26 replies to this topic

[MichiganF1]

Just read on Speedvision he has talked with BAR and Arrows. I would love to see him get it, but apart from getting a token American, don't see how he could be the best option for these teams. Herta's a fine road racer but has never seemed up to F1 standards.

I do hope it's a serious proposition and not a lark or publicity stunt.

[ehagar]

Well, there have been worse test drivers... so why not. BAR? I wonder if Forsythe has anything to do with that...

[precise]

Much testing needs to be done next season coz of such things like the tyre war and car developement.

So employing a few more test drivers, like Ferrari, could be a very possible option.

[KenC]

Originally posted by MichiganF1
Just read on Speedvision he has talked with BAR and Arrows. I would love to see him get it, but apart from getting a token American, don't see how he could be the best option for these teams. Herta's a fine road racer but has never seemed up to F1 standards.

I do hope it's a serious proposition and not a lark or publicity stunt.

I've always considered Bryan a Coulthard-like driver. Very quick in qualifying, but a little lacking when it comes to racing. Bryan is no world-beater, but I think he is definitely fast enough to make a career of it in F1.

He's more suited to F1, than CART, where his weakness on ovals hurt him in the championship.

I've said it before, and I'll point it out again. There are 4 road courses in CART: Portland, MidOhio, RoadAmerica and Laguna Seca. There is also a temporary circuit which is closer to a road circuit than a street track, due to the lack of concrete barriers for much of the circuit. On these 5 tracks, Bryan has been superb in qualifying, a critical requirement for F1 success.

In the 5 seasons, when he had a regular top-line ride, from 95 to 99, Bryan qualified on the front two rows of the above 5 road courses, 18 times. That's 18 of 25, or 72% of the time. In CART, that's superb qualifying, better than Juan, better than Dario, better than Michael Andretti, better than Jacques Villeneuve, better than Papis, better than Blundell, better than Gugelmin, better than C. Fittipaldi, better than S. Nakano, better than Moreno, and better than Alex Zanardi. And, all of those drivers have had a shot at F1 or tested an F1 car.

For comparison with drivers, who all drove at various periods during Bryan's time in CART, Jacques Villeneuve's qualifying record is 6 for 10, 60% qualifying on the front two rows. Alex Zanardi's qualifying record, during his 96 to 98 years, was 9 for 15, 60% qualifying on the front two rows. And, Juan Montoya's qualifying record, was 3 for 10, 30%.

Bryan came up thru karting like many top F1 drivers. Bryan has always been fast, winning the Indy Lites championship with 8 poles and 7 wins in 1993. In 91, he was the Barber Saab champ, the same formula that Kenny Brack won a couple years later, and Juan Montoya finished 3rd in a few years later. In addition, Bryan has looked international early in his career, by competing in the Formula Ford Festival at Brands Hatch, finishing 11th of 193 drivers in 1991.

Bryan deserves a test seat, and will likely surprise people with his speed.

[BRG]

There are lots of half decent drivers around who could be used for testing. Why use Herta? He doesn't know any of the circuits (Brands Hatch is not a GP track anymore) and would need to learn everything before he could contribute much. Any competent driver out of F3000 will at least know the tracks.

Also, looking at KenC's statistics, a brilliant qualifier who cannot then turn it into consistent race performances isn't much use as a tester. The teams aren't looking for one quick lap, they want a ultra consistent and fast pace , for lap after lap to give them useful data. Herta doesn't look like the right choice.

[aportinga]

I think it's the news (Herta looking), which promotes the conversation. Most recently it has been mentioned that he actually spoke with BAR and Arrows regarding a ride - which I don't think he'll get.

I have to agree with BRG on this one and suggest that there are better drivers. However I'd look at giving better American drivers a shot. Gurney, Edwards and others are in the que. Giving one of them a minor testing role will certainly not hinder a teams daliy operations.

[MichiganF1]

That is good research, Ken, and I was surprised by those statistics.

[Ross Stonefeld]

Test drivers are one of two things.

-A young driver being picked up and groomed for a future race seat

-A veteran with lots of F1 mileage who is useful to the test team



Bryan Herta is neither.

[LuckyStrike1]

They don't use Laguna Seca as a F1 test track so why bother ...;)

Herta contributing to a F1 team as a testdriver is as likely as a Minardi landing on the moon in my opinion... why would any F1 team even consider a driver that can't make it in CART and never has driven a F1 car at all ....

[Blade]

I heard once from Senna in the news that Herta has a huge talent and was extremely quick.. faster than Senna in a secret test with McLaren in 1993. I think Herta is the next big thing since MS.

[KenC]

Originally posted by BRG
There are lots of half decent drivers around who could be used for testing. Why use Herta? He doesn't know any of the circuits (Brands Hatch is not a GP track anymore) and would need to learn everything before he could contribute much. Any competent driver out of F3000 will at least know the tracks.

Also, looking at KenC's statistics, a brilliant qualifier who cannot then turn it into consistent race performances isn't much use as a tester. The teams aren't looking for one quick lap, they want a ultra consistent and fast pace , for lap after lap to give them useful data. Herta doesn't look like the right choice.

Why?

¥ He's known as very analytical, and can develop good setups.
¥ He's not THAT old, only 31. Younger than Salo and McNish, who are restarting their careers with Toyota's F1 effort.
¥ He's not just "half decent", but clearly shown to be extremely quick on road courses.
¥ Some F1 teams might be interested in an American, not just any American, but a fast one, and Herta is arguably the fastest American on roadcourses, at the moment.
¥ Bryan didn't know Brands back in 91, either. That didn't stop him from figuring out the track and finishing 11th out of 193 drivers.
¥ Bryan is quick out of the box, in his first full-season in CART, he qualified on the front two rows on the 5 roadcourses, 3 times, 60%. Did a very good F3000 driver, like Junqueira do better in his first season? He's a pretty "competent" F3000 driver, being champ and all.
¥ Race setups and qualifying setups are not that much different in F1 any more.
¥ Like I said, Bryan is a Coulthard-like driver. Not a worldbeater. He's a good qualifier, and can race well from the front, much like David.
¥ Bryan failed at CART because less than a quarter of its tracks are roadcourses.

Having said all that, Bryan is not my kind of driver. I much prefer the Zanardi or Montoya type. A real racer. My point being that Herta is a much faster driver than most people realize. And, would be good as a tester. CART never suited his strengths, while F1 would much better suit his strengths. I always considered Bryan a fish out of water. He always should have gone to F3/F3000 back in 92/93. I believe he tested for Alan Docking Racing in Brit F3 for 92, but didn't have the funds to race.

[Ross Stonefeld]

heh, Oliver Panis' engineer drove at brands this year and finished like 13th


If you want to get behind an American in F1, come bother me, Herta is daydreaming

[Daniel Lester]

In news just to hand Minardi have joined forces with Nasa to send another mission to the moon.

The Minardi1 will be launched in a years time.

[ehagar]

Originally posted by Ross Stonefeld
heh, Oliver Panis' engineer drove at brands this year and finished like 13th

He made the final I believe, but got in an accident with some other driver.

[NYR2119935]

Go Bryan!!

[rdrcr]

Well, since I'm aquainted with the guy and even more so his partner Hollis Brown in their Kart Racing facility in Las Vegas. I thought I'd give Hollis, (who built my engines when I was in the PP classes) a call and see what was up. He (Bryan) is on the air this evening with Tagliani promoting the Las Vegas Karting Center's big event this weekend. He will appear on the CART Hotline show, produced by the CART Radio Network with host Larry Henry, live from Brendon’s pub in the Orleans Hotel and Casino in Las Vegas. When I inquired about Herta's efforts for F1 - there was a guarded reply - that a couple of testing positions are being considered - with the big "if" being the assurances of a full time seat in 03. It's all just preliminary so far. He wouldn't comment on the BAR & Arrows reports as the teams being contacted.

I don't know if he will ever make the jump as the commitment level is very high, moving family and all. Plus, the brutal competitivness that is evident from F3000 ranks into F1 testing seats is formidable to say the least. Still, many teams are considering two man testing for next season.

Regarding Bryan's marketability - He does have the all American boy look and manner. He is polite and aware of what needs to be done. (read good management).

BTW - I'm sure your a "hot" driver Ross, but a little humility would go a long way... While Bryan may not be the "Racer" that Jimmy Vassar or Paul Tracy is, he is a fine driver and is fairly bright - he has the knowledge to understand how a car works and set-up for road courses.

IMHO, you should be seeking out that Anderson 250 and getting a job at Bondurant teaching so you can drive and practice every day. Plus, since you are from PHX it's your hometown and would be easy to settle yourself once again. Again, IMHO you do fair bit of talking for a guy who hasn't won a race yet. When your resume starts to look like the one below - then maybe you can start to yak a bit.



2000 Competed in the FedEx Championship Series
Contested five events, substituting for Walker Racing driver Shinji Nakano at Long Beach and Rio, and Mo Nunn Racing's Tony Kanaan at Portland, Cleveland and Toronto. Recorded two top-10 finishes -- fifth at Long Beach and ninth at Cleveland. Best starting position was fifth at Long Beach

1999 Competed in the FedEx Championship Series
Driver for Team Rahal piloting a Ford-Cosworth/Reynard on Firestones. Finished 12th in the championship with 84 points. claimed second consecutive victory from the pole at Laguna Seca. Recorded six top-six finishes including another podium finish (third) at Long Beach. Qualified fifth or better in nine of the 20 starts -- the fourth best qualifying average of the field. Finished nonth in laps led for the season with 84.

1998 Competed in the FedEx Championship Series
Driver for Team Rahal piloting a Ford-Cosworth/Reynard on Firestones. Finished eighth in the championship with 97 points. Claimed first Champ Car career win in a flag-to-flag victory at Laguna Seca. Was one of only two drivers to score the maximum possible points (22) at an event. Earned three pole positions (Long Beach, Portland and Laguna Seca). Started in the top five in 10 of 19 events. Posted five top-five finishes and 10 top-10 finishes. Finished sixth in laps led for the season with 171.

1997 Competed in the PPG CART World Series
Driver for Team Rahal piloting a Ford-Cosworth/Reynard on Goodyears. Finished 11th in the championship with 72 points. Claimed two pole positions (Mid-Ohio and Laguna Seca). Recorded nine top-10 finishes including a podium finish of third at Cleveland. Started 11 of 17 races in the top-10 with four top-five starts. Led five events finishing 13th in laps led with 54.

1996 Competed in the PPG Indy Car World Series
Driver for Team Rahal piloting a Mercedes/Reynard on Goodyears. Finished eighth in the championship with 86 points. Claimed two podium finishes of second at Michigan and Laguna Seca. Finished in the top-10 in eight of 16 events. Closed out the season with seven consecutive top-six finishes. Recorded six top-five starts including a second at Laguna Seca. Named the STP Most Improved Driver. Finished 10th in laps led with 41.

1995 Competed in the PPG Indy Car World Series
Driver for Chip Ganassi Racing Teams piloting a Ford-Cosworth/Reynard on Goodyears. First full season of Champ Car competition. Finished 20th in championship with 30 points. Earned first Champ Car career pole position at Phoenix, setting track record (19.785 sec) Earned first Champ Car podium with a second place finish at Cleveland. Claimed three top-10 finishes including a fifth place finish at Mid-Ohio. Posted four top-five starts including front row starts at Mid-Ohio and Laguna Seca. Finished only seven of 17 races. Finished 15th in laps led with 30.

1994 Competed in the PPG Indy Car World Series
Driver for A.J. Foyt Enterprises piloting a Ford-Cosworth/Lola on Goodyears. Partial season of competition (five events). Made debut at Indianapolis where he qualified 22nd and finished ninth. Was the second-highest finishing rookie at Indianapolis. Competed in four additional events posting two top-10 finishes (Milwaukee and Detroit). A practice accident at Toronto resulting in leg and pelvis injuries ended his season. Was testing by the end of the year, after signing with Chip Ganassi Racing for 1995.

1993 Competed in the Firestone Indy Lights Championship
Driver for Tasman Motorsports Group. Won the championship. Recorded seven wins in 12 events. Claimed eight pole positions, setting a new single-season series record. Made 10 podium visits and only once failed to finish in the top five. Completed 99 percent of laps run.

1992 Competed in the Firestone Indy Lights Championship
Driver for Landford Racing. Finished fifth in the championship. Scored four podium finishes including a win at Toronto. Finished 10 of 12 events in the top seven. Received "America's Choice" award as one of North America's top young drivers.

1991 Competed in the Barber-Saab Pro Series Championship
Won the championship. Won four events and claimed two pole positions. Recorded the fastest lap in five events. Awarded Valvoline Team USA Scholarship to compete in the Formula Ford Festival and World Cup, posting an 11th place finish out of 193 entrants. Made two Formula Atlantic starts.

1990 Competed in the Barber-Saab Pro Series Championship
Finished fifth in the championship. Best finish was a third at Mid-Ohio. Claimed one pole position at Lime Rock Park.

1989 Competed in the Skip Barber Formula Ford Race Series Championship
Won the championship. Claimed victory in 14 of 18 events.

1986-
1988 Competed in Karting Events
Placed third at the Karting World Championship. Finished second in the World Karting Association season point championship. Earned karting's Sporstman of the Year award.

1982-
1985 Competed in Karting Events
Was the season point champion each year.

1982 Began racing karts at age 12

[Ross Stonefeld]

I have yet to meet a driver with more natural ability than I. If I had the chances Bryan Herta had, Id have an even better CV.




He wont get a race drive for 2003 Like you said, its brutally competitive over there, and Herta has as many races in Europe as I do


If Red Bull/Ford want an American, go with Giebler or Long or Edwards at least. Antinucci will probably test for Arrows as it is.

[Pete Stanley]

Herta is not to be underestimated on any road course. People joke that the only track he's good at is Laguna Seca, but that's just not so. Herta is always excellent at Mid-Ohio, Road America, Portland, and Cleveland. He's had good races at Long Beach, too.

I can't stand those who say that Herta isn't a real racer. That's nonsense. His accident at Toronto in '94 was enormous. As was his Indy accident in '95.

[Crazy Canuck]

bryan herta sux $h1t. he should race....ummmm....hmmmmm.....nothing! He should go back to teaching people how to drive around Laguna Seca - teh only thing he does well.

CC

[rdrcr]

Ross,

Modestly said I'm sure - What you say may be true about Long or Edwards, as the chances of D. Hill seem to be fading. He hasn't run well this past season. I don't know if his contact was renewed. Anyway -

If in fact you have this God given natural ability then take heed of my words and seek out the valuable connections that may await you. A 250 will go a long way in keeping your reflexes sharp, skills honed. You can't do it sitting in the snow in Wisconson right?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see you rise to the level of your talents and abilities, I really would. All the upstarts are cocky... I've seen it, heard it and even drove against some of them... Herta has made it, so has Richy Hearn to some extent, but others, really fast guys like Lee Hatch and Ron Emick haven't. It takes the whole package of race savey, marketability, self-promotion and salesmanship. It's a 24 -7 job.

[911]

rdrcr,

Please check your PM. I hope you are doing well.

911

[Slyder]

I don't know but, um, due to his age and stuff, I won't be surprised if he becomes the next Damon Hill.

[clickhappy]

too bad he's raced all around the world, and been competitive, even won races.

More than YOU will ever do.

Originally posted by Crazy Canuck
bryan herta sux $h1t. he should race....ummmm....hmmmmm.....nothing! He should go back to teaching people how to drive around Laguna Seca - teh only thing he does well.

CC

[Kaiser]

Originally posted by Slyder
I don't know but, um, due to his age and stuff, I won't be surprised if he becomes the next Damon Hill.

One could hope, a real quick driver, with great character, and a WDC to boot!!

[Crazy Canuck]

Originally posted by clickhappy
too bad he's raced all around the world, and been competitive, even won races.

More than YOU will ever do.

We're not talking about me are we? Would you like to?

Anyway, I don't disagree with you rpost since it is mostly all fact; yes he's raced all over the world and yes he's won races but competitive could be debated.


CC

[NYR2119935]

I hope Herta gets a ride!!

[MortenF1]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by KenC
[B]

I've always considered Bryan a Coulthard-like driver. Very quick in qualifying, but a little lacking when it comes to racing.

For me, its the other way round. I think DC is stronger in races than in qualifying, although he has improved.