37 replies to this topic

[WDC]

Michael Schumacher regarded as a foreigner without income by Swiss government

Unlike most of the other F1 drivers who reside in Monaco, Michael Schumacher's permanent residence is in Switzerland in the Vufflens-le-Chateau village.

ESPN reported on Wednesday that the Swiss government regards Schumacher as a foreigner without income and as such tax him on the basis of his expenses rather than his income.

A German daily estimated that based on Swiss law, Michael Schumacher must pay in the region of $980 000 in taxes a year, far less than he would anywhere else if he was taxed on his income.

[BRG]

Thank heavens for this, poor Michael is a bit hard-up after all, especially with a wife and family to support. Perhaps we should have a whip-round for him?

[Clatter]

Originally posted by BRG
Thank heavens for this, poor Michael is a bit hard-up after all, especially with a wife and family to support. Perhaps we should have a whip-round for him?

[Hooster]

"Coulthard 2001, Montoya 2002, Pizzonia 2003..."

Coulthard perhaps, Montoya no way and who is this Pizza guy?

Sorry to go off topic, but I don't feel like starting a new thread about this.

[Nikolas Garth]

Originally posted by Hooster
"Coulthard 2001, Montoya 2002, Pizzonia 2003..."

Coulthard perhaps, Montoya no way and who is this Pizza guy?

Sorry to go off topic, but I don't feel like starting a new thread about this.

I answered this question in another thread.

Clearly BRG is predicting who will finish 2nd in the WDC, in those years.

[BRG]

Dream on , guys!

[Rich]

Heh, if the Swiss government don't know what Michael earns, or if he has clever accountants, more power to him. If I was in the same position as MS, I'd be happy to pay that amount of tax. And you would too.

[MN]

So, MS has been using German national anthem and flag without even paying tax?;)

[tifosi]

Just wondering, how many F1 drivers, if any, actually reside in their 'home' country.

[bis2501]

Originally posted by tifosi
Just wondering, how many F1 drivers, if any, actually reside in their 'home' country.

If I'm not mistaken; Olivier Panis (France), De La Rosa in Barcelona and Tarso Marques (Italy?)... can't recall any other drivers.

[Ali_G]

Eddie irvine: Dublin.

Niall

[tifosi]

That's more than I thought actually. Does Eddie Irvine really officially reside in Dublin. I thought all of Great Britain had extremely high tax rates, like 90% at the top levels, or is Ireland different. (Not trying to set off any political wars here!)

de la Rosa and Marques probably don't make enough money to move yet. Panis is surprising though.

[gray_cat]

Originally posted by tifosi
That's more than I thought actually. Does Eddie Irvine really officially reside in Dublin. I thought all of Great Britain had extremely high tax rates, like 90% at the top levels, or is Ireland different.

The fact that Damon Hill resides in Ireland (Dublin, I think) shows that Ireland is different

[Ricardo F1]

England, last I checked, was 40% in the top bracket. Pretty much the same as the US when you include Fed and State tax. Everyone lives in Monaco because they don't have income tax.

[revvhead]

Hey all the guys run the ragged edge and put their lives on the line. If i did the same i really wouldnt be happy if more than half of what i earned had to be paid as tax. Sure, tax me some amount but to take more than half of one's earnings doesnt seem fair to me.
Other sports persons do the same : Boris Becker for example

[tifosi]

Maybe the 90% thing was awhile ago. I remember Ian Anderson of Jethro Tull saying he didn't understand all these rock stars leaving England because even after taking 90% he had more money than he could ever live on.

But for F1 I guess Monaco is number 1 because of no taxes. A lot of Rock Stars, particulary from Europe have their official residence in the Carribean for the same reason, no taxes. Heck at least Schumacher does pay a little bit.

[gray_cat]

Originally posted by tifosi
Heck at least Schumacher does pay a little bit.

$980,000.00 in taxes per year must be more than combined tax return of all the BB members so MS does indeed pay a little bit

[Ricardo F1]

tifosi - England has never had a 90% tax bracket. Never ever ever.

[Dudley]

and Tarso Marques (Italy?)... can't recall any other drivers.

He's brazilian

I thought all of Great Britain had extremely high tax rates, like 90% at the top levels, or is Ireland different.

The top UK rate of tax is 40% and has been so for AT LEAST 10 years. IT hit a silly amount for income over £100k a year during the incompetant labour government of 1974-1979.

[prettyface]

Originally posted by tifosi
Maybe the 90% thing was awhile ago. I remember Ian Anderson of Jethro Tull saying he didn't understand all these rock stars leaving England because even after taking 90% he had more money than he could ever live on.

That's because he owns a salmon plant in Scotland.

[george baird]

Foreigner try Alien.

[Mischa]

In the original German report (cant remember where) they mentioned one peculiar little thing. When Schumacher fills in his tax return/residence form he has to complete a little section that asks for his occupation. So, he puts down 'racing driver'. However, there are no motorracing circuits in Switzerland which means he is unable to practise his profession in this lovely country. Therefore, logically, he is classed as 'foreigner without income'. That is why his tax is calculated on the basis of his expenditure in Switzerland.

[baddog]

Originally posted by tifosi
Maybe the 90% thing was awhile ago. I remember Ian Anderson of Jethro Tull saying he didn't understand all these rock stars leaving England because even after taking 90% he had more money than he could ever live on.

But for F1 I guess Monaco is number 1 because of no taxes. A lot of Rock Stars, particulary from Europe have their official residence in the Carribean for the same reason, no taxes. Heck at least Schumacher does pay a little bit.

tifosi.. you are clearly very very old.. that 'while ago' is like over 20 years you old duffer!;)

Shaun

[Ali_G]

I'm borde.

So name the only set of countries in which if a person from one to the other, he or she is not considered foreigh or an alien by law.

Niall

[Rich]

Interesting point about the 'occupation' thing, Mischa. Did the article explain how Michael circumvents having to declare his income from product endorsements and merchandising?

[Mischa]

No, Rich, of course not. It was only a short article, and more of a chuckle at the absurdity of it all, rather than deep research into his financial, and very private, affairs.

However, right now, the Germans, politicians and all, are getting very worked up over some remarks Ralf made re German tax system, comparing it to a 'law of the jungle' and giving this as one of the reasons for settling in the, for him, more tax-friendly Austria.

[312 PB]

one could logically conclude that endorsements and merchandising are tangentially if not directly associated with his profession

[HP]

You need to see the entire picture. Living in Switzerland is more expensive than in Germany. That's noticeable when you know that many Swiss people living near to the German border, go shopping in Germany, except for gasoline, where many Germans come to Switzerland. Add to it that the Swiss franc is of higher value than the German Mark. So for Swiss people daily necities are cheaper to buy in Germany. And the Euro € won't change that.

Also you need to know that the German government launched a lawsuit against former tennis star Boris Becker. His father who was manager, was convicted, and if I remember correctly was even put to jail (Or was he was released on bail). Anyway that's something that hardly ever happens in other European countries, and for sure not in Switzerland, because tax evasion is not a crime that will put you in jail. The EU is giving Switzerland a lot of pressure on this issue, but so far we have remained stubborn, thanks to our way of democracy.

And for MS taxes, well he is as smart as many other rich people, and Switzerland is smart to apply laws that entices rich people to live there, instead of pushing them out.

[Zoe]

HP: The lawsuit was launched against a father of a German tennis star, however it was Peter Graf, father of Stefanie Graf, not Bum-bum-Boris' dad.

Otherwise your summary of the tax situation pretty much brings it to the point.

Zoe

[HP]

Originally posted by Zoe
HP: The lawsuit was launched against a father of a German tennis star, however it was Peter Graf, father of Stefanie Graf, not Bum-bum-Boris' dad.

Otherwise your summary of the tax situation pretty much brings it to the point.

Zoe

Thanks, how could I mix up those two

[AgRacer]

One thing you may consider, is how much tax does he pay in other countries? He basically works in England, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, etc... where ever the GPs are taking place.

I don't know how it works in Europe, but in the US, if you work in many states (say you're a salesmen, or something) you have to declare income in each state that has an income tax. So, say I work in Kansas for a few day, Missouri, Oklahoma, then many Illinois, Technically, since all those states have a state income tax, I'd have to file any income I made in each of those states and pay some form of taxes on it, depending on state laws (no, you don't get taxed twice in each state, only for the income you made in that particular state).

Do other countries work the same way? If you work in a country for three days (over a GP weekend) would you have to pay tax in that country for 3-days of your salary? For the mechanics they may not even bother simply because the amount would be so small, but for someone who makes 30m, I would think the local gov. would pay attention. Or maybe, they say he's just a visitor since it's only 3-days. Be he does spend a lot of time in Italy, and the UK.

Of course, I could be way off on all this....

[Nomad]

The tax laws in the Uk have probably changed since but it used to be if you spent more than 40 days a year in the UK then you were liable for tax (this I think was only for British Citizens) I think this was reduced to 20 a few years back which resulted in the Rolling Stones cancelling some of their UK dates to avoid going over the limit.
I can't remember the rules for non-British Citizens.
I also know of an extremely rich person who was advised to fly to Portugal on the night of the Chancellors budget to avoid capital gains tax.
Other strategies include creating an offshore company and receiving dividends instead of earnings. Anyone can have their bank branch in the channel islands and then internet bank to avoid tax. It's pretty easy really.

[Elvis]

I thought all of Great Britain had extremely high tax rates, like 90% at the top levels, or is Ireland different.

Only one thing to say here.

IRELAND is NOT part of Great Britain or the United Kingdom.

IRELAND = Republic

Thankyou very much.

[jaxfan]

o/t John Lee Hooker is dead? Just recently?

[tifosi]

jaxfan,

Yes, both John Lee Hooker and Carrol O'Conner (Archie Bunker fame) both died yesterday 6/21/01. I never listened to JLH but I'm sure a lot of the music I grew up on, Stones, Zeppelin, etc. owed a lot to him. Funny yesterday for lunch I went to a Red, Hot, and Blue restauraunt which is based on a Memphis blues-thing theme. There were lots of posters of John Lee, all the way back to the 50's and I was wondering around looking at them. Kind of freaky, really.

[Peeko]

Carrol O'connor, was that Edith?

[tifosi]

No Carrol was Archie, I know weird first name, but what the heck. He was also in Kelly's Heros as the General. One of my favorite Eastwood movies.

[Peeko]

No Carrol was Archie,