215 replies to this topic

[Redliner]

Hi everyone, how are you all? I have a simple question really. Which drivers have been thrown out of their cars? A few famous examples spring to mind. Martin Donnelly, Gilles Villenueve, Hans Hermann and Wolfgang Von Tripps. But this cant be the definitive list. Anyone who was thrown out in any formula or series would be appreciated, and the circumstances leading to their being chucked out.

[Liam]

Until the early 70's the cars didn't have seat belts, the thinking being if the car caught fire you wante to be able to get out, or, if it turned over, you didn't want to be in it at the time.

[Wolf]

Well, Redliner- Joe Fan can tell You a few stories of Masten bailing out of still moving cars... Does that qualify? And of course there is the famous Hermann accident on AVUS, in BRP entered BRM Type 25. Do a quick search and You'll find amazing photos posted in here.

Speaking of seat belts, I remember Moss saying he almost DNS in a race in America where the seatbelts were mandatory- apparently, Americans were the trend setters in that field too. Of course, most drivers in that time preferred being thrown out rather than to have a car land on top of them.

[MrAerodynamicist]

My headmaster told us once about how when he took his driving test, the time came for the emergancy stop. Instructor gives signal, he does the stop. He turns to look at the instructor only to realise that the guy braced himself against the door handle and is now lying in the gutter

[Ray Bell]

To clarify the mandating of safety harnesses...

Moss was speaking of simple lap belts, which it is now commonly known are not much help. And it was the popular belief that to be 'thrown clear' was the best defence against serious injury in a big accident.

But Dr Michael Henderson had other ideas, and he convinced a small number of people to use six-point harnesses that I think he designed. Among them was Niel Allen, who had them installed early in 1968. There might have been other people involved with Henderson, but from the point of view of the real acceptance of belts, he is the key player.

Niel was a bit of a hell-raiser those days, so it was both to his advantage to take some step in this direction, and to Henderson's to get them into his cars... he had a V8 sports car and a McLaren M4a FVA at the time.

And, true to form, Niel made a mistake one day in July of that year that set the world on edge... emerging from a small dustcloud on the outside of the infamous kink at Lakeside at about 140mph twenty or more feet in the air, backwards and upside down!

The car then tumbled and twisted, crashed and banged and finished up in a number of small piles of wreckage, one of which had the rollover bar still attached (torn out of the tub by the stay to the engine) and another the hapless driver. Who had a sprained finger.

From that point the racing world accepted that belting up would be the way to go. I'm not sure when the legislation came into being, but it was certainly before 1969 was over, probably at the end of 1968.

[William Dale Jr]

IIRC, Moss himself was thrown out of his car in an accident at Spa, around 1960?

[Buford]

I know you are talking about F1 but in American Sprint cars a guy was thrown out at the start of a race at Knoxville, Iowa I was in I think in 1979. Two drivers were killed in that wreck. Way back in about 1958 I have seen pictures of Johnny Thompson being thrown out of a Sprint Car in the East. He was not seriously injured. A similar crash threw Charlie Musselman out and he also was not seriously injured. I have seen video of 1930s Indy 500 footage with bodies strewn all over in many wrecks. Louie Meyer spun one year coming out of two and hit the inside guardrail. He was thrown out and got up and ran away. They have a good movie of that which is often shown.

[Ray Bell]

Quote

Originally posted by William Dale Jr
IIRC, Moss himself was thrown out of his car in an accident at Spa, around 1960?

Indeed, in practice for the 1960 Belgian GP.

Another who was thrown out was Graham Hill in the 1969 US GP at Watkins Glen - or half thrown out (Mike?) - and did a lot of damage to his legs. He had undone his now-mandatory belts to push-start the car after a spin and not refastened them.

As for Villeneuve, I think it's really stretching the friendship to say he was thrown out... the car broke apart around him and there was nothing left to prevent him sliding from the car, as I understand it.

[AlesiUK]

in karting it is fairly common to be thrown out of the kart.no seatbelts.Personally i was "thrown out" 3 times,the funniest of which was a track called Kimbolton,i actually landed in a field full of crops!

the best example i ever saw was a guy called John Dalziel,(he went on to race FF1600 i think?) he clipped the back of another kart and his kart went spinning thru the air,throwing him out,he must have gone 20ft in the air,landed on his feet right against a tyre barrier and promptly sat down on it!

[Vitesse2]

Quote

Originally posted by Ray Bell
Another who was thrown out was Graham Hill in the 1969 US GP at Watkins Glen - or half thrown out (Mike?) - and did a lot of damage to his legs. He had undone his now-mandatory belts to push-start the car after a spin and not refastened them.

Well, I'm not Mike Argetsinger, but ....

Hill was thrown completely clear of the car, landing 20 yards from it. There are two pictures in Life at the Limit, one of which shows the car in mid-air with Graham half out of the cockpit. The other shows him on the ground, with the remains of his Lotus 49 nearby. It's a moot point whether he would have been saved by wearing belts, since the car landed upside-down - IMO being thrown clear probably saved his life. I don't think Herrmann would have survived his AVUS crash either had he been strapped in.

[David M. Kane]

Surely Masten Gregory had the experience more than once. He eventually got
to the point he started jumping out of cars. He was accused of jumping a few times too early in the minds of the car owners.

[Ray Bell]

Quote

Originally posted by Vitesse2
....It's a moot point whether he would have been saved by wearing belts, since the car landed upside-down - IMO being thrown clear probably saved his life. I don't think Herrmann would have survived his AVUS crash either had he been strapped in.

Let's moot then...

I'm convinced, having seen the Allen crash, that from the description you give there was no real risk to GH had he stayed in the car. I've seen many others where this has proved to be the case too.

[Doug Nye]

It might be simpler to ask which top(ish) drivers from 'the classic period' were not thrown out at some time or another... Mike Hawthorn was ejected from his BRM when it rolled at Goodwood in 1956 - Tony Brooks was ejected from his BRM when it rolled at Silverstone in 1956 - Roy Salvadori was ejected from his Frazer Nash when it rolled at Silverstone in 1950 or '51 (help me boys???) - Fangio was thrown out of his Maserati at Monza in 1952 - Paul Frere from his Ferrari Monza at Kristianstad in '55ish (???) - Castellotti at Modena '57 - Collins at Nurburgring '58 - I was involved in a small way with Michael Henderson's safety breaktrhough in 1967-68 since we first published his work in 'Motor Racing' magazine. Mike proved in practical terms what is now self-evident - but which had long been unrecognised - that the combination of seatbelts to retain the driver with roll-over bars to protect his head and neck and onboard fire extinguishers to contain an initial blaze would be good news. The worst combination would be a belted-in driver, with no roll-over protection. Without roll over protection it was - and is - deemed a marginally better prospect to be ejected.

On the whole, I'd prefer to remain right way up...

DCN

[Keir]

Masten Gregory made "bailing out" an art form!

[Crazy Canuck]

HHF was thrown out!

oh, sorry...wrong kind of thrown out!

CC

[Ray Bell]

Anyone who saw Niel Allen's crash would be instantly convinced...

We were sure he'd be dead. And the rollover bar was gone, you will have noted from my description above...

[lom8104]

I myself have had the pleasure of being thrown out of my kart twice. The first time I was racing a 100C yamaha at a track called Branard (yes, the dragstrip is part of the track!) I went off the track and flipped into a pond! It is hopefully the last time I have to perform a "wet exist"........

The other time was last year at Summit Point raceway. I was driving a 125cc shifter at around 90-95mph when my outer wheel came off in a turn!! At first I thought "Gee, this oversteer is unbearable" Then all I remember is hitting (bouncing over) the gravel trap as my kart flew over me.

-lom8104

[Roland Kunz]

Hello

R.v. Frankenberg making a double flip with his Porsche RS in Avus gets full scores ;)

Grüsse

[Mike Argetsinger]

Quote

Originally posted by Doug Nye
- Roy Salvadori was ejected from his Frazer Nash when it rolled at Silverstone in 1950 or '51 (help me boys???) -

DCN

Doug - it was 1951 - the Daily Express Silverstone meeting according to his book (although he doesn't give a date - wasn't that race usually in April?). The book (Roy Salvadori Racing Driver - Roy Salvadori and Anthony Pritchard - Patrick Stephens Limited, publisher - copyright 1985) contains an incredible sequential series of photographs of the accident with Roy and the Frazer Nash flying through the air. The accident happened at Stowe. Roy was terribly injured and his parents were informed that he was not expected to live. He had three fractures to the skull as well as other injuries and did not regain conciousness for several days. When I knew him he was famously deaf in his right ear - until looking this data up today I never knew that the deafness stemmed from this accident. The LeMans Replica Frazer Nash was not repaired until September when Roy ran it at Shelsley Walsh and Castle Combe - although he had resumed racing in August at Boreham in a Jaguar XK-120.

[dmj]

I remember a fascinating picture of Cliff Allison thrown from his car in Monaco in (I believe) 1960.

[Roger Clark]

Quote

Originally posted by Mike Argetsinger



Doug - it was 1951 - the Daily Express Silverstone meeting according to his book (although he doesn't give a date - wasn't that race usually in April?).

5th May

[Doug Nye]

...and from 1951 for 16 years or so it became traditional for the 'Daily Express' sponsored BRDC International Trophy race to be run in May - hence the much-lamented 'Silverstone May Meeting' or 'May Silverstone'. Then the powers that be short-handled it back into late-April, and tried to promote it still as being 'May Silverstone'...

Spot the loony....but it didn't do them a lot of good, did it....

DCN

PS - Cliff Allison's incident at the Monaco chicane was quite extraordinary, not least for the fact that Cliff recalls waking up in hospital speaking French - "Which was strange - 'cos I can't speak French".

[Richard Jenkins]

Jean Behra amongst countless, countless others. Luigi Fagioli also died as a result of being thrown out of a car in 1952 at Monaco


I actually thought this thread would be about the two championship events that were later scrubbed off the list... Has anyone got the qualification & race classification for those races?

[David McKinney]

Fagioli was thrown out? Of a saloon?

[Stefan Ornerdal]

A Swedish driver, Staffan Svenby was thrown out of his Saab at Knutstorp in the middle of the sixties. Yes, a touring car! Svenby later became Ronnie Peterson's manager. I know I have a picture somewhere with Svenby sitting in the middle of the track, somewhat dizzy. I shall try o find the pic and post it here.

Stefan

[Carlos Jalife]

Innes was thrown out at the tunnel in Monaco, and he had not much due to his parachuting landing experience (he said), and Ricardo Rodríguez was thrown out after crashing at the Peraltada and landed in the rail which caused his demise.

[SennasCat]

I believe Paul Warwick was thrown out of his F3000 car in a fatal accident in the early 90's. That's all I know about it. Does anyone have more info????

[Vitesse2]

Quote

Originally posted by David McKinney
Fagioli was thrown out? Of a saloon?

I've found a couple of references to Fagioli being thrown out (eg Steve Small), but no-one commits themselves to the car's identity, although the implication is that it was a Lancia Aurelia or Aurelia GT. Even Martin Krejci seems uncertain:

http://www.wspr-raci...amp1952.html#24

But if it was an Aurelia, might he have actually been entered for the Prix de Monaco?

http://www.wspr-raci...amp1952.html#23

Bizarrely, the Motor Sport report of this event makes no mention of Fagioli at all!

[jarama]

Quote

Originally posted by Vitesse2


I've found a couple of references to Fagioli being thrown out (eg Steve Small), but no-one commits themselves to the car's identity, although the implication is that it was a Lancia Aurelia or Aurelia GT. Even Martin Krejci seems uncertain:

http://www.wspr-raci...amp1952.html#24

But if it was an Aurelia, might he have actually been entered for the Prix de Monaco?

http://www.wspr-raci...amp1952.html#23

Bizarrely, the Motor Sport report of this event makes no mention of Fagioli at all!

According to the book on Monaco GP by Rainer W. Schlegelmilch and Hartmut Lehbrink:

"In any case, the weekend was burdened by a gloomy omen: during training for the Prix de Monaco (for Sports Cars up to 2 liters) Luigi Fagioli, 54, was seriously injured in his Lancia Aurelia B20 at the tunnel exit and he died on 26 June."

Picture on Fagioli's Lancia after the crash caption:

"During the second qualifying session for sports cars up to two liters, Luigi Fagioli has a serious accident in his Lancia Aurelia at the exit to the tunnel. The reason remains unknown. The winner of the 1935 Monaco Grand Prix dies eighteen days later. He is only 54."

[jarama]

1935 Swiss GP: Hans Geier was found lying under a parked car, after a huge crash at the wheel of his Mercedes GP car.

[Ray Bell]

I have seen movie from Broughton's Pass Hillclimb, a public road event of the late thirties... must see if Clive got that transferred to video.

Anyway, in one scene a Hillman Minx (upright, skinny, like a forties Ford Prefect) rushes towards the hairpin left hander, vertical sandstone wall to the inside of the bend... the driver brakes... the 'riding mechanic' hurls himself bodily out the window in the inside of the bend, up to the knees, hanging on as ballast as the car turns into the corner!

The was he just shot out of the window it was incredible. This is tame by comparison...



Almost off topic... I know... Clive, by the way, told me who it was that performed this act... John Crouch or someone who went on to race in a big way... must ask him again.

[Ray Bell]

Quote

Originally posted by jarama
1935 Swiss GP: Hans Geier was found lying under a parked car, after a huge crash at the wheel of his Mercedes GP car.

A reminder... thanks for that... Louis Chiron at the Nurburgring in the 1936 German GP, tossed from his Mercedes.

[Doug Nye]

This is going to become tedious - Chiron also did the high fly out of his Tipo B Monoposto at Berne in 1934??? - rather nasty pic of him lying unconscious in the roadway in the big Swiss GP book sponsored by Albert Obrist - I think it was divined that most of poor Fagioli's cranial damage was inflicted by the A-pillar of his Lancia as he was being thrown out of the door opening, his death triggering the moves which made hard crash helmets compulsory (at last) - like Mark Donohue he was conscious and talking when removed to hospital - Chris Airey was thrown out of his superfast, super-successful Austin A40 when it somersaulted and killed him at Brands Hatch in '62 or '63??? - Trevor Taylor was thrown from his Lotus 25 at Enna in 1963 - Pedro Rodriguez emerged 'as an individual entity' from the cloud of debris which had been his wooden-monocoque F2 Protos at Enna in 1967 (??OK??) - Jackie Oliver ended up sitting on his backside in the middle of the Snetterton Esses when his Marcos GT (timber chassis again) disintegrated in 1962 - David Alexander was thrown high, wide and handsome from his AC Ace when he rolled it at Riches Corner, I think, Snetterton circa 1962 (pic in 'Autosport') - John Ogier was ejected from his Tojeiro-Jaguar at Stapleford hill-climb (again, pic in 'Autosport') - etc etc etc. The list is truly enormous...

DCN

[Vitesse2]

Quote

Originally posted by jarama



According to the book on Monaco GP by Rainer W. Schlegelmilch and Hartmut Lehbrink:

"In any case, the weekend was burdened by a gloomy omen: during training for the Prix de Monaco (for Sports Cars up to 2 liters) Luigi Fagioli, 54, was seriously injured in his Lancia Aurelia B20 at the tunnel exit and he died on 26 June."

Picture on Fagioli's Lancia after the crash caption:

"During the second qualifying session for sports cars up to two liters, Luigi Fagioli has a serious accident in his Lancia Aurelia at the exit to the tunnel. The reason remains unknown. The winner of the 1935 Monaco Grand Prix dies eighteen days later. He is only 54."

Aha! Another myth laid to rest ... not the Monaco GP at all!

[AlesiUK]

Quote

I believe Paul Warwick was thrown out of his F3000 car in a fatal accident in the early 90's. That's all I know about it. Does anyone have more info

warwick was killed at oulton park,i think it was 1990 or 1991,i was there anyway but i recall very little about it,he may well have been thrown out of his car because i don remeber a story of another driver stopping and rushing to the car to pull him out,only to find that he wasnt in it.

[FLB]

Wasn't Geki (Giacomo Russo) killed at Caserta in 1967 trying to avoid another driver (Beat Fehr) who'd been trown out of his car and lying on the track?

Weren't Ed Nelson and Fon de Portago thrown out of their Ferrari at the 1957 Mille Miglia? I seem to remember a description of (half of) de Portago's body found on a tree near the crash site.

[Ray Bell]

Quote

Originally posted by FLB
Weren't Ed Nelson and Fon de Portago thrown out of their Ferrari at the 1957 Mille Miglia? I seem to remember a description of (half of) de Portago's body found on a tree near the crash site.

It's quite possible, but that detail isn't actually revealed in this account...

Quote

Originally printed in Motor Racing, July 1957
...at about 180mph, a tyre burst for reasons which are still not clear. The car veered off the road, uprooted a massive granite marker stone, then flew through the air, snapping off a telegraph pole, and cutting to pieces spectators at the roadside who were pressing forward, regardless of danger, to see the cars pass. Annihilating its crew as it went, it bounced into one ditch, then hurtled across the road into the ditch on the opposite side. The Marquis de Portago, his passenger, Eddie Nelson, and nine spectators, of whom five were children, died, and several injured.

But there is no way that either an ejection or a body sectioning are discounted by the writer as he describes what was obviously a very gory incident. When I first saw this thread I actually checked this story to see, by the way... I was sure it said something.

[Keir]

A bit of a tangent, but Motorcyclists get thrown quite a bit!!! It's called "high siding!"
I have been involved in the act myself many years ago.
What happens is that suddenly the front end gets way too much grip and ......................off you go for "Mr. Cycle's wild ride!!!"

[dmj]

And Greatest of them all lost his life when thrown out on January 27, 1938.

[David Holland]

I have a few other GP drivers who have been thrown out or chucked out, so to speak.

Brian Shawe-Taylor exited his ERA at Goodwood in 1951 and woke up a few weeks later at the Atkinson Morley Hospital - he never raced again. Prince Bira was luckier in his ERA whilst practising in France 1939, I believe.

Other well known escapees are Ben Pon in his only single seater race for the 1962 Dutch GP - he vowed only to race safer sportscars after that.

Peter Arundell in a Lotus F2 at Reims, Mike Parkes in a Ferrari at Spa (painful picture in Mark Kahn's book "The day I Died") and Jimmy Stewart in a Jag at Le Mans were not so lucky and ended up badly injured when thrown out.

As did Christian Goethals who crashed his Porsche at Spa in 1958 when a man ran over the track at Stavelot. Les Leston once told me he got, "burned a little bit" at the Syracuse GP in his Connaught when, "my car broke a half shaft which went up through the tank and I had to jump out at 80mph"!

Others have not been so fortunate and it has proved fatal for Peter Ryan who crashed his Lotus at Reims and Harry Schell who broke his neck after his Cooper flipped at Abbey Curve, Silverstone.

Nasif Estafano died this way in a saloon when taking part in the Turismo Carretara. On approaching the town of Aimogasta he left the road in his Ford Falcon, it rolled and the door flew open, throwing him out. His co-driver Paccione remained in the car and was unhurt!

I also remember seeing a gruesome newspaper cutting of the aftermath of Peter Revson's Kyalami testing crash. He is simply lying over the armco as if he is trying to retrieve something from the ground. In this case it's possibly more accurate to say the car disintegrated as opposed to being "thrown out".

Thankfully racing is a lot safer today although "modern" historic racing has sobering reminders of the past as Nigel Corner would testify after a recent Goodwood Revival Meeting incident.

[Jim Thurman]

No one here has mentioned Willy Mairesse at LeMans in 1968. On a side note, I've read drastically conflicting accounts of this. One indicates he jumped out. One indicates he was thrown out on impact. One indicates he fell out of the car before the impact.

Like Doug wrote, this is going to become tedious...

Buford mentioned some of the more prominent incidents in the U.S., there have been countless others in the pre-belt open cockpit days...and some in the post-belt and even post-cage days.

I can add three CRA Sprint Car drivers were thrown from their cars when their harnesses failed.

Ray Douglas in 1965 at Imperial (El Centro), California, with tragic consequences. This was in the pre-roll cage days, but the following two came after cages.

John Redican in the early 70's (not sure which year, I believe 1972) at Ascot. EDIT: It was John Kellar at Ascot in 1972.

Dave Swindell in 1990 at Santa Maria, California. Fortunately, Swindell's car was doing a slow roll and went away from him. EDIT: It was not Dave Swindell. Dave was the first name of the driver, his last name escapes me at the moment

All were blamed on the harness release mechanism failing on each particular brand (or in the latter case, a design flaw that allowed the driver's hand to brush by and release it. It was also thought that played a part in the other two as well). After each incident, the CRA promptly banned that particular brand of safety harness.

Buford mentioned Charlie Musselman. I remember seeing a series of photos from the incident where he was thrown clear and it was terrifying.

Edited by Jim Thurman, 09 May 2013 - 06:10.

[Carlos Jalife]

Since I'm also a contrarian ;) I'm not sure that Pedro was thrown at Enna in the F2 race 1967 after crashing with Beltoise who didn't see Pedro coming behind Stewart (that's what he claimed), but the thing is the wooden Protos disintegrated so there wasn't a chassis around Pedro when the 'car' finally came to a stand, it was Pedro and pieces of the car around him. But he didn't land and roll and all those things, more likely he traveled a few dozens meters in his back and his heel got caught and broke. And they settled it at the hospital without anaestesia (hope the spelling is OK) while he cursed the italian doctors, and later learned they could understand much of what he said since it was failry similar to their own sicilain cursing. Whatever, he could speak with the locals and he found Redman years later after the brit had an accident at the Targa while they were running for John Wyer and nobody knew where he had been taken so Pedro went around asking until he found Brian.

And about Revson, I also remember the pictures and I don't think the car disintegrated, I can remember Graham and Denny pushing the car up all covered in foam but Revson was still strapped.

On a funnier note a friend once told me that everytime he visited them Peter would come down to have breakfast in his fireproof underwear. It seems it was the only underwear he had (and yes pretty ladies were always around).

[Graham Clayton]

One of the all time great pictures of a driver being thrown out of
a racecar can be found at the top left hand corner of the following
site:

http://www.speedwayr...getcrashes.html

The accident occurred during the running of the 1961 "World Speedcar
Derby" at the Sydney Showground.

The steering box disintegrated, which pitched the car right into
the fence, and a series of roll-overs. Although Cuneen's lap belt
broke, and flung him out of the car, he was still attached by the
shoulder harness.

I have seen film footage of this crash. Cuneen looks like a rag doll
as he is chucked around as the car rolls over multiple times, and is
lucky not to have the car finish on top of him.

He suffered no serious injuries, and was racing again the following
Saturday night!

It was only in the early 1960's that shoulder harnesses were
fitted to Australian speedcars. In the 50's drivers only had a
lap belt. Drivers being flung out of cars was not uncommon.

[Chris Bloom]

I believe Froilan Gonzalez was thrown out, I'm sure JMF mentions it in his book but I can't find it at the moment.

[Slyder]

Speaking of Spa 1960, Both Chris Bristow and Alan Stacey were killed instantly after they were thrown out of their cars.

Bristow was thrown out and decapitated.

Stacey was hit by a flying bird and knocked out, and also was thrown from his car.

[GunStar]

I was at Goodwood a couple years ago, and somebody got thrown from a Ferrari. Don't remember much as I didn't see the event, only hear about it around the stands.

[Vitesse2]

Quote

Originally posted by GunStar
I was at Goodwood a couple years ago, and somebody got thrown from a Ferrari. Don't remember much as I didn't see the event, only hear about it around the stands.

That was Nigel Corner, as mentioned by David Holland in post number 40 ^^

[Catalina Park]

I have seen a driver get thrown out at Oran Park (Sydney) in the early ninties, he was in a Clubman and didn't have his harness done up and didn't have his helmet done up either as he drove onto the track for his race he was seen pulling his gloves on and that was all he did! and in the first corner of the race he run up somebodys wheel and the car shot up into the air did and end over end and threw him out and he lost his helmet in the process.
He got up and walked away!

[Ray Bell]

Also at Oran Park, all in the one day and in the one corner, but in separate races...

Ray Heffernan was thrown from his car, finishing up lying dead face down against the wall at BP Bend.

John Marchiori was only semi-ejected from his Lotus a little while later, dying after being disembowelled in the incident, I believe.

[maxim]

Was Mike Parkes thrown out his Ferrari 312 at Blanchimont during 1967 Belgian GP?