling to beat  Bearman whenever he was the stand in driver, had his share of mistakes and bad weekends (Monza, Brazil, Qatar) etc.

 

I was also thinking about the team factor: being in a well funded one or the limitations Haas was dealing with and the `brains behind it` to develop the car.

 

Nico fooled up on occasion, certainly. But with the lesser car than the AM he had to `overdrive` the car more to gain some of is results than Alonso for his results.

[kosmos]

Dislike or not, if he deserves the credit, he gets them from me.

 

But last year compared with Nico and the teams they both drove, I firmly believe that Nico did the better job than Alonso. 

But in the top 10 he was rated 2nd (!) in the year that was supposedly his first goodbye, based on whatever performances that warranted a second place?

So the "being Alonso"  bonus isn't something I made up but has been effective already and as far as I'm concerned, based on the perfomances of last year compared with other drivers was effective another time.

 

BTW: You are of course not biased and your avatar being purely coincidence?

 

 

The difference is that I don't make threads like this complaining because a driver I don't like or the driver I like is higher or lower in any top. You have an issue with Alonso and everyone knows it or can see it by checking your post history,

 

 

 

 

[PayasYouRace]

I think we’ve got enough to go on to talk about the Autocourse top 10 and whether you agree with it than talking about posters’ histories and motivations.

[Henri Greuter]

The difference is that I don't make threads like this complaining because a driver I don't like or the driver I like is higher or lower in any top. You have an issue with Alonso and everyone knows it or can see it by checking your post history,

 

Ah, we're getting personal.

 

Funny thing about your posts is that you not even dare to discuss the point(s) I brought up  contentswise and only accuse me about my  personal opinion on Alonso.

For what it is worth (probably for you nothing but OK) I think Nico being underrated a more serious disappointment than Alonso being overrated.in the ranking.

And it has nothing to do with how I feel about Alonso. But for a F####Y like you that is of course not to comprehend and if someone was once against your man, he is aways against your man no matter what, be it for reaosns given or not.

 

You accuse me of something you need to point out in words.

While you are way more outspoken in EVERY SINGLE POST you make out here in your opinion about Alonso and no need to look up your post history to know what is very likely your bias.

 

 

 

 

Moderators, please close this thread.  it's becoming personal right now and that was definitely not the intention.

Edited by Henri Greuter, 30 January 2025 - 12:52.

[Anderis]

Nico fooled up on occasion, certainly. But with the lesser car than the AM he had to `overdrive` the car more to gain some of is results than Alonso for his results.

It still doesn't explain how Bearman was able to show up as a stand in and outqualify Hulkenberg 2 out of 2 times and finish ahead of him in Baku. Surely if the car is hard to drive, then a rookie with no regular seat shouldn't be immediately on pace with Hulkenberg.
 

Also Alonso's car hasn't been as competitive as Alonso had hoped either, so I don't see how "overdriving" would be an excuse for one driver and not the other. They didn't race to beat each other specifically, they raced against all other cars and it's the driver's task to stay within the car's limit.

Edited by Anderis, 30 January 2025 - 12:58.

[tyker]

Verstappen, Leclerc, Norris, Russell, Sainz, Piastri, Hamilton, Alonso, Hulkenberg, Gasly.

Very similar to mine, just swap Alonso and Piastri around and the same with Gasly and the Hulk.

[mirrorboy]

Reading the OP, it does look like this thread was created to give a personal opinion on Alonso rather than discussing some magazines' editors top10.

 

Anyway, we all know how these ranking debates end (hint: not good).

[Henri Greuter]

Reading the OP, it does look like this thread was created to give a personal opinion on Alonso rather than discussing some magazines' editors top10.

 

Anyway, we all know how these ranking debates end (hint: not good).

 

 

 

It was not. I was genuinely surprised Hulkenberg being ranked lower than Alonso, no matter what I feel about him.

 

 

But it seems that if you've been negative towards one you're disqualified from then on to post about that driver any longer even if you feel you have reasons and facts you based your conclusions on.

And previous opinions being used to `kill` off the poster in question and avoid a reasonable discussion and try to make a point why he is wrong.

 

 

BTW, for someone who is a member of 10 years or so with only 99 posts: did I touch a very sensitive nerve related with a subject/person that forces you all of a sudden to post?

Interesting

 

 

Moderators, please again my request, close this thread. it's not taken serious anymore and primarily yields personal reactions inspired on emotions related to one driver in particular instead of a discussion about him.

[mirrorboy]

No need to close the topic (or yes, it's not up to me to decide), but no offence intended, all topics and opinions are welcome. 

 

And I do post very little! But I'm a huge fan of this place full of motorsport geeks like myself, so nothing but respect for them and for you Henri.

[rocque]

All things combined I think Hulkenberg deserves to be rated above Alonso.

 

The automatic overrating of Alonso at work another time.

Piastri and (especially) Hamilton are too high in these rankings (I mean 2024 ones).

https://forums.autos...024/?p=10801104

[noikeee]

Almost all of us placed Alonso ahead of Hulkenberg in our ratings in that other top 10 thread, as I did. And I like Hulkenberg and think the current status of Alonso is slightly overrated (he's surely declining).

Basically, it's a strange thing to get annoyed with as it's an almost consensual opinion.

Edited by noikeee, 31 January 2025 - 22:44.