99 replies to this topic

[Macca]

The entry list has now been published

https://www.goodwood...-list-03.04.pdf

There will be a live stream on Youtube, apparently.


Paul M

[sabrejet]

We will be there, soaking up whatever the weather is!

[FastReader]

I'll be there on Sunday. The weather forecast looks okay. Looking forward to it.

[70JesperOH]

I have noticed that qualifying is in fact labeled qualifying for this year! - at least on the YouTube live feed.. (the official name are still official practice).

 

Jesper

Edited by 70JesperOH, 12 April 2025 - 10:33.

[FastReader]

Can anyone explain how they're running an hour behind schedule today?

[BRG]

It was a nice day, so they all stopped for Pimms.

[Gary C]

I got in last night and watched around 4pm UK time (I'm in Nairobi) and hugely enjoyed it, the Dan Gurney Trophy was excellent, looking forward to part 2 today.

[d j fox]

Saw the frenetic and very enjoyable Gordon Spice race... good close racing and no banging and shoving.
To me it looked like a 70s/80 Benelux championship race!
What Id like to know is are the majority of these cars genuine or just reproduced? The announcers only talked about the race " the number 27 car" etc and not about the history.Any comments?

[sabrejet]

Saw the frenetic and very enjoyable Gordon Spice race... good close racing and no banging and shoving.
To me it looked like a 70s/80 Benelux championship race!
What Id like to know is are the majority of these cars genuine or just reproduced? The announcers only talked about the race " the number 27 car" etc and not about the history.Any comments?

 

A mix I think. Last year I spoke with the owner of a Win Percy Trophy car (a leading machine at this year's race) and he told me that his machine was a street car restored as a period racer. It's hardly a surprise since these tin-tops led a 'colourful' life in-period. I'm OK with that and it seems to be the future of historics.

 

I know that a number of D-Types at this year's meeting are also later recreations but having looked at them VERY closely, I can confirm that aside from out-of-sequence chassis numbers you'd never know the difference.

[Colbul1]

I went to the Members Meeting for the first time yesterday and I know the weather for April was majestic, I know the last race was a last to first place spectacular, and the access all areas is just amazing. But, I never thought it would become my favourite event I have ever been to, worth every penny I would say.

[cooper997]

Last year Phil from FML decided to part with a couple of his cars. Advertising locally his Clement and Sunbeam. As usually happens, word spread and the Clement sold internationally and the Sunbeam more recently headed to Qld.

 

The Clement gets loaded for its trip to the Melbourne docks - 17/12/24.

 

 

Destination Goodwood - 13/4/25

Mike Whiteman-Hayward coming to terms with his new beast during Saturday's run. In a note to Phil he shaved 11 seconds off his practice times duriing the Saturday race (after some tinkering).  Then another 5 secs down to 2m 18 on Sunday.

 

Prior to it coming to Australia, Julian Ghosh purchased it at the Brooks auction on Phil's behalf.

 

Long before Goodwood, Phil ran the car at Phillip Island.

 

 

Stephen

 

 

[Philip Whiteman]

I must say I find the 'number' commentary pretty lame. The art of the commentator is to inform and entertain, rather than describe self-evident stuff in the manner of an announcer reading out a bank statement. Good commentators carry a lot of stuff in memory - you'd have thought the new, less experienced ones at Goodwood events would have made, or been provided with some notes that might colour and authority to what they say. 

[john aston]

I was there all weekend and the commentary was excellent. I have no complaints -  and God knows I've endured some awful commentators elsewhere. John Watson was notably good  , often in areas well outside his experience And , as usual , if you were watching the free live stream , then beggars can't really be choosers - it's targetted at people who've paid to be there ,and rightly so. 

Edited by john aston, 14 April 2025 - 16:41.

[wheadon1985]

I was there clerking, that was me doing the starts with the union flag on Sunday. Always one of my favourite events to organise.

[sabrejet]

I'd have to say what we could hear of the commentary sounded very good. MM is one of my favourite meetings of the year and we stayed as long as we could.

[68targa]

I was there all weekend and the commentary was excellent. I have no complaints -  and God knows I've endured some awful commentators elsewhere. John Watson was notably good  , often in areas well outside his experience And , as usual , if you were watching the free live stream , then beggars can't really be choosers - it's targetted at people who've paid to be there ,and rightly so. 

That's the point really - I watched on live stream and had to keep reminding myself that the commentary is for the benefit of circuit spectators.  My apologes to John Watson when I shouted telling him to keep quiet so I could hear the glorious sound from the Lotus 97T demo.

[Doug Nye]

As far as I am concerned Wattie's performance was a revelation... 

 

DCN

Edited by Doug Nye, 14 April 2025 - 19:21.

[sabrejet]

My apologes to John Watson when I shouted telling him to keep quiet so I could hear the glorious sound from the Lotus 97T demo.

 

You didn't miss much; '80s turbo F1 cars weren't renowned for their glorious sound.

[sabrejet]

As far as I am concerned Wattie's performance was a revelation... I have some hopefully interesting photos to share when I get a mo.

 

DCN

 

Agreed: he had some interesting insight into (for example) his experience of Lotus Elites racing at the circuit in its first existence.

[opplock]

As far as I am concerned Wattie's performance was a revelation... I have some hopefully interesting photos to share when I get a mo.

 

DCN

 

I always enjoyed his 1990's F1 commentaries on Eurosport. Unfortunately picture quality was rubbish compared to BBC so I often put up with the trousers on fire alternative.  

[FastReader]

I was there yesterday and I agree that John Watson's addition to the commentary team was a big bonus having enjoyed his work with David Addison on Youtube's GT World Europe commentaries. But whilst Bruce Jones' input was okay, I found Alice Powell's and particularly Ben Edwards' commentaries grated on me. How I yearn for the days of Ian Titchmarsh and Brian Jones - affable, informative and never, ever, shrill, they would knowledgably talk about stuff that you couldn't see or didn't know as well as the race that was going on in front of you. And they would never have referred to "the number 19" (for instance) without also identifying driver and car. 

 

Having said all that, I thought it was one of the best Goodwood events for several years, and when the commentary grated too much I just turned my radio off. 

[Vitesse2]

I always enjoyed his 1990's F1 commentaries on Eurosport. Unfortunately picture quality was rubbish compared to BBC so I often put up with the trousers on fire alternative.  

I used to watch the BBC pictures with the sound muted and listen to Wattie's and Allard Kalff's Eurosport commentary via my stereo using the audio outputs from my satellite box.

[Doug Nye]

One of the finest drives I have ever seen at any Goodwood circuit meeting, both pre- and post-1966, was Frank Stippler's remarkable display in this gorgeous little Ferrari Dino 206SP.  It was even more gorgeous before, late in the race, he clipped the tail of André Lotterer's Ford GT40 under acceleration onto the Lavant Straight, but the latter apologised to him subsequently, explaining that he had missed an up-change which was why his car had abruptly hesitated, just catching his fellow German by surprise.  

 

But in the circumstances - and after such an extraordinary drive - what's a mere dent between friends. Incidentally, there wasn't a mark on the GT40's tail - relatively flexible moulding (and two hefty exhaust tail-pipes) v. fragile aluminium.

 

 

Photo: GPL

 

DCN

[DouglasM]

The event was streamed on a WeChat channel here in Guangzhou, China. The commentary was by two lovely lads sitting in a pokey studio and watching the same as me. I helped out by sending messages like 'The brown car is a Reliant Sabre', 'The green car is a Lotus Elite', 'SWB means short wheelbase', 'FHC means Fixed Head Coupe', etc.

They were in awe of cars power sliding through corners. Here the saloon car racers look like they're on rails.

The Edwardian racers were just beyond them!  

[john aston]

The 206S was my car of the meeting - it was the first racing Ferrari I'd ever seen (Oulton Park TT 1968) , it looked achingly lovely and the sight and sound of being driven on the limit at Madgwick reduced me embarrassingly close to tears. 

 

Re 80s F1 turbo noise , I actually thought they sounded bloody good  in period ,with the Honda and Renault V6 making a very sonorous howl . Not so the Brabham - it might have had its prodigious power but it sounded very dull , making an industrial drone   

[P.Dron]

The Arundell Cup (Formula Junior) was excellent - very close racing from flag to flag. Unfortunately it seems that there is no video available of the full race, certainly not in the Goodwood website.. 

[2F-001]

It was all quite marvellous.

[BRG]

It was all quite marvellous.

A very Goodwoody comment!

 

And weren't those the last words of someone famous?

[FastReader]

The Arundell Cup (Formula Junior) was excellent - very close racing from flag to flag. Unfortunately it seems that there is no video available of the full race, certainly not in the Goodwood website.. 

It was a great race but a shame to find out later that Calum Grant received a 10 second penalty dropping him from 3rd to 4th. Does anyone know what the penalty was for?

[Ralf Pickel]

On that same topic - anybody knows why both Aston DB4GT have been disqualified in the Moss Trophy?
It was strange anyway, DBs never have been that quick before and had a chance for a top spot.
And one has a Newey connection…..

Edited by Ralf Pickel, 15 April 2025 - 09:38.

[2F-001]

It was a great race but a shame to find out later that Calum Grant received a 10 second penalty dropping him from 3rd to 4th. Does anyone know what the penalty was for?

'Contact with the chicane', I was told. There were two or three penalties like that over the weekend; I think Lotterer received one in the VW Golf.

[2F-001]

On that same topic - anybody knows why both Aston DB4GT have been disqualified in the Moss Trophy?
It was strange anyway, DBs never have been that quick before and had a chance for a top spot.
And one has a Newey connection…..

If my reading of the MSA blue book and notes on TSL is correct it was Eligibility matter (rather than a Conduct one), but the regs quoted relate to an Appeal (rather than the offence) which might be something yet to be heard and above the heads of the Stewards. Beyond that... no idea! 

[Myhinpaa]

One of the finest drives I have ever seen at any Goodwood circuit meeting, both pre- and post-1966, was Frank Stippler's remarkable display in this gorgeous little Ferrari Dino 206SP.  It was even more gorgeous before, late in the race, he clipped the tail of André Lotterer's Ford GT40 under acceleration onto the Lavant Straight, but the latter apologised to him subsequently, explaining that he had missed an up-change which was why his car had abruptly hesitated, just catching his fellow German by surprise.  

 

But in the circumstances - and after such an extraordinary drive - what's a mere dent between friends. Incidentally, there wasn't a mark on the GT40's tail - relatively flexible moulding (and two hefty exhaust tail-pipes) v. fragile aluminium.

 

 

DCN

 

Anyone have any idea which one of the 18 (or less) Dino 206S this is? (From 002 to 032)

 

Judging by claims of "over 300 horsepower" it must for sure have a Tipo 233S F1 spec. engine fitted?

[sabrejet]

On that same topic - anybody knows why both Aston DB4GT have been disqualified in the Moss Trophy?
It was strange anyway, DBs never have been that quick before and had a chance for a top spot.
And one has a Newey connection…..

 

There was a disqualification in another race for post-event weight and it's possible that's the case here, though I can't recall seeing cars being weighed at any time. 

[2F-001]

There was a disqualification in another race for post-event weight ...

That was Rob Huff's Capri, was it? (Gordon Spice Trophy, part 1?)

[sabrejet]

That was Rob Huff's Capri, was it? (Gordon Spice Trophy, part 1?)

 

Sounds about right; I know it was a tin-top.

[wheadon1985]

All the judicial paperwork can be found on the online noticeboard - https://www.barc.net...ng-april-12-13/

[wheadon1985]

There was a disqualification in another race for post-event weight and it's possible that's the case here, though I can't recall seeing cars being weighed at any time.

Cars are checked for weight, we have Neil Trundle doing it for us at Goodwood these days.

[Ralf Pickel]

All the judicial paperwork can be found on the online noticeboard - https://www.barc.net...ng-april-12-13/

Thank you - that is very interesting.

[Adrian Beese]

I just watched the Salvatori cup on YouTube. I was surprised by the driving standards of some of the back markers and midfield runners when being lapped by the two leaders. Either blue flags were not being waved sufficiently (unlikely) or not being obeyed. This could have had an effect on the result especially on the last lap.

[Thundersports]

A very Goodwoody comment!

 

And weren't those the last words of someone famous?

John Le Mesurier

[Doug Nye]

Anyone have any idea which one of the 18 (or less) Dino 206S this is? (From 002 to 032)

 

Judging by claims of "over 300 horsepower" it must for sure have a Tipo 233S F1 spec. engine fitted?

 

I believe it is Andreas Mohringer's ex-works initially 166P, ex-Scarfiotti 206SP Montagna Spider, ex-Scuderia Nettuno Leandro Terra car '0834' - finally relinquished into the Historic racing world by Terra only as recently as 1997 - then Harry Leventis, and on to Mohringer around 2012-13.  Emphasis upon "I believe"...   - SORRY!!! CORRECTION - UTTER GARBAGE 

 

Car was actually owned and entered by Arnold Meier of Zurich - chassis '028' ex-Edoardo Lualdi-Gabardi, the 'gentleman' hill-climber from suitably-named Busto Arsizio, Milan.  The car is prepared by Thomas Schnitzler's Edi Wyss Engineering AG of Hermatswil, Switzerland.  And it is powered by a 2.4-litre 4-valve per cylinder 'Tasman' Dino V6 engine.  After Lualdi 1966-69 the car was re-worked by the factory with 312PB-like Guglielminetti bodywork and sold into eventual US 'Vintage' scene ownership. Back to Europe and restored to near original body by Brandoli c.2018. 

 

In Frank Stippler's hands it certainly owned Goodwood on Saturday afternoon. 

 

DCN

Edited by Doug Nye, 27 April 2025 - 17:53.

[7MGTEsup]

I always enjoyed his 1990's F1 commentaries on Eurosport. Unfortunately picture quality was rubbish compared to BBC so I often put up with the trousers on fire alternative.  

 

Once James Hunt was gone I preferred the John Watson, Ben Edwards combo to the Murray *I'm very much mistaken* Walker BBC version.

[BRG]

John Watson is an under-rated commentator, just as he was a very under-rated racing driver.

[Catalina Park]

On that same topic - anybody knows why both Aston DB4GT have been disqualified in the Moss Trophy?
It was strange anyway, DBs never have been that quick before and had a chance for a top spot.
And one has a Newey connection…..

From reading the stewards notes it appears that the wrong exhaust manifold was bolted to an oversized engine, on both cars.

[Ralf Pickel]

From reading the stewards notes it appears that the wrong exhaust manifold was bolted to an oversized engine, on both cars.

Just a slight mishap - could happen to anybody...

[Andrew Stevens]

I gather it was only a slight 'over capacity' issue. Merely the accidental fitting of a 4.7l engine against the original 3.7l ones... A mistake anyone could make!

 

Are DB4 GTs nowadays allowed to run larger/wider tyres? Wasn't that an issue with them in period after a homologation mistake? 

 

Oh and do Lotus Cortinas run Watts Linkages?  It appeared that car 711 had one which may have contributed to it's success? 

[john aston]

I won't lose any sleep . Goodwood is a fantastic ,  absurdly enjoyable pantomime and not a recreation. No championships are involved but some of the world's best drivers are. .  I dare say I'd think differently if I were a racer , but from a punter's perspective all I'll say is that the two DB4GTs looked and sounded bloody wonderful as they were drifted around Madgwick. 

[sabrejet]

Agreed in full. I hope to be there again next year. 

[JonnyA]

The comments above regarding the Dino appear to explain how an obstensibly 2-litre car could run with GT40s in a straight line.