131 replies to this topic

[sandy]

If you wanted to talk to someone who drove a 250F in a GP who could you contact - Stirling Moss, Jack Brabham, Roy Salvadori, Reg Hunt ...who else?

[Vitesse2]

Only other one I can think of is Emmanuel de Graffenried.

[gerard BARATHIEU]

you forgot Theresa de FILIPIS, Maurice TRINTIGNANT,Caroll SHELBY.Hans HERRMANN.

Good!!

[Gary C]

Chris Amon!!!

[David McKinney]

J F González, Roberto Mieres, Phil Hill, Carroll Shelby, John Fitch, Giorgio Scarlatti, Maria-Teresa de Filippis, Gino Munaron, Hans Herrmann, Cliff Allison, Colin Davis, Ken Kavanagh, Arnold Glass, David McKay, Gavin Quirk, Len Gilbert, Chris Amon
I think they're all still alive
I've got another 18 names whose continued existence I'm less sure about

[cabianca]

Phil Hill

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by David McKinney
I've got another 18 names whose continued existence I'm less sure about

Have now gone through my notes and eliminated several names who have indeed passed on, but still have a list of ten drivers who AFAIK are still alive. Haven’t checked them against anyone’s database though, and some of them maybe shouldn’t be here:
Jean Lucas, André Simon, Lucien Barthe, René Bourely, Gerino Gerini, Ottorino Volonterio, Clemar Bucci, Pablo Gulle, Bob Eade, Brian Prescott

[Tim Murray]

Volonterio is definitely no longer around:

http://forums.atlasf...ight=volonterio

[eldridge]

Horace Gould?

[David McKinney]

is definitely no longer around

[GIGLEUX]

David, Jean Lucas died on 27 sept 2003.

[sandy]

Any ideas on who would be left now - Moss, Brabham, Salvadori, Phil Hill, Glass, Hunt I'm sure of - who else?

And who is left as to who could discuss what it was like to drive a GP front engined Ferrari - Phil Hill of course and then there are all of those Australians and New Zealanders who raced the Super Squalo Ferraris, Brydon's 1.5 litre, Roycroft 4.4 litre etc, that were out there, but any one else?

Did Tony Brooks ever drive BRM's 250F on any testing day?

I guess as far as Vanwall's are concerned (front engined ie) we only have Stirling Moss and Tony Brooks.

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by sandy
I guess as far as Vanwall's are concerned (front engined ie) we only have Stirling Moss and Tony Brooks.

Plus Salvadori, Titterington and Gonzalez. And I think Surtees tested one

[Paul Parker]

Exercising the little grey cells here I think Desmond Titterington died somewhere around 2002/3.

[Allen Brown]

http://www.oldracing.../watn/?Letter=T

Desmond Titterington died 13 Apr 2002.

http://www.oldracing.../watn/?Letter=V

Ottorino Volonterio died 10 Mar 2003.

[David McKinney]

Apologies to all concerned on the Titterington front
My 2004 Volonterio reference was corrected at the time

[Arturo Pereira]

Clemar Bucci was still alive by the end of 2006. I talked with him by phone by then.

[Sharman]

You've missed Fritz D'Orey on the 250F list

[cpbell]

Of course Baron de Graffenried passed away recently.

[David McKinney]

Originally posted by Sharman
You've missed Fritz D'Orey on the 250F list

I admitted to missing 18 names off the 250F list

[Ted Walker]

Then getting newer you could to someone who COULD drive a 250f ,one Charles Lucas

[Sharman]

Willy wasn't bad either

[Doug Nye]

Interesting question this - and interesting answer too. Ask Moss about the 250F and he enthuses - he loved them. Ask Brabham about the 250F and he spits blood - he came to detest his (though of course it was a somewhat different animal from the rest!).

DCN

[Macca]

I wonder if that was somewhat of a financial thing - the car was tired and needed a full rebuild which it didn't get, then it blew up........maybe he lost a packet..........




Paul M

[cpbell]

Originally posted by Doug Nye
Interesting question this - and interesting answer too. Ask Moss about the 250F and he enthuses - he loved them. Ask Brabham about the 250F and he spits blood - he came to detest his (though of course it was a somewhat different animal from the rest!).

DCN

If as a young cub I might bold as to reply to Mr Doug Nye, might it have been that Jack's style didn't suit the Maser - did it need to be driven a little more delicately?

[Rob Miller]

Dan Gurney drove a front engined Ferrari.

[oldtimer]

Tony Brooks also drove a front-engined Ferrari.

Are these cells out to lunch, or munched out, but didn't I see Brabham in the Owen coloured 250F at Silverstone in1956? I would have thought the handling would have suited his driving style.

[Sharman]

Never driven a 250F but I always under the impression they were a very balanced car and any driver worth his salt could hang the tail out at will.

[sandy]

I wonder what is the current status of existing 250F drivers?

[JimBradshaw]

I wonder what is the current status of existing 250F drivers?

As far Au is concerned :

Stan Jones deceased, Reg Hunt, Mancunian alive in US , Bib Stillwell deceased, Arnold Glass deceased ...

JB

[Ray Bell]

And Reg Hunt is still with us...

That's right isn't it, Stan?

[David McKinney]

And Reg Hunt is still with us...

That's right isn't it, Stan?

It's what he said

And you both missed David McKay, who drove Jones's car in the 1961 NZ GP. Deceased

Of the New Zealanders:
Ross Jensen, John Mansel and Rod Coppins all deceased
Len Gilbert, Chris Amon and I believe Bob Eade still with us
Gavin Quirk and Brian Prescott TBA

But does sandy want to know about the existing status of the '50s GP drivers or, as he says, the status of existing 250F drivers?

[Barry Boor]

Am I missing something? I thought Phil Hill died last year.

[David McKinney]

Am I missing something? I thought Phil Hill died last year.

Who's saying he didn't?

[Barry Boor]

Post #6

[Red Socks]

Post #6

Yes Barry but post 6 was written in 2004-is that what you are missing.

[Barry Boor]

In my defence, may I say that my new computer is sending me an e-mail every time a new thread begins on TNF. I received such an e-mail headed '250.F drivers.' Thus, I assumed 'twas a new thread and never looked at dates.

Still,

Edited by Barry Boor, 18 February 2010 - 17:38.

[sandy]

It's what he said



But does sandy want to know about the existing status of the '50s GP drivers or, as he says, the status of existing 250F drivers?

The former, I think - drivers who raced them in International Grand Prix, but then why exclude those drivers who still raced them seriously in Australia, New Zealand, South America, South Africa etc., well into the 60s.

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by David McKinney
It's what he said

And you both missed David McKay, who drove Jones's car in the 1961 NZ GP. Deceased.....

Totally missed Hunt's name in that line-up! Sorry...

And I never knew McKay drove one in NZ. 1961 remains a major shortcoming in my knowledge.

[Tony Matthews]

1961 remains a major shortcoming in my knowledge.

What were you inside for, Ray?

[JimBradshaw]

As an Australian, I am remiss because I completely forgot about Ken kavanagh, the superb motor cyclist who raced his own 250F at Monaco and Spa in 1958.

He was born in 1923 and appears to be still with us..as far............ as I can determine.

JB

[David McKinney]

Yes, pretty sure he's still with us, living in Italy

You also forgot another Australian 250F driver, Kavanagh's motorcycle team-mate Keith Campbell, who also raced a 250F in 1958, though not in any world championship events

[JimBradshaw]

Yes, pretty sure he's still with us, living in Italy

You also forgot another Australian 250F driver, Kavanagh's motorcycle team-mate Keith Campbell, who also raced a 250F in 1958, though not in any world championship events

Sorry David,

I realised after I posted, you had in fact mentioned Kavanagh very early in the thread.

I confess, I have never heard of Kieth Campbell..please tell us more David where, when . whose car etc?


JB

[Rob29]

Sorry David,

I realised after I posted, you had in fact mentioned Kavanagh very early in the thread.

I confess, I have never heard of Kieth Campbell..please tell us more David where, when . whose car etc?


JB

Keith Campbell-Maserati 250F chassis#2526

07.04.58-Goodwood-6th Glover Trophy-9th (last) 2laps behind.
19.04.58-Aintree-13th BARC International 200-retired lap29-oil pipe

[JimBradshaw]

Keith Campbell-Maserati 250F chassis#2526

07.04.58-Goodwood-6th Glover Trophy-9th (last) 2laps behind.
19.04.58-Aintree-13th BARC International 200-retired lap29-oil pipe

Thanks Rob,

Was it tha same car? Were they sharing?


JB

[Levin68]

It seems the thrill never subsides...

http://www.stuff.co....y-special-racer

[David McKinney]

Thanks Rob,
Was it tha same car? Were they sharing?
JB

No, one car each
Campbell's was the ex-works 1956 car 2522 (which had also been raced as 2516, 2523 and 2501, and had been the test-car for the V12 engine). For 1958 it was converted back to a six, renumbered 2526 and sold to Campbell. He raced it in the Richmond Trophy at Goodwood, the Aintree 200 and the International Trophy, but was killed in a motorcycle accident soon afterwards

Kavanagh's car was the ex-works 1957 lightweight 2527, which he entered in seven 1958 races and three more in 1959

[Rob Miller]

but then why exclude those drivers who still raced them seriously in Australia, New Zealand, South America, South Africa etc., well into the 60s.

I don't think South Africa ever saw a 250F.

[David McKinney]

Well, not until 2009, anyway

[David McKinney]

Getting back to Australian 250F drivers: didn't G W Patterson do a few laps in Jones's car in the 1957 AGP?


And the Brazlian nationals:
Ciro Cayres
Camillo Cristofaro
Roberto Galucci
Luis Margarido
Mario Marsiglia
Antonio Mendes de Barros
Arnaldo Paccini
Ruggero Peruzzi

Don't know which of those are alive, dead or otherwise