78 replies to this topic

[Bob Nomates]

Post the worst or most spectacular F1 crash you have seen.
http://mach.me.queen...3000_crash.mpeg

[BuzzingHornet]

i'm not going to post the movie of it, but the Gilles Villeneuve (at Zolder) crash was the most horrific. What a piece of crap that Ferrai was

As for spectacular, Zonta at Spa last year! He absolutely trashed that car

[Bob Nomates]

that post was for a new thred I don't know how it ended up in here, nothing is ever my fault, anyway back to the topic.
I have seen the Villenuve crash and it is a bad one, what make it worst is that he came out of the car and went flying past the camera.

[BuzzingHornet]

Yeah a post by Todd just showed up here and then disappeared! Wierd

[BuzzingHornet]

Yeah the Villeneuve crash was bad. I don't know if this is a myth or not, but I heard that his shoes got left in the car when he was flung out... does anyone know if that is true??

Two terrible crashes in CART last year, Rodriguez and Moore, both awful shunts. Concrete walls... thats safe.

[Damop]

Well, showing the F3000 crash allows recollection of a recent horrific crash - Moore's crash at Fontana ranks right up there for violence and tragedy. Nobody need post that one

[Peeko]

Even though its not F1, I'd have to say Moore's was the worst I'd seen. I agree Damop, no need to post it. I lent Imola 94 to a freind of mine because he wanted a copy. He asked if I wanted a copy of Greg's last race (the fatal one), and I said no thanks. I have only seen the accident once, and that's enough.

[ClashCityRocker]

Originally posted by Peeko:
Even though its not F1, I'd have to say Moore's was the worst I'd seen.

You wouldn't believe how many times the Newscasts showed that crash. And everytime they were going to air it, the reporter would say something like "The following scene may be distrubing to some viewers".

Made me sick.



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When they kick at your front door,
How you Gonna come
With your hands on your head or on the trigger of your gun

GUNS OF BRIXTON

[bschue]

Hey XFord- Why is your name XFord?

[Peeko]

XFord, yes definately. That one was brutal.

[bschue]

This is not for those with a weak stomach:

A friend of mine I work with used to go to the USGP at Watkins Glen every year in the 70's.

I think it was the '72 or '73 race when a young Austrian maned Helmut Koenig went off the track and under the single layer of armco (armco also claimed Francois Cevert at the Glen). The car's front end went under and then the armo sheered everthing off from the driver compartment back to the engine.

My friend was in the corner watching where this happened and said it was hideous. He said the course marshals just walked up and looked in the car, shook their heads and threw a tarp over the car and then the race went on.

Pretty sick.

[RacerX]

Yeah, Krosnoff's crash was a bad one. Swede Savage's crash at Indy in '73 was another bad one that had a terrible impact and then big time fire.

[Em Gee]

Lorenzo Bandini, Ferrari, Monaco 1967. Went straight into the guardrail on a corner following the tunnel, the car immediately burst completely into flames. You can't watch the film and not be stunned.

Anything involving fire is the scariest. Gerhard Berger in the Ferrari at Imola was horrifying too. I was screaming at the TV for them to get him out. Something that still gives me chills, thank God he survived.

[Damop]

Danny Ongais had a horrible crash at the INdy 500 in 1981. I remember watching that one on TV - the car disintegrated immediately ahead of the seat. His legs were exposed and flapping in the air - it's a mental image I won't forget. I haven't seen any pics or video of it since. Amazingly, he wasn't killed.

[MichiganF1]

Stan Fox at Indy in 1995 - the car flying down the road with his legs sticking. Amazingly, while he had a serious head injury, his legs weren't broken.

[Wishbone]

Another none F1 crash...

I seem to remember a F3(?) crash in the wet in Germany in which at the start of the main straight a driver went into the back of the car in front and tore off the nose of his car leaving his feet sticking out at the front, the throttle open and no front wheels.
The next camara shot showed all the other cars braking carefully into the first bend and then this missle of a car going straight off through.
It may not have been the most destructive crash but for the driver it must have been terrifying to have time to think about what was going to happen and not be able to do anything about it.
I don't think he was too badly injured, he may have broken his ankles but not like Jonny.

Does anyone remember this?

[Elspeth]

Em Gee, I agree with you. Lorenzo Bandini's crash was horrifying. The worst thing was he hung upside down in that flaming car for 4 minutes before anyone got to him.

Gilles' crash was awful to see as well.

Of Jim Clark's crash all I have seen is the incredibly crumpled Lotus after. No one cxould have survived.

[John B]

How about the Martin Donnelly crash with the Lotus in the early 1990s

[John B]

How about the Martin Donnelly crash with the Lotus in the early 1990s

[NYR2119935]

Definately Greg Moore.



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CART
Hockey
Metallica
Taco Bell

[nigel red5]

greg moore`s was definitely the worst, i felt really sick that evening, i`ve vowed to myself never to look at it again.
the following give me the chills, and i hope to god nothing like these ever happen again (wishful thinking if you like..)

ricardo paletti - canada 1982 startline (someone should have kicked hell out of that cameraman who was right in front of the car, just trying to get the best picture...sick.)

roger williamson - mid - 70`s (its on "the quick & the dead" and "speed fever") holland i think - not sure.

gilles at zolder. 1982.

tom pryce - south africa 1977. - renzo zorzi`s car had an engine failure and he pulled off at the side of that long main straight. two 18 yr. old marshals with fire extinguishers ran across the tack to put out the fire. pryce hit one of the boys at 190 mph, the fire extinguisher flew out of the boy`s hands right into pryce, killing him instantly. the car then continued on to the end of the straight. it`s really really bad.
(also on "speed fever".)
i only found out very recently that this happened on the afternoon that i was born.
born on "raceday" - fate or what....

andrea de cesaris - holland 1985.

gerhard berger - imola 1989....that was scary as hell.

ukyo katayama - portugal 1995 startline (he was a very very lucky boy)

[Hot Rod Otis]

Gilles at Zolder was the worst F-1 crash I remember seeing. Seeing his body launched into the catch fencing was sickening.


Gordon Smiley's wreck at Indy in 82 was bar none the worst crash I've ever seen. He hid the turn 3 wall head on at 185mph, the car exploded like a bomb hit it.

[John B]

Otis, those accidents occured within days of each other in May. Smiley's impact angle was caused when he turned the wheel to the right to correct a slide. he was running a hopelessly slow car that was totally not set up and almost had crashed on his first lap. At the worst moment the car regained traction and shot straight into the wall. Rookies were advised after that to let the car spin naturally rather than attempt a super save.

Rodney Orr's wreck at Daytona practice in 1994 was the worst I had heard of, he was disfigured by a caution light that sheared into the roof of his car.

[This message has been edited by John B (edited 05-17-2000).]

[tak]

I'm afraid it's not F1 and I can't name the driver or the year, but the Mercedes flipping into the grandstands at Lemans in the 50's has to be the worst. Very bad for the sport, and I'm not sure (m)any lessons were learned.

[Statesidefan]

From the old films I've seen the von Trips accident at Monza in '61 was terrible. I never saw the Peterson accident in 78, but I have heard it was bad.

Moore's was probably the worst I have seen in recent memory, but Jo Gartner's crash on the Mulsanne was bad as well as Bellof's at Spa. I remember the Bellof crash like it was yesterday.

GV and Pironi's crashes are ones I have only seen short takes of. I hate to sound morbid, but does anyone know where I can see them?

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"The strategy of a Formula One race is very simple. It's flat out from the minute the flag drops." Mario Andretti 1976


[This message has been edited by Statesidefan (edited 05-17-2000).]

[Mosquito]

One that's still fixed on the back of my eyes is some weird accident I happened to see at Eurosport years ago. In this case an innocent bystander was killed.

It was a formula Ford race in England (Donnington?) I believe. In soaking wet conditions, one car tried to overtake another on a straight. They touched wheels and he slid of the track against a low concrete wall. The car broke on the wall sending the engine hurtling over to the other side.
The engine bouched over a parked car and then landed dead-on on a fleeing spectator who was immediately killed on the impact. The driver was unhurt btw.

I can't recall any name, track, etc., Just have all the visuals like the car was Marlboro sponsored, the guy killed wore a yellow raincoat, etc... I really felt bad about it, especially since it happened all so slow. If the fleeing guy would have looked back, he would have seen the enigine coming and could easily have stepped aside...

[Laphroaig]

Greg Moore... That one was horrible to see... But there was another one a bit like it.
Marco Campos' fatal F3000 accident (don't know what year). On Magny Cours he got airborne when he hit someones rear wheel, twisted round his length axis and crashed upside down against the corner of wall (the last couple of inches), rolled over again and ended in the gravel.
Nothing seemed wrong at first, the car wasn't seriously damaged, but then you could see that the whole rollbar/airbox section of the car was missing because it hit the wall... Only then I realized that his head must have hit the wall too...

... and there have been a lot more I've seen on TV

I really hope I'll never see an accident where a car takes of in Monaco... you'll never know where the car ends up...

[BuzzingHornet]

Laphroaig, I was thinking exactly the same thing about Monaco the other day, its amazing that no F1 cars have ended up over the barriers, especially on the first lap. If one did, the race would probably finally get taken off the calender I reckon

[Zoe]

Statesidefan,

you know more about the Bellof crash? I was a big fan of Stefan and I know very very little about his fatal accident, all I've heard is some rumours and I'd like to know more. Did he crash while trying to overtake Ickx, and what was Ickx role in that crash? I've heard Ickx comments after that crash and they just made me sick, but as a I said, its all rumours.

I'd be grateful for all information!

Thanx,

Zoe

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One of the important freedoms is the freedoms to continue to be unpopular (B. Mawhinney)

[madmac]

Wishbone,

It was Dino Morrelli who had that wreck, similar to Herberts in consequences. Good news is that Dino is in Formula Palmer Audi this year.

As for the worst accident, all of them.

[OssieFan]

Just reading about some of these crashes, inparticular Gilles Villeneuve's, gives me chills.

Some of the worst I have seen would be Herbert's F3000 crash, Lauda's Nurburgring crash, Wurz's first corner crash in Canada 98 , the pile up in the 1998 Belgian GP and many others. I haven't yet seen the full crash of Greg Moore's, they showed a tribute to him on TV but they cut to a different scene just as he was about to hit the wall.

OssieFan

[Mosquito]

Ossie,

There is an AVI on espn.com somewhere if you would like to see it. It was really a bad impact, couldn't have hit the wall any worse then he did.

[Fabien Pousset]

Andretti's crash at Mid-Ohio in 98 was terrible.
It's just incredible he didn't get seriously injured, or worse.

[Conners]

Obviously the most appalling crashes are ones where people are badly hurt, but for sheer spectacle the Spa'98 pile up at the start has to come out tops.

[Anavar]

I don't want to come off the wrong way but here is Moores accident. Terrible to say the least.
http://f-1.sovintel....orites/various/
cart_gm.mpg

[mtl'78]

The Lauda crash was the most disturbing I'd seen until Gilles. If you've seen it, it's hard to believe he could have survived...

I think its the shot of Hunt reaching into the wall of flames to get to Nikki, very disturbing...

The Gilles crash is truly the most violent F1 crash I've seen. It just went on, and on, and on... that was the worst part. I remember watching it, and the car is launched, flies through the air for 100 meters, and did about 10-15 back-over-front rolls, and in the last one, launched him back accross the track and through 1 fence, knocking off his helmet and finally landed next to the second fence. If you saw it, I mean, there was no hope...

The single most horrifying moment came when I had tickets in the 1st corner 1998. Alex Wurz made a bonehead move and lauched himself straight up maybe 20-25 feet in the air, did about 5 barrel rolls, landed upside down, did a few more rolls, as cars are crashing all around what is left of his cars. A stray tyre came flying towards us and hit the fence hard about 10 meters from where I was. I was sure Wurz was dead, and I remember being unable to breathe for a few seconds until I saw a shaken Alex signal the crowd he was OK.
That was by far the scariest crash I ever witnessed.

[doohanOK]

I've got a few I reckon were bad:

-Greg Moore, Fontana 1999.
-Christian Fittipaldi, Surfers Paradise 1997.
-Gilles Villeneuve, Zolder, 1982.
-Ricardo Zonta, Spa, 1999.
-Michael Andretti, Mid Ohio, 1998.
-Jeff Krosnoff, Toronto, 1996.
-Gerhard Berger, Imola, 1989.

I've yet to seen footage of the crashes of Stefan Bellof, or Jim Clark.

There are so many, but I'd prefer to forget a few of them, especially Ayrton.

regards,
doohanOK.

[EddieJF1]

I remember that Fittipaldi crash at Surfers. The car looked like it exploded.

[RedFever]

Impressed by how people slam someone without a second thought.

The Ferrari 126C2 used by Gilles Villeneuve was actually considered one of the safest F1 cars in those days. Saying that Ferrari was a piece of crap (implying it was the team's fault Gilles' died) it's ridiculuos. In fact, Gilles would have died the same way if he had been in any of the 26 cars that day.

You can't forget that Gilles was at 180mph!!! Mass was at around 120-130mph. The point of contact between the two wheels (Gilles front left and Mass rear right) had opposite directions, basically a combined speed of over 300mph. Obviously a car flies in that situation. Gilles went as high 45-50 feet from the ground at 190mph!!!! then landed front down, smacking on the ground (doctors believed Gilles was clinically dead in that instant, the G forces enough to snap his neck!!!). But it's not over!!! the car rolled over three more times. Then, it took off again, another 15-20 feet in the air and landed on the front again on the asphalt. Then it's went the chassis broke. The dinamic of that accident would make it impossible to survive it even in today's F1 car, with regulations that are a far cry from those in place in 1982. Yet, the 126C2 of Didier Pironi, with less atrocious combination of events, managed to get through a fly of over 450 feet long at high speed (Pironi hit Prost the same way Gilles touched with Mass) and landed frontally but with a gentler angle and didn't go back in the air for more bouncing. The cockpit protected Didier's body perfectly, while the front crashed, braking severely his legs. Consider that Schumacher and Panis hit the walls are speeds less than half that of Didier and still fractured their legs. All in all, that Ferrari was probably tha safest car to drive in those days (look at Ronnie Peterson's Lotus front, who had the same damage almost as Didier's car at lower speed and with the advantage of the absorbtion capabilities of the guard rail).

On the subject: the worst accident I saw was not Gilles. Roger Williamson in Zandvoort 1973 was much worst. His car was flipped upside down and caught fire. He was in the cockpit unhurt but unconscious. David Purley, his teammate stopped and tried with all his strenght to flip the car, so he could take Roger out. He struggled for almost a minute, begged the marshalls to come and help him (they didn't move, the safety service the most pathetic ever seen), kept benging on the car, pushing the wheels, calling people for help, pushing some more, all while his friend was burning alive in the cockpit. While you felt horrified for Roger's fate, it was David desperate and incredulous state that made the entire accident more horrible. He could not believe that nobody would help him save Roger. No marshall joined him (they stood watching Roger burn) and no other driver stopped his car and joined him, they simply slowed down and went away. A very sad day in F1 history, probably the darkest moment because with a little human courage and compassion a life could have been saved.

[RedFever]

Impressed by how people slam someone without a second thought.

The Ferrari 126C2 used by Gilles Villeneuve was actually considered one of the safest F1 cars in those days. Saying that Ferrari was a piece of crap (implying it was the team's fault Gilles' died) it's ridiculuos. In fact, Gilles would have died the same way if he had been in any of the 26 cars that day.

You can't forget that Gilles was at 180mph!!! Mass was at around 120-130mph. The point of contact between the two wheels (Gilles front left and Mass rear right) had opposite directions, basically a combined speed of over 300mph. Obviously a car flies in that situation. Gilles went as high 45-50 feet from the ground at 190mph!!!! then landed front down, smacking on the ground (doctors believed Gilles was clinically dead in that instant, the G forces enough to snap his neck!!!). But it's not over!!! the car rolled over three more times. Then, it took off again, another 15-20 feet in the air and landed on the front again on the asphalt. Then it's went the chassis broke. The dinamic of that accident would make it impossible to survive it even in today's F1 car, with regulations that are a far cry from those in place in 1982. Yet, the 126C2 of Didier Pironi, with less atrocious combination of events, managed to get through a fly of over 450 feet long at high speed (Pironi hit Prost the same way Gilles touched with Mass) and landed frontally but with a gentler angle and didn't go back in the air for more bouncing. The cockpit protected Didier's body perfectly, while the front crashed, braking severely his legs. Consider that Schumacher and Panis hit the walls are speeds less than half that of Didier and still fractured their legs. All in all, that Ferrari was probably tha safest car to drive in those days (look at Ronnie Peterson's Lotus front, who had the same damage almost as Didier's car at lower speed and with the advantage of the absorbtion capabilities of the guard rail).

On the subject: the worst accident I saw was not Gilles. Roger Williamson in Zandvoort 1973 was much worst. His car was flipped upside down and caught fire. He was in the cockpit unhurt but unconscious. David Purley, his teammate stopped and tried with all his strenght to flip the car, so he could take Roger out. He struggled for almost a minute, begged the marshalls to come and help him (they didn't move, the safety service the most pathetic ever seen), kept benging on the car, pushing the wheels, calling people for help, pushing some more, all while his friend was burning alive in the cockpit. While you felt horrified for Roger's fate, it was David desperate and incredulous state that made the entire accident more horrible. He could not believe that nobody would help him save Roger. No marshall joined him (they stood watching Roger burn) and no other driver stopped his car and joined him, they simply slowed down and went away. A very sad day in F1 history, probably the darkest moment because with a little human courage and compassion a life could have been saved.

[boru]

I never knew the full story of Roger Williamson. Wow that is really hard. That angers me now just thinking about it. That would be the worst in my book too, knowing that nobody helped him. Sickening.

[BuzzingHornet]

RedFever I know you are a Ferrari fan but come on that car disintegrated into a thousand pieces, even after the impact new bits were falling off like confetti. If that was the safest then there must have been some very worried drivers out there.

[Damop]

Andretti's 1998 crash was spectacular - I had forgotten about that. I believe he was doing about 180 mph and the car flipped so many times. Amazingly, he was unhurt. If I recall correctly, that collision was started because PJ Jones had a chunk of someone's wing land in his cockpit and he couldn't steer.

Speaking of PJ Jones, the incident where his car drove up the front of Herta's after Herta had spun was unreal. I remember they were showing the workers trying to help out Herta, then suddenly they ran, you see Herta scrunch up as much as his belts would allow, then Jones' car shoots in to view and lands on top of him. Incredible!

[Damop]

I'm with Red on that one - the violence of the crash would meant no one could have survived it. Cars launching into the air frequently result in death, no matter how safe the car is - Gilles, Krosnoff, Moore are prime examples. In those cases open-wheel cars getting airborne is a recipe for disaster.

[BuzzingHornet]

Yeah, you're right, todays cars wouldn't survive that impact either IMO.

[Ray Bell]

Bevan Gibson's Bathurst inversion in the Elfin 400 was bad enough, rotating on its flattened roll bar for a hundred yards after its backflip.

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Life and love are mixed with pain...

[doohanOK]

Well actually it was Alex Barron, not PJ Jones that mounted Bryan at Road America in 1998.

And Alex Zanardi was fined $50,000 and put on probation after causing the piece of wing to enter PJ's cockpit, which then made PJ brake suddenly, and Michael had no where to go.

Vasser's shunt at Surfers Paradise in 1999 was nasty, but not as bad as others mentioned.

Purley got some sort of award for attempting to help poor Roger from the wreckage.

regards,
doohanOK.

[Bob Nomates]

What injuries did Gilles have on his body does anyone know, quite alot I wouls imagine.

apprently Senna didn't have any on his body apart from the damage to his head.

[RedFever]

BH, I am not saying the 126C2 was the safest car one can produce. I am simply saying that Ferrari's in those days were notorious for being the safest cars in F1 relative to the competiton, as much as Lotus were considered the "flying coffins" because safety was compromised for performance. It was common knowledge and nobody pointed a gun to any driver to sign for Lotus. After all, they want to win.

The car disintegrated like confetti. True. 18 years later, Greg Moore's car disintegrated like confetti as well, because of the dynamic of his accident. At those speeds and with those impacts, the best open wheeler in the world will open up like if it was made of paper. That's the reality and there is nothing we can do about it. We can increase safety so that drivers don't die in accidents like SChumacher's or Panis, but if you get into a Gilles or Greg's situation, you can only hope to die quick. Gilles' Ferrari was no ecception, it was probably the safest car (Renaults and Alfas were sturdy too) around but nothing can resist that kind of crash. And this has nothing to do with me being a Ferrari fan. Look at Imola 1980. Gilles hit the wall at the Tosa at 190mph and exited the cockpit confused but unhurt. It was the angle of impact (lateral hit) that saved his life. If he had hit it frontally, his T5 would have melted like butter. He was skilled and lucky in turning the car sideways on three wheels before impact. In 1977 Fiji's GP, he also flew up in the air because he got in contact with Ronnie. However, speed considerably lower than Zolder and landing on the bottom of the car instead of the front, avoided serious damage to the driver (unfortunately a spectator and a marshall died, as the the marshall was trying to convince Japanese fans to leave the position they occupied, on the outside of a turn!!!!!)

The dynamic of the impact makes the difference. And in fact, nobody accused Ferrari for Gilles' death, since it was obvious that nobody could survive such a crash in any car.

[This message has been edited by RedFever (edited 05-17-2000).]

[BuzzingHornet]

Yeah actually you are right, the Villeneuve crash and the Greg Moore crash were about equal in destruction, maybe the car wasn't that bad. I suppose you cannot rationalise a crash like that, just as you can't rationalise slinging your body round a track with walls at 200mph