21 replies to this topic

[Admiral Thrawn]

I'm interested to know if anyone has a reasonably accurate estimation of the power of the cars of the 2004 season. If not, then what is the lastest season where the power is fairly reliably known?

I found the following information from Ferrari:

1996 F310 600bhp
1997 F310B 650bhp
1998 F300 700bhp
1999 F399 750bhp
2000 F1-2000 770bhp

The power of the F2001, F2002, F2003-GA and F2004 is not revealed by Ferrari.

Despite this, I've seen several sources quote:

the F2001 outputting 840bhp.

the F2002 putting out the "high 800's", "just under 900bhp" and 880bhp.

the F2003-GA producing from 900bhp to 930bhp.

the F2004 listed at anywhere from 910bhp all the way up to 950bhp.

And that's just Ferrari.... I have no idea about the other teams.

[mrman_3k]

That's generally what I've heard but I doubt anyone actually knows the more recent models for sure. Guess we could have someone who owns an F1 Ferrari to take it to a dyno day

[panzani]

http://www.atlasf1.c.../ludvigsen.html

[Admiral Thrawn]

Originally posted by panzani
http://www.atlasf1.c.../ludvigsen.html

What is that a link to? Can't read it...

[desmo]

Oooooh. Not this again...

[J. Edlund]

The Honda engine is said to be one of the most powerful engines. During the summer the power was somewhere around 930 hp.

Power output of the Ferrari Tipo 049 engine (end of season 2000) was 817 hp, 866 hp with the ram effect of 350 km/h.

[Ferrari_F1_fan_2001]

Originally posted by J. Edlund
The Honda engine is said to be one of the most powerful engines. During the summer the power was somewhere around 930 hp.

Power output of the Ferrari Tipo 049 engine (end of season 2000) was 817 hp, 866 hp with the ram effect of 350 km/h.

I've read that F1 engines make upto 3% gains every year in terms of power so lets say that in 2000 the engine produced around 816bhp

in 2001 it would be: 840.48bhp
2002: 865.6944 bhp
2003: 891.665232 bhp
2004: 918.415277 bhp
2005: 945.967728 bhp?

Given the statements made by people about power exceeding 900bhp for the top flight teams, those figures dont seem exaggerated at all. So given that, F1 cars produce around 315bhp per litre or 94.5bhp her cylinder.

If/When the 2.4l V8's come into fruition I estimate they'll have around 756bhp? I could however have worked that one out wrong. Feel free to correct me.

Aj

[xflow7]

I think I'm correct in saying that Honda made some noises not too long ago indicating they thought they might break 1000HP during next year if the engine regs were not changed, so mid-to-high 900's for the latest spec 2004 engines seems plausible.

[ferrarista]

From what i've read in the recent months, Ferrari should be the most powerful, according to Schumacher it has over 950 bhp; then BMW comes with 950, at least according to what Theissen said in Monza.
About Honda, there are many rumours; some sources say 960, other ones few bhp over 900 mark. However it's one of the best engines IMO.
As always there's a lot of speculations about power figures, but i think these numbers aren't far from reality.
Regarding Aj's post, i've read that Mosley has said some weeks ago that the top teams improve by 4% in terms of power every year. So, with this hypothesis, Ferrari '04 engine has about 950 bhp, that is more or less what MS has stated.

[Fat Boy]

Originally posted by Ferrari_F1_fan_2001


I've read that F1 engines make upto 3% gains every year in terms of power so lets say that in 2000 the engine produced around 816bhp

in 2001 it would be: 840.48bhp
2002: 865.6944 bhp
2003: 891.665232 bhp
2004: 918.415277 bhp
2005: 945.967728 bhp?

Wow, I wouldn't have guessed a bit over 945.967725 BHP.

[xflow7]

Originally posted by Fat Boy


Wow, I wouldn't have guessed a bit over 945.967725 BHP.

Reminds me of the time a classmate of mine in Physics decided to be a jackass and turn in a lab where he'd calculated the speed of light to 5 significant figures based on a flashlight, a mirror, and a stopwatch.

[Admiral Thrawn]

Originally posted by Ferrari_F1_fan_2001


I've read that F1 engines make upto 3% gains every year in terms of power so lets say that in 2000 the engine produced around 816bhp

in 2001 it would be: 840.48bhp
2002: 865.6944 bhp
2003: 891.665232 bhp
2004: 918.415277 bhp
2005: 945.967728 bhp?

Given the statements made by people about power exceeding 900bhp for the top flight teams, those figures dont seem exaggerated at all. So given that, F1 cars produce around 315bhp per litre or 94.5bhp her cylinder.

If/When the 2.4l V8's come into fruition I estimate they'll have around 756bhp? I could however have worked that one out wrong. Feel free to correct me.

Aj

It doesn't work quite as simply as that. For example, the engine regulations changed from the 2003 to the 2004 season. From all the figures I've seen relating to Ferrari's engine output:

2001 840bhp
2002 880bhp
2003 930bhp (maybe or maybe not a little high)
2004 950bhp (According to Schumacher) This also makes sense, as the reduced increment of the increase compared with other seasons takes into account the new engine regulations.

[Admiral Thrawn]

Another possibility for Ferrari?

2001 840bhp

+ 4% (33.6bhp)

2002 873.6bhp

+4% (34.9bhp)

2003 908.5bhp

+4% (36.3bhp)

2004 944.9bhp

This doesn't take into account any reduction in gain between 2003 and 2004. It does appear to be much closer to the existing published estimates than the +3% theory, however.

[ViMaMo]

There was a reduction in power from 2003 to 2004, the engines in the early part of the season might have been running on lesser power. But as the season moved on, power picked up and they are close to what they could have achieved in a evolution of 2003 spec engine. Maybe off by a couple of bhps but still there.

Remember BMW saying they almost lost no power. Just new materials and construction.

[J. Edlund]

From the end of the season 2003 to the start of season 2004 the power is usually said to have been quite constant. The developement during the winter increased the engines life as needed without sacrificing power, at least for the top teams.

If the power was around 930 hp during the summer, around 950 hp seems possible for the end of the season. With full ram effect this should should mean that the power is around 1000 hp at speeds of 350 km/h. The power haven't been this high since the mid eighties with the turbocharged engines.

I would expect that the power levels will be similar or slightly lower during the first races 2005, but it will probably don't take long until they are higher than today.

[Ferrari_F1_fan_2001]

I dont think lots of power = fast car. IIRC Minardi have more power than Renault? And Toyota are reputedly the most powerful engine on the grid? Power doesnt mean alot, torque curves and acceleration probably are far more important than having bundles ofpower yet not being the quickest down the straight.

My 2 cents.

Casper

[Monstrobolaxa]

Originally posted by xflow7




Reminds me of the time a classmate of mine in Physics decided to be a jackass and turn in a lab where he'd calculated the speed of light to 5 significant figures based on a flashlight, a mirror, and a stopwatch.

Did he calculate the error? He must have had fast reflexes!!!!!!

[ivanalesi]

Originally posted by Admiral Thrawn
I'm interested to know if anyone has a reasonably accurate estimation of the power of the cars of the 2004 season. If not, then what is the lastest season where the power is fairly reliably known?

I found the following information from Ferrari:

1996 F310 600bhp
1997 F310B 650bhp
1998 F300 700bhp
1999 F399 750bhp
2000 F1-2000 770bhp

The power of the F2001, F2002, F2003-GA and F2004 is not revealed by Ferrari.

Despite this, I've seen several sources quote:

the F2001 outputting 840bhp.

the F2002 putting out the "high 800's", "just under 900bhp" and 880bhp.

the F2003-GA producing from 900bhp to 930bhp.

the F2004 listed at anywhere from 910bhp all the way up to 950bhp.

And that's just Ferrari.... I have no idea about the other teams.

Ferrari's 94 3.5l V12 was over 800, so the 3l in 95 was below 700, for sure the 96 one had 700... and really it was a huge step between F310 and B, but it wasnt the most powerful engine in 97, actually Ferrari sucked on fast tracks that year.

[eoin]

Originally posted by Ferrari_F1_fan_2001
I dont think lots of power = fast car. IIRC Minardi have more power than Renault?

Casper

I wouldn't go saying that too loudly. Minardi are probably 70HP+ down on Renault.

[ferrarista]

Originally posted by ivanalesi


Ferrari's 94 3.5l V12 was over 800, so the 3l in 95 was below 700, for sure the 96 one had 700... and really it was a huge step between F310 and B, but it wasnt the most powerful engine in 97, actually Ferrari sucked on fast tracks that year.

The problem in '97 was the chassis; the engine was a bit under Renault power but it was neverthless very good.
I don't know if the engine was below 700 in '95, the drop in power between '94 3.5 V12 and the first 3l was about 15% and since '94 V12 had 830 bhp, as you say, then the F310 had at least 700 bhp. In fact Martinelli in the latest interviews says that with the V8 the formula one will go back to the range of 700, basically the level of '95.

[J. Edlund]

Originally posted by Ferrari_F1_fan_2001
I dont think lots of power = fast car. IIRC Minardi have more power than Renault? And Toyota are reputedly the most powerful engine on the grid? Power doesnt mean alot, torque curves and acceleration probably are far more important than having bundles ofpower yet not being the quickest down the straight.

My 2 cents.

Casper

Torque is only needed for driveability, maximum power from the engine is what counts when you want acceleration and top speed. But if you got a bad chassi you might need to compensate with more downforce = more drag and performance drop even if you have a more powerful engine than your competition.

[ivanalesi]

Yep, now i remember that 95's levels were actually 92's levels and in 92 the engine power was 720bhp for Renault:) Just look how fast, even with the resources spent in those years the engine power can go up!