11 replies to this topic

[Hunt the Shunt Fan]

Hi! I'm new to the forum and I hope you don't mind the question:

Was there any retribution towards Frank Williams/Patrick Head after Senna's death? I'm not talking about the trial they faced in Italy. I'm just wondering if there were any people in Formula 1 that held Williams personally responsible and wanted them to pay. It seems to me if the greatest F1 driver died in your F1 car then you should be greatly punished -- kicked out of F1 and ostracized by the racing community.

Thanks

[HP]

F1 is about racing, not some retaliation game, nor lynch justice. The lawyers were not able to provide enough evidence to convict Williams.

What about Roland Ratzenberger that died the same weekend, or other drivers before, well known or not.

And to close, if something like that would be introduced, F1 would go out of business tomorrow, since no company could bear the risks anyway.

[leegle]

Yes just imagine where Lotus would have finished up if they had to face up to the problems the drivers of their cars faced at Spa in 1960! I think it better to accept that people make mistakes and that the more they learn the less mistakes they make.;)

[pRy]

Oh, I'm sure Frank Williams felt/feels personal retribution and pain over the death of Ayrton. Have you not noticed that on every car since 1994, Williams has had the Senna "S" on their front wing mount points?

Frank Williams has always had a photograph of Ayrton on his office wall too.

The Williams team are human too.

[Clatter]

It seems to me if the greatest F1 driver died in your F1 car then you should be greatly punished -- kicked out of F1 and ostracized by the racing community.

Firstly, why should it matter who died? Are you saying they sould only be punished because it was Senna, but if it was anyone else then thats fine?

Secondly, This would apply of it was a deliberate act, but it wasnt, no one has ever accused Williams of a deliberate act.

[Hellenic tifosi]

HP, Clatter:up:
Everyone is focusing on Senna's death but the one of Ratzenburger is totally forgotten...

[Peterson]

The frontwing thing was interesting. Didnt know that.
Any pictures?

[MarkWRX]

Hunt,

The "greatest driver of all time" is subjective. You may think Senna is or was, I would disagree. Technical ability is one thing, but a champion is a champion for a number of reasons, and sporting conduct is one of them. Michael Schumacher is perhaps the best technical driver in F1. He can get 100% from a car that anyone else can only squeeze 95% from. However, he lost all his championship points, for good reason, in 1996.

F1 has lost many great drivers - Francoise Cevert comes to mind, as does Ronnie Peterson, Clay Reggazoni (still alive but in a wheelchair). Following your logic, the F1 grid would have changed dramatically during the 70's and early 80's.

Just as an engine failure leads to improvements in design and construction of the engine, driver injury or death lead to improvement in the safety of the sport.

F1 drivers race on the ragged edge of control in order to be fast. Sometimes they cross over that line. Driver's know that will happen and they have the "committment" (which is, I think, an F1 term of art for "balls") to do it anyway. I am very very sure that I could not keep my foot planted on the throttle in an F1 car going through Eau Rouge.

Welcome to the forum from another new member, and I hope you enjoy the healthy debate that occurs here.

Mark

[gerry nassar]

It was an accident and nobody holds Williams responsible.

The Front wing thing was interesting. I'll have to keep a look out.


Hunt - Welcome to the Atlas bb!!!

[crouchyaj]

This is what we call a flmamebaite thread.

To accuse Williams so without evidence is ridiculous.

I thought the coroner actually declared that what killed Senna was someting coming off the track and pentrating his helmet, ie nothing to do with the car what so ever (please correct me if I'm wrong)

So please refrian from irrational statements and start a sensible debate/topic

[Todd]

Rosberg was killed in an Auto Union
Alberto Ascari was killed in a Ferrari
Jim Clark was killed in a Lotus
Jochen Rindt was killed in a Lotus
Mark Donohue was killed in a Penske
Gilles Villeneuve was killed in a Ferrari
Ayrton Senna was killed in a Williams
Greg Moore was killed in a Reynard
Dale Earnhardt was killed in a Childress Chevrolet

What do they have in common? They were all loved by millions of fans, revered for their talent, and killed in high speed crashes. Was it through the negligence of their constructors? I think a case could be made that Colin Chapman had a share of blame in Jochen Rindt's death, and I've read that Goodyear may have had a role in Donohue's death, but that doesn't change the fact that motor racing is dangerous in and of itself. Would you like to eliminate Ferrari, Williams, and Reynard(BAR) from the F1 grid? That doesn't leave many active teams, and there is no reason to assume that the ones left behind build safer cars than the ones that have lost drivers.

Senna knew the risks of racing. He chose to accept them. People with your mindset should find another pastime.

[tim]

It seems to me if the greatest F1 driver died in your F1 car then you should be greatly punished -- kicked out of F1 and ostracized by the racing community.

Err, interesting theory. Why?

If that was the case, we'd have no Williams (Senna), no Lotus (Jim Clark) and no Ferrari (Gilles) and so on. How boring would that be?

Racing drivers are professionals. They know the risk is there - they may die or they may get injured like Alex Zanardi. Yet they still choose to drive every day. I was at the Rockingham CART race, and every driver was driving his heart out (possibly not Takagi as he only lasted about 30 seconds), despite Alex Zanard's injuries just seven days before.

After Senna's death, Frank Williams actually cried on the plane on the way home. His assistant commented that this was the only time that he'd ever seen Frank cry. This, after all, was the man who told his wife "Emotion is weak" when they left their old house after many years and moved into a new one (true story ;) )

Accidents happen. Perhaps all the drivers should drive around in padded cars on tracks with foam all around them, never driving above 30mph.