20 replies to this topic

[Megatron]

What is the exact and correct green that British cars carry (or carried before sponsorship)? It was mentioned at Le Mans that the Bentely was "true" BRG but looked black on the TV camera's. I would think Jaguar would not be true BRG, too bright, but I thought the Jordan 191 was close.

Is the Bentley (which really did look black at times) "true" BRG?

[quintin cloud]

In my view the green that Lotus used in the 1960's like the 33 and 49 is the best example of the British racing green.

[BRG]

Sorry, but there just ain't any such thing as "true" British Racing Green.

IIRC, the original CSI national racing colours list simply says "green" for the UK - it does not specify an actual shade. I don't know for sure, but I imagine that the establishment of proper agreed colour standards for paints is comparatively recent (?) so there was no real way that a particular shade of green could be mandated. By the time that such a standard had come along, different manufacturers/teams had already adopted their favoured version of BRG. So Jaguar's shade may have differed from those of Vanwall, Lotus, BRM, Bentley or Aston Martin. What many of us think of as BRG is probably the shade of green that BMC used for MG road cars.

As for the original BRG, one story has it that it was the house colour scheme used on Napier's cars that somehow became adopted as the national colour - and that was indeed a very dark green.

[VAR1016]

Originally posted by BRG
Sorry, but there just ain't any such thing as "true" British Racing Green.


As for the original BRG, one story has it that it was the house colour scheme used on Napier's cars that somehow became adopted as the national colour - and that was indeed a very dark green.

Yes, funnily enough I have seen such a shade described by a paint manufacturer as "Connaught Green".

Whether the makers had Send in Surrey in mind, or one of the four regions of Ireland or perhaps a hotel in London - or even a Royal Duke - I have no idea!


PdeRL

[petefenelon]

Originally posted by Megatron
What is the exact and correct green that British cars carry (or carried before sponsorship)? It was mentioned at Le Mans that the Bentely was "true" BRG but looked black on the TV camera's. I would think Jaguar would not be true BRG, too bright, but I thought the Jordan 191 was close.

Is the Bentley (which really did look black at times) "true" BRG?

Never has been, never was one true BRG.

David Betts, a keen historian of the sport, has a collection of photos of different interpretations of the theme:

http://dbetts.motorsport.org.uk/brg/

[eldougo]

Quote : BRG .
What many of us think of as BRG is probably the shade of green that BMC used for MG road cars.
______________________________________

That is so true i remember years ago .A classic car repairer here in Sydney was about to begin
spraying a D type an he said it was the same colour as a MGB. green. I personaly think
it is a great colour for some cars.


Doug.

[lustigson]

I'm not an expert, but I reckon the true BRG is the equivalent of the true Italian racing red... which is non-existent.

[Ray Bell]

No pics of the earliest BRMs on that site...

If there ever was a car that should have been painted whatever the 'official' colour was, that was the one.

I imagine it was like the C-type depicted... I know the BRM book explains that they diced the light green because it showed the mechanics' fingerprints too well. And that this had happened to a nother British team pre-war.

So dark green is the colour virtually by default, if I read the situation correctly.

[Bernd]

Originally posted by lustigson
I'm not an expert, but I reckon the true BRG is the equivalent of the true Italian racing red... which is non-existent.

Rosso Corsa is no myth, it's an option in the Ferrari catalogue. The only choice if you ask me.

[VAR1016]

Originally posted by Bernd


Rosso Corsa is no myth, it's an option in the Ferrari catalogue. The only choice if you ask me.

My personal preference is the darker red used by Alfa-Romeo, pre-war and by Lancia for the D50.

Can anyone tell me the colour code for the Lancia red?

PdeRL

[lustigson]

I remember a story about Ferrari painting it's cars in whatever tone of red available at the time. Sometimes this was darkers, sometimes lighter.

I do recall that Alfa was usually a bit darker than Ferrari -- am I correct? And I'm curious about Lancia and Maserati, too.

[Geoff E]

On the Duke video "Racing Green" (1993), Neville Hay says that BRG was so significant that it had its own British Standard BS381C. In fact, this BSS comprises standard colours for paints, and colours are given a 3 digit number eg "Light orange 557 (BS381C)". What is (or was) the number for BRG, I have no idea.

[Eric McLoughlin]

Colour standards have been around for at least a century. The British miltary have had official colours goiung back to pre-World War 1. The US military has FS (Federal Standard ) numbers in use during World War 2.

As for BRG, as BRG stated, there has never been any standard BRG. My Caterham Seven is painted in Caterham's version of BRG, which is very different from the rather "olive" tinted Lotus BRG of the mid 1960s.

[David Birchall]

My understanding has always been that the colour was closer to the green used on Castrol Oil cans and adverts. Certainly lighter than the Jags used in the fifties.

[dbw]

as race cars are conserned i suspect that brg is as much a single color as bugatti blue....[or ferrari red]..i think it depended a lot on what was handy as the car came out the door...assuming there was a "standard" formula[slim chance] ,what were the chances the next 5 gallons mixed up would match? also...was it brushed? sprayed? over bare alloy? over a light or dark primer?thick or thin mixture?..all the results will vary even with paint from the same can....

a good example is the famous "lavender" lotus elites...now widly copied on restorations,it actually was a result of UV degredation to the factories light blue...it never was a "color" at all!

[Frank S]

During the late 50s in Southern California there was reason to find a US substitute/equivalent for standard MG BRG. One 'expert' said Brit paint was not likely to last as long. Another said the critical characteristic was cost.

My friend's 'enthusiast' accident (sand in the line) meant he had to do the search. On advice from several, he settled on a 1954 Dodge truck green, distinguised by its indistinguishability when applied to the original object. On a TD Midget, it resonated as BRG to end all BRGs. For my friend. I preferred the all-but-black BRM BRG. I understand the way it got dark was to add red.

Imagine. Rosso Corso under the skin skin . . .

Frank S

[Jack-the-Lad]

I'm thinking of repainting the Elan, so this thread is of real interest to me. Frankly I really like the so-dark-it's-almost-black shade of green. If anybody knows the paint code of the Le Mans Bentleys I would be interested in knowing it.

Jack

[lustigson]

Why don't you try the Bentley factory? They might be willing...

[Eric McLoughlin]

Caterham Cars at Dartford. Kent will paint your Seven in any shade of green you wish - as well as their standard version of BRG. It might be worthwhile contacting them for colour advice.

[Richard Neale]

Cooper Racing Green as researched by John Cooper, David Cooper and Dupont is

Dupont Chromabase.
Color Spectramaster Green, Value shade #7

GS 57612 Tinting Guide mixed as follows for a 2 quart pot.

806J HS Black 193.4 grams
830J HS Fast Green 290 grams
881J HS Yellow Oxide 325.6 grams
801J HS White 351.2 grams
150K B/C Balancer 1328 grams
175K Binder 1722.8 grams

Mix with 7185 S high temp Chroma system basemaker 1:1 for application.

Best results come from using Dupont primer/surfacer 30S Gray as an under coat.

Did you Really want to know this

[dolomite]

Here's the Triumph version (no.75 on this chart) :