48 replies to this topic

[Angel Eyes]

Just look how he did compared to Trulli

Trulli vs. Alonso in 2004 season

Qualifying: 8 - 7 to Trulli

Points: 42 - 41 to Trulli

What does this tell about Alonso ? He wasn't able to outqualify nor outscore his team- mate in the way how Kimi or MS did.

Qualifying Kimi vs DC 12 - 6 to Kimi.

Qualifying MS vs. RB 13 - 5 to MS

Qualifying JB vs TS 11 - 7 to JB

All MS, KR and JB beat their team-mates easily. Only FA didn't. He got beaten by trulli instead. Alonso wasn't any better than Trulli. Expect FA to be trashed by Fisichella next season. Because Fisi is A LOT BETTER than Trulli.

[A Wheel Nut]

I'm going to grab a chair and watch this thread unfold.

[Angel Eyes]

Im showing the facts. Those stats between JT and FA don't lie.

The truth is that JT did outqualify and outscore FA. And JT won with that very similar car. Which showed how good car renault actually is. IF the driver like JT can win with that car, it must be a super car then.

[Group B]

Originally posted by A Wheel Nut
I'm going to grab a chair and watch this thread unfold.

Ahhh, wonderful, a slagfest that doesn't involve MS for once.

[Gaston]

Which showed how good car renault actually is. IF the driver like JT can win with that car, it must be a super car then.

Ask Villeneuve.

[A Wheel Nut]

Originally posted by Group B



Ahhh, wonderful, a slagfest that doesn't involve MS for once.

As much as I agree, I'm sure someone will somehow manage to bring Schumacher's name in to this thread.

Other than us of course!;)

[Dudley]

Ignoring the point of the thread which appears to be about as interesting as being in the back row at a competition of "Who's paint can dry quickest"

What is certainly true is that the Renault has gone ass-backwards since the beginning of the year. They've turned into Sauber!

[lanius]

Fernando didn't get trounced by Jarno at all like you said in the other thread.
The fact, however, is that Alonso got outqualified and outscored by his teammate, nothing can change that.

Trulli is no journeyman, but one would expect a highly talented and hyped driver like Alonso to be able to eclipse him. He is, afterall, the one getting most of the attention in the team, knowing that the Renault team is "built around him".

*thinking of ways to get MS involved in this...*

[Arrow]

I really dont understand what happened at renault this season.Alonso thrashed trulli last year and started off well in 2004 but he really wasnt much better this year.I think qualifying between them is a bit scewed because alonso threw away two of them when he spun off,which consequently wrecked his races and made trulli look a bit better than he otherwise might have looked.
The stats may favour trulli but i still beleive alonso was the better performer.He just never got to really show it.

I cant wait for next year though.

[BorderReiver]

Originally posted by Dudley
Ignoring the point of the thread which appears to be about as interesting as being in the back row at a competition of "Who's paint can dry quickest"

What is certainly true is that the Renault has gone ass-backwards since the beginning of the year. They've turned into Sauber!

More than true I'm afraid.

All I will contribute to this debate before all hell breaks loose and the pro and anti morons arrive is that Trulli IMO is a pretty under-rated driver.

[Group B]

Originally posted by BorderReiver


More than true I'm afraid.

All I will contribute to this debate before all hell breaks loose and the pro and anti morons arrive is that Trulli IMO is a pretty under-rated driver.

Probably true; trouble is that next year he gets paired with another pretty under-rated driver, meaning they're both in a rather lose-lose situation whatever the result.

[Fortymark]

Alonso isn´t overrated, Trulli may be underrated instead.

[Car no.27]

Originally posted by Fortymark
Alonso isn´t overrated, Trulli may be underrated instead.

Great response

[magicalonso]

jarno trulli is the best qualifier in F1, I'd say he'd have outqualified raikkonen or button more easily (he did in 02)

[xype]

Originally posted by Arrow
I really dont understand what happened at renault this season.

Their car happened.

Originally posted by Arrow
The stats may favour trulli but i still beleive alonso was the better performer. He just never got to really show it.

This statement makes little xype's head hurt.

Alonso is not overrated, he wouldn't win a GP if he was. Trulli is not underrated, he wouldn't get a drive if he was. I think this year Trulli won on experience. But both are about even, in my opinion. Next year will indeed be interesting.

The only way to compare drivers would be to give all of them the same car and let them drive 5 qualifying sessions and 5 long stints and compare their times, sectors, ability to adapt trough the distance. And give everyone enough time to set up their car. Not gonna happen, so why bother. Besides everyone knows that JV is the best and MS only lucky to have his team built around him.*

*I win. I managed to bring in JV _and_ MS in a thread about Trulli and Alonso! Where's my cookie?!

[kismet]

Alonso was definitely overrated last year when (some) overzealous fanboy "journalists" liked to portray him as one of the two complete drivers on the current grid, the only one able to hold a candle to him obviously being one Michael Schumacher. Now that he's done his best to prove them wrong, I think the perception is thankfully a bit more in touch with reality.

[Fortymark]

Originally posted by kismet
Alonso was definitely overrated last year when (some) overzealous fanboy "journalists" liked to portray him as one of the two complete drivers on the current grid, the only one able to hold a candle to him obviously being one Michael Schumacher. Now that he's done his best to prove them wrong, I think the perception is thankfully a bit more in touch with reality.

Say what you want about Villeneuve but so far Alonso has clearly beaten him. JVi was running close to Button in an team which didn´t really like Jaques. Button today is one of F1´s hottest property..and I don´t think that JVi has lost much of his speed being out less than an year.
Trulli beat Button as an newcomer driving for Renault in 2002.

Spain last year when Alonso really pressured MS and beat Barrichello in what in my eyes was an clearly inferior car was impressive. Also when he lapped MS at Hungary, wow
Alonso is great and Trulli is very quick.

[wagner]

Originally posted by Angel Eyes
Just look how he did compared to Trulli

Trulli vs. Alonso in 2004 season

Qualifying: 8 - 7 to Trulli

Points: 42 - 41 to Trulli

What does this tell about Alonso ? He wasn't able to outqualify nor outscore his team- mate in the way how Kimi or MS did.

Qualifying Kimi vs DC 12 - 6 to Kimi.

Qualifying MS vs. RB 13 - 5 to MS

Qualifying JB vs TS 11 - 7 to JB

All MS, KR and JB beat their team-mates easily. Only FA didn't. He got beaten by trulli instead. Alonso wasn't any better than Trulli. Expect FA to be trashed by Fisichella next season. Because Fisi is A LOT BETTER than Trulli.

41-42 is hardly "got beat". Doesn't 2003 mean anything to you, and doesn't what they showed during races mena anything to you either. To me it's no doubt that Alonso is great. He made quite many mistakes yes but better be fast, have chance of glory and spin out, rather than cruise into a points finish.

I'm not going to slag Trulli, he is excellent sun glass driver but never showed to dominate Alonso. Trullis potential is known, he can be fast in some races and in many qualifyings, but Alonso is the one who can mount a serious championship challenge when the car is capable.

[Taxi]

Alonso is as good as Kimi, in my opinion. Just see what he's doing to villneuve. What impresses methe most it's is race craft. relly devastating

[magicalonso]

Originally posted by Taxi
Alonso is as good as Kimi, in my opinion. Just see what he's doing to villneuve. What impresses methe most it's is race craft. relly devastating

I agree with this, come race day FA consistently manages to beat some cars he has no business finishing ahead of. i also suggest that trulli is severely underrated, I expect him to walk all over Ralf next year.

[HSJ]

Originally posted by A Wheel Nut
As much as I agree, I'm sure someone will somehow manage to bring Schumacher's name in to this thread.

Other than us of course!;)

Schumacher. You just knew it had to be me.

Originally posted by Arrow
I really dont understand what happened at renault this season.Alonso thrashed trulli last year and started off well in 2004 but he really wasnt much better this year.I think qualifying between them is a bit scewed because alonso threw away two of them when he spun off,which consequently wrecked his races and made trulli look a bit better than he otherwise might have looked.
The stats may favour trulli but i still beleive alonso was the better performer.He just never got to really show it.

I cant wait for next year though.

[Cojayar]

Originally posted by Angel Eyes
Im showing the facts. Those stats between JT and FA don't lie.

The truth is that JT did outqualify and outscore FA. And JT won with that very similar car. Which showed how good car renault actually is. IF the driver like JT can win with that car, it must be a super car then.

Noop, you are showing the results. Overrated is about quality not final result of a race. This is motorsport racing, not cheess. And you know qualy this year means nothing because one of the two has to stop first. No team stop both cars together because they don't pass.

Anyway, I don't know why I reply to you. You are a joke. A waste of time. And specially you don't have a clue about motor racing. As Alonso said, it's always that the bosses get rid of my team mates. But you know more than them.

[inaki]

Originally posted by Angel Eyes
Just look how he did compared to Trulli

Trulli vs. Alonso in 2004 season

Qualifying: 8 - 7 to Trulli

Points: 42 - 41 to Trulli

What does this tell about Alonso ? He wasn't able to outqualify nor outscore his team- mate in the way how Kimi or MS did.

Qualifying Kimi vs DC 12 - 6 to Kimi.

Qualifying MS vs. RB 13 - 5 to MS

Qualifying JB vs TS 11 - 7 to JB

All MS, KR and JB beat their team-mates easily. Only FA didn't. He got beaten by trulli instead. Alonso wasn't any better than Trulli. Expect FA to be trashed by Fisichella next season. Because Fisi is A LOT BETTER than Trulli.

Sorry, but IMO Trulli didn't do better. Qualifying doesn't tell you everything.

Remember that this was Trulli's 8th season, Fernando's 3rd (2nd in a car other than Minardi)

This has been best year ever for Trulli. 1 win, in fact 1st win in his career, and 2 poles. But Alonso has done this year 4 podiums (Melbourne, Magny-Cours, Hockenheim, Hungary) and Trulli only 2 (Monaco and Barcelona)

Alonso was 1 point behind Trulli only because Trulli collected more points in the races where Alonso had to retire, Monaco (Ralf incident - 10 points) and USA (Puncture - 5 points).

In terms of qualifying, biggest Jarno´s strenght, they are 8-7 after 15 GP´s

But again in 15 GP´s Alonso has fastest laps than Jarno 11 times. Trulli has been faster than Fernando only 4 times during the race.

Trulli survived because he was fired but it was inevitable to be beated if he remained in the team.

And you'll see Fernando crushing Fisi, and that he will be multiple times WDC. I hope he will still beat more records, especially the only one remaining as youngest ever WDC. Actually is a record of brazilian Emerson Fittipaldi (Lotus 72 Ford) 1972 25 years 8 months and 29 days, to add the ones as:

Youngest ever winner of a GP:
Fernando Alonso (ESP 22 years and 26 days (Hungría'03)
Bruce McLaren (NZL 22 years, 3 months and 12 days (USA'59)
Jacky Ickx (BEL 23 years, 6 months and 6 days (Francia'68)
Michael Schumacher (GER 23 years, 7 months and 27 days (Bélgica'92)

Youngest ever driver in podium:
Fernando Alonso: 21 years, 7 months and 22 días (Malasia'03)
Elio de Angelis (ITA 21 years, 10 months and 7 days (Brasil'80)
Rubens Barrichello: 21 years, 10 months and 24 days (Pacífico'94)

Youngest ever poleman:
Fernando Alonso: 21 years, 7 months and 21 days (Malasia'03)
Rubens Barrichello (BRA 22 years, 3 months and 5 days (Bélgica'94)
Andrea de Cesaris (ITA 22 years, 10 months and 4 days (USA-W'82)

Youngest ever driver to make a fastest lap:
Fernando Alonso: 21 years, 10 months and 17 days (Canadá'03)
Bruce McLaren: 21 years, 10 months and 18 days (Gran Bretaña'59)
David Coulthard (GBR 23 years, 4 months, 4 days (Alemania'94)
Michael Schumacher: 23 years, 7 months, 27 days (Bélgica'92)



I think that he is underrated. Wait and see.

Regards

[Cosmograph]

I'd say Trulli is negatively portrayed given the fact that he hasn't liven up to his initial promise, and his race results suffer in comparison with his qualifying. However, Alesi certainly didn't quantifiably achieve much during his years in F1, but he was loved and admired.

Comparing present day JV with Alonso is just silly. If Alonso can't have the better of someone who's not driven any F1 cars in 11 months, while Alonso has had 10's of thousands of KMs in the R24, he'd be really overrated. If you gave JV winter testing in the R24, I'm sure you'd see the gap greatly minimized or erased.

Facts are you simply can't adequately compare drivers against each other unless you look at their performance as teammates, all things being equal, and through out retirements, etc, which are not of their own making.

[alonsofan]

Originally posted by Cojayar


Anyway, I don't know why I reply to you. You are a joke. A waste of time. And specially you don't have a clue about motor racing. As Alonso said, it's always that the bosses get rid of my team mates. But you know more than them.

I agree with you cojayar.

People that don't now almost anything about this sport (and i mean formula 1 just in case you forgot in which website you are ;) ) just like to take some numbers (called stats) to prove a stupid thing. You cannot rate a driver by saying he was has almost the same points as his teammate bearing in mind that alonso was unlucky this season starting with monaco (Ralf as stupid as always ) where he could have won, US (tyre puncture), England and Belgium (engine problem) and so on. You have also to bear in mind that the car wasn't as good as the team wanted and team tactics where not specially good (if the team had called him 10 secs before to the final pitstop when trulli had the accident in england he could have taken some points).

P.S: Don't take hasty conclusions just because of my nick ;)

[Fortymark]

Originally posted by Cosmograph
Comparing present day JV with Alonso is just silly. If Alonso can't have the better of someone who's not driven any F1 cars in 11 months, while Alonso has had 10's of thousands of KMs in the R24, he'd be really overrated. If you gave JV winter testing in the R24, I'm sure you'd see the gap greatly minimized or erased.

I dunno if you meant to quote me but I think they could be compaired.
JVi has had plenty of more milage than FA in F1 and knows the tracks really good, he´s an real experienced driver and an world champion. He has tested the car for some days and he hasn´t been away for that long time.
Trulli doesn´t know the Toyota any better than Jvi knows the Renault. Trulli have totally blown off Panis at Suzuka where JVi in two races hasn´t put in many faster laps than Alonso. In race conditions Alonso have had 103 faster race laps than Villeneuve and the opposite with 6 laps out of 109. Of course I have not counted laps when they pitted.
IMO Villeneuve have not been impressive so far in the two races he´s done with Renault. But I´ve been very impressed with Trulli so far.
Jacques may need more time in the car but I think he should at least show a little more speed than what we have seen so far.

[BMW4life]

^^^^

Read my sig...

[senninha]

Originally posted by magicalonso
jarno trulli is the best qualifier in F1, I'd say he'd have outqualified raikkonen or button more easily (he did in 02)

Agree, partially, on first part.

Let´s see how Alonso will perform against Fisi next year.

[Group B]

Originally posted by inaki



Sorry, but IMO Trulli didn't do better. Qualifying doesn't tell you everything.

Remember that this was Trulli's 8th season, Fernando's 3rd (2nd in a car other than Minardi)

This has been best year ever for Trulli. 1 win, in fact 1st win in his career, and 2 poles. But Alonso has done this year 4 podiums (Melbourne, Magny-Cours, Hockenheim, Hungary) and Trulli only 2 (Monaco and Barcelona)

Alonso was 1 point behind Trulli only because Trulli collected more points in the races where Alonso had to retire, Monaco (Ralf incident - 10 points) and USA (Puncture - 5 points).

In terms of qualifying, biggest Jarno´s strenght, they are 8-7 after 15 GP´s

But again in 15 GP´s Alonso has fastest laps than Jarno 11 times. Trulli has been faster than Fernando only 4 times during the race.

Trulli survived because he was fired but it was inevitable to be beated if he remained in the team.

And you'll see Fernando crushing Fisi, and that he will be multiple times WDC. I hope he will still beat more records, especially the only one remaining as youngest ever WDC. Actually is a record of brazilian Emerson Fittipaldi (Lotus 72 Ford) 1972 25 years 8 months and 29 days, to add the ones as:

Youngest ever winner of a GP:
Fernando Alonso (ESP 22 years and 26 days (Hungría'03)
Bruce McLaren (NZL 22 years, 3 months and 12 days (USA'59)
Jacky Ickx (BEL 23 years, 6 months and 6 days (Francia'68)
Michael Schumacher (GER 23 years, 7 months and 27 days (Bélgica'92)

Youngest ever driver in podium:
Fernando Alonso: 21 years, 7 months and 22 días (Malasia'03)
Elio de Angelis (ITA 21 years, 10 months and 7 days (Brasil'80)
Rubens Barrichello: 21 years, 10 months and 24 days (Pacífico'94)

Youngest ever poleman:
Fernando Alonso: 21 years, 7 months and 21 days (Malasia'03)
Rubens Barrichello (BRA 22 years, 3 months and 5 days (Bélgica'94)
Andrea de Cesaris (ITA 22 years, 10 months and 4 days (USA-W'82)

Youngest ever driver to make a fastest lap:
Fernando Alonso: 21 years, 10 months and 17 days (Canadá'03)
Bruce McLaren: 21 years, 10 months and 18 days (Gran Bretaña'59)
David Coulthard (GBR 23 years, 4 months, 4 days (Alemania'94)
Michael Schumacher: 23 years, 7 months, 27 days (Bélgica'92)



I think that he is underrated. Wait and see.

Regards

That's all fine Inaki, but stats aren't the be-all and end-all. I don't see Senna, Fangio, Prost or Clark on any of those lists - yet I do see DC, Rubens and de Cesaris. Alonso is an excellent driver who may have a glittering career ahead of him, but it won't be those stats or beating JVi that covince me. Next years head to head with Fisico will perhaps tell us a little more.

[HSJ]

Originally posted by Fortymark


I dunno if you meant to quote me but I think they could be compaired.
JVi has had plenty of more milage than FA in F1 and knows the tracks really good, he´s an real experienced driver and an world champion. He has tested the car for some days and he hasn´t been away for that long time.
Trulli doesn´t know the Toyota any better than Jvi knows the Renault. Trulli have totally blown off Panis at Suzuka where JVi in two races hasn´t put in many faster laps than Alonso. In race conditions Alonso have had 103 faster race laps than Villeneuve and the opposite with 6 laps out of 109. Of course I have not counted laps when they pitted.
IMO Villeneuve have not been impressive so far in the two races he´s done with Renault. But I´ve been very impressed with Trulli so far.
Jacques may need more time in the car but I think he should at least show a little more speed than what we have seen so far.

I think the point is that if one rates FA based on him beating JV in the Renault this year, then they are on rather thin ice.

[HSJ]

Originally posted by Group B


That's all fine Inaki, but stats aren't the be-all and end-all. I don't see Senna, Fangio, Prost or Clark on any of those lists - yet I do see DC, Rubens and de Cesaris. Alonso is an excellent driver who may have a glittering career ahead of him, but it won't be those stats or beating JVi that covince me. Next years head to head with Fisico will perhaps tell us a little more.

It will tell us a lot IMO. If FA beats GF it will be a very good achievement for FA. But if GF beats FA it will also be a very good achievement for Fisi. If they come out about equal, then it is pretty safe to say neither is the next multiple WDC, unless you're a huge fan of one or the other. But in the case of one of them losing out, the loser will certainly not be the next big thing, that's for sure. The winner might, though.

[DamattaSpeed]

Originally posted by magicalonso

I agree with this, come race day FA consistently manages to beat some cars he has no business finishing ahead of. i also suggest that trulli is severely underrated, I expect him to walk all over Ralf next year.

I think you and fortymark have captured my viewpoints effectively.

[Group B]

Originally posted by magicalonso
i also suggest that trulli is severely underrated, I expect him to walk all over Ralf next year.

I'll be more than a little surprised if Trulli "walks all over" Ralf.

[Ni55]

Originally posted by inaki


Youngest ever driver to make a fastest lap:
Fernando Alonso: 21 years, 10 months and 17 days (Canadá'03)
Bruce McLaren: 21 years, 10 months and 18 days (Gran Bretaña'59)
David Coulthard (GBR 23 years, 4 months, 4 days (Alemania'94)
Michael Schumacher: 23 years, 7 months, 27 days (Bélgica'92)

Hey, what happent to Kimi ?, he was younger than both MS and DC when he got fastest lap at the Australian GP 2002. He might also have been younger than MS and Jacky Ickx when he won his first race (Malaysia 2003).

[JaviM]

Originally posted by Angel Eyes
Just look how he did compared to Trulli

Trulli vs. Alonso in 2004 season

Qualifying: 8 - 7 to Trulli

Points: 42 - 41 to Trulli

What does this tell about Alonso ? He wasn't able to outqualify nor outscore his team- mate in the way how Kimi or MS did.

Qualifying Kimi vs DC 12 - 6 to Kimi.

Qualifying MS vs. RB 13 - 5 to MS

Qualifying JB vs TS 11 - 7 to JB

All MS, KR and JB beat their team-mates easily. Only FA didn't. He got beaten by trulli instead. Alonso wasn't any better than Trulli. Expect FA to be trashed by Fisichella next season. Because Fisi is A LOT BETTER than Trulli.

you don't know a thing about this sport...

if you watched the races,in every race Alonso was almost always ahead of Trulli..at some races he was 1 minute ahead.

bah,I spending time replying you in this stupid thread....don't make me laugh,baby

[alonsofan]

Originally posted by JaviM





you don't know a thing about this sport...

if you watched the races,in every race Alonso was almost always ahead of Trulli..at some races he was 1 minute ahead.

bah,I spending time replying you in this stupid thread....don't make me laugh,baby

[holiday]

Originally posted by Angel Eyes
Just look how he did compared to Trulli

Trulli vs. Alonso in 2004 season

Qualifying: 8 - 7 to Trulli

Points: 42 - 41 to Trulli

Agreed. Trulli was better than Alonso, although at least in my understanding "beaating" may be too strong a word. Trulli's forced daparture from Renault was a plot by Briatore not really supported by Renault, that's why Briatore now himself has become a victim of his autocratic driver policy. Trulli is rehabilitated and the whole story has told us that even in such a performance oriented cosmos like f1 there is a strong human and subjective element involved.

[Corners]

It is very true that Alonso on his reputation should have beaten trulli in qualifying and the championship. In reality Trulli won a race out-qualified and scored more points and also had to miss a race and drive the Toyota for 2 races so there isn't any excuses for Alonso really.
It was either a very bad year for an immense talent or a representative year for a more modest talent. Hard to tell facts don't always give the right impression as wel know.
Its like Australia some people started making the incorrect assumption that Fisi had met his match when in reality it was Fisi that lost his front in qualifying.
Schumi has had some very strange races lately but in the middle of that was Suzuka, people read too much from a single situation.
Alonso hasn't impressed a lot though that's for sure.

[holiday]

Unlike last year, this time Trulli also marked the highlights with two poles and one win. He impressed me also with his qualifying runs at Toyota.

[beanoid]

Erm, Alonso is the only Renault driver to score since July. So I guess the fact that FA caught up to him, after experiencing more mechanical problems than JT in the first half of the season, says something. Not that Trulli is a bad driver by any stretch, but claiming that he "beat" FA in real terms is quite ridiculous. IMO they were pretty even up till the second half of the season, when Trulli threw in the towel.

(not sure why i replied to this total flamebait thread, but there you are)

[HBoss]

What would the numbers look like if we added the 2003 results? I think we would have a better perspective from all of the numbers and not only those that make A or B look better.

This is like judging Montoya and Ralf by considering one season only and ignoring dozens of other races.

[Pep]

Alonso lost with his 5 retirements 5 probable podiums and much more potential points than Trulli.

Alonso had to retire in:

- Monaco (was 2nd -> accident, at least Ralf was somewhat involved),
- Canada (was 1st when his team failed in the pits -16 seconds stopped- and 4th -2 seconds behind Ralf who finished second and catching him up- when his suspension failed),
- USA (was 3rd -> puncture),
- Spa (was 1st -> engine failure & oil leak) and
- Monza (was 3rd -> spun, his own fault)

Trulli had to retire in:

- Canada (was 3rd -> suspension),
- England (was 8th -> suspension)

-----------------------------------

Alonso's other mechanical problems:
- England (engine failure in the quali, finished 10th),
- Europe (was 4th when he lost the power steering, struggled the rest of the race),
- Germany (was 2nd - aerodynamic problem).

Trulli's:
- USA (mechanical problem in the quali, finished 4th)
- Germany (was 4th - aerodynamic).


The thing is that Alonso lost enough points to fight with Button for 3rd in the drivers championship. Moreover, he had very bad luck in those circuits where he had a winner car (Monaco, Canada and Spa).

[checkonetwo]

i think they were pretty even, which makes trulli look really good, because alonso undoubtedly is a top-notch driver and a major talent.

over one lap trulli is second to none, in the races alonso seems to be a bit stronger. for further evaluation please refer to the 2005 stats, which are currently being worked out by the great invisible one.

[role]

Briatore seems quite sattisfied with Alonso's effort this season. He has called this one his best Formula 1 season when talking to Spanish journo's yesterday after the race. Here is his interview in Spanish:

Marca

And the translation in English:

Flavio Interviewed

[Angel Eyes]

JaviM wrote:

"if you watched the races,in every race Alonso was almost always ahead of Trulli..at some races he was 1 minute ahead."

I did. And this is what I saw.

Malaysia: Trulli almost 1 minute ahead of FA
Bahrain: Trulli beats FA again
Spain: Trulli beats FA easily and takes a podium.
Monaco. Trulli ahead of FA again.
Silverstone. Trulli ahead

And the final results between those two

points: Trulli 46 FA 45 = Trulli better
Quali: Trulli 8 FA 7 = Trulli Better
Car Reliability: Trulli: 2 dfns due to tech failures. FA 3 dfns due to tech failures. = Almost equal car reliability. Both had super reliable cars.

THEREFORE. No one can say that FA was any better than Trulli

[Dino G]

Alonso is not overrated. His talent and ability has been noted since qualifying a Minardi in 18th position when he was a teenager.

They guy is still so very young and will be a force for the next decade.

Jarno is, as we all know, an excellent qualifier. His race pace is not the same as Alonso and in the end, if it were not for Trulli's outstanding qualy performance, the gap would be much wider than what it is. Jarno's qualy saves him but we all have computers and the reality is Alonso is by far a better racer than Alonso.

With that being said, I am puzzled as to how good he truly is. It has nothing to do with his comparison to Trulli, but his comparison to Villeneuve.

There is no way that Villeneuve should have out qualified Alonso is Japan.

There is no was that Villeneuve should be less than one tenth behind Alonso for fastest race laps.

The fact that JV, in 1000kms, has caught up to Alonso , who has had at least 15,000kms to a virtual dead heat for fastest lap ...who does that flatter? Does it flatter Alonso as being as fast as the great former champion? Or does it flatter the washed up has been (some say never was) who can lap as fast as Alonso in counterclockwise Brazil? If all the drivers were complaining of sore necks, can you imagine JV's neck, which was still coming to grips with the regular direction of racing?

That's the thing. Over three races JV has taken clumps out of the gap and while there is no denying how good Fernando is, I think that Jv has been too close to him.

So there you have it, Fernando has the pace of a champion!

[Pep]

Malaysia: Trulli almost 1 minute ahead of FA
Bahrain: Trulli beats FA again
Spain: Trulli beats FA easily and takes a podium.
Monaco. Trulli ahead of FA again.
Silverstone. Trulli ahead

Tsk, tsk...Let's be fair:

Malaysia : Alonso started from the back of the grid. He was 6th by lap 24 when his race was hampered by a bad strategy from Renault (they fueled him for the rest of the race and he started lapping 4 seconds slower).

Bahrain : Alonso started again from the back of the grid (this time not his fault, Symonds said they didn't calibrate the brakes properly) and he was much faster than Trulli, clinching the 2nd fastest lap of the race (almost one second faster than Trulli, the 8th fastest lap).

Spain : Again Alonso was much faster than Trulli in the race. Trulli was running in clean air all the race and when Alonso finally gained positions (he had started 8th) and had clean air being 4th, he reduced the gap to Trulli from 16 seconds to less than one second in the final lap (Alonso 4th, Trulli 3rd)

Monaco : Yeah, Trulli was better.

Silverstone : Again Alonso totally destroyed Trulli on the race. Alonso had an engine failure in the quali and started from the back. In the first lap Trulli was 5th and Alonso was 14th and many seconds behind him stuck in traffic. In the lap Trulli crashed, he was 8th and Alonso 9th 3 seconds behind.

I think that there are 2 or 3 races in this season where you can say that Trulli had a better race. Perhaps Malaysia, Monaco and Europe. But as it has happened these two years, when Trulli has a great race and is ahead of Alonso (Monaco for example), Alonso is always on his pace. When Alonso is ahead of Trulli, Trulli usually laps significantly slower than Alonso, and many times finishes miles behind him (or he is even lapped by Alonso).

Btw, another interesting statistic...

Fastest lap victories: Alonso 11, Trulli 4

[doggy]

Originally posted by checkonetwo
i think they were pretty even, which makes trulli look really good, because alonso undoubtedly is a top-notch driver and a major talent.

over one lap trulli is second to none, in the races alonso seems to be a bit stronger. for further evaluation please refer to the 2005 stats, which are currently being worked out by the great invisible one.

totally agree. with limited running, JT also did well in 2 races with that dog called Toyota.
alonso too have driven very well, especially the second half of season.

toyota and its new driver pairing will be pretty competitive in 2005...major surprise to naysayers on this BB.

[ivanalesi]

Alonso isnt overated, at least because Trulli is no slow driver!