16 replies to this topic

[Brabham-BMW]

Does anyone know or have an opinion of how close Berger was to continue at Ferrari in 1996?

My opionion is that Berger was close and Ferrari wanted him to stay and partner Schumacher, but decided against it, because that he did not want to the comparison between Schumacher and Senna and seccondly because he considered himself to be to old to face Schumacher.

Better to jump ship to join Alesi at Benetton which he knew he was more or less on par with.

[John B]

Would Ferrari have wanted to continue to pay his salary, given they were taking on Schumacher for a high price tag? IIRC Berger signed a pretty good contract in 1993. I assume Irvine signed for considerably less than Berger would have....

Also, would Berger have fit with the "designated #2" policy (or was that decided on after he signed with Benetton?)

[SeanValen]

Prost also thinking about joining Michael at Ferrari in 1996.

[holiday]

Not close.

I always had the impression that he made the decision to leave the moment MS's arrival was clear. But it also looked as if it was a hard decison him since he genuinely seemed to love Ferrari.

Then again, he also set very seriously his eyes the Williams seat left vacant by Coulti. But -as he openly admitted in an interview also to be found on his hp- during the poker with FW he completety overlooked Villeneuve coming from NA.

One thing one has not to forget. At 1996, Berger was still very much in the anti-party against MS. Whereas MSwas the icon of resurrected racing scene in Germany, making f1 as popular in Germany as Boris made tennis several yeras ago, Berger rather stood for the old school of successful Austrian pilots and had his own, if ever diminishing following.

Later, in the wake of MS joining Ferrari, when the force of Schumacherism in Germany became irresistibel and constant criticism of him would have seriously undermined anyone's position in the German motorsport scene, Berger gave practically in and fell into line. I still think to this day, that he became pretty much aware that he endangered his BMW relations if he continues to be the spearhead of the MS antiforce. Not sure at all whether BMW would have afforded such a liability as their main F1 man...

[Sakae]

GB & Ferrari? Doing what? Mr. T' job? Ouch. Didn't N. Lauda characterised him and Alesi as "those two idiots"?

[Oachkatzlschwoaf]

Originally posted by holiday
Later, in the wake of MS joining Ferrari, when the force of Schumacherism in Germany became irresistibel and constant criticism of him would have seriously undermined anyone's position in the German motorsport scene, Berger gave practically in and fell into line. I still think to this day, that he became pretty much aware that he endangered his BMW relations if he continues to be the spearhead of the MS antiforce. Not sure at all whether BMW would have afforded such a liability as their main F1 man...

come on, this must be one of the craziest theories i've ever read on this board

[holiday]

Originally posted by Oachkatzlschwoaf
come on, this must be one of the craziest theories i've ever read on this board

hehe, not at all.

But I have to add Berger's change of attitude towards MS seemed to be genuine, too, that I'll concede gladly. Today, there is no resentiment anymore, if anything, he rather often sides with MS, for example in the JPM-MS on track fights.

Berger is no fool, he knows where the wind blows from. He also went to great pains to get rid of his playboy image before becoming BMW motorsport director. The guy is a character but a pretty smart fox, too. He knew that his gna gna criticisms of MS were incompatible with his role as BMW representative as much as his former role as playboy. Comparing Berger's statements before 97, 98 with the ones he made afterwards you had often the impression its not the same person at all who is talking. 180 degree turn around, I'd say.

[wawawa]

Originally posted by John B
Would Ferrari have wanted to continue to pay his salary, given they were taking on Schumacher for a high price tag?

As I recall, Berger was willing to take a cut in salary, just so long as Todt gave him equal #1 status. Eventually, I don't think it came down to money - Ferrari had to shell out a big amount to break Irvine's '96 contract, and pay his salary on top of that.

[John B]

Thanks.

The line about GB joining Williams that Holiday mentioned was interesting- hadn't heard that one before. Wonder how the Hill-Berger pairing would have worked out....would GB have managed to equal JVs results

[Zmeej]

Originally posted by holiday
the spearhead of the MS antiforce

I like the sound of that...

[baddog]

He has basically said he felt michael, who he didnt know AT ALL at the time wouldnt be someone he could work with, based on what he read and heard of him.. but that later, when he actuall knew michael a bit, he regretted the decision and felt they might have worked together well

Definitely the seat was his if he wanted it.

Shaun

[holiday]

Originally posted by baddog
... and felt they might have worked together well

Personally I could see them coming along well, but professionally Berger had nothing to offer anymore. He was from another, less professional era, rejected to practice starts, wasn't overly fit and at his second Ferrari stint pretty piss slow, if I might say that. At Ferrari and Benetton alike, he was regularly outqualified and outpaced by Alesi whom I don't rate in the top echelon either. Probably it'd have been best for Ferrari to lay him ice to only revive him for Hockenheim, a track where he excelled until the very end of his career.

The Berger of the 80s was a strong race winner, but the one of the 90s...even Berger himself has said that with hindsight he could have spared himself his last stint at Benetton....

[checkonetwo]

i d like to provide some information re-readable in bergers autobiography "zielgerade" concerning his second ferrari epoque 93-95.

first of all, he said he left mclaren for two reasons: honda were about to leave and he couldn`t take senna anymore. though good friends, he had to get out of sennas shadow. ferrari really wanted him and offered him a very good deal.

the 93 ferrari was a dog, and berger hated the active suspension, while alesi looked better with it and simply didn´t care. two very bad incidents for gerhard during that season had a bit of an impact on him, especially the second:

first, the monza qualifying, where jean changes track while berger comes from behind, on the qualifying outlap at 330 kmh. very close to a replica of the tragic gilles - accident, berger throws around the car and crashes badly, but remains unhurt.

second: estoril, two weeks later, his car turns left, unsteerable, coming out of the pits at 200 km/h, and crosses the track exactly between two cars, coming at 300. all three pilots didn´t even realise what happened and when berger saw the video he almost threw up. the computer said the time window for something like that to happen without an absolutely epic, lethal crash, was less than 1/10 of a second.

from that on berger didn´t want the active suspension anymore, but ferrari refused that. at the end of the season alesi was looking slightly better and berger had to accept a pay cut in advanced negotiations with montezemolo for the 95 season.

the 94 car was at the beginning 1.5 sec down on williams and benetton, but from hockenheim on his season got better and was acceptable, and berger was, in his own words, working harder than ever before. at the end of the 94 season he got along well with jean todt and had shown good work and testing ethics, which was appreciated.

montezemolo offered him a very good deal for the 96 season. berger accepted but wanted a clause in the contract that said that he could withdraw any time if ferrari hired another driver who would earn more than him.

ferrari wanted to let alesi go, because he didn´t have enough discipline in their eyes. instead todt wanted prost, then at the age of 41. everything was set for berger - prost for ferrari in 96, when one day montezemolo and todt come to him and say they have to do some talkings with schumacher, because the german market is the biggest for ferrari, and fiat releases the bravo, and he´s world champion, young, and very fast, and if berger would have a problem with that.
berger said, no problem, still having his contract clause in mind.

lauda is sent to talk with weber, and comes back with the info they want 28 mio. $ and that weber is crazy. nothing is being heard for a while, but berger realizes todt, not being on best terms with lauda anymore, is negotiating with weber on his own, and nobody talks of prost anymore. at silverstone gerhard tells the press, just to release a test balloon, that schumacher had signed with ferrari.

todt and montezemolo totally freak out, so it´s immediately clear for berger he was right on the point. from that on he just leaned back and watched, and started to plan his moves. he was very shure he could get a seat at williams if he wanted to, because frank repeatedly told him so. but he totally overlooked bernie´s coup with villeneuve, and by the time he wanted to sign with sir frank, it was too late, which was, by his own admission, the biggest mistake in his career.

after that he met with briatore and they immediately signed a pre-deal. so when ferrari finally admitted to berger that schumacher would also drive for the team in 96, and for a lot more money than he will get, he already had a new car and two weeks time, according to his contract clause, to think it over if he wanted to stay with the team.

ferrari were 100% sure he would stay. two dinners with montezemolo later his deal was offered two significant upgrades, including more money and guarantees for identical material, and berger was totally surprised that ferrari were able to offer two deals like that, which added up to something not been here before. berger met up with briatore again, and was offered a deal that was significantly lower than the ferrari offer. but berger expected a lot of technical problems for ferraris 96 season, alot of dnf`s, plus schumi on his back, plus the sentiment at that time that they wouldn`t be very amicable towards each other. so he didn´t go for it and decided instead to let montezemolo and todt know through the press on the very last day. two days of heated chaos later they were all friends again and going for dinner with each other.

his general attitude towards ms was that he didn´t like his over self confidence which could have been interpreted as arrogance, and wanted to wait a bit. plus of course there was a little bit of the good verbal old school spanking austrians love to give germans (and vice versa). anyhow, by the time he took over schumachers benetton he realised once and for all that this was a very special driver, as it took him longer than ever before to get somewhat used to the car, because it was so unpredictable and mean on the limit. he`s been laughed at a lot for this and he knows it.

today they get along very well, but at that time berger wasn´t in the mood for confronting michael schumacher in a difficult stage for ferrari.

[Zmeej]

Thanks for the info checkonetwo

Didn't know most of that.

[Megatron]

With Senna gone, the retirements of Piquet, Mansell and Prost, Berger suddenly became (shortly) the highest paid driver in F1 and even in later days demanded a good salary. I doubt that Ferrari, no doubt (before the IMENSE injection of Marlboro money) were in a position from a team or $$$ to field a car for two "name" drivers.

[checkonetwo]

i am not sure about that megatron. it is widely recognized that berger was for his last ten years of f1 constantly one of the three top earning guys in the sport. actually it has been said that his negotiating abilities were on par with his driving skills.
which were, at least until his tamburello-crash, unquestionable.

[PLAYLIFE]

Thanks for that piece checkonetwo, an interesting read