78 replies to this topic

[schuy]

Hello,

I have just become more aware of this car.

It is now my favourite classic car.

Can anyone shed some light on the car's reputation during the times it raced?

I read that it hasn't won a race...
Was the car a real disappointment, or was it not even expected to win?

The car, for those who don't know it, was originally a Ferrari 250 GTO SWB, and was converted by Bizzarini to a 'breadvan' shaped car.
It's chassis number is 2819GT.

Liran.

[jarama]

Liran,

racing career of 2819 GT in brief mode,

1961, in 250 GT SWB form:
- Tour de France Automobile, #145, 2nd o/a - 2nd in GT Category, Olivier Gendebien / Lucien Bianchi
- 1000 Km de Monthléry, #1, 3rd o/a, Maurice Trintignant / Nino Vaccarella

1962, in Breadvan form:
- 24 Heures du Mans, #16, DNF - gearbox, Carlo Abate / Colin Davis
- Guards Trophy - Brands Hatch, 4th o/a - 1st in GT Category, Colin Davis?
- Ollon-Villars Hillclimb, 1st in GT Category, Carlo Abate
- 1000 Km de Monthléry, 3rd o/a - 3rd in GT Category, Colin Davis / Lodovico Scarfiotti

Carles.

[ray b]

I never saw it race back in the day
BUT DID SEE IT IN A HISTORIC RACE
cart support race at tamiami park miami mid 80's
several commented on it was the most valuable car in the race
looked good but was not pushed real hard
beaten by shelby 350 mustangs ect
but sounded neat and looked good

[Pedro 917]

Here are some pictures of the "breadvan" taken on 27 September 1992 at the celebration of the 40th anniversary of the Garage Francorchamps, founded by Jacques Swaters who had been the Belgian Ferrari importer for 40 years. The meeting was called FF40 and the Esplanade of the Cinquantenaire in Brussels (Concours d'Elegance 26 Sep) and the national race track of Spa-Francorchamps (Sports Meeting 27 Sep) held one big celebration for the yellow Ferrari's, the Francorchamps Garage and the racing team of the same name, or just simply for Jacques Swaters. There were a lot, and I mean a lot of road & racing Ferrari's and it was one of those events never to forget. I've met a lot of famous people of motor racing history that weekend : father and son Chinetti, Phill Hill, Mauro Forghieri, Louis Klementaski, Paul Frere, Andre Pilette, Olivier Gendebien, Derek Bell, JC Andruet, David Piper etc..

[Mickey]

The Breadvan goes on sale at Christie's.

The car carries a pre-sale estimate of $3,500,000-5,000,000.

[Ray Bell]

Where have all the pictures gone?



This isn't the right one, is it? Where does this one come from?

[David Shaw]

Here's a better picture.

http://www.pestalozz...rrari_breadvan/

[Rosemayer]

Here is one I had on my computer

[Arjan de Roos]

Just a coincidende I guess:
Last monday I was modelling on a model kit in 1/43rd of the SWB BV. Some details that I found out:
The air slots in the sides of the van (say the roof) have been carved in at Le Mans.... Contrary to what some registers state. I have seen the car in pics at LM with (on the grid) and without these slots.

The nose air intake was removed later after her racing career was long over. The rounded nose however looks not so raw as it should be.

The perpex plastic cover over the inlet trumpets was redish on the front side at Le Mans (always overlooked by model makers).

Check out:

http://personal2.idd...50_breadvan.htm

http://www.ferraribreadvan.com/

http://www.maranello...819GT.250GT.htm

And ah, what was the phone number or Christie's again??

[Hieronymus]

Who is the current owner of the Breadvan?

I have a dear friend, with very close links to this car, that will be very interested to hear the latest about this car...

[Rosemayer]

This was Bizzarinis design to use the KAMM design theory but took it to the extream.

[Arjan de Roos]

Originally posted by Hieronymus
Who is the current owner of the Breadvan?

I suppose still Mr. Monte Shalett.

[David Beard]

Originally posted by jarama
- Guards Trophy - Brands Hatch, 4th o/a - 1st in GT Category, Colin Davis?
-Carles.

I'm quite sure I watched this on BBC TV at the time. I recall being fascinated by Raymond Baxter using the term "bread van" when describing it.

[Ferrariboxer]

HELLO, ONE BREAD VAN WAS BUILT ON A ISO CHASSIS, THE CAR WAS IN SOUTH OF FRANCE.
YES ISO WITH V8 CHEVY ON IT.
SALUTI

[Hieronymus]

I spoke to Colin Davis on Sunday and he was amazed to hear about the expecting selling price of this car. As far as he can recall he did drive the car at the Guards Trophy race. He stand corrected, though. He remembers something about damaging the car's nose at one stage. Carlo Maria Abate apparently owned a Ferrari 250 GT of his own.

Colin said the car went like lightning at Le Mans in '62.

[Henk Vasmel]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
Where have all the pictures gone?



This isn't the right one, is it? Where does this one come from?

The Ferrari Breadvan is well documented, but I had never seen this beast. What is it? I would begin by looking at Japan, possibly Nissan. Anyone has a better clue, or the correct identification even ?

Regards,

Henk Vasmel

[Ray Bell]

I found the picture on a log book sold here to keep a record of car expenses...

Other than that, I know nothing! It must have existed, however.

[Andrew Kitson]

I saw it race at Thruxton on Easter Monday 1975 in the historic race supporting the F2 meeting.
John Harper drove it, finishing 6th.

[klemcoll]

I first saw the "Breadvan" with Abate driving it at Brands in '62. An old friend from New Orleans USA has used it regularly and well for the past 20+ years and has had a very good time with that old beast. Frankly, it's not such fun to drive, however. The seating position is, well, contrived I would say with the gear lever best situated were your right hand attached to your right elbow! Volpi built it up because Ferrari would not then sell him a new GTO. He put the motor REALLY far aft, as he wanted to create something just as good as a GTO, if not actually better. Well, he and Bizzarrini almost succeeded. An interesting car indeed, but a real handful at speed.

[Hieronymus]

The Breadvan is suppose to go on auction today. I'll be interested to know what it will eventually go for...

[Arjan de Roos]

Obviously unsold due to not reaching its reserve. It might be sold anyhow...

Lets hope it will resurface every now and then.

[WINO]

If the reason for the existence of the Breadvan is the fact that Enzo did not want to sell a GTO to Count Volpi, how come that Volpi showed up at Le Mans in 1962 with the Breadvan AND a GTO? Another piece of folklore?


WINO

[Hieronymus]

Yes, the car was unsold. Can confirm this via a first-hand source.

[Scuderia CC]

I council highly of reading this thread, http://ferrarichat.c...35&page=1&pp=20

Best regards

[WINO]

Very interesting letter by Count Volpi. It finally explains the photo I have of the Breadvan, being sanded to bare aluminum during scrutineering time at Le Mans 1962. But it does not explain how he got a Ferrari GTO in the race for Nino Vaccarella and Giorgio Scarlatti.


WINO

[Pedro 917]

I saw the Breadvan today at the Techno Classica Fair in Essen, Germany :

[Ted Walker]

I understand that it now lives in Germany.

[Scuderia SSS]

I hope you dont mind me posting here. I did post a couple of shots of the "BV" in another thread, as i didnt realise there was one already going.
Hope you enjoy!!

[Paul Parker]

I was at the 1962 August Bank Holiday meeting at Brands Hatch and as far as I can recall Colin Davis was driving a pukka 250GTO (For Scuderia Serinissima perhaps) in the wet GT race and he locked up on the approach to Druids and hit the earth bank nose first at about 20/25mph. He was lying 7th or thereabouts.

Mike Parkes won easily in the Equipe Endeavour GTO, Surtees spun the Maranello Concessionaires GTO but finished 4th? with Ireland or Salvadori 2nd and 3rd in UDT Laystall and John Coombs' GTOs. Graham Hill was 5th in the pre-lightweight E type 4 WPD and I believe 'Pipes' was 6th in his original green GTO.

In the Guards Trophy the 'Breadvan' was driven by Carlo Abate and the race was won by Parkes in a 246SP. He also won the saloon car race in an Endeavour Jag Mk2. I believe the engine from the 'Breadvan' that presumably was a Testa Rossa unit ended up in the back of the old Cooper that Chris Lawrence raced at the 1966 British GP at Brands Hatch

[Scuderia SSS]

Originally posted by Paul Parker


In the Guards Trophy the 'Breadvan' was driven by Carlo Abate

Indeed, the 2 B/W photos i posted are of Abate driving the Breadvan.

[Alan Cox]

Here are a couple of shots taken during its English club racing career, from Oulton Park 1975-1976 when driven by Kim Mather and John Harper.

Edited by Alan Cox, 21 December 2010 - 10:11.

[Scuderia SSS]

Very nice Alan,
I wonder how many No's the Breadvan wore during its racing career?

[Lotus23]

Nice thread. Saw it run a couple of times in '62 -- at LeMans and Montlhery.

Have some 44yo b&w snapshots buried somewhere, but they're not nearly so good as Paul Creed's. I recall it caused quite a stir at the time.

[Clement]

Some good photos on the ferrarichat forum

[Arjan de Roos]

Great pictures guys!

The Ferrari Breadvan is probably one of the most party attending Ferrari of all. Also very often repainted as well as swopping owner rapidly.

What puzzles me are the pictures of the car mid seventies. The car has a wider opening in the nose, different air slots on the nose, no plexis in front of the head lights, but also, and this I find strange: one large opening on the side behind the side windows. Strange as I knew the nose was rebuild after a shunt around 1975 (Harper driving?). But was the car modified or completely restored after 1976?

[CRX Lee]

Originally posted by Scuderia SSS
I wonder how many No's the Breadvan wore during its racing career?

I found a B/W photo in the old Koni archives showing it wearing #15, a number that I haven't seen in the above photos. I rather beleive this would have been a shot from LeMans as it is in a grouping of other 250 GTO Ferraris (# 2 and #6) that are marked as being 1962 but it may be practice and not the race. The photo appears to be at the entrance of a pit lane with some hay bales in the background and signage written in French. I could post them but have no clue as to who deserved the photo credits.

I do recall seeing photos of the car for many years but did not know the Bizzarini connection.

[Arjan de Roos]

CRX Lee,

That would be the Paris 1000 km race at Montlhery in the fall of 1962. At Le Mans the breadvan had #16, but #15 in Paris. It finished 3rd in Paris.

The other GTO's must be:
#2 Bianchi/Mairesse 3943GT
#6 Guichet/Noblet 3527GT
They finished 4th and 5th behind the BV.

[Alan Cox]

Light in the tail - or what? Kim Mather in the Breadvan in 1975 at Aintree

Edited by Alan Cox, 21 December 2010 - 10:12.

[Scuderia SSS]

Looks like very heavy braking Alan. That rear wheel is almost off the ground

[Barry Boor]

So there was only one of these, was there?

Well, I am delighted to say that I'VE GOT IT!

[Sharman]

In the thread on Exhausts I raised the matter of "extractors", I've just noticed that the photos in post 28 show these on the breadvan. Snap according to RL. when it ran at Oulton And Aintree it had side exhausts

[jal43]

Hi

There are two versions scale model cars little known, o at least I have never seen any photo. That of red and black color with the letter T in white circle and Edgardo Mungo's silvering, that I take part in Hill Clim XXX1 Coppa Callenga in 1965,
Can someone inform me more about these two versions? Do photos exist?


A greeting

Joan Albert

[cstlhn]

Here is a photo of the BV at Road Atlanta in 1984. It was then owned by Dr. Ron Finger, the plastic surgeon from Savanah, GA. Gordom Tatum maintained the car for him. The car went to Joe Marchetti shortly thereafter.
In 1985 Monte Shallett purchased the car from Marchetti and brought to me to be restored. Having more than I could handle on my plate I arranged for the car to be restored in Modena through Alberto Pedretti.
I know Sport Auto redid all of the mechanicals but I am not sure who did the panel work. If memory serves me it was Allegretti. Great pains were taken to get it right.
The car was basically unused for many years and appeared at the Cavallino Classic in 2004. Monte had owned the car for twenty years!
I have been unable to speak with him since Hurricane Katrina but understand through a colleague in the Netherlands that the car is there having some metal work done to it? I guess it was sold?
I too would love to know where my old friend the BV ended up.

[dretceterini]

anyone ever figure out exactly what that ugly white car, a photo of which is posted earlier in this thread, actually is???

[David M. Kane]

Anyone bold enough to tell the Gordon Tatum story?

[marlondylan]

Originally posted by cstlhn
Here is a photo of the BV at Road Atlanta in 1984. It was then owned by Dr. Ron Finger, the plastic surgeon from Savanah, GA. Gordom Tatum maintained the car for him. The car went to Joe Marchetti shortly thereafter.
In 1985 Monte Shallett purchased the car from Marchetti and brought to me to be restored. Having more than I could handle on my plate I arranged for the car to be restored in Modena through Alberto Pedretti.
I know Sport Auto redid all of the mechanicals but I am not sure who did the panel work. If memory serves me it was Allegretti. Great pains were taken to get it right.
The car was basically unused for many years and appeared at the Cavallino Classic in 2004. Monte had owned the car for twenty years!
I have been unable to speak with him since Hurricane Katrina but understand through a colleague in the Netherlands that the car is there having some metal work done to it? I guess it was sold?
I too would love to know where my old friend the BV ended up.

It was sold to Germany recently.

[David M. Kane]

I had a nice chat on the phone yesterday with Harley Cluxton. I will ask him about the "Van" at our upcoming lunch. He knew Gordon Tatum...

[Alan Cox]

I don't know how many of you might have noticed that the Breadvan won the Shell Ferrari Historic Challenge round at Mugello on the 4th April driven by Claudia Huertgen and Max Werner.

[Arjan de Roos]

The Breadvan was in Holland a few years ago. It received a new nose at renowned coach building specialist Hietbrink. I saw some pics on their site http://www.hietbrink.com/

[lanciaman]

It's a plug ugly brute!