48 replies to this topic

[Ali_G]

[random rant]

Well in the end it turns out that Ralph FIrman when in F1 is indeed Irish. When giving the results at the end of the race last night, under nationality was written IRL.

There seems to be a lot of confusion about this. For instance, he is down as British on the f1 website. But technically, now when referring to F1 shouldn't Ralph be reffered to as being Irish. He has Irish citizenship, holds an irish passport, and now is recognised by the FIA as primarily being irish.

So why are people still calling him British. Is it because he lives there. Eddie Jordan lives there too. People wouldn't dare call him British.


[/random rant]

Niall

[Flying Panda]

Yes, thats true.

And David Coulthard is British, yet, is usually ignored by our commentators when they talk about British drivers. :

[MrAerodynamicist]

He has dual-nationality I believe, with bth British and Irish parents.

[AlesiUK]

oulthard is always reffered to as "british" when he wins,but when he does crap,he is "Scotish"

[Dudley]

Whereas the ITV feed treats him like God either way.

[Jacaré]

Originally posted by Ali_G
[random rant]

Well in the end it turns out that Ralph FIrman when in F1 is indeed Irish. When giving the results at the end of the race last night, under nationality was written IRL.
[/random rant]

Niall

the shamrock is a clear statement by Firman!
http://www.f1-live.c...e/diapo_113.jpg

[AD]

Ralph was Irish before turn 5 on lap 6. For a while after that he was obviously British

Seriously though, he made a basic mistake but was driving excellently. He was actually a few places ahead of Fisichella, even though he started behind Giancarlo. I believe that Ralph will do well this year

[Jacaré]

yep Firman was ahead of Fisichella because Fisi lost 3 places in Turn 6 of the first lap with a braking mistake.

[fifi]

well the last time i checked, being born in Norwich and living there, kinda makes you British

because his mam's irish he can claim dual nationality with an British Dad

So actually i guess hes HALF IRISH ;)

[Ross Stonefeld]

The things that make him Irish
-Irish mum

The things that make him British
-British dad
-born in England
-raised in England
-Have you heard his accent lately?
-British entry
-British flag on suit and car

[Bart]

Maybe "IRL" is where he's going to be looking for a new job, unless he improves quickly?

[eoin]

No he is british, but races with an irish racing license.

Maybe "IRL" is where he's going to be looking for a new job, unless he improves quickly?

Give the guy a break...just because he spun in the race doesn't mean that he belongs in IRL, if you use that sorta logic RB and JPM should also be on the next plane state-side.

[FlatFoot]

Who cares?

[Lada Lover]

Ralf Firman - IRL, doesn't look good.

Indy Racing League. Sorry just a joke

Ralf will be given a chance and rookies make mistakes and then learn from them.

[flyer72]

Originally posted by eoin
No he is british, but races with an irish racing license.



Give the guy a break...just because he spun in the race doesn't mean that he belongs in IRL, if you use that sorta logic RB and JPM should also be on the next plane state-side.

I agree - he lost it in the same place as RB, who I don't quite rate as a rookie driver. Let the man have at least half a season before being judged.

[Ali_G]

Ross: He holds an Irish Passport. Doesn't this mean he's Irish.

Chekc his race suit. Not sign of an union Jack.

If he ever wings a race or makes the podium, there'l be an irish flag and the irish national anthem, end of story.

Niall

[FlatFoot]

Originally posted by Ali_G
If he ever wings a race or makes the podium, there'l be an irish flag and the irish national anthem, end of story.

Niall

We'll all die wondering.....

[superbird]

I'm wondering whats with the rifle sight on the side of the helmet, my (Irish) boyfriend thinks it's highly dodgy. I think if he holds both passports then he should go by the one he grew up in.

On a slightly related note the boyfriend asked me if I was proud of DC after todays race because he's British. Well I doubt many Scots celebrate when an English sportsperson or team wins so why should I support theirs unless I particularly like them?

[Daemon]

Ralphs Irish??

Shhhh. Don't tell Benson and Hedges. They won't be impressed the "British driver" they hired to promote their British Brand, doesn't consider himself British.

[masterhit]

Originally posted by fifi
well the last time i checked, being born in Norwich and living there, kinda makes you British

because his mam's irish he can claim dual nationality with an British Dad

So actually i guess hes HALF IRISH ;)

Exactly. Like me. Now, if he becomes an Irish citizen, that's the end of the story, but until this has been confirmed, he can choose to call himself either as suits a given group of people (i.e sponsors and fans)

[fifi]

Originally posted by Ali_G
Ross: He holds an Irish Passport. Doesn't this mean he's Irish.

Chekc his race suit. Not sign of an union Jack.

If he ever wings a race or makes the podium, there'l be an irish flag and the irish national anthem, end of story.

Niall

well im scottish through and through, but I qualify for an Irish passport
if i took this up.......does this make me Irish.....uhm i dont think so


yeah there iwll be an Irish Flag and the Irish national anthem....but he has an IRISH racing Licence

[lustigson]

Isn't it a matter of which nation/club issued his license? I heard he has two passports, but it could be that the Irish motor club (or whatever it's called) issued his racing license.

I remember the same matter being discussed (though in the press) about Eddie Irvine. There were even threats after took his first win, because they raised the Irish flag in stead of the Union Jack and played the Irish anthem.

[BRG]

This came as news to me - I thought that Ralph was a Norfolk boy, like me! It strikes me that the Irish licence etc is a bit of sucking up to Eddie Jordan - and why not if it helped get him the seat!

[El Magnificante]

With his accent, he could be the next James Bond

I don't care he sounds pretty damn English and is in my book. We need the return of a few English gentleman racers. "Oh I say old boy, would one mind terribly if I throw myself orf the track, what".

Mind you, coming from Norwich, I'm not surprised he puts himself down as Irish. People have been known to fall asleep at the wheel when driving through Norwich due to the incredible dullness of the place.

[BRG]

Originally posted by El Magnificante
Norwich... due to the incredible dullness of the place.

And yet your profile shows that you are in Northampton....

Pot

Kettle

Black?

[El Magnificante]

Originally posted by BRG
And yet your profile shows that you are in Northampton....

Pot

Kettle

Black?

It maybe the a*sehole of the midlands but it's certainly not dull. Alan Partridge isn't our local radio presenter

[Ross Stonefeld]

Originally posted by El Magnificante
Mind you, coming from Norwich, I'm not surprised he puts himself down as Irish. People have been known to fall asleep at the wheel when driving through Norwich due to the incredible dullness of the place.

Maybe thats why I went rototilling in a turnip field

[El Magnificante]

Originally posted by Ross Stonefeld



Maybe thats why I went rototilling in a turnip field

[Nikolas Garth]

Originally posted by Ali_G
[random rant]

Well in the end it turns out that Ralph FIrman when in F1 is indeed Irish. When giving the results at the end of the race last night, under nationality was written IRL.

There seems to be a lot of confusion about this. For instance, he is down as British on the f1 website. But technically, now when referring to F1 shouldn't Ralph be reffered to as being Irish. He has Irish citizenship, holds an irish passport, and now is recognised by the FIA as primarily being irish.

So why are people still calling him British. Is it because he lives there. Eddie Jordan lives there too. People wouldn't dare call him British.


[/random rant]

Niall

I wouldn't worry too much about the "Irish" issue. A few more weekends like the one just passed, and no one will be claiming him as British.

[Ghostrider]

I don't care if he is Irish or British, as long as he gets some points for Jordan.

[Eric McLoughlin]

When did he start racing under an Irish licence? Was he racing under a British licence up to now? Certainly in his British F3 days he was only ever listed as a British driver. I'm not sure if he ever raced on Irish soil?

[avidfan]

There's tax law in Ireland exempting profits derived from sporting activities from taxation. Damon Hill was tax exempt for most of his F1 career by listing his residence as Ireland. Maybe Ralph's positioning himself tax-wise for a big bucks future by electing for Irish citizenship based on his mother's nationality at birth.

[tintin75]

The British flag was raised when he finished on the podium eight times last season in Japan.

[kwood24]

dont you just hate that, somebody goes and spoils a good rant by actually looking up the facts, whats next f1.com taking down its hotest pit babe section, dohhhh

[fifi]

Originally posted by kwood24
dont you just hate that, somebody goes and spoils a good rant by actually looking up the facts, whats next f1.com taking down its hotest pit babe section, dohhhh

[se7en_24]

Ali, if a bloke walked into your local in Ireland with Firman's accent and claimed to be Irish, I can just imagine the reception he'd get! A friend of mine holds dual nationality the same as Firman, and he is laughed at by my Irish mates if he tries to tell them in his posh English accent that he's Irish.

And as already noted, the union flag has always been raised for him in the lower formulae.

[lustigson]

Isn't it the same with Jordan itself? Formally Jordan is an Irish team, racing under an Irish license even though the team is based in Britain. The same goes for Toyota, which, in my impression, is still a Japanese team even though their headquarters is in Köln. That doesn't make them a German team, now, does it? And what about Renault, which is based in Britain, but a French team? And, in the not too distant past, Benetton, which was Italian at one time, though based in Britain.

To put it this way: it depends on what license you have (driver or team wise) to have a certain 'nationality' displayed on the results screens.

[Garagiste]

Benetton were a British team, according to the national anthem played when they won.
During 94-95 it seemed like we heard GSTQ every weekend, no matter who was on the top step - when it was MS they played it for the constructor.

[Eric McLoughlin]

Damon Hill (and Eddie Irvine) managed to be residents of the Irish Republic for tax purposes but still retained their British nationality - and race licences. Jordan may be Irish in spirit but of necessity thay have to be based in the UK. There are simply no facilities or adequately qualified personnel available in Ireland to run and base an F1 team there.

The chances of Firman or Jordan getting on the podium this year are pretty slim I would think so controversy over which flag to fly and which anthem to play will remain an academic exercise.

[lustigson]

Originally posted by Garagiste
Benetton were a British team.

They were for the most part of their excistence. However, they changed their nationality in (I believe) 1997... hence the little Italian flag on the nosecones.

[Michael Connolly]

With his accent, he could be the next James Bond

The current James Bond is Irish - born and reared. Is that the accent you're thinking of?

There's tax law in Ireland exempting profits derived from sporting activities from taxation. Damon Hill was tax exempt for most of his F1 career by listing his residence as Ireland. Maybe Ralph's positioning himself tax-wise for a big bucks future by electing for Irish citizenship based on his mother's nationality at birth

The tax breaks apply to Irish residents, regardless of Nationality. That's why Damon benefitted. Ralph's tax status is determined by his country of residence - the UK

I see nothing confusing. He holds dual citizenship, so there's nothing wrong with ITV calling him British.

He entered his Nationality as Irish, so that's why the FIA show IRL beside his name. The fact that he made this choice and stuck a shamrock on his helmet (urg!) suggests to me that he considers himself Irish.

It does make a difference because regardless of what we might think of his right to call himself Irish, it's the first time there's been a driver racing under that tricolor since Derek Daly in the eighties. If the Malaysians can make a fuss about Alex, then dammit I'm going to celebrate Ralph ;-)

[BRG]

Originally posted by Michael Connolly
If the Malaysians can make a fuss about Alex, then dammit I'm going to celebrate Ralph ;-)

Of course, Alex is apparently half-British (on his mother's side) but we were always very happy for Malaysia to take all the credit. I guess that if Ralph has Irish ancestry and dual nationality, then he is entitled to use whichever one he chooses.

But it does seem a bit odd for a Norfolk-boy who always previously raced as British to suddenly declare himself Irish and just after signing for an Irish team. Call me a cynic if you want....

[Eric McLoughlin]

Sportsmen and women treat nationality as a negotiable commodity these days - look at Lennox Lewis and Zola Bud. They decided to be British when it suited them. Even Barry McGuigan, who was born and bred in the Irish Republic (and represented Ireland in the 1980 Olympics), had himself re-classified as a British boxer when he turned professional. It's always interesting watching the Republic of Ireland soccer team singing the Irish national anthem before an international match. It's obvious who's really Irish and who's not.

[Garagiste]

However, they changed their nationality in (I believe) 1997

Ah, so that's why they stopped winning? Being serious for a moment, you may well be right, I can't remember what anthem was played after Berger's sole and final victory in a benny.

BRG:

Of course, Alex is apparently half-British (on his mother's side) but we were always very happy for Malaysia to take all the credit

Meow! Cruel, but on the money!

[Jardins]

Originally posted by Eric McLoughlin
Damon Hill (and Eddie Irvine) managed to be residents of the Irish Republic for tax purposes but still retained their British nationality - and race licences. Jordan may be Irish in spirit but of necessity thay have to be based in the UK. There are simply no facilities or adequately qualified personnel available in Ireland to run and base an F1 team there.

The chances of Firman or Jordan getting on the podium this year are pretty slim I would think so controversy over which flag to fly and which anthem to play will remain an academic exercise.

During the "Parade of Nations" at the Canadian GP, Firman was represented by the Irish flag. I suspect that if he were ever to win or get on the podium, it would indeed be Irish flag and national anthem.

Thanks to Bira for providing a link to this thread. I was wondering what was going on with Firman's nationality.

[Eric McLoughlin]

I'd forgotten this thread. My prediction about Jordan not making the podium turned out to be oretty accurate - not!

[se7en_24]

Originally posted by Jardins


During the "Parade of Nations" at the Canadian GP, Firman was represented by the Irish flag. I suspect that if he were ever to win or get on the podium, it would indeed be Irish flag and national anthem.

Thanks to Bira for providing a link to this thread. I was wondering what was going on with Firman's nationality.

If he is racing under the Irish banner then of course he'd have the Irish flag and anthem on the podium. However, if he went into a pub in Ireland and claimed he was Irish with his accent - he'd probably be racing wheelchairs the next day ;)

[Pilla]

I think half the planet claim that they have Irish ancestary no matter where they are from (75% on St Patricks day)

[Ali_G]

Originally posted by Pilla
I think half the planet claim that they have Irish ancestary no matter where they are from (75% on St Patricks day)

The best example of this is with Tony Cascarino.

To play with Ireland, he claimed that his grand mother (or something like that) had Irish ancestory. So he got to play with ireland. But later it was found out that his grand mother had no Irish links at all, and more than that, he had no Irish links what so ever.

For some reason though, FIFA didn't seem to care, and let Cascarino play out his career with Ireland until he retired.

Niall