60 replies to this topic

[ckkl]

Michael Schumacher is always very sensitive when the issue of comparisons to Senna arise; in fact any mention of Senna is off-limits.

The most famous examples:

The infamous post-race press-conference in '00 when Schumacher bursts into tears when the interviewer mentions he has tied Senna for all-time wins. Albeit Schumacher was under a lot of pressure at that stage (after so many years of coming 2nd in a Ferrari) and was feeling the season slip away.

When reporters mention he is within range of Senna's qualifying record, Schumacher is always quick to decline comment and usher the next question.

Recently, Schumacher noted he was doubting whether he could continue after Senna's death at Imola 10 years ago.

It seems Schumacher almost idolised Ayrton Senna.

Are there any interesting anecdotes or opinions on this?

[dajwalia]

I do not think Schumacher has/had any idols in F1 as such. From what I have read during various interviews given by MS, I feel that when Senna was a star and MS not driving in F1, he never followed Senna or anyone else as idols.

[BRG]

Curiously, you never hear Schumacher talk about Jim Clark either. Or Fangio.

Maybe there is only room for one star in Michael's universe?

[Nav-D]

MS did not really idolise Senna at all, he actually wanted to beat him and he wasn't exactly filled with grief after Senna died, he took the 94 WC by punting out hill and was very smug about it.

[Group B]

Originally posted by BRG
Curiously, you never hear Schumacher talk about Jim Clark either. Or Fangio.

Maybe there is only room for one star in Michael's universe?

I think that's because he both saw and raced with Senna. He has said himself that his knowledge of historical F1 is pretty sparse. Senna was both tangible flesh and blood and a man in his own mould.

[Group B]

Originally posted by Nav-D
MS did not really idolise Senna at all, he actually wanted to beat him and he wasn't exactly filled with grief after Senna died, he took the 94 WC by punting out hill and was very smug about it.

Remind me why's that's relevent to the thread

[Nav-D]

Originally posted by Group B


Remind me why's that's relevent to the thread

Just proving how happy he was to win a WC where is main challenger died who he supposedly idolised.

[Daniel Lester]

I reckon MS started racing because it was fun, he also happened to be good at it and eventuall made F1. I don't think he set out to be an F1 driver as a kid and I don't think he followed it and its history closely, as we do, until he got there. I'm sure he knew the people and drivers involved (like Senna and Prost) but it wasn't a massive interest to him.

As MS said it affected him as he had never come across death in his sport and Senna was a big rival. Imagine how Senna would have faired had Prost died shortly after they were pitched into battle against one another.

[Daniel Lester]

Originally posted by Nav-D


Just proving how happy he was to win a WC where is main challenger died who he supposedly idolised.

Yeah, but MS dedicated the title to Senna as he felt Senna would have won it, even more fitting I guess given the way he clinched it.

[Group B]

Originally posted by Daniel Lester
I reckon MS started racing because it was fun, he also happened to be good at it and eventuall made F1. I don't think he set out to be an F1 driver as a kid and I don't think he followed it and its history closely, as we do, until he got there. I'm sure he knew the people and drivers involved (like Senna and Prost) but it wasn't a massive interest to him.

As MS said it affected him as he had never come across death in his sport and Senna was a big rival. Imagine how Senna would have faired had Prost died shortly after they were pitched into battle against one another.

Much nearer the mark I think

[baddog]

Originally posted by Nav-D


Just proving how happy he was to win a WC where is main challenger died who he supposedly idolised.

Did you know that they say your assumptions about other peoples motivations are a mirror of yourself?

Shaun

[tifosi]

Originally posted by Group B


Remind me why's that's relevent to the thread

Well, perhaps Nav-D is pointing out that Schumacher idolized Senna so much that, seeing Senna punt out his rival for a championship he would do the same thing?????

[Gnuzuechter]

MS did not really idolise Senna at all, he actually wanted to beat him and he wasn't exactly filled with grief after Senna died, he took the 94 WC by punting out hill and was very smug about it.

What a load of bull!

Once I saw a very old videointerview with Michael Schumacher (he was around 16 that time) where he was asked by the interviewer about F1. He said he would love to drive there and that AS is his idol...

And in my opinion someome must be a sore real live loser if he insist that MS was "glad" about AS death.

What a Jerk!

[Jordan191]

Originally posted by Nav-D
MS did not really idolise Senna at all, he actually wanted to beat him and he wasn't exactly filled with grief after Senna died, he took the 94 WC by punting out hill and was very smug about it.

you mean Hill tried a low percentage move and it bit him in the butt. Don't let facts get in the way of a good flame.

[1george]

Looks like that some people are not entitled to show their emotions.

[boyRacer]

Originally posted by Nav-D


Just proving how happy he was to win a WC where is main challenger died who he supposedly idolised.

Click

[ckkl]

Michael Schumacher on Senna:

"It was an awful weekend and a major shock for us all," the 35-year-old Schumacher recalled on his own website.

"It was the first time that I had been confronted by death in my sport and for a while I doubted whether I wanted to carry on at all. Senna was a symbol for Formula One and did so much for the sport."

Source: http://f1.racing-liv...413142219.shtml

[Group B]

Originally posted by ckkl
Michael Schumacher on Senna:



Source: http://f1.racing-liv...413142219.shtml

Pretty much proves the point that Daniel Lester and I were making.

[Nav-D]

Originally posted by Group B




Pretty much proves the point that Daniel Lester and I were making.

Him saying it makes all the difference doesn't it?!

Remember Indy 2002, where MS and Rubens fudged up the finish and Rubens won, MS said afterwards that it was payback for what Rubens did for him at Austria 2002, I suppose you'd believe that too.

[Group B]

Originally posted by Nav-D


Him saying it makes all the difference doesn't it?!

Remember Indy 2002, where MS and Rubens fudged up the finish and Rubens won, MS said afterwards that it was payback for what Rubens did for him at Austria 2002, I suppose you'd believe that too.

You're a sad, bitter and twised little man aren't you Nav-D? How old were you in 1994? 7 or 8? Either way the events of that year clearly went a very long way over your head.

[Nav-D]

Originally posted by Group B


You're a sad, bitter and twised little man aren't you Nav-D? How old were you in 1994? 7 or 8? Either way the events of that year clearly went a very long way over your head.

I blame the newspapers at the time.

[CV2k]

It's sad how blood thristy the media is. They will bug him about Senna forever and hope that he will say something that they can put into an outrageous HEADLINE

[SeanValen]

Michael:
"I didn't expect to win this championship, I always knew it was Ayrton who was going to win the championship, he was the best driver, I like to take this title and give it to him."


quote, I got the words pretty much right, I remember watching it on 1994 FIA press conference, australia, on the fia video review of 1994, after Michael's words, they show a picture of Senna to close the season off.

Michael is a private person, he's german as well, and was more younger and less emotional then he is now back then, but he had alot of respect of Senna's talents as a driver, sure he was competitive, so was Senna, what happened at Imola 94 was the first time MS saw death in his sport, it did effect him, and I believe him when he says he thought of quitting, F1 just felt dangerous after Imola 94, I remember the feeling, I understand,, anyone seconds guessing MS's feeling, is letting their MS bias, or whatever in the way, as those who do that feel they know MS better then MS knows himself, lol. No one envisioned Senna dying, especially MS, he was the benchmark he was chasing, it was a shock, he knew it could of been him in different circumstances that weekend, all those drivers who raced after the death of roland including MS I think were going into the unknown, call it bravery or whatever, f1 was feeling dangerous.

Senna and Schumacher are always going to be talked about, they are special drivers for their eras

[raceday]

Taken from memory, I've read that Schumi said that he saw a carting race when he was about ten years old and he saw someone drive way better than the others and that he was mighty impressed. He didn't know who it was and that he had to find out who it was and it turned out to be Senna. (MS has IIRC driven Carting since he was four so he knew a thing or two about it already at the age of ten I reckon)

He has also said that there's no question that Senna was the fastest

[SeanValen]

Originally posted by raceday
Taken from memory, I've read that Schumi said that he saw a carting race when he was about ten years old and he saw someone drive way better than the others and that he was mighty impressed. He didn't know who it was and that he had to find out who it was and it turned out to be Senna. (MS has IIRC driven Carting since he was four so he knew a thing or two about it already at the age of ten I reckon)

He has also said that there's no question that Senna was the fastest

Yeah he commented he(Senna) was taking these amazing lines and stuff, anyone who knows MS's comments over the years will likely remember those comments.


Another popular quote, was when MS took a shot a Damon Hill at Williams:

"He was never a number one driver, he was a number 2 driver put in the position of a number 1 driver, Ayrton would have done circles around me." Something like that MS said.

[Inness]

Originally posted by raceday
Taken from memory, I've read that Schumi said that he saw a carting race when he was about ten years old and he saw someone drive way better than the others and that he was mighty impressed. He didn't know who it was and that he had to find out who it was and it turned out to be Senna. (MS has IIRC driven Carting since he was four so he knew a thing or two about it already at the age of ten I reckon)

He has also said that there's no question that Senna was the fastest

EXACTLY! his father was with him at the time and was equally impressed!

[DEVO]

Did MS ever carry a Brazilian flag after Imola in honor of Senna's death? I thought it was a classy thing that Senna was going to do by showing Roland's flag during his victory lap that never happened.

[D. Heimgartner]

I think a valid comparison is between MS and Tiger Woods. Both were driven by their respective parents, with the notable difference being that Tiger Woods' father instilled in his son an understanding and appreciation of the history of golf.

For MS, records are just numbers without faces or stories. It's really sad... actually...

[tifosi]

Originally posted by D. Heimgartner
I think a valid comparison is between MS and Tiger Woods. Both were driven by their respective parents, with the notable difference being that Tiger Woods' father instilled in his son an understanding and appreciation of the history of golf.

For MS, records are just numbers without faces or stories. It's really sad... actually...

Damn! I wish i was a close personal friend of an F1 driver, lucky dude

[raceday]

I made a few searches at atlas and came up with a few things that may be a little intresting

http://www.atlasf1.c...p/id/2920/.html

Germany's Michael Schumacher said his tears at Sunday's Italian Grand Prix were triggered by memories of the late Ayrton Senna.
"It was a mixture of many things that moved me in Monza," Schumacher told RTL television on Wednesday. "When I thought of Senna, it was really too much for me."
Schumacher equalled Senna's total of 41 grands prix victories by winning at Monza.
When asked on Sunday whether it meant a lot to him to equal the Brazilian's mark the normally ice-cool Schumacher said: "It does mean a lot to me..." before bending his head and weeping into his hand.

http://www.atlasf1.c...p/id/2908/.html

http://www.atlasf1.c...ort.php?id=2474

Michael Schumacher could win the Monaco Grand Prix for the fifth time in seven years on Sunday but he says nobody will ever dethrone the late Ayrton Senna as "King of Monte Carlo".
The Brazilian won a record six times, with five in a row from 1989 to 1993.
Schumacher won his first Monaco Grand Prix for Benetton the following year, just weeks after Senna was killed at the San Marino Grand Prix at Imola in a Williams.
"Senna is the king," Schumacher said after the first day's free practice on Thursday.
"I don't think I ever will be. It's not a challenge I'm aiming for, you can't compare the two of us. You never know what he would have done in the future

."

I'm pretty convinced that MS studied Senna very closely the years right before he entered F1 himself and that he admired AS skills a lot (who didn't?). Once he was in he had to take another attitude, I think, because you can't go arund and show admiration for someone you are there to beat.

[SeanValen]

Originally posted by raceday

."

I'm pretty convinced that MS studied Senna very closely the years right before he entered F1 himself and that he admired AS skills a lot (who didn't?). Once he was in he had to take another attitude, I think, because you can't go arund and show admiration for someone you are there to beat.

That's it exactly, spot on, you got to make a name for yourself at the end of the day.

[Captain Cranckcase]

I vaguely remember a short newsclip in 1991 on Australian TV when I lived in Adelaide, it could of been before the GP that year or after he switched to Benetton and they asked who his Formula 1 hero was, he said Senna.

[kos]

Originally posted by SeanValen


That's it exactly, spot on, you got to make a name for yourself at the end of the day.

Also I think that MS learned (or was advised) very early that every word he said would be twisted by the media in all possible ways, so it is only natural that he kept his feelings about Senna to himself - I think that his thoughts about Senna are too intimate to him to let the media rip them.

I think that the fact that he didn't attended Ayrton funerals speaks volumes about his feelings - he didn't wanted to share his grief with anybody.

[rce]

Originally posted by ckkl

The infamous post-race press-conference in '00 when Schumacher bursts into tears when the interviewer mentions he has tied Senna for all-time wins. Albeit Schumacher was under a lot of pressure at that stage (after so many years of coming 2nd in a Ferrari) and was feeling the season slip away.

Reading his autobiography gave a better light to that event/post race press conference. And gave a much better light on the man. Don't fully understand the hate people have towards him or any driver for that matter...but that's another story. Regarding his thoughts on Senna - I agree with the above positive posts...they sum it up nicely.

[Sir Frank]

Das muss 1980 gewesen sein. Da war dieser Fahrer, der mir sofort ins Auge fiel: Seine Linie, seine Kart-Beherrschung, seine Eleganz, wie er überholt hat - das war einfach extrem auffällig. Ich habe mich sofort erkundigt, wie er hieß, und es war Ayrton.

It must have been in 1980. There was this driver who caught my attention right away. His lines, his kart control, his elegance at overtaking, it was extremely striking. I asked to find out who he was, it was Ayrton.

[MFOT_Froza_Ferrari]

Originally posted by Jordan191


you mean Hill tried a low percentage move and it bit him in the butt. Don't let facts get in the way of a good flame.

Exactly. You'll never convince some people of reason, however.

To them it is impossible for contact to be accidental when one driver was most likely worried about his handling after a crash while the other driver is trying to sneak through a small opening between a swerving car and a wall...

[Zmeej]

Although Schumi has been a right bastard on many occasions, and a high percentage of his F1-related utterances have been self-serving, IMO his feelings about Senna, and his distress about the Brazilian's death were and continue to be genuine.

All of the quotes above attributed to MS are proof, and I can remember hearing or reading most of them.

Also, in SPEED's "Formula One Decade" recent revisiting of Imola '94, it was quite plain that he was devastated by the news of Senna's death. IMO, there was nothing at all contrived in his somber mood on the podium that day, nor in his words at the press conference.

Ironically, however, it's part of Senna's legacy that this controversy continues to rage:

Originally posted by Jordan191
you mean Hill tried a low percentage move and it bit him in the butt.

Both Hill and Schumacher acted like bloody-minded fools over the course of '94 and '95, and MS added another page to the story at Jerez in '97.

IMO, if it weren't for Senna's example, Hill might have opted for a Prost/Stewart-like "high percentage" decision, hung back, and won the championship.

Similarly, MS might not have turned in on his opponents the way he did in Spain and Australia...

[Jordan191]

Originally posted by Zmeej
Although Schumi has been a right bastard on many occasions, and a high percentage of his F1-related utterances have been self-serving, IMO his feelings about Senna, and his distress about the Brazilian's death were and continue to be genuine.

All of the quotes above attributed to MS are proof, and I can remember hearing or reading most of them.

Also, in SPEED's "Formula One Decade" recent revisiting of Imola '94, it was quite plain that he was devastated by the news of Senna's death. IMO, there was nothing at all contrived in his somber mood on the podium that day, nor in his words at the press conference.

Ironically, however, it's part of Senna's legacy that this controversy continues to rage:

Both Hill and Schumacher acted like bloody-minded fools over the course of '94 and '95, and MS added another page to the story at Jerez in '97.

IMO, if it weren't for Senna's example, Hill might have opted for a Prost/Stewart-like "high percentage" decision, hung back, and won the championship.

Similarly, MS might not have turned in on his opponents the way he did in Spain and Australia...

my comment was in reference to one move at one race. You want to debate a particular move, start a thread and if it's worth it I'll debate you. Otherwise it's pointless.

[raceday]

Originally posted by Zmeej


Similarly, MS might not have turned in on his opponents the way he did in Spain and Australia...

I'm booored beyond belief that the australian controversy is brought up endlessly. And as far as I've seen every time it's discussed seriously it ends in an agreement to disagree or in harsh words.
But I have to ask about the other one?? I saw that race and I certainly don't remember anything like that? The race report doesn't either: http://www.motorspor...sp?ID=351&FS=F1

[Zmeej]

Actually, sunshine, YOU got into the debate about the move before I did. The "facts" as you expressed them are as much opinion as those of the poster you criticize.

Anyway, at least I made it relevant to Senna and his impact on Schumacher.

[Johny Bravo]

Originally posted by D. Heimgartner
For MS, records are just numbers without faces or stories. It's really sad... actually...

You must feel damn lucky to have been able to discuss this with MS.

[Jordan191]

Originally posted by Zmeej
Actually, sunshine, YOU got into the debate about the move before I did. The "facts" as you expressed them are as much opinion as those of the poster you criticize.

Anyway, at least I made it relevant to Senna and his impact on Schumacher.

who are you responding to?

[Zmeej]

You; J191.

Please be gentle.

[fingers]

I'm surprised noone remembers what he said about Senna and how he watched him when he was younger, he thought he was awesome he thought the car always seem to be floating around the corners as if they weren't there. The reason schumacher doesn't mention much about other drivers from history is that he thought Senna was awesome and the best ever and was truly upset by firstly a tragic loss of a great champion and racing god and also the possibility that schumacher would've actually had someone to actually race properly against. Senna left a huge void for Schumi to clean up in and it actually upsets Michael, he wanted that challenge especially in his younger years you could see it in the races he was determined to race against Senna. The 5 races Senna won in 93 also showed Michael that he needed to improve his game since senna had a lower private version of Schumachers factory engine and was winning race after race. Schumacher would only ever get beaten by people in faster cars after that until the end of his career.

[Jordan191]

Originally posted by Zmeej
You; J191.

Please be gentle.

dude I didn't mean anything but the fact that discussing everyones nasty moves adds nothing. My original post was in comment to an obviously errant flame.

Carry On.

[Zmeej]

Whew!

[dworsham]

wow, it has been awhile but this thread takes me back to days when there were several evil, mean trivial, pontificating threads were posted weaved a way far from the orginal post.

kinda makes me sick, sad, not social at all.

come on folks! can we rancor not bash:mad:

[glorius&victorius]

I remember Brasil 92:
Schumacher commenting on Senna after the race:
"He's not worth being a world champion if he drives like this"

[chauncey]

I am curious. Does anyone remember what Michaels reactions were like on the podium in Imola that tragic day? That to me would say a lot!

[Jordan191]

Originally posted by chauncey
I am curious. Does anyone remember what Michaels reactions were like on the podium in Imola that tragic day? That to me would say a lot!

pretty somber. About the only one who looked remotely happy was Larini