132 replies to this topic

[Megatron]

Remember the 76 that Chapman tried to replace the 72 with? I think they ran it in 1974. What was wrong with the car that it failed so bad they had to resort back to a late 1969 design?

[David M. Kane]

I'm not sure if it was not stiff enough or just didn't create enough downforce. In essence, it was not very fast out of the box and show little potential for development...so they went back to square. Perhaps someone else's memory is better than mine. It looked good!

[Vitesse2]

This quote from Doug Nye's Autocourse History 1966-91 probably says it all!!!

Colin [Chapman] told me: 'When we got the 76s their systems didn't work - fuel, oil, cooling and brakes didn't work, and the steering wasn't very good. Nothing very serious [!!!!] ... halfway through the programme neither Ronnie nor Ickx would drive them and then we put one on the scales and it weighed the same as the old 72! Its rear hubs were cracking and I had this terrible fear of a wheel coming off. I just couldn't live with that so I said to Ralph [Bellamy], "Look, there's no point in sorting it all out; if we do, all we've got is a car the same weight as the 72 with fifty new problems ..."

[LittleChris]

Didn't it have 2 clutch pedals ?

[Vitesse2]

Actually, it had the first electronic clutch, as well as a normal clutch pedal - the clutch could be operated with a button on the gear lever, but only when the car was moving.

Apparently Ronnie liked it but it didn't work very well, so they scrapped it ... one of those examples of Chunky's ideas being ahead of the technology I suppose.

[FLB]

Its last race was at Watkins Glen in 1974, when Tim Schenken took the start despite not having qualified. He was subsequently disqualified.

An appropriate ending for the design.

[carlos.maza]

LittleChris:

It had two brake pedals and one clutch pedal, which was suposed to be used only in the starts.
It also had the electronic clutch Vitesse2 mentions.

[stavelot]

Originally posted by Vitesse2
This quote from Doug Nye's Autocourse History 1966-91 probably says it all!!!

"Look, there's no point in sorting it all out; if we do, all we've got is a car the same weight as the 72 with fifty new problems ..."

Did Jacky Ickx and Ronnie Peterson lead with this car in South African or Spain Grand Prix this year, didn't he?

[Vitesse2]

Indeed: Ronnie led in Spain, in the wet, thanks to a superb start. However, he lost the lead when he changed tyres and the engine blew up a few laps later when it lost all its water.

But, of course, leading a race and winning it are two different things: [cliche mode] to finish first, first you must finish [/cliche mode]

Two races later, the 76s had been temporarily abandoned and Ronnie won Monaco in a 72E ...

Late season, Chapman grafted the back end of the 72 onto the 76 but it still didn't work. If even Chunky gave up on it, it must have been a dog!

[stavelot]

Two races later, the 76s had been temporarily abandoned and Ronnie won Monaco in a 72E ...

Late season, Chapman grafted the back end of the 72 onto the 76 but it still didn't work. If even Chunky gave up on it, it must have been a dog! [/B][/QUOTE]

I remember at the '79. It was very similar thing.

Andretti (WC) preferred the new Lotus 80 (fully wing car). His team mate Reutemann worked on the old 79 again.

What happened?

No win, Reutemann got very strong in the first half but lost rapidly in the second half of the saison because of the unreliability of the good old 79 (broken suspension, drive shaft, brakes etc).

Andretti tried with the 80, gave it up and draw again with the 79 without success.

[bobbo]

Duh . . .

Dumb question: When did Uncle Chappie get the nickname "Chunky?" Never heard THAT one before TNF.

Bobbo

[William Dale Jr]

I remember reading somewhere that the dual brake pedal setup was to allow the drivers to either left or right foot brake without interefering with the steeing column. Is this right?

[carlos.maza]

William Dale Jr:

I think you are right, as the dual brake pedal was actually one pedal with a "Y" shape and the steering column in the middle.

[FLB]

Originally posted by bobbo
Duh . . .

Dumb question: When did Uncle Chappie get the nickname "Chunky?" Never heard THAT one before TNF.

Bobbo

Because he was a little on the chubby side. He was very concious of his weight, but hid it quite well.

It was a nickname given to him by a Lotus mechanic (Dave Lazenby IIRC).

[Yelnats]

I knew a guy in collage with the knick-name "Chunky". But I always thought it was bestowed on him because of the qualities of his leavings from a heavy booze session,.


Apparently he didn't chew his food very well or had very slow digestion!

[Vilcornell]

Hi all,

I can't find stuff about this car, maybe someone can help..... was is numbered 74? Was it really a rubbish car? Ronnie qualified 2nd in Spain with this or 72?
I havn't seen recentlya pic of it, but I seem to remember a strange rear wing, at least in the press release days; what kind of shape did this car has? Wich other drivers drove it? Any stories about it?

thanks

[Ray Bell]

Can't have been too bad... it was the 72 by the way...

It won races between 1970 and 1974... that's not to be sneezed at.

[st59cz]

It was Lotus 76 or JPS (Mk I)...

[Vitesse2]

It wasn't the 74, it was the 76 alias the John Player Special (the 74 was the Texaco Star F2 car). I think you'll find this thread will answer some of your questions:

http://www.atlasf1.c...&threadid=38836

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by st59cz
It was Lotus 76 or JPS (Mk I)...

Hampered by a lack of proper reference material, I checked Racing Car News...

The cars are merely described as JPS... which could mean anything... but the photo of Peterson two races later (Monaco, which he won) is in a 72... now I see they reverted to the 72 after the 76 proved hard to get into competitive race trim.

Wouldn't the 76 be the JPS Mk 2, by the way?

[MrAerodynamicist]

Originally posted by Vilcornell
I havn't seen recentlya pic of it, but I seem to remember a strange rear wing, at least in the press release days; what kind of shape did this car has?

You mean this...?

http://members.aol.c...odwood/100-.jpg

As taken at this years Goodwood FoS.

[Vilcornell]

Many thanks, also for the photo; ........anyway it look great; I have had a Politoys slot car in childhood, that's why i had in mind that kind of rear wings.

I'm going to read 38836 thread

[Eric McLoughlin]

The 76 had some innovative features (when did a Lotus not have innovative features?) such as a semi-automatic clutch and gearbox and two pedal operation. The only problem was that it didn't work too well and so the team reverted to the trusty 72 for most of the 74 season.

[Allen Brown]

Race results of the Lotus 76

[stuartbrs]

Wouldn't the 76 be the JPS Mk 2, by the way?

The 78 is the MkIII according to the big Tamiya box I have....

Would that make the 77 ( one of the most pretty Lotus cars IMO ) the Mk2? And was this the first case of a sponsor name being used as the designation of a car?

[WGD706]

After four very successful seasons with the 72,Chapman decided to start a new technical revolution;together with former McLaren and Brabham designer Ralph Bellamy he created the Mk76 for the 1974 season.
The 76 had got the revised aerodynamics of the Mk72 and the brake discs of the front axle remained inside the bodywork. For the first time, a double rear wing was used for better downforce. The Mk76 also had got a semi-automatic gearbox, the clutch pedal only was used for the start or leaving the pits. On the knob of the gearshift a button had been installed to activate the clutch the electronic-magnetic way, when touched with the right hand for changing gears. For the choice of left foot braking, four pedals were installed. On the right there was the gas pedal followed by two brake ones in the middle and on the left side there was the conventional clutch pedal.
In the first two rounds in Argentina and Brazil, the 72D had been driven both by Ronnie Peterson and Jacky Ickx, bringing the Mk76 to it´s debut at the third round of the 1974 season, the South African Grand Prix at Kyalami. This first outing was connected with a lot of troubles, making the drivers only qualify 10th (Ickx) and 16th (Peterson) on the grid to get both of them retired.
The next round, the Spanish Grand Prix at Jarama, looked a lot more promising. Peterson qualified 2nd, Ickx 5th, and both drivers were able to be in the lead temporarily. But it became clear very soon, that the Mk76 did not only have an aerodynamic problem, but also immense troubles with it´s reliabilty.
For this reason JPS/Lotus decided to return to the Mk72 for the 6th round of the championship, the Grand Prix of Monaco, and they developed an E-version of it very quickly. Peterson won that round, Ickx scored the 8th place.
The same time Chapman and Bellamy produced a B-version of the Mk76. That had a big, single rear wing, new long side pods reaching until the front axle with modified radiators for better weight balance and a flat nose section very similar to that of the 72. This revised models were used as the team´s spare cars from the Dutch Grand Prix at Zandvoort on.
But both drivers were not very happy about the cars in general, and so they preferred driving their old 72Es, Peterson won two further races, France and Italy. They used the 76 only three more times, giving Peterson a remarkable 4th place at the German Grand Prix at the very demanding Nuerburgring-Nordschleife. The last race of the Mk76 was the United States Grand Prix at Watkins Glen with Tim Schenken as the team´s temporary third driver, where the Australian was disqualified. Then John Player Team Lotus relied on the Mk72 for another season for 1975, it´s 6th overall.
Somewhere I read that a mechanic had told Chapman that he saw Ickx's car popping wheelies (front end going almost 3 feet in the air) when starting out, but Chapman wouldn't believe it until he saw it with his own eyes, which he did...then promptly put some more weight in the front end. I'm not sure if this was the old 72 or the 76.

[Vilcornell]

...really really exaustive

does 76 have something to do with Ronnie departures from the team in 1976?

[Eric McLoughlin]

The comments on whether the Lotus 76 should be designated "JPS Mk. II" is interesting. In John Tipler's book "Caterham Sevens - Racers for the Road", he recalls his time as a member of the Lotus PR team in the mid 70s. He says that, at that time, Chapman was very sensitive about his funding from Imperial Tobacco and was insistent that the cars be called John Player Specials. Anybody caught calling them Lotuses in a PR context was apt to receive a tongue lashing (or worse) from the boss.

[DOHC]

WGD706 --

In the first two rounds in Argentina and Brazil, the 72D had been driven both by Ronnie Peterson and Jacky Ickx, - - - For this reason JPS/Lotus decided to return to the Mk72 for the 6th round of the championship, the Grand Prix of Monaco, and they developed an E-version of it very quickly.

I think that the designation 72D and 72E differs in different places. I recall that the 72 used in 1973 was generaly called 72D, but during that season, IIRC early on, there were some regulation changes that implied improved (side?) impact requirements. This led, again IIRC, to the development of the 72E, which was characterized by its sidepods' front end being smoothly attached to the tub. And that was the way the car looked in May 1973. Is there anyone who has definite information on the meaning of the designations 72D and 72E?

The same time Chapman and Bellamy produced a B-version of the Mk76. That had a big, single rear wing, new long side pods reaching until the front axle with modified radiators for better weight balance and a flat nose section very similar to that of the 72. This revised models were used as the team´s spare cars from the Dutch Grand Prix at Zandvoort on.

Most of that revision of the 76 was in place already at the Swedish Grand Prix at Anderstorp in June 1974. But the long sidepods were optional. Peterson ran the 76 in practice for that race, just as he did at several other meetings, including Monza, as mentioned in the other thread. At Anderstorp, he used the original sidepods in one practice run and the long sidepods in another. The rear wing was a single unit though, as on the 72.

Originally posted by Vilcornell
does 76 have something to do with Ronnie departures from the team in 1976?

Probably. The 72 was too old to be a real contender, and a promising new Lotus was not yet in sight.

[2F-001]

Did the cigarette ''John Player Special'' pre-date the begining of the Team Lotus sponsorship by much? It seems amazingly fortuitous that the brand well fitted its dual role of product name and the car 'name' (in the largely new-world sponsored style). The product wasn't launched with the sponsorship deal in mind was it?

As a pre-teen of sheltered childhood, I had become accustomed to the red/gold/white GLTL livery long before I understood where the colours came from! I think the only fag-packets I'd seen were my Aunt's 'Park Drives' (plain white with a little ornate lettering) and I hadn't grasped the nature of the marketing - I guess I just thought it was someone's idea of a pretty colour-scheme...

[DOHC]

Originally posted by 2F-001
Did the cigarette ''John Player Special'' pre-date the begining of the Team Lotus sponsorship by much? It seems amazingly fortuitous that the brand well fitted its dual role of product name and the car 'name' (in the largely new-world sponsored style). The product wasn't launched with the sponsorship deal in mind was it?

I'm not sure but IIRC the market introduction of the cigarette coincided with and relied on Team Lotus changing their livery to the classical back and gold.

[Don Capps]

The chassis plate of the Duncan Dayton JPS Lotus at Indianapolis simply states: 'JPS 22'

[David Beard]

This is the 76 at the 1974 Silverstone International Trophy, I think. Sorry about all the grobblies on the neg.

Few F1 cars have been made to look better when modified from the original concept (for example the McLaren M23 was progressively messed up, aesthetically). I think the 76, however, was prettier in later long radiator pod form.

[dbltop]

Here are some pictures of the Lotus 76 that ran in the historic race in Montreal. I guess it was dubbed the "Juan Valdez Special" because of the ban on tobacco advertising. It was driven by Art Valdez. The Lotus 79 present was liveried as the Bert Skidmore Special,and the McLaren M30 was also missing any Marlboro markings.



This beautiful car had a double rear wing.



And it had an amazing V-shaped brake pedal, with the steering column above the notch of the V. I guess to enable left or right foot braking without tangling on the column.



And a large fire extinguisher bottle in the cockpit. Was this original equipment or was it added on after. Just another reason to hope for no fire, I can't emagine that thing going off where it's located!

[DOHC]

It was common in those days to have the fire extinguisher located in that spot. More or less standard.

[Twin Window]

I think the '74 British GP was the last appearance in the UK for the Type 76. Here it is looking rather unloved at that race.



As you can see, it had undergone quite a lot of modification by then! Interesting that the current owners have restored it into it's original spec as it didn't race like that more than a couple of times. Actually, it didn't race much more than a couple of times - period!

Didn't David Render buy it for sprints and stufF? I'm sure I saw him in it at Curborough a year or two later...

TW

[RTH]

Warecrete boss , David Render had a 76 (and others) on loan from his friend Colin Chapman for hillclimbs & sprints.

The 4 pedal arrangement in the cars original launch guise was because it was equiped with an electro -hydraulic clutch built in to the top of the gear knob and it was expected drivers could then left foot brake to advantage, I seem to remember it was Ronnie who didn't like doing this and needed a brake pedal in the usual place, like all these early systems (Colin Chapman was always keen on these mechanised cluch/gearchange ideas ) it was not a success and discarded, the car gradually reverted back to being more like a 72, in fact I seem to remember 72/9 was built AFTER the 76's !

[Megatron]

I think the feeling was that the 76 was almost as quick as the 72number whatever at the time but had a load of problems. It came down to as qucik with probelms or as quick with no problems.

[Megatron]

What are they gonna do for Marlboro on the historics? Stick "Yarhbrough" on the car and hire Cale to drive it?

[Twin Window]

Originally posted by RTH
...it was equiped with an electro -hydraulic clutch built in to the top of the gear knob...

Ah yes, just like the NSU Ro 80 - talk about a car too far ahead of it's time! Trick semi-automatic gearchange and a Wankel engine!

TW

[RTH]

Originally posted by Twin Window


Ah yes, just like the NSU Ro 80 - talk about a car too far ahead of it's time! Trick semi-automatic gearchange and a Wankel engine!

TW

Quite right, I remember driving one in '73 it was extraordinary, in fact if you look at one now the styling could be current.

Good though I believe the Mazda RX8 is , it still can only manage 18 mpg in real world driving and needs a litre of oil every other tank fill up - 30 years later !

[petefenelon]

Originally posted by Megatron
I think the feeling was that the 76 was almost as quick as the 72number whatever at the time but had a load of problems. It came down to as qucik with probelms or as quick with no problems.

One of the problems was that the 76 was meant to be a "lighter 72" - inevitably the 72 had grown a bit warty over the years and was somewhat over its ideal fighting weight by '74 - but when it appeared it was something like 100lbs heavier, wasn't it?

[Vitesse2]

A previous discussion of the Lotus 76 ....

http://forums.atlasf...&threadid=38836

[Geza Sury]

Is this the same car? (Picture posted originally in this thread.)

[RTH]

Looks very much like it, its definitely a 76 at the Goodwood hillclimb in a Ronnie look-a-like helmet

[Twin Window]

Both the 76s made still exist; one in the UK and one in the States. The UK one is the first chassis and was used by Peterson and Schenken retiring on every occasion. I suspect that will be the Goodwood one. The US one was used by only by Ickx, except for the '74 German GP where ironically Peterson took it to 4th. That was the only GP finish for a 76, never mind points! I reckon that'll be the one in Montreal. Which one it was that I photographed at Brands I have no idea, just that it was the spare for Mad Ronald.

And yes - what a huge difference it makes when the driver actually fits in the car and wears a half-decent replica of the original driver's helmet.

TW

[Geza Sury]

Originally posted by Twin Window
Both the 76s made still exist; one in the UK and one in the States. The UK one is the first chassis and was used by Peterson and Schenken retiring on every occasion. I suspect that will be the Goodwood one. The US one was used by only by Ickx, except for the '74 German GP where ironically Peterson took it to 4th. That was the only GP finish for a 76, never mind points!

Spot on, TW. Just take a look at those two links: Lotus 76/1 JPS9, Lotus 76/2 JPS10

[Rob Ryder]

TW
The spare at Brands carrying No.31 would be the second chassis (a.k.a. JPS10 )

[Ruairidh]

Originally posted by petefenelon


One of the problems was that the 76 was meant to be a "lighter 72" - inevitably the 72 had grown a bit warty over the years and was somewhat over its ideal fighting weight by '74 - but when it appeared it was something like 100lbs heavier, wasn't it?

Yes.

Despite its lack of success, I still have a lot of affection for this car, am I the only one who thinks it was, in its original form, very pretty?

[Twin Window]

Originally posted by Rob Ryder
TW
The spare at Brands carrying No.31 would be the second chassis (a.k.a. JPS10 )

Ah, thank you Rob. I take it the thumbs-down mean you didn't like the car!

TW