14 replies to this topic

[Magee]

In 1967, Porsche built 20 of these special light-weight cars for the track. Only 10 remain, and two of them are still racing. On this QuickTime site you can see one in action --
http://www.endorphin...e_911r_alt.html

[diego]

It don't load -- ain't got no gas in it.

[Magee]

Diego, perhaps the site is not on your server. The file is quite large and if you have a slow machine it could take a while. Try to go to the Apple Quick Time home site and start from there.
Mike

[rdrcr]

Originally posted by diego
It don't load -- ain't got no gas in it.

: It's got "gas" for me...

Interesting video clip on Ed Mastuitia's Porsche 911R. Weight saving measures included, Bamboo strips to support the trunk, holes drilled everywhere, no insulation, Fiat taillights in special mountings, etc., etc.

For those who can download it, it was taken at Laguna Seca in the annual Historics event.

Thanks for the clip, cool car.

[dretceterini]

I thought it was 17 cars; not that it matters much. I knew a guy in Los Angeles who passed away that owned on that was rather scruffy. His last name was Green...

[Ralliart]

The 1967 Typ 911 R has a chapter devoted to it in "Porsche Legends - Inside History Of The Epic Cars" by Randy Leffingwell who wrote (in part): "The 911 R production run of twenty cars used fiberglass wherever possible for body panels and plexiglass similarly for windows. It was powered by a variation (Typ 901/22) of the 2.0 liter Carrera 6 engine (Typ 901/20)...(Ferdinand) Piech's engineers weighed every piece of equipment...The individual taillight lenses weighed nearly 1/2 kilogram less than the standard taillight fixture. Rubber tie-downs replaced heavy metal latches for the front and rear deck lids. Two Weber 46 IDA3C carburetors fed the engine. Out of 1991cc (80 x 66mm), the 911 R claimed 210hp at 8000 rpm (and the car weighed 810kg (1,760 lbs)...When fiberglass is laid up as a single guage, and reinforced only with wafer-thin bamboo strips laminated to the inside, a front deck lid can be so thin it literally flexes in the wind...The original plans from Porsche engineering called for only twenty production copies (with four additional prototypes). After these were completed, Huschke von Hanstein saw them and imagined a larger run, say 500 cars, that would qualify for the GT category. But the car was only conceived by Piech as a production experiment...and it all ended after the twenty four cars...A marketing director at Porsche vetoed the large number. He believed it would be impossible to sell 500. He was probably right; some of the twenty were still available in 1970."
Rico Steinemann wanted to challenge several endurance records (including a record attempt at a distance of 20,000km) and went to Monza, with Jo Siffert, Dieter Spoerry and Charles Vogele with a Porsche Carrera 6. Firestone provided the tires and British Petroleum was involved as a way to promote a new engine oil. On 29 October 1967, Siffert started out but, after some 10 hours, and only two of the planned five world records accomplished, the attempt was finished when the front left shock absorber ripped out of the body of the car. The pounding around on the old Monza banking had fatigued the metal to exhaustion. The rules specified that the attempt could be repeated within 48 hours so, by 31 October, 10pm at the latest, a new car had to stand at the start line if they were to give it another go.
Enter the 911 R...Running 24 hours a day, four days, for 20,000km, flat out, the records were set. Five world and eleven international records plus an unanticipated record...90 tires were consumed in 96 hours.
Vic Elford won the 1967 Marathon de la route in a 911 R, in 1968, a specially constructed 911 with R components was fitted with a Sportomatic transmission and won the Marathon again. Later in 1969, Gerard Larrouse and Maurice Gelin took a 911 R to the Tour de France and Tour de Corse and won both. Outright.
Quite the car, the 911 R!!!!

[Magee]

Ralliart,
The book says the engine was a 6 Carrera 901/22 or /20. Ed Mastuitia says in the clip that it was a 906 engine. Did he mean model or engine? Was the 906 running the 901/22?
And do you know the 904's engine series?

[diego]

Got it working! I was stymied by my firewall....

Great videos, great site. Thanks!

I've seen that car run, its a beaut.

[Ralliart]

The book has the specs for all the cars listed in the back pages and a 1965 904 Carrera GTS has a Typ 901/20 engine, flat six 1991cc while a 1965 Typ 904/8 Bergspyder has a Typ 771, flat eight, 1991cc and the 911 R has a Typ 901/22, flat six, 1991cc. I don't know if that helps at all. I certainly don't know about engine series but I'd bet someone out there does. Incidentally, Leffingwell is scheduled to appear at a book signing/car show here in southern California tommorow evening. Unfortunately, it's scheduled at the same time that the Milwaukee CART race is being shown live, so I've got to decide between now and then whether to watch the race or go to the show.

[HistoryBuff]

Not many people stay on the story this long but 44 years ago I was walking along a street below Sunset Strip (I say "below" because Sunset is at the top of the hill, below the Hollywood Hills)  and I met an actor with a white 911R. He convinced me that it was rare enough that I did a two page story in Motor Trend.

Now  44 years later I am curious to know if  Jeff Mannix's 911R was bought straight from the factory, did it have a racing history, and what the SN is? I heard a rumor that it is Seinfeld's 911R but then a lot of the white 911R cars look the same. I am interested in what Mannix sold it for but not in the modern day post-2000 prices when they went crazy.

 

Also for general knowledge, did Porsche really think they could homologate it as a GT car with only 20 built, or did they lose steam on the project at 20 cars? Looking forward to comments, sorry I am not a Porsche expert and only noticed the car in the first place because of the round taillights.

[arttidesco]

 

Also for general knowledge, did Porsche really think they could homologate it as a GT car with only 20 built, or did they lose steam on the project at 20 cars? Looking forward to comments, sorry I am not a Porsche expert and only noticed the car in the first place because of the round taillights.

 

I suspect the 911R project may have been started to cover the eventuality that World Championship Endurance racing might go towards mandating production based machines after the disappointing take up for the 3 litre prototype category towards the end of the 1960's, by the mid seventies that is exactly what happened with the Group 5 Silhouette spec series which was dominated from the get go by the Porsche 935 vehicles.   

[RS2000]

When did 20 become the "minimum production" figure for Group4 (down from 40)? The fact that 917s etc. were the result of that reduction doesn't mean that a 911R was irrelevant. Quite apart from capacity classes in racing, Gp4 was just about beginning to be recognised as a category in rallying then, as the new (post 1.1.66.) Appendix J settled down. A 911S in Group 3 (which category was much more restricted than it had been up to 31.12.65.) was probably much slower than a (more modified) 911 (L?) that had gained Group2 homologation as a "touring car".

 

17 would have been quite good going to get homologation for a "20 minimum" category then. The actual regulations stated "provisions for" the minimum production had to be proved, rather than completed cars actually counted.  

Edited by RS2000, 12 November 2014 - 19:36.

[fbarrett]

Recall that the 911R was the first real racing iteration of the basic 911, and Porsche had only discovered the merits of fiberglass a few years earlier in the 904. Maybe they just wanted to build a series of hot-rod 911s, make a splash by setting records, and try to sell the cars to race teams? By 1968, though, maybe potential customers figured out that they could buy a production 911 and modify it for a lot less money.

 

Frank

[stuartbrs]

I thought Vic Elford was instrumental in getting Porsche to bolt a 906 engine in the back of the 911R. What a car!

[RS2000]

He doesn't mention it in his book. Like most successful drivers he would probably have taken the opportunity to do so. He does cover at length how he introduced Porsche to the importance of gear ratios in rallying. His influence on Porsche probably only began to be felt some way into 67. He refers to using the 911R on the 67 Coupe des Alpes as if it was just another car.