271 replies to this topic

[Alien]

Well i´ve been experiencing a growing interest in drivers from the past ....

One of the most spectacular sights in racing is the driver controlling the car when he´s absolutely at the edge of loosing it, correcting some oversteer or some understeer washout, or even recovering from a spin. Who do u think has had the best car control in f-1 ever? and what has been a sight that you always remembered?

For me probably it was Senna putting reverse, after spinning the car the wrong way and ending up on some kind of mud. He did this instantly, used his momentum and recovered the car so cleanly and spectacularly, i´ll never forget that mclaren getting out on the track again. Well that´s kind of spin recovery rather than car control, but that´s the sight that i´ll always remember.

I´ve heard and seen other amazing stories, like Nigel Roebuck´s account of G.Villeneuve handling a piece of sh*t ferrari in a 160+ kph corner, or some accounts on Clark controlling his spins and exiting the track at the same point to avoid damage. Depailler was another one who had just an amazing control, i put up a link to a video not long ago in the TNF. I´ve heard fangio and nouvalri had an amazing ability to control the car on the limit.

On a more modern account i remember Montoya, sliding through a chicane in portland in 1999 gaining a 10th on everyone else at the sector, a reporter said that it was "the stuff that legends are made out of". I also remember Montoya spinning at Road America because of a broken gearbox and controlling the car like a meter away from the wall with one hand while trying to get it in gear with the other. Or there was even a story of Montoya going lock-to-lock at the donnington Chicane in an F3, anybody heard of it.

So again, who´s had the best car control ever? and what is the sight that you´ll always remember?

[Barry Boor]

I think for 'hanging it out and yet getting it all back again' I would have to say that the best I have seen would be Archie Scott-Brown in the big Lister Jaguar.

[cheesy poofs]

I have two names that stand-out for me: Gilles Villeneuve and Ronnie Peterson

W W !!

[dretceterini]

Clark, as I am not old enough to have seen Nuvolari or Fangio (although I did see Fangio at the Monterey Historics)

[Robbie]

He's no longer flavour of the month but Michael Schumacher's car control is particularly fine: the reactionsand the constant corrections are a key feature of his success and his wet racing. Ask Eddie!

[Don Capps]

I saw folks like Buck Baker, Ned Jarrett, Sam McQuagg, LeeRoy Yarbrough, Tom Pistone, and Richard Petty do things on various tracks scattered throughout the Southeast that even made those with Jaundiced Eyes blink, sit up a bit straighter, look around, and then say, "Did I really see that?"

Gilles Villeneuve was simply amazing, in a class all by himself long before he hit GP/F1 -- his driving style in F/Atlantic was somewhere between breathtaking and frightening. He would set the car at an attitude and get through a corner at an angle that you swore he wouldn't do anything but bounce off the guardrails -- for lap after lap.

Jim Clark, Juan Fangio, and perhaps Mario Andretti were in a class all their own. They often didn't look fast -- until you looked at their times. I think Jackie Stewart and A.J. Foyt were also like that. But Clark was just so smooth, even when he had cars with some kick to them, like the Indy Lotus cars. How he spun -- twice! -- and keep that thing from hitting the walls either time was truly remarkable. I have seen the films many times and I still marvel at how he did it.

And, like Barry, Archie and the Listers....

[servellen]

I was young when i saw Senna Prost Mansell etc.. but I remember Senna was spectacular in carrying raw speed around the corners with much confidence. I really cannot say how it compares to Michael Shumacher's car control which is particularly smooth, consistant and effective, like the way he drives in the rain with the reflex corrections, it just seems very natural.

I think we have to remember that drivers drove different cars, quicte different spec, so it is difficult to really judge who has the best all time car control until we are able to raise some people from the dead and put them all in the same car and engine and have them races a few races.

I think Prost has the most finess in driving the car, very good with the tyres. His biggest shortcomming was his inability to adapt to wet weather conditions.

[Wolf]

Weeell, I'm here to bring up one name, and y'awl know who he is... He raised interesting points about driving techniques in 'Design and Behaviour...', namely that he had, long before the corner, decided what the car was ging to do, instead of reacting to car's input. I've always been taught that smooth is fast, and am follower of that train of thought. Although willing to admit that wringing the neck of the car in some cases, like GV I'd say, may under certain circumstances prove to be faster, I have always wondered how many drivers were loosing time by manhandling the car, rather than gaining time...

[tmccandless]

A few years ago, US coverage of a GP had super slow footage of a particular corner that Schuey was hitting within an inch or two every single lap. While it's not a loosing it and getting it back scenario, I thought it was pretty impressive all the same.

On second thought, like his dad, JV has pulled some doozies in his time. Of course he's planted the thing as well but I might give the tip to the Red Baron or Clark. My humble opinion.

[david_martin]

Walter Rohl springs to mind

[Alien]

I found roebuck´s account about Gilles Villenueve:

1981 French Grand Prix
Qualifying at Dijon:

During practice at Dijon in 1981, Gilles crashed at the Courbe de Pouas, an undulating, flat-in-fourth right hander, with no run-off worth mentioning. During the lunch break I found him dabbing a cut on his jaw: "Bloody catch pole cracked my helmet and broke the visor ..."

"You overdid it ?" I asked. "Just ran out of road?" "No, no," he grinned. "I ran out of lock! "The car is really bad through there - an adventure every time. Go and have a look this afternoon and you'll see what I mean." I did. I watched the Cosworth-engined Williams and Brabhams droning through on their rails, and waited.

At its clipping point, at the top of a rise, the Ferrari was already sideways, its driver winding on opposite lock. As it came past me, plunging downhill now, the tail stayed out of line, further and further, and still Gilles had his foot hard down. As he reached the bottom of the dip, I knew the position was hopeless, for now it was virtually broadside, full lock on, Villeneuve's head pointing up the road, out of the side of the cockpit.

Somehow, though, the Ferrari did not spin, finally snapping back into line as it grazed the catch fencing, then rocketing away up the hill. For more than a hundred yards, I swear it, the car was sideways at 130 mph. "That's genius," said David Hobbs, watching with me. "Are you seriously telling me he's won two Grand Prix in that?"

Found it on this page: http://www.f1cartvid...uvereports.html

[karlth]

Apart from the obvious. Heinz-Harald Frentzen has often amazed me with amazing reflexes, especially in 1999 (probably because the camera was on him more then)

[Liam]

I remember watching Shumi in his bennetton days qualifying at Hungary (I think) He came out of the last corner, and lost the back end, no hope of catching it. Instantly the car was clouded by rear tyre smoke, and the camera moved in to see the obvious wreakage on the on wall. The smoke cleared to reveal an empty track, nd then the director picked up Michael exiting turn 1! He'd lost it, floored it, did a full 360 in the middle of the track and drove off unharmed.
That and JPM in a CART car.
I've not had the pleasure of watching Gilles, wasn't even born for Jimmy, so the modern lot will have to do me

[fines]

Originally posted by Liam
I remember watching Shumi in his bennetton days qualifying at Hungary (I think) He came out of the last corner, and lost the back end, no hope of catching it. Instantly the car was clouded by rear tyre smoke, and the camera moved in to see the obvious wreakage on the on wall. The smoke cleared to reveal an empty track, nd then the director picked up Michael exiting turn 1! He'd lost it, floored it, did a full 360 in the middle of the track and drove off unharmed.

The most amazing fact about that spin was that his time for this lap was still considerably faster than the best his teammate was able to achieve using a more conventional line out of the last turn...

[Jdcasas]

I´m too young to take part in the nostalgia forum so I´ll just have to say JPM in a CART car.... truely amazing. The 99 season of cart was one of the best years of racing I have ever seen in any type of motorsport (and please dont bring up all the bs of lack of competitiveness, bad drivers etc. It was good racing anyways ;) ) People have to see a lap of montoya qualifying at milwaukee, or michigan 2000, or scraping the wall but still taking pole at the nazareth oval.

[SennasCat]

70s - Ronnie Peterson
80s - Gilles Villeneuve and Keke Rosberg - does anyone remember the 360 spin and continue he did at Long Beach and only lost one place
80s + 90s - Ayrton Senna. Saw on the box him pre-emptively wind on opposite lock at Spa coming out of Eau Rouge. Also was at the sweeper at Adelaide for his pole lap in 1985. Mesmerising
90s - Michael Schumacher and Jacques Villeneuve
Naughties - Juan Montoya (CART and F1) and Michael Schumacher

[AlesiUK]

i feel i have to mention Alesi here,his car control was,and still is amazing.My first memorys of watching Jean come from Birmingham in 1989,the birmingham superprix was held on a street circuit a bit like monaco(except without the glamour!).the story is well documented i think but it is true,in those days Halfords sponsored the race and had red and blue advertising signs plastered over the barriers.i remember my dad pointing out jeans car after the qualifying.the sidewalls of the tyres were red and blue,yet there was not a mark on the wheel.at the time i was about 8yrs old so it ment nothing to me,looking back though it was pretty amazing.

another example that springs to mind is spa 95,first qualifying was wet and hardly anyone went out.alesi did and the bit that sticks in my mind is coming out of la source,the car was sliding all over the place but jean had it under control then suddenly the car snapped left towards the barrier,jean caught it,it then broke right so much that the tv pictures showed 2 spectators standing behind the wall ducking,they though the ferrari was going to hit them.Alesi somehow caught it and sped off down towards eau rouge.i think he ended up about 2 seconds faster than anyone else!

France 92?after the restart it rained heavly and everone headied to the pits for wets except jean and he was only a second a lap slower than the guys on wets,eventually he spun at 170mph(i read somewhere that it is still the longest spin telemetry has ever recorded!).

other examples include nurburgring95 and suzuka95.

[ry6]

What is great car control?

A driver handling a spectacular tail-out (oversteering) slide, a driver patiently extracting the last "tenth of a second" out of an ugly "torpedo" type understeer, or a driver so smooth that he makes it look easy?

I have been lucky to see Ronnier Peterson and Jochen Rindt handling spectacular tail-out slides and Jim Clark on the other hand driving so smoothly that he did not look like he was actually streaking away from his pursuers.

What we apparently "see" does not always reflect the expertise of the driver inside the cockpit.

[Ray Bell]

Not much mention of Jochen Rindt yet...

Of course, seeing him dominate that Warwick Farm race in a downpour must rate as one of the great drives, but he'd been receiving accolades from many quarters for years before that, especially in the F2 Brabhams.

Then there was mention somewhere that he spun at Spa in 66... is that right?

[Vitesse2]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
Not much mention of Jochen Rindt yet...

Then there was mention somewhere that he spun at Spa in 66... is that right?

Yes - very much so. IIRC some of the footage in "Grand Prix" shows him spinning the Cooper in that sudden downpour that did for Stewart, Hill, Bonnier, Spence, Bondurant, Hulme and Siffert. Jochen being Jochen, I don't think he lifted ...

[David M. Kane]

I like Steve Williams list, Jochen Rindt was a master too as Ray Bell pointed out. Lets not forget the early Jody Scheckter. David Hobbs also had some interesting things to say about his sideways style, "I've never seen anyone who could take a car from the brink of diaster only to put it immediately back into another". I particularly remember a F5000 race at Watkins Glen in a Sid Taylor Lola. I walked away that day saying, "that guy has very big balls!".

[Ray Bell]

Another driver with incredible car control, who I've seen do some marvellous things, is KB.

I'm sure many others will back me up in this.

[Vitesse2]

Originally posted by David M. Kane
I like Steve Williams list, Jochen Rindt was a master too as Ray Bell pointed out. Lets not forget the early Jody Scheckter. David Hobbs also had some interesting things to say about his sideways style, "I've never seen anyone who could take a car from the brink of diaster only to put it immediately back into another". I particularly remember a F5000 race at Watkins Glen in a Sid Taylor Lola. I walked away that day saying, "that guy has very big balls!".

Errr .... Silverstone 1973 comes to mind here!! For the WRONG reasons!

[Doug Nye]

What constitutes the kind of 'car control' envisaged as being at the core of this thread is a critical question. Car control per se - i.e. the ability to make a motor car sit up and beg upon command regardless of the circumstances - was perhaps best demonstrated in as humble a branch of motoring as driving tests, in which speed hardly ever exceeds a 20mph rush from one test 'box' marked out by traffic cones, to another. Paddy Hopkirk - the Monte Carlo Rally-winning Mini-Cooper star - was a master of this true art, and to see him spinning his car to line-up within millimetres in a parking box, and then to accelerate into another box, slither to a stop with his front tyres' contact patch just mm over the check-line, already spinning in reverse 'cos he's shooting back out again...and all against the pitiless clock, was truly to see a master at work.

In the 1980s I completed a BMW high-speed driving course at Salzburgring under Rauno Aaltonen - another ex-BMC works team Mini star - and Rauno's demonstration of 10/10ths wiggle-woggle motoring in a BMW M3, in reverse, was utterly electrifying.

Car control at F1-type high speeds in inclement weather is really a different department - and for that I think I'd nominate either Keke Rosberg in the race-winning Theodore at Silverstone 1978 (? is that right, the year Andretti et al aquaplaned off at Abbey Curve???), or Jacky Ickx for his manouevre in overtaking Lauda on the outside round Paddock Hill Bend at Brands Hatch in 1974 (???ish? - without looking it up). Both cars were teetering on the most visibly ragged of ragged edges - Ickx's for 200 yards - but Keke's for lap, after lap, after mesmeric lap. The car was crap. The car control was fantastic... but still perhaps not quite up to Paddy 'Opscotch at less than 20mph in his driving tests.

DCN

[dretceterini]

I agree with Mr.Nye. Anyone who can put a car within a mm of where they want to go, even at 20-30 mph is one hell of a driver!

Stu

[David M. Kane]

Vitesse 2:

Err? Gilles and Jochen Rindt had a shunt or two in their day too! Jody's,
I must admit, does take the cake. He did overcome Silverstone and he did go
on to win a World Championship...

[rdrcr]

I concur with Doug's assessment and interpretation of "car control". I haven't seen the actual racing drives (live) of those before 1975... So with that in context in mind...

There are two types of car control in road racing... On the one hand, there is the style of making it look so easy, as in Jackie Stewart's effortless finesse behind the wheel, no matter what he was in. And on the other, the raw, brutal 11/10's driving of a Gilles Villeneuve. Both, exude two types of car control that I've witnessed, which given the two interpretations of the definition, are fine examples in my personal estimation.

Also, the inclusion of Rally greats like a Hopkirk or a Walter Rohl or one of the current wizards of the drift, Tommy Makinen must be mentioned. As the WRC drivers give the highest examples of supreme car control due to the fact that there is the variable of the constant unforeseen situation that must be contended with at almost every every corner.

[MrAerodynamicist]

If you're talking 360s, I've got a video clip of Mansell doing one at some insane speed after mucking up an attempt to pass Berger, Imola '90. JV also has something about spins on the last corner of Austria! A couple of years ago he did a 360 without stopping on said corner, then this year he did a 180, didn't stopped the car while it was going backwards and then did a J turn to face back the right way and carried on!

[The Runner]

TOM PRYCE !

[stevew]

Originally posted by Jdcasas
I´m too young to take part in the nostalgia forum so I´ll just have to say JPM in a CART car.... truely amazing. The 99 season of cart was one of the best years of racing I have ever seen in any type of motorsport (and please dont bring up all the bs of lack of competitiveness, bad drivers etc. It was good racing anyways ;) ) People have to see a lap of montoya qualifying at milwaukee, or michigan 2000, or scraping the wall but still taking pole at the nazareth oval.

Yep, JPM on a CART oval.

You said you're too young to take part in this forum, but you saw one of the very best at car control...

[Keir]

Amon in the 250F, Gilles in anything, Senna at Monaco on a Q lap!!

[Rainer Nyberg]

Tiff Needell does magnificent powerslides!

[Ray Bell]

When I mentioned KB, two specific instances came to mind...

Reversing at valve bounce in an EH Holden as he dodged between the piers to fling the thing into its parking spot under a motel in Brisbane - Jim and Carmen McGuire shaking their heads as he did so - and pitching his T400 backwards into the wall at Oran Park neatly and precisely when he had the brake line fail.

Peter Wherrett's description of his attack on the Bathurst esses when he set that 100mph lap record is another memorable point in a career studded with great drives.

[William Dale Jr]

Ray, would KB's lap in Hardies Heroes in 1981 fall into the above category?

[AlesiUK]

to add more to alesi claim,does anyone else remember the infamous story about Jean's drive home after Monza1994?he was leading the race and wouldve won if not for the car breaking down in the pits.he stepped out of the car and went straight into his alpha road car,still in his overalls.he sped of towards avignon,his brother jose who was in the passanger seat got out after 30mins,he was to scared.alesi was ment to drive to milam airport and then fly home,he didnt feel like doing that.he drove flat out all the way back to avignon and beat his own record!

I remember an interview with nigel roebuck a couple of years ago,he was asked a question something along the lines of:"if you had to get to an airport 100miles away and you had only 1hr to get there,which racing driver,past or present would you choose to drive you there?".he said "for sheer speed and chance of getting there i would probably choose senna,clark or fangio"."but for sheer excitment i would choose Jean Alesi!"-he was talking about the above story!.that,along with Murray Walkers choice of jean in his f1 heroes is eveidence enough of the greatness of the man.

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by William Dale Jr
Ray, would KB's lap in Hardies Heroes in 1981 fall into the above category?

Probably fits right in with the EH between the piers...

If only John Medley and Bob Levett would start posting, they could elaborate on some specific instances.

[wsshores]

Originally posted by david_martin
Walter Rohl springs to mind

I had the good fortune, in 1988, to see Walter Röhrl in the Audi 200 Quattro at Sears Point. One of the practice sessions was held in a downpour. Most of the drivers didn't go out onto the track. Some took a few exploratory laps. Walter Röhrl was out for the entire session, treating the crowd to a spectacular display of opposite lock car control. It was beautiful.

William


This was the car:
http://audisportclas...ca/transam.html

[buzard]

I was at an F5000 race at Riverside. Standing on the bank outside of turn 7. I heard a funny sound
and looked down at my feet and saw the right front wing endplate, the right front wheel then
right rear wheel pass by me about 6 feet away. Someone lost it going into 7 and rather than
spin just rode the dirt bank around like it was Daytona. The white T333 with gold trim then
come back to the flat dirt area, shot two rooster tails of dirt from the rear tires, snapped around
and slid throught the dirt on the inside of turn 7a and slid up onto the straight! WOW!

Warwick Brown.

And any race that has Jimmy Sills in it!

buzard

[Ray Bell]

Yes, I forgot Warwick, he was an amazing talent.

He did that once before, you know... at Surfers Paradise, where there is a kind of levee bank around the whole circuit. Under the bridge he went wide, that was the fastest corner on any Australian circuit, too... and went onto the levee bank...

He said later that he thought he'd be right. He sort of thought of it as a wall of death thing, using the embankment to take him around, but the bank had a gap in it and the T300 nosedived into the other side of the gap and folded under.

He had his feet folded under too... lots of damage, and then had fatty embolisms and nearly died... strange to know he did that again!

[Ray Bell]

Finally it has come to me... it really should have been one of the first things I thought of...

At Warwick Farm the esses lead to a set of faster esses entered as you cleared the Northern Crossing. That's a fast right, then there's a fast left past the start of the ornamental lake with the black swans in it... that's where I used to wave flags.

as one straightened up from the left hander you were already in the braking area for the Causeway. this was a very tight left hander into a narrow section across the centre of the little lake, with Armco each side, right on the edge of the road, with a slightly less tight left on the exit with a quick rush up to Polo Corner... this exit from the Causeway was directly behind the paddock area.

The car involved was this one...



This car was recognised as a difficult one, unlike the predecessor, the Mildren 'Yellow Submarine' which Kevin had revelled in with both Alfa 2.5 V8 and Waggott TC4V 2 litre engines. With the lump of Chevy in the back, F5000s were worst under brakes, I guess.

In that era of the M10B, they had taken a chance on this orphan chassis. but at its first outing it was difficult to get it to handle well - and I think it remained so for some time. In practice, Frank Matich had been the class of the field with a 1:23.9, much better than Graeme Lawrence in the ex-Amon 2.5 Ferrari Dino on 1:25.1, though he got down to a 1:24.4 in the last session. Leo Geoghegan with the Waggott TC4V-powered Lotus 59 had a 1:25.2, Niel Allen's M10B a 1:25.5 and Max Stewart's Rennmax with the same power as Geoghegan a 1:25.9, so KB was fifth on the grid with 1:26.1 before he also improved in the last session, getting fourth on the grid with a 1:25.7. David Walker had a 1:26.5 in the Lotus 70.

In the race Matich bolted with Allen passing Lawrence on the first lap as KB followed Geoghegan and Stewart. But the second lap saw KB get by the little cars and then he passed Lawrence to be a threat to Allen.

Manfully he forced this great hulk to perform the deed of staying with the top car in the class, but he was working it hard, and on the sixteenth lap he lost it entering the Causeway. It was a quick 180 degree spin, Lawrence and Geoghegan were right up behind him so he was there facing them as they entered the Causeway...

But KB didn't just spin and come to a stop... no sir! He was almost at rest when he dropped the clutch and powered on... but not going forwards... he had plucked reverse and backed off the Causeway, round the corner and did a quick front end throw to get the car spun around again... and still without coming to a stop had it in a forward gear and was off towards Polo as Geoghegan went by him!

Is that car control or what?

[Pyry L]

The most interesting display of car control I´ve witnessed in person was watching Matti Alamaki and Martin Schanche drive the wheels off their cars in Norway in the late 80s. Martin was all over the track in his RS200, using all of the road and then some...then along came mr. Alamaki in his 205 turbo 16 very gently, not looking all that fast, you know: very little opposite lock in the corners, the tires kicking up only a little bit of gravel and the whole scene in general looking a bit sedate. That was until you looked at the times The most fantastic display of driving I´ve witnessed was Hannu Mikkola at the 1985 1000 lakes rally in an Audi S1, there are no words to describe the experience. Perhaps a comparison could be drawn with Keke´s blistering lap of Silverstone, you could just see that he was driving to completely different laws of physics than everybody else. On video it has to be In Car 956 with Derek Bell at the wheel, Patrick Depailler and heads above all else the onboard videos of Ari Vatanen, Walter Rohrl and Per Eklund driving up Pikes Peak.

[David M. Kane]

Runner:

I once saw Tom Pryce in a Shadow at Watkins Glen and he was fantastic. Sorry I had forgotten about him. In my mind, he was a star headed to a very
big future.

[Pine]

Originally posted by Alien
What is the sight that you´ll always remember?

Jean Alesi lapping a backmarker. His left fist is in the air, waving angily at the backmarker. His other hand is on the steering wheel, in full opposite lock
It was in the early '90s, and I don't think I will ever forget that.

[David McKinney]

A couple of personal observations.
Back in 1963 or 1964, I was standing trackside at Levin in New Zealand, on the inside of a sweeping corner which would have been taken by the fastest saloons at around 80mph (or even 130km/h). The leading Lotus-Cortina was cornering as if on rails - at least so it seemed as I glanced up from my lap-chart each lap. It was only after a few laps, when the guy had made a bit of a break on the field, that I was able to watch more closely. Every lap the front wheels were going to perhaps 15 or 20 degrees either side of centre, maybe three or four times on each lock, in the space of a couple of seconds, without the tail moving out an inch, and with the car deviating from the perfect line not one iota. That impressed me.

Fast forward to 19/9/99, and the Goodwood Revival meeting. I was lucky enough to be able to watch the Richmond and Gordon Trophies race from another trackside position, this time at the exit to the chicane. Now, over the years, I’ve watched many, many people driving 250F Maseratis, some a lot better than others. On a corner like this, flooring the throttle-pedal is likely to kick the tail out. Your gentleman driver, if he’s going fast enough for this to happen, tends to lift off to bring it back into line. A more experienced driver will keep his foot in it, apply some opposite lock, and let the tail come back of its own accord. A really good driver, say a Willie Green, will be going 10mph faster and will make several large corrections to the steering - perhaps sawing away three or four times before the car straightens out.
But that day at Goodwood I saw something I’d never seen before, and wouldn’t have believed if I hadn’t seen it with my own eyes. And it wouldn’t have been noticeable, at least not so obviously, from any spectator enclosure. Another 250F driver, an old guy of about 70, came out of that corner a little faster than he had on earlier laps (it was wet, remember) and got the tail out a tad further than he wanted. He kept his foot in it, and must have applied twenty corrections in the space of two or three seconds to keep the car pointed the way he wanted it. I didn’t know anyone’s arms could move so fast, and it explained to me why Stirling Moss - for it was he - was the great driver he was.

[eldougo]

I have seen all the following drivers an it,s to hard to pick
who had the best car control.
MOSS-CLARK-RINDT-PETERSON-PRYCE-VILLENUVE-ARNOUX-ROSBERG
SENNA-SCHUMACHER-MONTOYA.
In order down the years ,however only one goes to the top
of the list GILLIES.IN 1977 British GP.Qualified 9th.
in a McLaren m23 . Iwas standing on the in side of STOWE
corner an he came in there so fast he lost it an as it was
spinning around he grabed 1st or 2nd gear an just powered
away,Just unreal presence of mind to do that in his FIRST
ever drive of an F1 car,an that was only after a hand full
of laps under his belt.JUST UNREAL.

[Wolf]

One would think that holding a car in perfect flat-out 4 wheel drift, while having to steer with only one hand (the other holding a gear lever in place) would at least get an honourable mention...;)

[Ray Bell]

Fangio in Champagne country, Wolf?

Having seen the great man at work, I am inclined to say he was truly a master, even at seventy-something years of age.

Coming up the back straight at Sandown on rock-hard tyres in the 3-litre W196, he was seemingly going over the top of the hill into the fast downhill esses with just a bit of a back-off. But as I got closer to this scene, I became aware that this was just not so. I started hearing things.

As he reached the back-off point, I heard the tyres just faintly chirping.... each lap the same, chirping away. The old man had those wheels on the point of locking up without going too far, and you just wouldn't have known.

No wonder Brabham exclaimed about him that day, "It gives you heart to see him driving that hard at that age..."

[Doug Nye]

Wolf - JYS Spa '67 H16 BRM??? Not merely car control but also the most enormous ???? And were not JMF's most celebrated high-speed drifts in Normandy or in the Eifel rather than Champagne???

DCN

[Ray Bell]

Fangio's celebrated "without lifting off" at Reims was in a car that jumped out of top gear...

[dmj]

Sometimes even a driver with less natural ability can find a fascinating way through a corner... I remember a race in Montreal, three years ago, I believe, where certain Irish Ferrari driver did wonders in last corner. Lap after lap he drove through it with mere inches from wall and a lot, lot closer than everyone else (except ones who actualy hit that wall...) I am sad he will be so down the grid there this year that I won't have oportunity to watch him again... No TV live coverage for him, I am afraid.
But for best ever... I hope Dennis won't mind I took this from his site:

His next major race saw him involved in a duel with the greatest of them all, Tazio Nuvolari. At Pescara in Italy, he attempted to pass the Mantuan on the second lap but skidded off-course and burst both rear tires. He limped back to the pit but rather than being humbled by this he returned to the race to continue the attack. On the eighth lap his brakes sized before entering a corner and the car slid of the road, jumped a ditch and passed between a telegraph pole and the parapet of a bridge before re-emerging onto the circuit and back into the race. Rosemeyer eventually finished second behind his teammate Varzi on this most eventful afternoon.
After the race, Dr. Porsche went to the scene of Rosemeyer's drive through the woods and being the engineer measured the gap between the pole and the bridge. He found it to be only 2 1/2 cm. or 1 inch wider than the Auto Union at its widest point. Silently the mercurial Porsche shook hands with the young driver and patted his shoulder. Rosemeyer won his first race in the Masaryk G.P. in Czechoslovakia finishing six minutes ahead of Nuvolari and Chiron.