19 replies to this topic

[austin]

According to race entry lists, from 1984-1987, McLaren were using the "TAG" engine. However, people on the forums keep referring to the team as McLaren/Porsche. What was the connection between TAG and Porsche?

[Bernd]

Technics d'Avant Garde (From memory!)

Basically a Saudi concern that financed the development of the Porsche F1 engine for McLaren.

[Ray Bell]

Although I think their main part in the McLaren-Porsche thing was that they financed the engine program, it's possible they had some input on the engine management side.

They own Heuer, don't they?

[wildman]

Here's a bit more info on TAG and its principal, Mansour Ojjeh. As far as I know, TAG is still a major shareholder in McLaren.

[calibre001]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
Although I think their main part in the McLaren-Porsche thing was that they financed the engine program, it's possible they had some input on the engine management side.

They own Heuer, don't they?

They did- it was sold to LVMH about 18 months ago

[Bernd]

Originally posted by Ray Bell
Although I think their main part in the McLaren-Porsche thing was that they financed the engine program, it's possible they had some input on the engine management side.

They own Heuer, don't they?

I just reread Dougs McLaren any TAG EMS work is not mentioned there and I've not heard of it before.

Yes they own Heuer the company is now known as TAG Heuer. I own 3 TAG's and one original Heuer, very nice timepieces.

[Roger Clark]

I believe that Bosch developed the engine electronics of the TAG-Porsche engine. Initially at least there was some friction because they were prepared to co-operate with Porsche but not with McLaren.

[Bernd]

Originally posted by Evan Shift


They did- it was sold to LVMH about 18 months ago

Heuer was? Really that's news to me, are the watches still going to be known as TAG Heuer?

[Pilla]

Originally posted by Bernd


Heuer was? Really that's news to me, are the watches still going to be known as TAG Heuer?

They once had shares in Mclaren but they were sold farely recently, maybe that is what he meant, I think Heuer is kind of TAG's core business.

[david_martin]

Originally posted by Bernd


Heuer was? Really that's news to me, are the watches still going to be known as TAG Heuer?

Yeah the LVMH deal was finalised in 1999, and a license to use the TAG trademark was included in the deal. As for the TAG engine management system electronics, that project came about during 1992 when McLaren were designing their first semi-automatic gearbox and active chassis and needed an electronics platform to control them. It was subsequently extended to do the engine management functions on the customer Cosworth engine they ran in 1993. AFAIK Bosch did the engine management system for the Porsche engine and Honda had their own system which McLaren then used until the end of 1992.

[Pilla]

Your right:

http://www.tagheuer....and/history.lbl

Fast forward to 99 and it says that Tag sold Heuer.

What does TAG actualy do, they own part of a F1 team (I was wrong they still have a share holding in Mclaren) they make stereo systems (Tag Mclaren Audio), and they charter aircrafts, do they even have a core business?

Mclaren is pretty diverse in itself, they obviously make F1 cars, and Road Cars but also Stereos, own a Marketing Service, Advanced Composites (helping to build the Beagle 2 Mars Lander), A motorcycle race track, and a Catoring company!

[ghinzani]

Mclaren own a bike race track?? which one? I knew they owned Lydden at one point. Mansour Ojeh's son Karim races in the Formula Palmer Audi club racing series which is a single seater race series for amateurs. He looks like he is in his 30's at least so Mansour must be knocking on retirement age.

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by ghinzani
.....so Mansour must be knocking on retirement age.

With his kind of money I reckon he's well past retirement age!

[calibre001]

TAG's core activity is being a financial investor- they don't really manage businesses, just make savy investments. They have interests in Asprey and Garrard and owned about 30% of Tag-Heuer.

The family money laregly comes from arms trading, and Mansour's step-mother has been in the press recently as a key player in the proposed Cordiant ad agency takeover.

[ghinzani]

Is'nt Mansours wife a hot french chick?

[calibre001]

Originally posted by ghinzani
Is'nt Mansours wife a hot french chick?

Almost certainly. I had the pleasure of meeting one of his son's girlfriends earlier this year. There is no need to feel sorry for the Ojjeh boys...;)

[Holger Merten]

Originally posted by Bernd


Heuer was? Really that's news to me, are the watches still going to be known as TAG Heuer?

BTW: Yes that's a fact. They sold 3 Billions for the whole group. That’s why I still wear an IWC (made in Switzerland). A “Fliegerchronograph” for insiders only.


And it's right TAG paid for the development of the engine, and therefore the engine was named TAG, but Porsche was just the engine developer and producer. I'm not sure, if Porsche could be named officially as part of this relationship? I remember, that in Germans magazines, always Porsche was the hero, but I think we were proud that we took successfully part in F1.

[Eric McLoughlin]

As mentioned above, TAG are a Saudi based company (I think the Saudi Royal Family are or were involved) whose role in life is to finance and promote new technologies. They also have a large land portfolio. A few years ago they purchased a 99 year lease on the former Minnistry of Defence airfield here at Farnborough which fits into their overall strategy of investement in South East England.They own a fleet of biz jets (Canadair Challengers I think) some of which are regular visitors to Farnborough. They hace spent a fortune turning Farnborough airfield into what will eventually be the biz jet airport for the London area.

The Saudi connection was what took Williams into the big time in 1977. They managed to procure support from a number of Saudi business - Saudia (the national airline, TAG and Bin Laden (the comstruction company).

[Doug Nye]

TAG's response to Bosch's relative lack of cooperation where McLaren was concerned on the TAG Turbo-by-Porsche V6 engine management system was to head-hunt their best people and establish TAG Electronics to do the job in house at Woking. During the McLaren F1 road car programme the predominantly British boys working on that project were housed in the same building as the predominantly German guys working for TAG Electronics.

Come Christmas the inevitable happened.

The McLaren Cars road car team challenged the TAG Electronics sparks team to a football match... between the lines...

DCN

[David McKinney]

So that's how tag football started