21 replies to this topic

[jpm2]

The thread on the 1933 French Grand Prix reminded me that I know very little of Karl Waldthausen, one of the names on those entry lists.

The 1933 French Grand Prix was one of the last races of Karl Waldthausen, a driver who was to crash fatally two months later in the Grand Prix de Marseille (it seems a tyre burst overturning his Alfa Romeo). Has Sheldon says of Waldthausen, "perhaps few have heard of him these days, but he was one of those stalwarts who so enrich motor racing by their enthusiasm and persistence".

In fact, who was Waldthausen? When was he born and where?
Can anyone add some flesh to the bones of a bare name?

Regards

[Mike Riedner]

Taken from http://www.nzz.ch/kl...liste-1932.html

Result mountainclimb Klausen (CH) 1932:

Class Racecars over 5 litres cpacity

1 R. Caracciola Alfa Romeo 2650 15.50.00
2 H. Stuber Bugatti 2262 16.53.00
3 Earl Howe Bugatti 2262 17.21.80
4 A. Muff Bugatti 2262 17.25.60
5 M. Tadini Alfa Romeo 2330 17.30.20
6 F. Benoit Bugatti 2262 17.31.00
7 M. Lehoux Bugatti 2262 17.39.60
8 H. Von Waldthausen Alfa Romeo 2330 17.40.80
9 P. Pietsch Bugatti 2262 17.43.00

Taken from www.teamdan.com:
II Grand Prix de Marseille
27 August 1933 - Miramas: 500.000 km (5.000 km x 100 laps)
1 42 Louis Chiron Alfa-Romeo B (8C-2600) 2h49m15.2, 177.25 kph
2 34 Luigi Fagioli Alfa-Romeo B (8C-2600) 2h50m25.2
3 20 Guy Moll Alfa-Romeo 8C-2300 96 laps
4 12 Jean-Pierre Wimille/Raymond Sommer Alfa-Romeo 8C-2300 96 laps
5 14 Goffredo Zehender/Parenti Maserati 8CM (8C-3000) 96 laps
6 8 Marcel Lehoux Alfa-Romeo 8C-2300 94 laps
7 18 Laszlo Hartmann Bugatti T51 83 laps
8 26 Pierre Felix Alfa-Romeo 8C-2300 80 laps
9 28 Mlle Hellé-Nice Bugatti T35C 71 laps

Fastest Lap: Louis Chiron, 1m52.0 (160.71 kph)


Did Not Finish
2 Tazio Nuvolari Maserati 8CM (8C-3000) 80 laps/Rear axle
38 Philippe Étancelin Alfa-Romeo 8C-2300 60 laps/Driver fatigue
36 René Dreyfus Bugatti T54 55 laps/Crash
4 Baconin Borzacchini Maserati 8C-3000 50 laps/Hub
10 Raymond Sommer Alfa-Romeo 8C-2300 31 laps/Fuel tank
32 Angelo Bugatti T35B 31 laps
24 Karl Waldthausen Alfa-Romeo 8C-2300 22 laps/Fatal crash
22 Julio Villars Alfa-Romeo 8C-2300 0 laps/Crash

Taken from www.motorsportmemorial.com:

Name: Karl von Waldthausen
Complete name: Karl Baron Horst von Waldthausen
Birth date: 25.Mar.1907
Birth place: Essen, Germany
Death date: 27.Aug.1933
Death place: Miramas, France
Nationality: Switzerland
Gender: male
Age at death: 26

Accident date: 27.Aug.1933
Category: Grand Prix - non-championship
Race: Grand Prix de Marseilles
Event: race
Circuit: Miramas
Circuit variant: oval
Country: France

Role: driver
Vehicle type: car
Vehicle sub-type: single seater
Vehicle brand/model: Alfa Romeo 8C-2300
Vehicle number:

Note: Karl von Waldthausen was a resident of Nyon (VD), Switzerland.

[jpm2]

Thank you Mike. You've been ver helpfull.

Can anyone add more flesh to the bones?

[Hans Etzrodt]

Baron von Waldthausen had a severe accident at the Marseille Grand Prix on August 27, 1933. On lap 20, Waldthausen had crashed in the south Turn of the Miramas Autodrom. It is said that a tire of his Alfa Romeo racing car had burst at full speed, causing his car to tumble over several times. The driver was thrown out of the car onto the concrete track, severely injured. He was immediately transported in a regular touring car to the next medical depot, from where Waldthausen was immediately brought to the next hospital. At 5:30 PM he was admitted to the Salon-de-Provence Hôpital and already one hour later he passed away. A double fracture of the right leg was diagnosed, also a double shoulder fracture and internal injuries. Baron von Waldthausen had remained fully conscious until the last moment.

Karl Baron Horst von Waldthausen was born on March 25, 1907 in Essen, Germany. It is said that at a later time in his life the 26-year old driver supposedly became Swiss citizen. According to AUTOMOBIL-REVUE, Baron von Waldthausen was a native of Liechtenstein, but lived already for many years at Lake Geneva. He established himself as a young, rather wealthy man in the Villa Barholoni in Versoix near Geneva. Already at that time his whole passion was directed towards motor sport. To pursue this obsession, he had his own autodrom built inside his park and used it for his own pleasure. His neighbors had very little understanding for the young driver and complained about the great noise from the racing cars. The city council had to interrogate and Waldthausen decided for that reason to move to Villa Tatiana near Nyon, canton de Vaud, where he again had an autodrom of his own built inside his park to go after his favorite sport.

Baron von Waldthausen became better known through his financial support of the Swiss Grand Prix at the Meyrin circuit in 1931. Not only automobile races but also motorcycle races were financed with his help. He started his racing career in 1932 only after he and Julio Villars had formed the Swiss Racing Equipe Villars-Waldthausen. At Grand Saconnex near Geneva, Waldthausen drove a 1750 Alfa sports car, Villars a BNC 1100cc sports car. At Develier-Les Rangiers, Waldthausen made third fastest time of all cars, now driving an Alfa Romeo Monza racing car, with which he placed eighth in the 3-liter racing car class at Klausen. At Stelvio Waldthausen came third in the large racing car class behind Tadini and Caracciola. Up the Mont Ventoux he came third behind Caracciola and Benoit in the racing class up to 3000cc. At Rheineck-Walzenhausen-Lachen, Waldthausen drove a Steyr sports car and Villars the Alfa Monza in the racing class. At the end of the season Waldthausen and Villars came fifth and sixth respectively in the sports car class of the 1932 Swiss Championship.

The year 1933 became a much busier season, which began at the Tunis GP, where Waldthausen came fourth behind Nuvolari, Borzacchini and Zehender, beating Falchetto, Pietsch and Zanelli. At Alessandria, Villars came sixth, while Waldthausen retired. Next they went to the Picardie GP, where Waldthausen retired again and Villars came fourth. At the following Eifelrennen both cars retired. They then entered for the very important 1933 Grand Prix de France at Montlhéry, where Villars came sixth and Waldthausen retired early on. At the Marne GP, both cars retired again. In July 1933, Dr. Josef Karrer from Zürich joined the Equipe with his new Maserati. On August 13 at the La Baule Grand Prix, Waldthausen came fourth, behind the Bugattis of "Williams", Lehoux and Falchetto, beating Czaikowski to fifth place. At the Grand Prix de Comminges one week later, Waldthausen came again fourth, one lap behind Fagioli, Wimille and Moll, all with Alfa Romeo Monzas. Then two weeks later came his fatal crash at the Miramas Autodrom.

[Otto Grabe]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mike Riedner
[B]Taken from http://www.nzz.ch/kl...liste-1932.html

Result mountainclimb Klausen (CH) 1932:

Class Racecars over 5 litres cpacity

1 R. Caracciola Alfa Romeo 2650 15.50.00
2 H. Stuber Bugatti 2262 16.53.00
3 Earl Howe Bugatti 2262 17.21.80
4 A. Muff Bugatti 2262 17.25.60
5 M. Tadini Alfa Romeo 2330 17.30.20
6 F. Benoit Bugatti 2262 17.31.00
7 M. Lehoux Bugatti 2262 17.39.60
8 H. Von Waldthausen Alfa Romeo 2330 17.40.80
9 P. Pietsch Bugatti 2262 17.43.00

over 5 litres


...a small correction: to 3 litres

best regards
Otto Grabe

[eukie]

Hans, what are the sources for your tremendous knowledge about Von Waldthausen's life? I'm asking because on this site - http://www.wellhause...althausen.shtml (search for: Albert Karl Wilhelm Horst Freiherr von Waldthausen) - about the genealogy of the Waldthausen-family (one of the VERY important industrialist families in Essen and the Ruhrgebiet, just behind Krupp or Thyssen maybe) his birthplace is given as Mainz, not Essen.

[jpm2]

Thank you Hans. Very enlightning.

Regards

[Doug Nye]

Just as a possibly related aside I would just mention this, as in a previous TNF thread...

There was a club racing driver in Britain in around 1961-62 named Rudi de Wald ...(or Waldt)...hausen who crashed fatally (in a Lotus 11 I believe) at Oulton Park. An unfortunate relative of the de Waldthausen/Waldhausen involved in this thread?????

DCN

[Boniver]

He started his racing career in 1932 only after he and Julio Villars had formed the Swiss Racing Equipe Villars-Waldthausen.

But in 1932 start in the Coppa Ciano (30 july)

Edmond Villars - Alfa Romeo


Edmond or Julio Villars - the same driver or not ???

[Hugo Boecker]

Originally posted by Doug Nye
Just as a possibly related aside I would just mention this, as in a previous TNF thread...

There was a club racing driver in Britain in around 1961-62 named Rudi de Wald ...(or Waldt)...hausen who crashed fatally (in a Lotus 11 I believe) at Oulton Park. An unfortunate relative of the de Waldthausen/Waldhausen involved in this thread?????

DCN

This was RUDI de WALDKIRCH as far as I know he died on March, 18 1961 at the BARC Members Meeting at Oulton Park. He drove a Lotus 18 FJ.

[Doug Nye]

Aaah! OK. Faulty memory. Nearly though...

DCN

[jpm2]

Does anyone have photos of Karl von Waldthausen?

[Hans Etzrodt]

Originally posted by Boniver
He started his racing career in 1932 only after he and Julio Villars had formed the Swiss Racing Equipe Villars-Waldthausen.

But in 1932 start in the Coppa Ciano (30 july)

Edmond Villars - Alfa Romeo


Edmond or Julio Villars - the same driver or not ???

• Villars retired at the 1932 Coppa Ciano with the team's 6C-1750 Alfa. While working on this Waldthausen abstract, I tried to keep track primarily of Waldthausen's race entries but will not claim that my account is a complete enumeration of his record.
  
• Of that period, I am aware of only one Villars from Switzerland, Julio.

[Hans Etzrodt]

Originally posted by eukie
...what are the sources for your tremendous knowledge about Von Waldthausen's life?...

Primarily AUTOMOBIL-REVUE 1932 and 33 with a mixture of occasional tidbits out of my small reference library.

Originally posted by eukie
...I'm asking because on this site - http://www.wellhause...althausen.shtml (search for: Albert Karl Wilhelm Horst Freiherr von Waldthausen) - about the genealogy of the Waldthausen-family (one of the VERY important industrialist families in Essen and the Ruhrgebiet, just behind Krupp or Thyssen maybe) his birthplace is given as Mainz, not Essen.

Very valid question, Marco!

Waldthausen was an entirely new topic for me and therefore a teaser of great interest. There appears to be not just one but several contradictions, which I was not able to clear up. Whether he really became Swiss citizen is just one, his correct name is another. Did he really live in Liechtenstein, or is this fiction? So, I worded these statements accordingly, which hopefully will raise the caution-flag of the reader.

• Karl Baron Horst von Waldthausen was born on March 25, 1907 in Essen, Germany: this information originates from Jimmy Piget, if I am not wrong.
• Albert Karl Wilhelm Horst Freiherr von Waldthausen, born 25.03.1907 in Mainz comes from the site mentioned above).
• Baron Horst von Waldthausen is how his name appears in the elaborate result tables of AUTOMOBIL-REVUE.

So, which one should be our version for future reference?

[Michael Müller]

As far I know "Baron" and "Freiherr" have the same meaning, whereas "Freiherr" is the more correct one.
All first names normally are in front of the title, so "Albert Karl Wilhelm Horst Freiherr von Waldthausen" should be the official and correct writing. "Baron Horst von Waldthausen" is the short form showing only the main first name, and the more international title "Baron" in front.

[Hans Etzrodt]

Originally posted by jpm2
Does anyone have photos of Karl von Waldthausen?

I did not know I had a picture but eventually found this one.


Baron Horst von Waldthausen

[Hans Etzrodt]

I found one more


The Baron in the early thirties.

[jpm2]

Thank you Hans. It's good to add the face to the name

Regards

[Carlo]

As far I know "Baron" and "Freiherr" have the same meaning, whereas "Freiherr" is the more correct one.

Just for correctness...

Freiherr and Baron mean absolutely the same title.
Freiherr is the term that is used in official documents.

Whereas, when you talk to a "Freiherr", you name him "Baron".

In former times, I had to work for aristocrats, so I had to learn that stuff..... :yawn:

Btw, Simon Moore expects the v Waldthausen Alfa Romeo as #2111038.
After the fatal crash, Villars offered all cars of their team for sale.


Ciao Carlo

[Marc Ceulemans]

The Ecurie Villars also entered 2 cars for Villars and Baron Karl de Waldthausen in the 1933 Belgian GP, scheduled on July 9, but withdrew 2 days before the race and instead they came to compete at the hillclimb La Baraque near Clermond-Ferrand.
A probable reason of this brutal change was a financial clash between the team and the organisers..


Other hillclimb results (Baron von Waldthausen)

1933:
Grand Saconnex, 13 March, 2nd Sport 3-liter (Alfa Romeo)
La Turbie, 6 April, 1st Sport 3-liter (Alfa Romeo)
La Baraque, 9 July, 1st Sport (Alfa Romeo)

[Bugatti bourgogne]

Dear Sir,

who can have or know where I can find a picture of the 1750 Alfa Romeo that was driven by them ?

regards,

Julien

[jpm2]

I simply don't know. I'm searching myself

Regards