37 replies to this topic

[Dazed and confused]

Autosport: Formula 1 rookie Kimi Raikkonen is thought to have snubbed the world championship-wining Ferrari team before signing for rival McLaren for next year.
Raikkonen is to replace fellow Finn Mika Hakkinen at McLaren for 2002 as the double world champ is taking a sabbatical. But the 21-year-old Sauber driver is believed to have been offered a seat alongside Michael Schumacher at Ferrari for 2003 earlier this year.

However, he is believed to have to turned down the Maranello drive because he knew he would not get equal status with the four-time world champion.

When announcing his young signing, McLaren boss Ron Dennis revealed that Raikkonen had turned down an offer from a leading team, but did not say which team it was - only that it was one which has distinct number one and number two drivers, the most well known of which is Ferrari.

"Kimi had options with other teams," said Dennis, "and one of them was to stay at Sauber for one more year and then move on to a team where he would be a number two driver.

"The thought of that was very unattractive to him because he did not want to be a number two in a team. Whereas at McLaren, we have a policy of not having number one and number two drivers and that is set to continue. Kimi liked that."

I have a feeling Ron Dennis hired Kimi just to piss Ferrari off. Heidfeld would have been a more logical replacement for Mika, since he already has links to Mercedes. Maybe they are planning to bring him to the team in 2003 if and when Mika decides not to make a comeback.

[Odyss]

Maybe Kimi's being smart here. He preferred a drive in a top team in the year 2002 itself and joined Mclaren. I'd like to see Ron's face when come 2003 Kimi troops over to Ferrari.

[HP]

Well McLaren having Kimi and possibly NH is certainly a strong pairing, but there are other drivers too. If Kimi is given the unreliable crap that Mika and David had this year, then Kimi will be thinking again if the move to McLaren was in his best interest. And altough I do like Kimi, if he really thinks that way about not going through a learning phase as #2, and relying on his talent only, then Kimi will face a few issues along the road.

Ferrari is not so stupid as they appear. They probably have watched Williams closely. And when Patrick Head mentioned publicly that both his current drivers have still a lot to learn, the Ferrari people will have registered that too. And well one of his drivers won 2 races, the other almost two.

[King Sputum]

Originally posted by Dazed and confused

I have a feeling Ron Dennis hired Kimi just to piss Ferrari off. Heidfeld would have been a more logical replacement for Mika, since he already has links to Mercedes. Maybe they are planning to bring him to the team in 2003 if and when Mika decides not to make a comeback.

I have a feeling that you couldn't be more wrong:
a) making other teams piss of is not priority one issue when selecting drivers
b) "Heidfield would have been more logical". How come he's more logical, because he is not faster? (I don't say that Kimi is the fastest of all drivers, above average anyway)
c) Yes maybe they are planning to get him 2003, maybe they have also other plans

[HP]

Originally posted by Odyss
Maybe Kimi's being smart here. He preferred a drive in a top team in the year 2002 itself and joined Mclaren. I'd like to see Ron's face when come 2003 Kimi troops over to Ferrari.

Kimi has a long term contract, and I doubt that Ron Dennis would free Kimi easily.

[cosmoK]

Originally posted by Dazed and confused
"Kimi had options with other teams," said Dennis, "and one of them was to stay at Sauber for one more year and then move on to a team where he would be a number two driver.

"The thought of that was very unattractive to him because he did not want to be a number two in a team. Whereas at McLaren, we have a policy of not having number one and number two drivers and that is set to continue. Kimi liked that."

I really wonder what DC thinks about all that. Sure, the no.1/no.2 stituation isn't as clear-cut at McLaren as it is at Ferrari. But it is true that Ron has, over the years, tend to favour Mika over David more often than not. Would DC not go into next season expecting his young teammate to play a supporting role to him, as he has done for Mika? And for his years of service & his performance this season, he has certain rights to. It is also the sensible thing to do if they want to beat Michael/Ferrari, not to mention the superfast Williams, to the WDC.

[Toyoter]

Here's what I don't understand. He's only 21, and has only 1 year of experience. Why not go to Ferrari in 2003, be Michael's #2 for a couple of years, and then move up to be the clear #1 when Michael retires? As a driver, I would love to go to a team with the knowledge that some day they would build the entire car/team around me, especially if that team was the most legendary team in the paddock! I think Kimi was heavily influenced by his relationship with Mika.

[KinetiK]

Originally posted by Toyoter
Here's what I don't understand. He's only 21, and has only 1 year of experience. Why not go to Ferrari in 2003, be Michael's #2 for a couple of years, and then move up to be the clear #1 when Michael retires? As a driver, I would love to go to a team with the knowledge that some day they would build the entire car/team around me, especially if that team was the most legendary team in the paddock! I think Kimi was heavily influenced by his relationship with Mika.

Because when MS retires Ferrari will enter a state of decline and Kimi will be left being King **** of Turd Island. All teams, regardless of how regimented & strong that they think they are enter periods of decline, Ferrari's will begin in 2002 or 2003 and when MS leaves Ferrari will be struggling ala '99 Williams or '95 McLaren. A person or a team can only give 110% for a short time before they need to pull back and rest. It's happened several times to each of Williams & McLaren who are the two most successful teams of the modern era and it's going to happen to Ferrari... it's inevitable. Ferrari just has to be able to arrest the decline a lot faster than they did after 1990. They may only have 3-4 years of marginal results before they're back on top if they do it the right way.

Here's hoping, anyway...

[Dazed and confused]

Maybe he doesn't want to do it because when MS leaves Ferrari Byrne, Brawn and Todt will leave too. They are not going to win anything after that.

To King Sputum: With a five year contract Ron is making sure that Ferrari is not going to have Kimi racing for them in the near future. They could have gone for Heidfeld instead. He has been as good as Kimi, but they already have some kind of contract with him. Having secured that two of the most promising youngsters are not going to drive for Ferrari is good tactics IMO.

[KinetiK]

Originally posted by Dazed and confused
Maybe he doesn't want to do it because when MS leaves Ferrari Byrne, Brawn and Todt will leave too. They are not going to win anything after that.

That's my point, when MS leaves it will be 8 years (more or less) at Ferrari for "Team MS", they'll all be burned out and will want to return to England or other sundry locations to work 'at home' or they'll just leave the sport. "The Ravages of Time" or something like that... My point is both Luca M and MS have stated they want to keep Ferrari at the point of excellence even after Team MS takes its leave. I'll consider that a success if, after 2004, Ferrari dips to no worse than 4th or 5th in the WCC and then rebounds to win it in 2007 or 2008. Lots of conjecture but heck, that's our mandate here at AtlasF1.com, right?

Whoo hoo! This is my THOUSANDTH post. Where's my champagne???

UPDATE: I don't deserve Champagne if I can't spell it correct!

[Jaybee]

Kimi may have turned down Ferrari because he would not have equal status with Michael Schumacher. I wonder just how DC feels at present, having to acknowledge equal status with a 21 year old with 1 years experience and no podium finishes! Who, in the McLaren team, will have the saddest face at the end of 2002? Kimi, second status driver or DC, beaten by the kid!

[Louis Mr. F1]

Kinetik

congratulation!! i think you'll receive the 1000 club member gift.
and i am fast approaching you. watch out

[Clatter]

Well done Kinetik, welcome to the club.

It will be an interesting year at Mac in 2002. Personally I think DC will come out on top. I just hope that they produce a car that can challange and not leave its drivers stranded on the start line.

[Singing in the rain]

Would a Finn ever accept a nr 2 status? -No! (IMHO)

[cosmoK]

Wasn't Mika Salo no.2 to Eddie Irvine at Ferrari? (still think he should have kept that win for himself, he's never going to get another chance)

[Ricardo F1]

I'm sorry to see Mika go, but I don't think DC will give a monkeys about Kimi coming in on equal status. He has experience and time at McLaren, no doubt Kimi may out qualify him a couple of times, but DC will come out on top. I just hope they can produce the car to beat Schumacher.

[Peeko]

I just hope they can produce the car to beat Schumacher.

DC had that car in 98. Last year's car was also capable. Where did he finish?

[DEVO]

I was just saying that after Ferrari mentioning the fact that Kimi is not good enough for them... that it was a case of sour grapes... turns out it was sour grapes!

[TazioN]

What if Kimi is going to McLaren with the blessing of Ferrari? Kimi can then learn about the team and how they work for a year, and get valuable info for Ferrari when he goes there. Even next year he could be helping the Ferrari cause from inside.

Maybe not very likely, but fun to think about that.

[Ricardo F1]

I think McLaren have signed a very long term contract with Mr Raikonnen - he ain't going nowhere very quickly.

[Ricardo F1]

Peeko - is this personal attack today out of anything rational or are you just being a ****?

[Peeko]

I would have asked the question to anyone that said give DC a car, and he'll challenge Schumacher. It happened to be you. He's had the car before, one of them was clearly faster, and lost.

[King Sputum]

Why they are never speaking honestly in the world of F1? (at least they lie too often)

In the world of True F1...

Luca: "We wanted Kimi, but we hadn't much money left. We offered him 200 $ a week and he said no."

Mika H: "I would drive next year, but Erja wants me to stay home to watch Huu, so that she can go out"

Michael: "Why our tracktion control works so well? It's because we have had it several years now, and we have had time to develope it"

Mika S: "I am not a blond, this is colour"

[petri]

Kimi does not want to play the second fiddle in any team, not even in Ferrari.

[Ricardo F1]

Peeko - I'll admit it, you're right he had a fast but unreliable car in 98. Mika did a great job with it. Similarly DC did a great job with the car this year, unfortunately for him and Mika the car was not up to the task - but he got many a moral victory in beating Schumacher in a lesser car.

So judging by this years performance, kept up for next year if McLaren produce the car DC is capable of winning in it.

[AD]

Ricardo,
McLaren (and Williams) need to build a significantly faster car than Ferrari to win either championship next year. There is not a driver out there who can match Schumacher over a season in equal cars. Hence DC, Ralf and Juan Pablo need their teams to build very competitive cars to beat Michael in the WDC next year.

[Ricardo F1]

I disagree, the McLaren wasn't really a match for the Ferrari this year, except on rare occasions. DC still blitzed pole at Michaels 'home' (Monaco) and beat him in Brazil because of a better setup guess.

Given even cars there's little to choose between the top five drivers in F1 ; you just need a little luck.

[HP]

If you read Jean Todt's comment from today you can see that Ferrari just didn't had the financial means to buy Kimi's contract.

[rayyu882]

Originally posted by Ricardo F1
I think McLaren have signed a very long term contract with Mr Raikonnen - he ain't going nowhere very quickly.

Well, I think we all saw that contract in F1 doesn't mean a whole lot nowadays, all Kimi has to do is to underperform for half a season and Ron will no doubt let him go...

[Scoop]

Originally posted by HP
If you read Jean Todt's comment from today you can see that Ferrari just didn't had the financial means to buy Kimi's contract.

I think ferrari are clear about not supplying engines for free.
anyway, with RB confirmed for next year, they don't need one more expensive driver and pay off RB.

[Scoop]

Even if MS left and ferrari went on a decline, i think kimi could have used atleast a year with MS to learn racecraft.

[Scoop]

remember KR has a good car unlike Alonso, who too has been impressive. Alonso has done better than Burti, but KR has generally been outqualified by Nick.
I think Ron should have taken Nick Heidfeld, and i think DC will outdo KR.

[HP]

Originally posted by Scoop
remember KR has a good car unlike Alonso, who too has been impressive. Alonso has done better than Burti, but KR has generally been outqualified by Nick.
I think Ron should have taken Nick Heidfeld, and i think DC will outdo KR.

NH has already close ties with Mercedes, so they could take NH next year in.

[Mrv]

Originally posted by HP
If you read Jean Todt's comment from today you can see that Ferrari just didn't had the financial means to buy Kimi's contract.

You really beliieve this? Ferrari have the money to get anyone they want. Like Luca said, they will never put a young driver with hardly any experience in their cars. They have there minds set on someone else to replace Rubens should he falter in the future. Montoya, Ralf, Fisi, Heidfeld, and Alonzo's names have been mentioned at Maranello. Money is no object for them, the only thing really stopping them is if a driver doesn't want to sign with them for any amount of cash!!!

[HSJ]

Originally posted by Odyss
Maybe Kimi's being smart here. He preferred a drive in a top team in the year 2002 itself and joined Mclaren. I'd like to see Ron's face when come 2003 Kimi troops over to Ferrari.

Ha! I like to see the tifosi faces when he stays at McLaren and wins, wins, and wins for the good guys! Why go to Ferrari? After all, all the greats won in a McLaren: AS, AP, MH(?). If you're not a McL champion, you're not really among the elite!

[HSJ]

HP,

And altough I do like Kimi, if he really thinks that way about not going through a learning phase as #2, and relying on his talent only, then Kimi will face a few issues along the road.

Not needed. MH never had a #2 role or a "master" as a teammate to learn from, neither did AS, or even MS.

[HSJ]

Originally posted by Dazed and confused
To King Sputum: With a five year contract Ron is making sure that Ferrari is not going to have Kimi racing for them in the near future. They could have gone for Heidfeld instead. He has been as good as Kimi, but they already have some kind of contract with him. Having secured that two of the most promising youngsters are not going to drive for Ferrari is good tactics IMO.

Exactly my thoughts. Though of course even without it it was a good move to get KR, but this makes it even more logical. Mika said in an interview for Finnish TV that he started to talk to RD around Monaco GP that he would like to take a year off. That meant they would have to start looking for a good driver as a replacement, but none seemed to be available. Mika admitted that it was his dream to get KR to McLaren, the team he thinks would be the best for a young driver to go to to learn the trade (he speaks from personal experience). So for months they tried to figure it out, apparently MH would have driven on if no good enough replacement would have been found. Naturally they got the best (potential) they could. The best possible choice IMO.

[HSJ]

Originally posted by DEVO
I was just saying that after Ferrari mentioning the fact that Kimi is not good enough for them... that it was a case of sour grapes... turns out it was sour grapes!

Yep! They will deny it of course... Pretty interesting reactions from the tifosi lately.