22 replies to this topic

[schuy]

ciao,
my friends, i read an AUTOCAR, from several weeks ago, showing the unveiled performance figures for the Bugatti veyron.
apparently, it has 1001 BHP, and, it does 0-300kph, as 0-186mph, in 14 seconds, really.
so, i wanted to ask you, what do you think.
i spoke to a friend, and, he told me, the clutch wouldn't be able to suffer so much hard torque, my friends.
so, please tell me, what is your judgement.

ciao,
liran biderman.

[jetsetjim]

You would be able to get clutches to cope with serious amounts of torque.. it would have to be a multi-plate clutch, with a fairly nasty bite to it (possibly carbon/carbon)

Mind you, you don't have any torque figures quoted.. how much is it reckoned to have?

Given that an Aston Martin Vantage road car has as much as 600lb.ft of Torque, most SP1 race cars have up to 650lb.ft of torque, then I don't see much of a problem.

[schuy]

ciao,
hey, thanks for the information, mate.
here are the figures.
the Bugatti, uses a 7,993 cc engine, with 1001BHP @6000rpm, and 922lb ft of torque, on a band of revs from 2200 to 5500rpm.
the Bugatti will use paddle shift.
thanks for your input.

ciao,
liran biderman.

[schuy]

ciao,
hey jim, by the way, the article goes further and says:
Power is channeled to all four wheels through a unique seven-speed transmission, with double clutches and shift paddles behind the steering wheel.

thanks man!

ciao,
liran biderman.

[jetsetjim]

922 lb.ft or torque?? Christ.. it's gonna be a handful to drive! I think the clutches will cope.... as for the transmission.... I'm not so sure... I think it'll be a driveshaft breaker as well......

[Speed]

From the bugatti official site: - I]The direct injection drive unit produces 408 kW/555 hp at 6800 rpm. The impressive power potential of the 18-cylinder engine is also reflected by its enormous maximum torque, which reaches 650 Newton metres at 4000 rpm.[/I]

I guess Autocar ran a road test and came up with the figures, but the power figure on the site is half of what autocar has mentioned. What am I missing here?

[schuy]

ciao,
hmmm, i see, that's interesting.
jim, yeah, it should be quite a handful, to drive!
have you seen the photos, then?
a seven-speed gearbox, it should pose quite a huge problem, as the throttle will be so tender.
hmmm, i wonder if it has traction control??!!??!!
have a good night.

ciao,
liran biderman.

[Bluehair]

The actual force that the clutch, gearbox, drive shaft, and rear end have to cope with will depend on the amount of grip the tires can provide. If this car just smokes the tires, everything should hold up. On the other hand, if the car gets a really good grip, it might just leave a nice trail of drive-train parts all over the road. I'm totally in favor of 1000HP and 900+ft/lbs of torque no matter what happens. Sounds like a lot of fun while it lasts!!

[schuy]

ciao,
Speed, the figures that you mentioned, are very weird.
AUTOCAR haven't done a road test, since it's a new car, and, it hasn't been driven publicaly, as much as i truly know, and for the papers.
they only did mules, i assume?
anyway, the Bugatti, is very famous for the fact it can actually produce 1001BHP, that's what makes it so special.
by the way, if you can, look at the tires.
they are MICHELIN's, and, they have the writing "400" over them, actually.
and by the way, Bugatti say, the car will get to 252mph.
that's more than 400 kph, guys.
that's a very hefty amount, indeed.
speed, does the article you read, state it has a quad-turbo?
i think, Bugatti are planning to be producing 2 different versions.
the one, probably the version you mentioned, and the 2nd, the 1001BHP super-scary edition.
what do you think?

ciao,
liran biderman.

[schuy]

ciao,
bluehair, i like your attitude, man!
anyway, yeah, a 1001 BHP and 900+ lb ft of torque, will be very fun, even if it would mean the cars, will have to be serviced, rather frequently, i assume?
well, tell me more about your heavy expectations.
where are you from?
ciao,
liran biderman.

[Croaky]

It's not a problem to make clutches and driveshafts to deliver that much torque, it's just a problem to make them lighter than the average truck!

[Pascal]

Speed, the website obviously hasn't been updated, as the final engine configuration chosen for the Veyron is a W16, and not the 18 cylinder engine suggested with the first prototype. Not only do the Bugatti PR people now claim a 1001 HP power output, but as mentioned before they also expect their car to be able to break the 400 km/h barrier!

[Janzen]

I just had to find some info on this.


http://www.vwvortex....ron/index.shtml

hope the link works, that engine looks great.

[Zoe]

The engine looks nice, but man is the car ugly. It has the same ugly butt as the Audi TT.

The "enormous" power of the engine can be put into perspective quite easily: It gives a specific power output of about 140 hp/litre, which isn't exactly bad not maybe not as spectacular as it may seem. Consider the Toyota Supra from 1993, which, with two turbos, produces 330 HP stock, from a 3 litre straight six engine (2JZ-GTE). This gives 110 hp/litre for a street worthy engine that takes you and your car to the supermarket around the corner as well. Apply some simple tune-up measures and those engines deliver more than 500 hp with the same block and internals.

I'd be curious to see any reliability figures of that engine after, say, five years. But then Volkswagen certainly makes sure that this data will never be published.

Zoe

[Pascal]

Originally posted by Zoe
Consider the Toyota Supra from 1993, which, with two turbos, produces 330 HP stock, from a 3 litre straight six engine (2JZ-GTE). This gives 110 hp/litre for a street worthy engine that takes you and your car to the supermarket around the corner as well.

If you find that impressive, take a look at the Honda S2000 then. The car extracts 240HP from its 2 litre engine, but the amazing thing is that the latter is normally aspirated!

[mhferrari]

And the Honda S2000 revs to nearly 10,000 rpms!

[schuy]

ciao,
friends, so what is it, about those japanese engines, that they are so easy to tune?

ciao,
liran biderman.

[rdrcr]

Initially, I thought as most, if not all of you did... that this was one ugly bitch, but after I saw the other link that Janzen posted, I began to change my mind...

The compactness of this supercar is remarkable, look at it compared to the vintage Bugatti, it's almost the same length. The finish is second to none, mirror like and the attention to detail is also 1st rate. Of course for nearly a million bucks it had better be. Add in 1000 hp and all that torque and she gets gorgeous all of a sudden.

Here is another one in red & black - In the interior shot do I see paddle shifters?

http://www.supercars.....o=16/4 Veyron

I'll concur that the traditional horse collar grill is out of place and the flush round tail lamps are not in keeping with the rest of the car but aside from that she definitely has possibilities. The interior looks like something Metalcrafter's would fashion (Chrysler's design lab) it's beautiful and has those retro touches that are all the rage now. And, it looks comfortable as hell. Loose the grill and add some elongated LED tail lamps I might just spend my next 800k in fluff money there, if I had a billion or two to spare that is.

Still, if came down to spending that kind of money for a supercar, I'd be less inclined to go with this exact edition of Bugatti's exotic exclusivity and go with a used McLaren F1 in a heartbeat...

Of course if I had that kind of dough to begin with and I wanted the car regardless, I'd just customize it, by loosing the grill and changing the taillights ... so what's another 150k? Like who's counting anyway? People who own these cars often have multitudes of exotic, classic and racing cars scattered about.

They own them because they can.

[Zoe]

Originally posted by Pascal
If you find that impressive, take a look at the Honda S2000 then. The car extracts 240HP from its 2 litre engine, but the amazing thing is that the latter is normally aspirated!

No, Pascal, I didn't say that this is particularly impressive. Rather I used this comparison that those alleged 1000 hp of the Volkswagen don't impress me.

Besides, pure horsepower and torque isn't everything and one can even have too much of it. A friend of mine has a "somewhat" modified Vette and its undriveable in the wet due to its too many muscles.

The Honda engine sounds nice, yes, however with N/A engines a lot of power can be gained via revs, now we all know that because we're F1 fans, right? It will be interesting to watch these engines how long they will last in average.

Zoe

[desmo]

These sorts of cars have a tendancy to be vanity devices for those with big wallets and small self-images. I actually thought the older EB110(?) was much better styled. This car seems to have no unifying theme, being little more than a disjointed collection of questionable styling licks. Brings to mind the old saying about a camel being a horse designed by committee.

The car's best angles are the front quarters, showing some purposeful shapes that get along pretty well. Once one gets back to the overly heavy rear pillars it all starts to fall apart for me, and I expect better solutions to rear vision in this day and age. The engine, while a breath-taking piece is too self conciously on display, like a guy who works out wearing his shirt unbuttoned to the navel, tacky regardless of the abs.

The interior is a rather curious hodge-podge of Art Deco cues, apparently contrived to evoke pre-war nostalgia, combined with an instrument cluster which looks practically lifted from '50s Detroit excess.

Compare this car to such early mid-engine designs such as Pinanfarina's stunning Dino 246 or Giugiaro's iconic Miura, and I'm afraid it simply doesn't measure up. Still, I'd love to tour the western states of the US in it if it comes with a 'Get out of Jail Free' card.

In many respects a Honda Civic is a more impressive accomplishment to me.

[Zoe]

Spot on

In short, one could say it is a typical Volkswagen

Zoe

[imaginesix]

Brilliant design analysis desmo.

[Christiaan]

I saw one of the prelim designs at the Frankfurt Motor show in 1999. Viewing it live the car has some serious presence. The chrome W-engine was a WOW, and the tyre tread with diagonal EB emblems was a sign that this car was in all purity an excess. VW was marketing it as a product from the Honduras concept and claimed that the car was well the most well rounded supercar ever made. I am always somewhat sceptical of car shows where the car is about 10m away from observers. I mean, what are they hiding?

Still, seeing it live took my breath away, I applauded Gorgetto Giugiaro's retro styling. Its a very very excessive car in my view.