My god that Ron Dennis sure does know how to bitch and make a fool of himself. Ferrari this Ferrari that....Dennis Shutup and get on with your own job instead of slandering the opposition. but then again, nobody does it like Ron. Anyway, in his own words:
McLaren team boss Ron Dennis accused motor racing's world body FIA of favouring Ferrari, refuelling the bitter war between Formula One's leading teams.
Dennis told a news conference on the eve of Friday's first practice session for the season-opening Australian Grand Prix that he believed FIA was biased towards the Italian team because it did not want his team to maintain their domination of the sport.
Dennis said he had come to the conclusion after Ferrari were awarded last year's constructor's title despite its cars being disqualified from the Malaysian Grand Prix for breaching regulations, a decision that was later overturned on appeal.
"I don't have animosity toward Ferrari, I don't particularly have any animosity to the governing bodies and the decisions they choose to take because I'm a realist," Dennis said.
"The fact is this is a sport where people like to see people occasionally winning and that's in contrast with our own objective to win every single race.
Ron Dennis is a B!tch!!!
Started by
whiplash
, Mar 09 2000 08:22
22 replies to this topic
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#2
Oho
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Posted 09 March 2000 - 19:33
Ave !!
Actaully Rons comments only echo those made by many non team related commentators after the Paris decision. Read for example:
http://www.atlasf1.c...iew/horton.html
- Oho -
Actaully Rons comments only echo those made by many non team related commentators after the Paris decision. Read for example:
http://www.atlasf1.c...iew/horton.html
- Oho -
#3
MGPowell
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Posted 09 March 2000 - 19:36
I agree Daemon.
I konw exactly what will happen. Ron will put a claim that Ferrari are cheating at nearly every round. Especially if Ferrari are beating them.
His attitude is if, we aren't winning, everyone else is cheating. But of course if McLaren are winning, its because of Ron and not because he's probably cheating as much as the others are.
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Matthew Powell
Crazy Australian
I konw exactly what will happen. Ron will put a claim that Ferrari are cheating at nearly every round. Especially if Ferrari are beating them.
His attitude is if, we aren't winning, everyone else is cheating. But of course if McLaren are winning, its because of Ron and not because he's probably cheating as much as the others are.
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Matthew Powell
Crazy Australian
#4
Rainstorm
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Posted 09 March 2000 - 19:40
Have pity on Ron Dennis, he's only preparing the aliby/excuse as to why they are going to lose this year ;)
#5
whiplash
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Posted 09 March 2000 - 08:22
dennis has a valid point. of course fia want more winners, and especially for ferrari. ecclestone has said it himself.
similarly, if ferrari were winning all the championships they would favour the next best team. the governing bodies want f1 to be a spectacle, and they are twisting regulations to produce entertainment. ferrari has been a beneficiary (sepang 99, silverstone 98 - schu wins in pits, getting rid of mclaren's extra pedal + others).
all the teams push to the limit of the regulations. but if you know that one team will be forgiven but yours will be penalised (in the name of competition = entertainment) do you not think you have a right to air your opinion?
similarly, if ferrari were winning all the championships they would favour the next best team. the governing bodies want f1 to be a spectacle, and they are twisting regulations to produce entertainment. ferrari has been a beneficiary (sepang 99, silverstone 98 - schu wins in pits, getting rid of mclaren's extra pedal + others).
all the teams push to the limit of the regulations. but if you know that one team will be forgiven but yours will be penalised (in the name of competition = entertainment) do you not think you have a right to air your opinion?
#6
Daemon
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Posted 09 March 2000 - 08:35
Well of course its true that the FIA wants to improve the chances of the second and third best teams in the interest of the sport, but why does Dennis have to have a bitch about it and start pointing the finger. I used to think Ron was Ok, never liked Mclaren, or even Ron, but had a lot of respect for his success and the way in which he runs Mclaren. Now I can see him for the whinging fool he really is. Maybe DC ain't such a whinger after all, its just Mr 'Expert Excuses' himself putting the words in Davids mouth.
#7
130R
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Posted 09 March 2000 - 23:43
Dennis may be a beeeyaaiitch, but he may be right!
#8
RedFever
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 00:09
when SChumacher and Bennetton were dominating, the FIA was favoring Williams. So what's the news and why didn't Ron complain back then (when Bennetton's disqualifications favored his team)? Dennis is **** and only talks when it's convenient to him. If he had voiced his concerns when his team was on a low (96, 97), I could listen to him, but of course he only talks when it's convenient to him. SCrew him.
#9
whiplash
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 00:23
red, all the team bosses speak only when "it's convenient to them", what else would they do? there's so much at stake, they haven't got time to look out for others. besides dennis has never claimed to be an ambassador for the sport, he's doing what he does for mclaren, and for mclaren to win.
#10
f li
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 00:49
Do you guys for the moment think that BE and MM are not aware that McLaren's and Porsche's domination of the CanAm series killed it?
#11
Todd
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 02:20
The commercial interests of F1 favor Ferrari. All the British teams have to favor Ferrari too, deep down. That is because Ferrari is almost half the draw of F1, but they only take out 23.3% of the cut from the Concorde Agreement.
On the other hand, the rules are administered by Charlie Whiting. He has a hardon for Ron Dennis and Patrick head and they get away with enough to make claims that Ferrari benefits as much from their treatment by the sanctioning body as McLaren or Williams absolutely absurd. There have been a few exposed times when Whiting approved rule infringements for Williams or McLaren and then banned a Ferrari innovation as soon as it was discovered, despite the fact that it didn't bend the existing rules.
On the other hand, the rules are administered by Charlie Whiting. He has a hardon for Ron Dennis and Patrick head and they get away with enough to make claims that Ferrari benefits as much from their treatment by the sanctioning body as McLaren or Williams absolutely absurd. There have been a few exposed times when Whiting approved rule infringements for Williams or McLaren and then banned a Ferrari innovation as soon as it was discovered, despite the fact that it didn't bend the existing rules.
#12
Keith Steele
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 04:00
I agree with Todd, they all recieve beneficial treatment at one time or annother. Depending on how close the points race is. They are going to continue to do little things that will sell tickets and keep people tuned in. They don't even have to look back to Can Am. 1988 was a complete yawner with McLaren's dominance.
#13
mono-posto
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 04:43
Why is there all this talk of the FIA favoring Ferrari? That's stupid.
OK.. let's look at Maylasia. An FIA assigned delegate disqualified Ferrari because of the bardge boards. Ferrari appealed and their case was heard in front of a panel of independent judges. NOT FIA assigned judges. This INDEPENDENT panel heard Ferrari's case as well as the case of a number of other teams and found, via the evidence, that Ferrari was indeed within the regulations.
Recap: The FIA disqualified Ferrari, and independent judges overturned the disqualification. So tell me again how Ecclestone, Mosley or any other member of the FIA is favoring Ferrari?
OK.. let's look at Maylasia. An FIA assigned delegate disqualified Ferrari because of the bardge boards. Ferrari appealed and their case was heard in front of a panel of independent judges. NOT FIA assigned judges. This INDEPENDENT panel heard Ferrari's case as well as the case of a number of other teams and found, via the evidence, that Ferrari was indeed within the regulations.
Recap: The FIA disqualified Ferrari, and independent judges overturned the disqualification. So tell me again how Ecclestone, Mosley or any other member of the FIA is favoring Ferrari?
#14
Mila
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 05:16
I think that we have to distinguish between FIA actions that favor one or another team, and FIA actions that favor grandstand finishes to GP seasons. if Ron is thinking of Malaysia, he might do the same.
whatever Ron believes concerning favoritism, I think that the timing of his statement is very peculiar.
Todd, I agree that, from a marketing perspective, Ferrari is the best thing (by far) F1 has going for it. however vital this may be, it cannot be seen as a rational by the FIA (or the other teams) for unequal application of the rules, otherwise F1 will lose its status as "sport," and it would be regarded as "entertainment" only. (think of it, an F1 promotion stating: "when the flag drops, the bs continues.") let's hope that they care!
whatever Ron believes concerning favoritism, I think that the timing of his statement is very peculiar.
Todd, I agree that, from a marketing perspective, Ferrari is the best thing (by far) F1 has going for it. however vital this may be, it cannot be seen as a rational by the FIA (or the other teams) for unequal application of the rules, otherwise F1 will lose its status as "sport," and it would be regarded as "entertainment" only. (think of it, an F1 promotion stating: "when the flag drops, the bs continues.") let's hope that they care!
#15
Todd
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 06:58
Mila,
I'd love it if there were never any reason to suspect the sporting regulations/ interpretations of favoring any team. I just meant it should come as no surprise that Bernie didn't want to shoot his meal ticket following Malaysia in '99.
Have you found a place to watch the race live? I just called the mid-town Hooters. The lady I spoke to thought it wouldn't be a problem, as they have satellite and will put on whatever I want to see. I wasn't reassured by her level of understanding, however.
I'd love it if there were never any reason to suspect the sporting regulations/ interpretations of favoring any team. I just meant it should come as no surprise that Bernie didn't want to shoot his meal ticket following Malaysia in '99.
Have you found a place to watch the race live? I just called the mid-town Hooters. The lady I spoke to thought it wouldn't be a problem, as they have satellite and will put on whatever I want to see. I wasn't reassured by her level of understanding, however.
#16
bigblue
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 08:27
Todd, more details on Concord Agreement please? 23%? What do you mean?
#17
Todd
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 11:29
bigblue,
Formula 1 is a business. It brings in about 390 million dollars in TV rights. There are an addditional $5million X the # of races in sanctionong fees. Then you need to add in the merchandising revenue. I'm probably forgetting only about 50% of the sources of F1 revenue. The Concorde Agreement determines how the loot is divided between the various teams. They are each given points for reasons primarliy including:
Where they finished in the last couple championships.
How long they've participated in F1.
Ferrari gets enough points for being in their 50th year of F1 that they get 23.3% of the revenue left over after Bernie and Max pay themselves.
McLaren gets about 19.?% of the money.
Williams comes next by a good amount.
Then the rest.
This is why Ferrari probably breaks even from their F1 effort while Jaguar will require every Ford Focus buyer to kick in $300.00.
Formula 1 is a business. It brings in about 390 million dollars in TV rights. There are an addditional $5million X the # of races in sanctionong fees. Then you need to add in the merchandising revenue. I'm probably forgetting only about 50% of the sources of F1 revenue. The Concorde Agreement determines how the loot is divided between the various teams. They are each given points for reasons primarliy including:
Where they finished in the last couple championships.
How long they've participated in F1.
Ferrari gets enough points for being in their 50th year of F1 that they get 23.3% of the revenue left over after Bernie and Max pay themselves.
McLaren gets about 19.?% of the money.
Williams comes next by a good amount.
Then the rest.
This is why Ferrari probably breaks even from their F1 effort while Jaguar will require every Ford Focus buyer to kick in $300.00.
#18
Ricardo F1
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 12:37
Why does RD get called a b*itch for telling the truth???
#19
mono-posto
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 12:43
"The fact is this is a sport where people like to see people occasionally winning and that's in contrast with our own objective to win every single race."
So Ron...If you don't win every single race then the others must be cheating, is that it? Or the FIA is biased towards another team therefore preventing you from winning every single race? God forbid that reality interfers with your "own objective"! I don't think your a bitch Ron but you do need to grow up!
So Ron...If you don't win every single race then the others must be cheating, is that it? Or the FIA is biased towards another team therefore preventing you from winning every single race? God forbid that reality interfers with your "own objective"! I don't think your a bitch Ron but you do need to grow up!
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#20
busternuck
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 14:25
Todd,
Finally I know how Ferrari can actually afford to stay in F1 - and it's definitely not because of sales of Fiat Punto.
Cool info dude.
Finally I know how Ferrari can actually afford to stay in F1 - and it's definitely not because of sales of Fiat Punto.
Cool info dude.
#21
Oho
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 15:05
Ave !!
Mono-posto, the judges of the FIA court of appleas at Paris are FIA appointed. They may not have direct commercial links with the teams which certainly does not guarantee they are unbiased. None of the teams other than Ferrari had any say in the court, McLaren and Stewart were present only as observers, they were not part of the dispute which was between FIA and Ferrari. The court could and did not find that Ferrari was within regulations at Malaysia, that would have been practically impossible for several reasons. They did however find that the case against Ferrari was not strong enough to warrant exclusion. Just for your information.
- Oho -
Mono-posto, the judges of the FIA court of appleas at Paris are FIA appointed. They may not have direct commercial links with the teams which certainly does not guarantee they are unbiased. None of the teams other than Ferrari had any say in the court, McLaren and Stewart were present only as observers, they were not part of the dispute which was between FIA and Ferrari. The court could and did not find that Ferrari was within regulations at Malaysia, that would have been practically impossible for several reasons. They did however find that the case against Ferrari was not strong enough to warrant exclusion. Just for your information.
- Oho -
#22
Laphroaig
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 17:56
That whole Malaysia thing was rediculous anyway... And I don't mean the appeals and stuff.
Just that the cars had been checked a couple of times that race already! They had the first row of the grid, and they didn't found anything wrong then! The ferrari's were already at least 3 times before the race, and they were OK'd after the race, till they guy with his ruler walks up after Dennis tipped him.... "Oh yeah, Dennis is right, how could we have missed that all those times before???"
And the sad thing was that McLaren afterwards complained that they didn't expect Ferrari to defend their appeal by attacking the regulations, not the circumstance under which it was discovered, and that they would have protested differently if they knew!
I wonder if Dennis would have ever tipped the FIA if he found something illegal on a Minardi...
Just that the cars had been checked a couple of times that race already! They had the first row of the grid, and they didn't found anything wrong then! The ferrari's were already at least 3 times before the race, and they were OK'd after the race, till they guy with his ruler walks up after Dennis tipped him.... "Oh yeah, Dennis is right, how could we have missed that all those times before???"
And the sad thing was that McLaren afterwards complained that they didn't expect Ferrari to defend their appeal by attacking the regulations, not the circumstance under which it was discovered, and that they would have protested differently if they knew!
I wonder if Dennis would have ever tipped the FIA if he found something illegal on a Minardi...
#23
Oho
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Posted 10 March 2000 - 18:40
Ave !!!
Laphroaig, it is not FIAs task to guarantee that the cars meet the regulations, it is the teams task to do that. What you are arguing is that if an irregular and rule violating part or configuration is overlooked by the scrutineers the part somehow becomes "legal". That is absolute nonsense. If you speed on a rural road hitting 100 mph do you think you could explain to the police that pulled you over the next time around that you should get away with it because you did just the day before. It seem most unlikely that Dennis knew that the barge boards were irregular, he probably suspected it, but I sincerely doubt he knew. If he knew, what does it tell of the Ferrari staff?
- Oho -
[This message has been edited by Oho (edited 03-10-2000).]
Laphroaig, it is not FIAs task to guarantee that the cars meet the regulations, it is the teams task to do that. What you are arguing is that if an irregular and rule violating part or configuration is overlooked by the scrutineers the part somehow becomes "legal". That is absolute nonsense. If you speed on a rural road hitting 100 mph do you think you could explain to the police that pulled you over the next time around that you should get away with it because you did just the day before. It seem most unlikely that Dennis knew that the barge boards were irregular, he probably suspected it, but I sincerely doubt he knew. If he knew, what does it tell of the Ferrari staff?
- Oho -
[This message has been edited by Oho (edited 03-10-2000).]
