82 replies to this topic

[Gary C]

I've just uncovered some 35mm slide transparencies of Green Valley Raceway from June 1966. Can anyone give me some info about the track ; like, where it is / was even ????

[Frank de Jong]

Don't know much about the track itself, but it popped up in 1966 TransAm: TransAm
If the slides contain Trans-Am pictures (but that was in September), you know who's interested ;)

[Buford]

Near Dallas apparently

http://www.lonestarw.../galleryJ2.html

[Jim Thurman]

Green Valley Raceway was located at North Richland Hills, Texas (near Fort Worth) and operated from the 60's through the late 80's.

Basically it was a 1/4 mile drag strip with a twisty bit connecting it to make for a road course. A lot of drags through the years and the road course hosted Trans-Am and, after being closed for a while in the 70's, hosted the "new" Can-Am series in the mid-80's. The road course also hosted some SCCA Regionals and IIRC, a few SCCA Nationals.

Last aerial view I saw of it, it was completely surrounded by housing.

[Don Capps]

After it had problems with hosting events at the various venues in the area, the Dallas-Fort Worth Region (which I think was their correct nomenclature) of the SCCA worked out some sort of deal with the guy who owned the dragstrip around the early 1960s (1961 it seems) and snatched a Trans-Am date for 1966 when others hemmed and hawed.....

Today, it is part of a residential communuity, although the immediate area around the track itself still seems clear in the latest (1995) photos, the dragstrip closed in 1989 or 1990 and development has since overtaken it if my information is correct. I meant to visit the site on one of my visits to Dallas, but we ended up having to leave earlier than we had planned.

[Muzza]

It is amazing coincidence that this thread has been opened today. A few days ago Rick Kelly and I were debating about the location of Green Valley Raceway and Rick - who raced there in 1961 - is sure that the track is not located in North Richland Hills, but in (ta-da!) a small town called Green Valley, further north from Dallas.

I was researching on Ted Arnold (killed in a dragster crash in 01 September 1963) when I came across the place of the accident, Green Valley Raceway. Consulting Allan Brown's excellent book "The History of America's Speedway - Past & Present" (*) I indeed found a caption placing Green Valley Raceway at North Richland Hills (page 505 of the book). So I had listed it as such at Motorsport Memorial.

Besides that, Brown states in his book that drag racing took place at Green Valley circa 1981-1989... This did not sound right, as Arnold was killed at the venue twenty years before that. Also, the dates on Brown's book led me to believe that Green Valley was a originally a road course that had been later adapted to drag racing, but this page at Darren Galpin's The GEL Motorsport Information Pages seems to indicate the opposite!

Puzzled, I decided to contact Rick Kelly, the original source on Ted Arnold. Surprisingly Rick had raced at that track, sent me the following (reproduced verbatim) :

"My last race was in Norman, OK, on 1 October 1961. I drove in a race several months before that at Green Valley. I remember only three things about it

1) I did not win any pots;
2) Some sob had the nerve to nerf me at the first turn - sports cars were not permitted to touch each other in that ancient period of club racing. I was really really pissed. It was a very minute dent in the rear of my bumperless Morgan, but my anger enlarged the damage into a confrontation after the race with the offending driver - who immediately apologized - how do you stay angry when someone apologizes? I later learned that he had already been reprimanded by one of the official observers, very gently - and that the observer saw me coming and told the offender to apologize fast and not to even think of arguing with me. The observer knew me fairly well and had never seen my face so blazingly red with anger. Discretion is the better part of valour --- .
3) Green Valley was a drag strip that had been adapted for sports car racing!
yada yada yada
Go to http://www.mapquest.com
Search for Green Valley, Texas.
A little red star will show up on the map, 5 miles NNE of Denton, TX (home of several Miss Americas from North Texas State College).
By 1969 a huge new drag strip had been built south of Lewisville, TX, on the east side of I-35E. I knew that place very well. There was a three day pop-music festival, not unlike the one at Woodstock, that was set up on the grounds of the newer drag strip. The biggest difference was that we had hot sun instead of wet rain. But it was a great party! Santana, Janis Joplin, Led Zeppelin, Spirit, Country Joe and the Fish, B. B. King, James Cotton Blues Band, Chicago Transit Authority, Sam and Dave, Sly and the Family Stone, Ten Years After, and .....Sweetwater. Sweetwater was a great tragedy. Driving back to California for the Monterrey Festival, they had a bad wreck, and their lead singer, a girl with a gorgeous contralto voice, as good as Grace Slick, but not quite as powerful, had her throat and voice box crushed. She survived, but was never the same as a vocalist.
See, you can get messed up on the highways even more easily than on a race track!
The track where the Texas International Pop Festival was held in 1969 was called the Dallas International Motor Speedway.
Not the same track as the one at Green Valley. Green Valley might have been abandoned after DIMS opened.
But mapquest says that Green Valley is alive and well and north north east of Denton, Texas. Unlike Brainerd, MN, and its race track (6 miles north of Brainerd), Green Valley is now just a dot on the map, and a very dim memory of a wasted weekend in my head."

Don and Jim seem to confim Rick's testimony: Green Valley Raceway evolved from a dragstrip into a road course (and not the opposite) and dragracing was there already in the early 1960s.

But... was the track in Green Valley or North Richland Hills? Based on Rick's words, I have to believe it was in a small place called Green Valley, a town circa five miles north-northeast of Denton, and not it North Richland Hills, which is some 12 miles north-northeast of Fort Worth.

Any comments?

I sent an e-mail on this concern to Allan on 04 August, but he has not replayed yet.

I am really interested on hearing from you guys on this...

Cheers,


Muzza

(*) : My copy of Allan's book is of its second edition, dated 1994. Allan released a new edition a few months ago, but I have not ordered my copy yet - I will get it in October.

If someone is interested, the book can be ordered at:
P.O. Box 448
Comstock Park, MI 49321

[Frank S]

I knew I had seen some photos of Green Valley racing. No guarantees as to aid in locating the track, but there are some shots of cars on it...

http://lonestarwebs.com/galleryJ2.html

(Edit: put "Green Valley" into their search box to see a dozen more photos)

[WINO]

I get the impression there may have been two different Green Valley Raceways near Dallas/Ft Worth, over time. In the late fifties the only sportscar racing near Ft Worth was at Eagle Mountain National Guard Base, 10 miles North of the City.

The 1965 SCCA Road racing Annual lists Green Valley as being a 2.1 mile track near Smithfield, TX.

WINO

[Lotus23]

I can't add a lot to this discussion, but do I recall planning on running the Lotus at an SCCA National at Green Valley in mid-'66.

I was chasing those damnable points to get an invitation to the Runoffs at Riverside that year, and discovered that my closest SE Div competitors weren't planning on going there (too far away).

The exact reason I never made it there is lost in the recesses of my brain, but I can bet it was related to issues of time/money.

Got invited to the Runoffs anyway.

[HistoricMustang]

Damn, this gives me hope and thanks so much to all.

Very soon a group of us will be sitting where "The Masters Raced".

Henry

[Mark Silverberg]

Green Valley Raceway is (or was) most assuredly in North Richland Hills Texas at the intersection of N. Tarrant Road and Smithfield Parkway. There is residential development on all sides as of December of 03 when I drove past the site of the track. The south end of the drag strip was being graded for development at that time and Bursey road will be extended across it. The track is clearly visible in Terra Server in a 1995 arial photo. This is a track that appears to be more notable in history than in fact. When I lived in Texas in the late 80's no one there seemed to have much favorable to say about the track.

[Gary C]

a friend of mine has just scanned some 35mm slides I have in my collection taken at Green Valley Raceway back in June 1966. I thought you might like to see this photo of a Lotus (I think) in the paddock. Can anyone tell me what it is?? FJunior??

[BT 35-8]

The car is a slightly modified Lotus 20 Formula Jnr.

Easy part to pick it as a Lotus 20 is the use of the rear drive shafts also acting as the top/camber link , this car has been updated a little with wider 13'' wheels all around , instead of the 1961 spec. 13'' dia. fronts and 15'' dia. rears of 5'' inch width all round , these look like about 6'' or 7'' fronts and 8'' on the rear.

Bryan.

[jo-briggs]

Ditto - wonder how many times the oil filter got knocked off?

[David McKinney]

Uprated for Formula B, mebbe?

[David Beard]

The Lotus is very pretty...but what is the red car to the right?

[Ray Bell]

Some kind of Special...

If CRX Lee comes along he might tell is it's not a Devin... or he might say it is. But one thing's for sure, it's got 5-stud rear wheels and 4-stud front. It's no factory car.

[Allen Brown]

Originally posted by David McKinney
Uprated for Formula B, mebbe?

Looks like there's a C on the side, probably denoting it was running in Formula C (up to 1100cc IIRC).

Gary - I'd be very interested to see any other single seaters at that event. FA, FB and FC were very new at that point and the cars were still largely US produced. There were probably some real rarities at Green Valley that weekend.

Allen

[Gary C]

Allen (and everyone else), in that case, you may find this shot interesting. It looks to me like some sort of Lotus Indy car, what do you fellas reckon??

[David McKinney]

Assuming it's an SCCA meeting (which is where an FC Lotus would have run), the car is more likely to be an ex-F1 Lotus running under Formula A. Looks like an 18 rear end, but a later nose - an 18/21? Allen?

[David Birchall]

I'm with the other guys, I think it is a Lotus 20 updated with wider (LeGrand?) wheels and who knows what engine? It doesn't have a downdraft carb....

[David Swig]

The red car to the right in the first pic certainly doesn't look like any Devin I've ever seen.

It looks like an older car, something late 50s/early 60s, perhaps a Crosley Special of some sort? 1966 would have been pretty late to have been running a Crosley special (competitively, anyways)and I think the H-Modified class was just about finished at that time. Who knows?

[Allen Brown]

On the second picture, I can't offer much - it looks like it could be a 18/21 to me but I'm no expert. What I can add is that there were at least four Lotus 18s in SCCA racing by 1966 plus two 21s and even a Lotus 24, maybe two.

Allen

[CRX Lee]

Hello Ray! I can confirm that the red car is no Devin. I also agree with David, a Crosley base was wha came to mind for me as well. I wish I could see the tail and nose sections on the car. I have several books of te era showing a variety of specials but these limited photos ring no bells. Certainly it is fibreglass which leads me to think of limited but mass production bodies.

I totally agree on the Formula C class though but this is about 7 years before I attended my first SCCA club races. Where was Green Valley located? Those dark blue license plates remind me of Kentucky in those days but I am sure that many states had plain navy blue.

[David Swig]

Green Valley was a Texas track, though I'm not sure where. I seem to recall that I have a few old dash plaques from there...

[Ray Bell]

Originally posted by David McKinney
Assuming it's an SCCA meeting (which is where an FC Lotus would have run), the car is more likely to be an ex-F1 Lotus running under Formula A. Looks like an 18 rear end, but a later nose - an 18/21? Allen?

If you're talking about the blue and white car, David, I can't see why you don't immediately recognise it as a Lotus 20. At least a Lotus 20 body, perhaps a modified Lotus 18 chassis, but unlikely.

*Edit* Sorry, I now see what you're saying... that the 'Indi' Lotus is at the same meeting as the little car. It does look a little stubby, but it could be an Indy car. The exhausts are all Indy car.

Maybe a demonstration run?

[ggnagy]

The red car looks like a Jabro Mk 1. The hood is sitting on the bed of the truck.

Jabro Chassis page

[CRX Lee]

As a kid, I recall a Saab powered Jabro Mk III racing at Indianapolis Raceway Park 30+ years ago. I recall thinking the body and cockpit reminded me of a tiny Birdcage Maserati (how many 10 year olds are reminded of a Birdcage Maser?). I did not know of the earlier Jabro models but it looks to me like Gary has nailed it and the Crosley connection is probably right as well.

[Marksberk]

I can see the picture that you first posted. Can you repost or send to me at mark.schoenlein@o-i.com?
Thanks
Mark S.

[etceterini.com]

These amazing photos were provided by Jerry Melton who shot them in period and is sharing them with the world for the first time via etceterini.com!



Click on the link below to view the set:

http://www.cliffreut...eytexas1963.htm

[David McKinney]

Great stuff, Cliff

[Hse289]

Excellent photo`s, im looking forward to seeing the 1964 ones.

[E1pix]

Fabulous!

If I can ever provide technical guidance on helping you "restore" these old images to "original," please let me know. (Edit: This is not to say they're not wonderful as is! )

Edited by E1pix, 02 December 2011 - 21:47.

[Jerry Entin]

http://www.cliffreut...eytexas1963.htm
Here are some wonderful photos of the day.

The photos taken in heavy rains were probably of the third Green Valley event of 1963, the one held on July 15-16.

Some IDs based on race numbers:

- #5 and #93 show George Koehne's bobtail Cooper with Buick V8

- #35 shows the Lotus 18 raced by Bill Janowski after he sold the Monsterati

- #16 shows Tim White, the new owner of the Monsterati

- #17 is Tom Johnson and his Maserati 300S/Chevy, an old Ebb Rose car

- #97 and #18 Lotus 23s are Bob Markley and Gordon Richardson.

all research: Willem Oosthoek

[Michael Oliver]

Cliff - I'll second all the above comments - fantastic stuff!

My interest is Lotus 23s, so I am intrigued by the blue G Mod 23 #61, as this does not appear in any of the programme listings. #39 Dave Morgan does not appear in the photos but was entered in F Mod so unlikely to be this car. Pete Sherman was entered in a 23 in G Mod so could be this, although he is listed as #7 in the programme.

Also, the #97 white F Mod 23 is mis-identified, I believe, as Dave Morgan, when the programme says it is Bob Markley, who from time to time drove Homer Rader's 23.

Finally, the #18 Lotus 23 is Richard Macon in an Alfa-powered car. I believe that he owned and raced this car in the 1964 season and it appears that the photos were taken on different occasion as it is very wet, with signs of large puddles, quite unlike the other photos taken of the other cars, so perhaps this one could have been misfiled as 63 when in fact it is 64?

I too can't wait for a batch of 1964 photos!

[Michael Oliver]

http://www.cliffreut...eytexas1963.htm
Here are some wonderful photos of the day.

The photos taken in heavy rains were probably of the third Green Valley event of 1963, the one held on July 15-16.

Some IDs based on race numbers:

- #5 and #93 show George Koehne's bobtail Cooper with Buick V8

- #35 shows the Lotus 18 raced by Bill Janowski after he sold the Monsterati

- #16 shows Tim White, the new owner of the Monsterati

- #17 is Tom Johnson and his Maserati 300S/Chevy, an old Ebb Rose car

- #97 and #18 Lotus 23s are Bob Markley and Gordon Richardson.

all research: Willem Oosthoek

Hi Jerry/Willem

Are you sure about the ID of Gordon Richardson, as this was definitely the car owned by Dick Macon and it is parked next to his truck. If so, was Richardson the owner before Macon? Photo filename of #97 says Dave Morgan but I agree the programme says Markley. Interesting re July meeting in rain, I thought it looked very different to the rest.

Michael

[Jerry Entin]

Wonderful images Cliff:
The photos taken in heavy rains were probably of the third Green Valley event of 1963, the one held on July 15-16.

Some IDs based on race numbers:

- #5 and #93 show George Koehne's bobtail Cooper with Buick V8

- #35 shows the Lotus 18 raced by Bill Janowski after he sold the Monsterati

- #16 shows Tim White, the new owner of the Monsterati

- #17 is Tom Johnson and his Maserati 300S/Chevy, an old Ebb Rose car

- #97 and #18 Lotus 23s are Bob Markley and Gordon Richardson


all research Willem Oosthoek

[Jerry Entin]

John Miller working on Richard Macon's Lotus 23
That is Richard Macon without the shirt at the front.

Michael: The cars look the same and the girl in Cliff's photo looks like Richard Macon's first wife.


photo: Richard Macon collection

Edited by Jerry Entin, 03 December 2011 - 01:32.

[Michael Oliver]

Hi Jerry

Thanks for that. I think Richard had his car in 1964, didn't he, if I read your thread about him correctly?

Michael

[ERault]

Unsure if this help or confuse things, but according to Competition Press, the wet race discussed (on june 15/16, not july) was won by Richardson with an ex-Brabham Ford-engined Lotus 23.

[etceterini.com]

Here is the latest from Jerry Melton, Enjoy:

http://www.cliffreut...eytexas1965.htm

Here is Ken Miles getting some air:

[scags]

Great shot, Cliff!

[eldougo]

Very unusual Lotus23 what type of Ferrari motor was it powered by.
Great photos .


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[S&M Minis]

Very unusual Lotus23 what type of Ferrari motor was it powered by.
Great photos .


Uploaded with ImageShack.us

It was a single cam V-6. If I recall this was the early Dino motor based on a Columbo (Sp?) design and it was a different lineage than the later twin cam Dino's. The trivial detail of the time was that the cylinder banks of the two designs were staggered oppositely; i.e., which bank was forward of the other to offset the connecting rods on the crank journal. That's based on 46 year old memories and may have been wrong at the time!

Pictures taken the 1965 Mid Ohio USRRC. Unfortunately the car wasn't as quick as George follmer's lotus-Porsche. Ed Hugus operated out of Pittsburgh, PA, note the Continental Cars tow vehicle.

Edited to say thanks to Cliff for posting these great pictures.

Edited by S&M Minis, 28 December 2011 - 04:38.

[Hse289]

Excellent photo`s, thanks for posting.

[etceterini.com]

Jerry just sent some new info which is shown in the page description and
in some newspaper clippings at the end of the page:

http://www.cliffreut...eytexas1965.htm

[OCTARD]

Here is Ken Miles getting some air:

The above photo shows 5R002, at the debut event for the R-Model Shelby.

More from Jerry Melton on the race between Ken Miles in the Shelby and Charlie Barnes in the Merlyn:

"I couldn't get very close again that year. My corner work (flag station) didn't start until the next season. For the duel between Charlie
Barnes' Merlyn and Miles I was at the 180 degree turn at the top of the hill. Miles would hug the inside, drag racing out and down the straightaway (which
was a dragstrip) while Barnes made a wide, smooth outside parabola. It was a very tight contest."

[eldougo]

[quote name='S&M Minis' date='Dec 28 2011, 13:37' post='5462390']

Thanks for those details it sure looked the goods

[Ralf Pickel]

Is that Dino-powered Lotus 23 still around with that engine ?

Ralf

[etceterini.com]

Here is the new page, I did not finish with the captions as I just ran out of gas!
I'll have them all up by tomorrow, enjoy!

http://www.cliffreut...a1966season.htm