16 replies to this topic

[Roger Clark]

Can anybody tell me anything about Scuderia Colonia? My understanding is that ot all intents and purposes it was Wolfgang von Trips, but some posts on the Jupp Schmitz thread suggest that his involvement may not have been so great.

[Michael Müller]

Although already active as race entrant before, the Scuderia Colonia was founded as legal entity on 13 Jan 1961 at Cologne (as the name says) by Wolfgang Graf Berghe von Trips and some other German race drivers, von Trips was elected president. The idea was to install a platform for young race talents from the area, to lead them, to train them, and to arrange financial support. They ran some TCA Formula Junior cars built by von Trips and Colotti, and also 5 BMW 700 coupes, which had been accquired from BMW at special conditions due to the relations of von Trips.
They even entered a Lotus 18 in some 1961 F1 races for founder member Wolfgang Seidel and youngster Michael May, probably the same car as driven by von Trips at Cape Town and East London in 1960. The car could be fitted with a Ford engine, and was suitable for FJ then. They also ran the Count's privately owned Cooper T45 in some events.
Scuderia Colonia is still existing today, and active in national German amateur motorsport through all classes.

[Marcor]

Roger, I didn't know the exact involvement of Von Trips in the Scuderia that's why I've used the conditional In the Jupp Schmitz thread .

But do you think the Scuderia Colonia reached his goal ? Who started his international career in the team ?

[Roger Clark]

I first heard of Scuderia Colonia from an article in Motor Sport October 1960. DSJ described how von Trips was always keen to encourage young drivers: "Nobody is keener or more sincere about the sport of motor racing than Wolfgang von Trips, and in numerous small ways he does a great amount to foster the sport in Germany , and in particular he is continually fighting the anti-motor racing element which is rather strong in that country". He had bought a Formula 2 cooper and was having a Formula Junior DKW (the TCA?) built.

I am intrigued by Michael's suggestion that the Junior Lotus could have been the same car as raced in F1. Most if not all Juniors at that time had drum brakes. I thought, but haven't checked that the regulations demanded it until 1962, whereas the F1 Lotus 18s all had disk brakes. I could be wrong on this.

As regards Marcor's question of whether te Scuderia acieved its goal, clearly it did not enable any young German drivers to reach the top of international racing. It did, however, achieve the more realistic target of fostering enthusiasm and I suspect that this may have been been von Trips' goal. Of course, things coul have been very different if von Trips had survived and particularly if he had won the 1961 world championship.

[Michael Müller]

Yes, the TCA had a DKW 2-stroke engine. The "A" in TCA sometimes is said to stand for "Auto-Union" (DKW was part of AU), others - especially if another engine was fitted - say "Automobili".

Don't know the technical details of FJ then, but it seems unlikely that they had 2 different Lotus 18. It may also possible, that the car was originally a FJ, and was ran in F1 with another engine - with drum brakes! Interesting topic, anybody willing to pick it up?

Von Trips did a lot for German motorsport, e.g. it was him who convinced the then denfense minister Franz-Josef Strauss to open air force fields for motorsport events, e.g. Kassel-Calden and Mainz-Finthen.

[ry6]

The Scuderia ran the Lotus 18 and a Cooper T45 for von Trips and Seidel respectively in the December 1960 Cape and SAGP's.
Von Trips was 3rd in the Cape and Seidel an out of fuel with a lap to go while lying 4th.
The chassis numbers of these cars were apparently 18-373 and
F2-22-58.

In the SAGP Seidel was 5th but von Trips retired at half distance after trouble with the ignition.

The cars then ran in the SA Championship Pat Fairfield Trophy at Roy Hesketh Circuit. Seidel was 3rd and Tony Maggs, who drove the 18, was 5th.

[ry6]

I have just checked the official programmes of the 3 South African races I mentioned.

In the Cape and SAGP's the entrants of the cars were the same as the drivers eg

Entrant : W von Trips
Driver : W von Trips

Seidel entered himself for the Fairfield race.
Maggs was down to drive his Heron in the official programme of the "Fairfield" but obviously there was a "late" change to the
Colonia Lotus 18.

Despite the Scuderia not being the official entrant it is clear that the cars were Colonia cars.

[Michael Müller]

Don't believe the Lotus and the Cooper had been "Colonia cars" then, but privately owned by Seidel and von Trips. As said earlier, Scuderia Colonia was only registered as legal entity in early 1961. Von Trips at that time was Ferrari works driver, so it could well be that he had no use anymore for his privately owned car, and handed over ownership to the Scuderia Colonia, but Seidel was still privateer, and obviously used the Scuderia for entry purposes. Could well be a kind of tax advantage, a German "e.V." - registered club - is released from tax, so start and price moneys for Scuderia Colonia entries could be seen as tax-free sponsorship.

[fines]

Originally posted by Roger Clark
I am intrigued by Michael's suggestion that the Junior Lotus could have been the same car as raced in F1. Most if not all Juniors at that time had drum brakes. I thought, but haven't checked that the regulations demanded it until 1962, whereas the F1 Lotus 18s all had disk brakes. I could be wrong on this.

"auto motor sport" 12/61 (Jun 3) reports, that "from now on" brakes on FJunior cars are free. From 1962 onwards, two-circuit brake systems would be compulsory.

In an earlier issue (10/61) "ams" also states that the Scuderia Colonia is entirely Wolfgang Seidel's enterprise. No mention of an involvement of Trips!

[ry6]

I am looking at a photo on page 15 of Classic Car Africa April 1996 which shows Wolfgang von Trips Lotus 18 chasing Fanie Viljoen (Maserati 200SI) in the SAGP at East London.

The inside of the right front wheel can be seen and it appears that this "18" has disc brakes.

It would also seem that the suspension bits are a bit more "beefy" than the FJ bits.

I am not an expert on this but that's what it looks like to me.

[Roger Clark]

von Trips' lotus 1-373 was an ex-Ireland works car. It would be very surprising if it didn't have disc brakes.

I find the Auto Motor und sort statement that Scuderia Colonia was entirely Seidel's concept very surprising. THe British magazines of the time said that von Trips was behind it, yet I accept that a German magazine is more likely to have inside information. Could the date of ams, after von Trips' death be relevant?

also the list of Colonia cars that michael has posted on the Jupp Schmitz thread is different from what i believed them to run.

[ry6]

Just a snippet abouit the Pat Fairfield Trophy in which Tony Maggs drove the Colonia/Seidel Lotus 18 -

As I said the entry for Maggs did not appear in the official program as it was obviously "late" but I seem to remember reading a magazine article which said that the car had been entered by Mrs Seidel.

If I remember right they gave her a title like "Countess".

I will try to find the article.

(I have not mixed up with Countess d'Enseidel who I think raced in the days of Elizabetta Junek.)

Rob

[fines]

Originally posted by ry6
(I have not mixed up with Countess d'Enseidel who I think raced in the days of Elizabetta Junek.)

That's Gräfin von Einsiedel, btw. I don't recall Margot Seidel being a Countess, however.

[Michael Müller]

Have some cross-linking between this thread and the "Jupp Schmitz" topic, however, I continue here.

May be we are talking about 2 different things, the "Scuderia Colonia" as race entrant for Seidel in 1959 and 1960, and the "Scuderia Colonia e.V.", founded 13 Jan 1960 (1961 as given earlier by me is wrong, sorry). The Födisch/Louis biography of Wolfgang von Trips says that he was elected first president of the club, and they also say he was the initiator. Fines, you are nearest, may be you can find something during your next visit to Villa Trips.

One thing also is strange to me: if Wolfgang Seidel was really from Düsseldorf as said elsewhere in this thread, why should he name his team Scuderia "Colonia"? For those who don't know, although only 20 miles apart, the native inhabitants of Cologne and Düsseldorf are like cat and dog ...!

Any how could an ordinary technical employee of Daimler-Benz spent a "horrendous sum" for getting a F1 cockpit - in pre-sponsorship era?

[fines]

Michael, unfortunately I was just there (on Friday), and don't know if I'll be going again this year. After all, it's about three hours of journey for just four hours in the lib! I don't know too much about Seidel, though, maybe he was born in Cologne?

[ry6]

I have found an old article in a South African motoring magazine which covered the 1960 Dec / 1961 January Springbok Series in which Seidel and von Trips took part.
It states that the cars belonged to Seidel.

[paulhooft]

Scuderia Colognia still exsists today, an I was handed a card by a key member lately..
I was at the memorial day on 10 september 1991,
40 years after Graf Wolfgang Berghe von Trips died at Monza,
and was very pleased to see how many other attended the Meeting, that included a visit to the graveyard and a visit to the Villa Trips, 40 years after he died.
One Ferrari driver was missing, that should have come:
Michael Schumacher...

Paul