12 replies to this topic

[x_acto]

Hello,

Can anyone tell me when the radio communications between the drivers and the boxes started?
If anyone knows, can please tell me witch team start it?

Where did comes first, CART or F1?


Thank you!

[Vitesse2]

I believe they were experimenting with radio at Indy in the 1920s and Scuderia Evans certainly intended using it in Seaman's MG in the 1935 Tourist Trophy at Ards until someone backed a car into the transmitting unit.

Somewhere I have a copy of an article from The Motor from about 1946 which speculates about using army surplus "walkie-talkies" in racing.

So it's a bit older than you might think, but of course the fragility of pre-solid state electronics tended to limit its usefulness ....

[T54]

As far as the "modern" era, two-way radios were used first in USAC, then CART, then F1. I remember several "Euro" team principals and specialized suppliers visiting the US in the mid-1970's to early 1980's hunting for the US-built equipment.

The F1 teams used only a "plug-in" system when the car would stop by the pits, then disconnect and had no communications after that. This lasted until the mid to late 1980's when two-way wireless took over as it had been for several years in the US.
I can dig up some old catalogues showing this if you need more info.

T54

[stuartbrs]

As far as F1 goes wasnt it Renault in 1985??

[x_acto]

In 1985 Renault have one onboard camera during one GP with François Hesnault in the 3rd car.

[Frank de Jong]

Alpina-BMW used radio communication in touring car racing in 1973.

[Falcadore]

The ban on car to pit communications was lifted in Australia in 1977.

[D-Type]

There seems to be some confusion creeping in as to what form of communication we are talking about, there's

1. Driver-to-pit and pit-to-driver voice radio
2. The old plug-in telephone type link between driver and race engineer during pit stops
3. Car-to-pit telemetry
4. Pit-to-car telemetry and the race engineer being able to make changes to the engine management system etc. I don't know if this ever happened it was strongly rumoured at times
5. On-car camera to TV station
6. Driver to TV station and vice versa
7. Pit boards
8. Pit flags

[HistoricMustang]

Perhaps this quote will help:

Racing Radios, the major supplier of the radios used to listen in on the teams and race control during the NASCAR races owes its start to Frank Warren. In the mid 70's, Frank walked into the Diversified Electronics office asking for help on his radio system. Finding nothing wrong with the radios, the Diversified team asked for and received permission to enter the NASCAR garage at Atlanta International Raceway to try and solve the problem. While solving the problem, NASCAR asked to have their system checked and was pleased with the results, inviting the Diversified Engineers back for future races.

Frank is going to attend the memorial dedication at Augusta and this is one of the topics I would like to discuss with him.

Henry

[gmw]

At Chrysler we experimented with in car radios for NASCAR Grand National use in 1969. In conjunction with Engineers for Chrysler’s Huntsville operation, who had access to NASA technology from the Apollo program, we tested a two way radio system at Talladega before the initial September 1969 race. The unusual factor with this set up was the driver’s microphone. In place of the now universal noise canceling mike they used a Bone Conduction Microphone. This was a microphone inside of the helmet that pushed against the top of the driver’s skull. It picked up the vibration of the skull and transmitted that signal. I did some testing of the radio in the passenger seat of a two seat test car, and the bone conduction mike was amazing. The only thing you had to remember was to talk in a normal tone of voice, not shouting as is the normal response to the tremendously noisy environment. As long as you talked in a normal voice the sound quality as excellent.

Later in 1969 we did use the radio in Charley Glotzbach’s Dodge Daytona at Rockingham. Paul Goldsmith, who had just retired from driving was talking to Charley, and on one occasion the radio really helped. There was a crash in turn 4 and Goldsmith warned Charley, who was on the back stretch at t he time, and helped him avoid the accident.

None of the teams seemed that interested in using the radio at the time and we dropped it, but Bobby Allison was interested enough to go to work himself on the radio in 1970. He used a noise canceling mike I believe.

The first version of the bone conduction mike required the removal of most the energy absorbing foam inside of the helmet for a 2” diameter circle. A later version had a fiberglass bubble on top to allow the foam to remain. I think that we talked to Bell Helmets and they thought that something could be worked out, but we never followed up on it.

GMW

[T54]

The first version of the bone conduction mike required the removal of most the energy absorbing foam inside of the helmet for a 2” diameter circle.

Yes indeed, the Snell Foundation gurus would probably not let this fly today, but then again, look at the very dangerous hard-plastic earphones used in rally helmets today... As usual, the powers-to-be will wait until someone dies to fix it. But such microphones could be very tiny today, and more efficient than the ones used on front of the mouth with all the noise around?

Thanks for the info that will be, with your permission, quoted in my book on the history of safety equipment.
Regards,

T54

[Kvadrat]

Here's British Pathe 'Radio at 100 MPH!' film description:


729.29 | RADIO AT 100 MPH! (1:38:00:00 - 1:40:23:00) 24/07/1933

MG cars are equipped with radios to help them plan their tactics during a race at Brooklands.



Full title reads: "Brooklands. Radio at 100 MPH! M.G. Team receive instructions by wireless whilst racing - for the first time - in Light Car Relay Race - and win easily."

Brooklands, Surrey.

Various shots of racing cars setting off from the start. One of the cars is driven by the Earl of March.

Various shots of cars speeding around Brooklands banked track.

Shot of radio operator speaking to the driver of car 19A.

MS of car 19A driving at speed.

Shot of cars in the pits for relay change over. The second driver of the radio equipped team climbs into his car.

More shots of racing.

The final driver of the team pulls his car in and lines it up with those of his team mates. He gives a short interview to the cameras.

N.B. MG stands for Morris Garages.

[gmw]

We were well aware that removing the foam and replacing it with a hard object was a very bad idea, but we said "we are only using it for testing, so there is less risk......" We were just lucky that there were no problems.

GMW